User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 8:16:52 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes they should be reopened but where are they going to find people to work them? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 8:25:01 PM EDT
[#2]
Stop giving money to people that can work. Correct that to those that can’t feed themselves. Seems simple. But if you can’t feed yourself, you probably don’t vote.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 8:25:55 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've been saying for at least 10 years they need to reopen the sanitoriums and asylums and restart the eugenics programs. We'd get rid of liberalism in a matter of weeks once all those retards are back in padded rooms hopped up on medication, getting lobotomies and being spayed/neutered. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 8:28:35 PM EDT
[#4]
Yes, the sterilization of unfit mothers should be re-instated too.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 10:28:26 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes, the sterilization of unfit mothers should be re-instated too. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 10:46:16 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Is there a resurgence of tuberculosis I need to know about?  |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 10:57:01 PM EDT
[#7]
Yes - the liberals would have a place to live with like minded people - and free health care, free housing, free food, & free clothes - everything they are asking for...
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 10:57:01 PM EDT
[#8]
You could fund 20 sanatoriums for what it costs jails, police and crisis intervention teams to poorly deal with the existing problem. Even some of the people who campaigned against the original state-run institutions regret their success.
The problem is, no matter how well run your institution is, dealing with the mentally ill who have zero family support is an ugly business. Your average voter will never understand it because they don’t have to live with it or even see it. So the first time a political opponent wants to make an issue of it, you’ll lose. So, nobody wants to step on that landmine or go $20 million in debt to explain it. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 11:05:58 PM EDT
[#9]
I’m theory, yes. In practice you have to figure someone is going to be in charge of deciding who goes into them.
Who will be deciding? Exactly the people you wouldn’t want deciding. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 11:06:41 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: On the basis of "Guilty / Not Guilty" |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 11:08:18 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes, we need to bring back the sanatorium system and no, they don’t have to be shit on the wall Bedlam types. We can house those too dangerous or too incompetent to be out in society in a humane manner. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 11:10:21 PM EDT
[#12]
Short answer? Fuck yes.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/17/2018 11:31:50 PM EDT
[#13]
Who decides who is incompetent? The same Judges who say returning Vets are disqualified from firearm ownership because of the PTSD they suffer? What about the same arguments about people being prescribed, SSRIs to treat something like a tic disorder, or GERD? Who is to say conservatives or any one with a differing opinion isnt going to be committed? Liberals say we are mentally ill while say they are, who wins that fight?
Once those assurances are clear then let's bring them back. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 9:51:18 AM EDT
[#14]
The same Judges who say returning Vets are disqualified from firearm ownership because of the PTSD they suffer? The people I’m seeing aren’t people who have PTSD or extreme politicsl views. They are people standing naked on some homeowner’s lawn screaming about how they are bringing salvation as they try to kick in the door - and this is the 20th police encounter with them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 9:55:41 AM EDT
[#15]
Yes. The whole '60s notion of integrating them into society has been an abject failure.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 9:56:34 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Day Workers from the Hardware Store .. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 9:58:28 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
YES There are lots of homeless crazies out on the streets that should have ZERO interaction with society. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 9:58:31 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Hell yes. Carter and Reagan should never have closed them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 9:59:26 AM EDT
[#19]
Sure. What will the standard be for holding people in them against their will, and who will make that decision?
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:02:01 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I’m theory, yes. In practice you have to figure someone is going to be in charge of deciding who goes into them. Who will be deciding? Exactly the people you wouldn’t want deciding. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:06:22 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes. The whole '60s notion of integrating them into society has been an abject failure. And that’s not meant to be a slam, I had to watch a video of a mentally ill guy being restrained and it is pretty horrible business because you understand he doesn’t grasp why people are attacking him and he screams just like a bunny in a trap. On the other hand, the citizens are much comforted by not being screamed at by a big, naked, mentally ill guy wielding a giant pair of tin snips. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:11:31 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Eh... I think we can integrate more of them than we have in the 60s and we’ve done so successfully; but there are a lot of seriously damaged people we just let roam free just because we lack the stomach to restrain them. And that’s not meant to be a slam, I had to watch a video of a mentally ill guy being restrained and it is pretty horrible business because you understand he doesn’t grasp why people are attacking him and he screams just like a bunny in a trap. On the other hand, the citizens are much comforted by not being screamed at by a big, naked, mentally ill guy wielding a giant pair of tin snips. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:11:31 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sure. What will the standard be for holding people in them against their will, and who will make that decision? Most of those people are harmless; but they can be very scary to people expecting rational behavior. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:13:20 AM EDT
[#24]
We're okay with locking people up for doing hookers and blow.
Lock up the guy that's roaming the streets talking to utility poles and suddenly we're screaming about cruel tyranny. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:16:13 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Go to San Francisco. That's my experience with the 5150s and why I like the idea of sanitoriums. But again, politically it is a landmine. The first time someone wants to kill your reelection, they show a video of some poor mentally ill guy being restrained and it is an immediate, emotional gut-connection with millions of voters who have normal human empathy for him but have never had to deal with mental illness personally. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:20:25 AM EDT
[#26]
Yes, with proper control mechanisms to prevent abuse. This would be a sound investment in public safety for the community. We have far better tools and technologies now than we had in the 50's and 60's for treating/diagnosing the mentally ill.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:22:34 AM EDT
[#27]
Build as many as you want it won't do a damn thing unless there is a mechanism to forcibly institutionalize the mentally ill. Right now the only way to legally institutionalize a mentally ill person is if they are deemed a danger to self, others, or gravely disabled but the pendulum has swung so far to guarding civil liberties most mentally ill don't meet the criteria.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:28:22 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Dude, I understand the concern and share it; but we are so far past that point. If I showed up at a million dollar home and started flinging shit at you and screaming, and you called the cops and they committed me, I’d be back in three days most likely (and still OK to purchase a firearm in most of the U.S.). If I continued to be crazy as fuck during the emergency detention, I’d be back in six weeks max. Most of those people are harmless; but they can be very scary to people expecting rational behavior. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Sure. What will the standard be for holding people in them against their will, and who will make that decision? Most of those people are harmless; but they can be very scary to people expecting rational behavior. Since we're not liberals, we ought to be able to articulate the scope of the problem, why the proposed solution is likely to solve it, and provide at least some evidence that the proposed solution is workable. So far, no one advocating for sanatoriums have said anything concrete about who would go in, how they would get in, how they would get out, what problems it's likely to solve, how, why, etc. Frankly, it sounds like liberals talking about assault rifle bans: It'll do something good because it has too! We didn't disband the old system because of its overwhelming effectiveness. Ramping up a giant government-run apparatus for the purpose of incarcerating lots of people under standards no one can articulate doesn't sound like a good idea to me. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:30:09 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
IIRC, we have thalidomide & JFK to blame for the elimination of mental-health facilities. Someone will Shirley correct me if that is wrong. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:32:35 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Whos gonna pay for it? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:34:58 AM EDT
[#31]
1 in 6 Americans take psych drugs, that should tell us something.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:36:55 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Pretty sure some are dumped at ERs and kicked back out after a few hours because there's 0 chance of getting them into prison. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:40:16 AM EDT
[#33]
Yes but not for the reasons that many posters fantasize about
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:43:43 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How many people currently running about in the U.S. do you envision involuntarily committing, who are they, and what sorts of problems are they causing? What will the standard be for releasing them? Since we're not liberals, we ought to be able to articulate the scope of the problem, why the proposed solution is likely to solve it, and provide at least some evidence that the proposed solution is workable. I do not know what the scope of the problem is. I know that within Dallas County, which has a population of about 2.5 million, there are at least 1,500 people who have serious mental illness and who are somewhat dangerous. The standard for releasing them is exactly coincidental with the federal grants for treating them. When those grants are no longer available, presto! They’re cured. They rotate in and out of Lew Sterrett until they find some poorly trained Dallas cop and get killed by him, then the family that has ignored them for decades shows up and cries on TV and demands money. The cop who was just trying to deal with a situation he was poorly equipped for has his life ruined and must move to some rural Texas town and take a 30% pay cut if he wants to continue being a cop. The mentally ill person is dead. The local liquor and convenience stores benefit from the infusion of taxpayer cash and life goes on. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:46:08 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You are already paying, in many different ways. Use the money wisely, and get them off the street. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:47:25 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I like the idea of sanatoriums. I just wouldn’t go back to a 1960s model. Lots of people who used to be warehoused benefit and do better from being out of those places. But they do need to exist, and we need a lot more of them. But again, politically it is a landmine. The first time someone wants to kill your reelection, they show a video of some poor mentally ill guy being restrained and it is an immediate, emotional gut-connection with millions of voters who have normal human empathy for him but have never had to deal with mental illness personally. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:47:38 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes i have said this for years |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:48:13 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Are you suggesting that nobody can acknowledge an obvious problem until they have all the data you describe? I do not know what the scope of the problem is. I know that within Dallas County, which has a population of about 2.5 million, there are at least 1,500 people who have serious mental illness and who are somewhat dangerous. The standard for releasing them is exactly coincidental with the federal grants for treating them. When those grants are no longer available, presto! They’re cured. They rotate in and out of Lew Sterrett until they find some poorly trained Dallas cop and get killed by him, then the family that has ignored them for decades shows up and cries on TV and demands money. The cop who was just trying to deal with a situation he was poorly equipped for has his life ruined and must move to some rural Texas town and take a 30% pay cut if he wants to continue being a cop. The mentally ill person is dead. The local liquor and convenience stores benefit from the infusion of taxpayer cash and life goes on. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: How many people currently running about in the U.S. do you envision involuntarily committing, who are they, and what sorts of problems are they causing? What will the standard be for releasing them? Since we're not liberals, we ought to be able to articulate the scope of the problem, why the proposed solution is likely to solve it, and provide at least some evidence that the proposed solution is workable. I do not know what the scope of the problem is. I know that within Dallas County, which has a population of about 2.5 million, there are at least 1,500 people who have serious mental illness and who are somewhat dangerous. The standard for releasing them is exactly coincidental with the federal grants for treating them. When those grants are no longer available, presto! They’re cured. They rotate in and out of Lew Sterrett until they find some poorly trained Dallas cop and get killed by him, then the family that has ignored them for decades shows up and cries on TV and demands money. The cop who was just trying to deal with a situation he was poorly equipped for has his life ruined and must move to some rural Texas town and take a 30% pay cut if he wants to continue being a cop. The mentally ill person is dead. The local liquor and convenience stores benefit from the infusion of taxpayer cash and life goes on. OP did not acknowledge a problem. He asked whether a specific action was a good idea. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:57:58 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Lots of people do well with a task. The issue is, using them for simple labor can be abused, and has been in the past. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 10:59:23 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No. I'm suggesting that returning to a giant government-run incarceration program that didn't work the first time is dumb. It sounds like liberals with socialism: Sure, it didn't work before, but that's because we did it wrong. OP did not acknowledge a problem. He asked whether a specific action was a good idea. 2. You assert it didn’t work. What is your evidence for that? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 11:04:56 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What is interesting...is that our society accepts putting old people for various reasons into nursing homes...but our society doesn't want to have Sanatoriums... A Mayberry type society is the last thing the government wants . Death, crime, drugs, mayhem......that is the stock and trade of government |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 11:05:53 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Build as many as you want it won't do a damn thing unless there is a mechanism to forcibly institutionalize the mentally ill. Right now the only way to legally institutionalize a mentally ill person is if they are deemed a danger to self, others, or gravely disabled but the pendulum has swung so far to guarding civil liberties most mentally ill don't meet the criteria. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 11:06:08 AM EDT
[#43]
Quoted:
Yes or no? No, for the same reason you can't deport 25 million illegals |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 11:08:02 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yeah , it’s needed . The mentally defective shouldn’t be running around with the rest of us . However, due to corruption, lack of money, etc. they're mostly running the streets or getting involved in petty crime. Seriously. Take half of the money set aside for Welfare and put into mental health services. Take the rest of welfare and taper that shit off. No more cash for ghetto breeding machines. No more extra benefits. Build a shitpile of mental health facilities and get these people some help. The only people who should be getting any sort of assistance in this country are: 1) Disabled veterans (either physically or mentally impaired) 2) The mentally ill 3) Seriously handicapped or very old/infirm who have no families or means of assistance |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 11:10:21 AM EDT
[#45]
Yes.
Crazy fuckers need to be put in the crazy fucker warehouse. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 11:13:43 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How many people currently running about in the U.S. do you envision involuntarily committing, who are they, and what sorts of problems are they causing? What will the standard be for releasing them? Are we talking about homeless shelters, homes for autists, both, neither? Since we're not liberals, we ought to be able to articulate the scope of the problem, why the proposed solution is likely to solve it, and provide at least some evidence that the proposed solution is workable. So far, no one advocating for sanatoriums have said anything concrete about who would go in, how they would get in, how they would get out, what problems it's likely to solve, how, why, etc. Frankly, it sounds like liberals talking about assault rifle bans: It'll do something good because it has too! We didn't disband the old system because of its overwhelming effectiveness. Ramping up a giant government-run apparatus for the purpose of incarcerating lots of people under standards no one can articulate doesn't sound like a good idea to me. Some could eventually leave once they get things in order. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 11:19:16 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes, we need to bring back the sanatorium system and no, they don’t have to be shit on the wall Bedlam types. We can house those too dangerous or too incompetent to be out in society in a humane manner. You can house those moderate to severe mentally Ill (such as the Parkland shooter and Holmes in CO.) early on when symptoms first start. It doesn't have to be prison-like. A secured large area with the amenities of a small town such as restaurants, movies, pool, an other activities that are supervised while being secure by walls like a prison. This type of activity is far more likely to keep them calm, promote recovery, And less apt to be called inhumane by the other mentally ill folks, the liberals. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 11:23:13 AM EDT
[#48]
There are more than a few articles about how closing ha ha hotels, I never heard that before but do like it, has caused prisons to have to get into dealing with mental health inmates.
Getting programs and trained folks in to deal with these nuts or kooks or just slightly off balance folks has cost a lot of money. And prisons are full, around tn there are a lot of jails that were sized way big so the state of tn could pay the town with the jail to house tn inmates cause there are not enough prison beds in tn to house all the inmates. Prisons are expensive, but I would expect ha ha hotels to also be expensive. I personally do not expect ha ha hotels to make a return though. Right now this country is in a "hug the thug" phase that has a while to go still. By no means do I feel the brutality of old should make a sudden return to prisons such that inmates are beaten on a regular basis for no reason and what not. And at the same time you can read articles from across this country that show inmates routinely attack corrections officers and face little repurcussions. Tn is starting to charge them with assault charges and that can add time to the sentence and what not but a whole lot of 11 29 seems to be coming out of these assault charges. 11 29 is 11 months and 29 days, so not a whole lot of time added to a sentence if it is tacked on at the end and often it is just run with what they are already serving. Current economy has many folks leaving corrections jobs and few folks entering into corrections jobs because of the low pay, high stress, and what not. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 11:26:44 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No, for the same reason you can't deport 25 million illegals |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/18/2018 11:27:54 AM EDT
[#50]
True story. In the 70s the ACLU sued California and got the court to agree that nobody should be in a sanitarium unless they were a demonstrable 'threat'. The doors flew open and Voila! all the inmates were released onto the streets. Hence, the current homeless problem. Until then, "skid row" were generally small areas in large metropolises. Now, the homeless dominate the landscape in many big cities because of ACLU's action.
If you like your homeless population you can keep your homeless population. Thanks, ACLU. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
