What is up with "The Promise Keepers"??? - Page 2

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - What is up with "The Promise Keepers"??? (Page 2 of 4)

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:08:00 AM EDT

[#1]

Reminds me of one of my favorite Chris Rock's bits - Niggas want credit for shit they supposed to do!"

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:08:03 AM EDT

[#2]

Quoted:
It's simple.
A bunch of LOSERS, who seek positive affirmation, by lumping themselves together with a bunch of like minded losers.
For the weak minded/weak spirited.

If you NEED someone or something to TELL you how a man acts and conducts himself, you ain't one.

wow, you are describing most of arfcom perfectly. congrats.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:08:14 AM EDT

[#3]

Quoted:
My understanding, which is week, and not based on any meetings, is that they believe in being a Husband and a Father (in their belief, their God given roles)- part of which is being the head of the household and being morally responsible for the household. I suspect it is like saying I love my children, therefore I discipline them. They are saying I love my wife, they are implying that they are doing what is necessary for their family so she can focus on being a wife and a mother - the roles they feel God intended for her.

What other roles are there? Men are supposed to lead their family, lead their communities, lead by example, be the spiritual leader, and primary bread winner of the household. Woman are to assist their husbands, to care for their husbands, and to nurture their children. Reversing these roles generally leads to a weakened male and weakened marriage which is now evident as divorce rates have climbed over 50% with 80% being initiated by women. If a man isn't doing his part as being the spiritual leader and head of his household then what purpose does he serve? He no longer is needed, the wife can make money without him, and the wife will seak out a stronger male role model for her children. As a male you determine the path and status of your family otherwise your woman will seek someone who will.

RR

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:08:39 AM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
This reminds me of when I've had rather heated discussions with certain other posters here in GD, then find out later that they are 15 years old.

It's important to keep that in mind here.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:08:46 AM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Why do people put "Join the NRA" or "Gun control is a steady aim" bumper sticker on their cars? Maybe its to spread a message. Maybe its to get others to think.

Please post picture of said vehicle so I can evaluate properly.

So in other words you are just stirring shit.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:09:19 AM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
This reminds me of when I've had rather heated discussions with certain other posters here in GD, then find out later that they are 15 years old.

I'm 13 and a half.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:09:31 AM EDT

[#7]

Promise Keepers goes way beyond bragging about loving their wives.

They have been around for a LONG time and are a fairly big org. Or at least they were haven't heard much about them since they had a ton of public attention in the 90s.

I think the premise is pretty cool but if memory serves they are deeply religious being the wife of a promise keeper seems to be a fairly subserviant role.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:09:51 AM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:
Reminds me of one of my favorite Chris Rock's bits - Niggas want credit for shit they supposed to do!"

Exactly!!!! Chris and I need to sit down and talk about this.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:10:09 AM EDT

[#9]

PROMISE 2

A Promise Keeper is committed to pursuing vital relationships with a few other men

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:10:31 AM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:

Quoted:
This reminds me of when I've had rather heated discussions with certain other posters here in GD, then find out later that they are 15 years old.

I'm 13 and a half.

You don't say.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:10:40 AM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
Divorce rates are over 50% and 80% of those divorces are initiated by women. It is necessary for some men to councel one another in being good spirtual leaders so as not lose their families. If you are married then you know already that marriage isn't easy.

I'm not a member of promise keepers but my uncle is and it helped save his marriage.

RR

Actually, it's around 50/50.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:11:14 AM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
It's simple.
A bunch of LOSERS, who seek positive affirmation, by lumping themselves together with a bunch of like minded losers.
For the weak minded/weak spirited.

If you NEED someone or something to TELL you how a man acts and conducts himself, you ain't one.

Yet you post here, seeking positive affirmation, by lumping yourself together with a bunch of other like minded people.....

I see no difference.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:11:17 AM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:

Quoted:
my dad went through it. he's a good man.

my cousins douchebag of a husband did as well.
he's the guy with the bumper stickers and constantly talking about it while failing to support his family and spending all his money on his motorcycle and booze.

Case in point!!

So I have to watch out for the amount of Ammo and Guns I buy?

Thanks I got that lecture this past weekend.

Problem is I thought she was pregnent so I went out and bought some of the last few toys that I would ever have but it turned out she was just late. Yikes. I told her that too and she said you really think I would not let you buy something. I told her no but I might not let myself buy something so I can get something for the kid.

Made her feel better.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:12:34 AM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:
It's simple.
A bunch of LOSERS, who seek positive affirmation, by lumping themselves together with a bunch of like minded losers.
For the weak minded/weak spirited.

If you NEED someone or something to TELL you how a man acts and conducts himself, you ain't one.

Different does not equal loser. The intention of this org is not to seek positive affirmation. There is a pretty deep and wide premise to this group that goes far beyond affirmation from others.

You and I may disagree with them and their beliefs but it doesn't make them losers.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:13:14 AM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:
Some people go out of their way to look for things to take offense at.

Yep exactly

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:14:55 AM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:
Some people need rules and a program.

Some people had shitty dads and have no idea how to treat women. Those people may have a genuine need for a program or positive role models.

If the program is moderately difficult, they will fail and come back for more because of the guilt associated with failure.

I've never understood promise keepers. As Mr. Chris Rock says, "You want a cookie?!"

I've also noted a nearly 1 to 1 correlation between an "I love my Wife" bumper sticker and a passenger seat occupied by sour faced woman pushing 300 lbs. YMMV

But, I've been told that I have a low tolerance for deviancy, and that I'm an unsympathetic jerk.

I see many here didn't bother learning about promise keepers before they made judgments.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:15:41 AM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Divorce rates are over 50% and 80% of those divorces are initiated by women. It is necessary for some men to councel one another in being good spirtual leaders so as not lose their families. If you are married then you know already that marriage isn't easy.

I'm not a member of promise keepers but my uncle is and it helped save his marriage.

RR

Actually, it's around 50/50.

Actually it's near 80%. Seen figures with sources cited during a meeting at church about this very organization. I will try to find the sources if I can but since the introduction of no fault divorce and female takes all- the numbers are not in the males favor.

RR

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:17:32 AM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:

Quoted:
My understanding, which is week, and not based on any meetings, is that they believe in being a Husband and a Father (in their belief, their God given roles)- part of which is being the head of the household and being morally responsible for the household. I suspect it is like saying I love my children, therefore I discipline them. They are saying I love my wife, they are implying that they are doing what is necessary for their family so she can focus on being a wife and a mother - the roles they feel God intended for her.

Which is great if you are in to that sort of thing, but why brag about it with a bumper sticker?

You see it as bragging that doesn't mean that is their intent. This is no different then someone that puts a USMC or Ranger or <gasp> a Boltface sticker on their car. It shows people in part what defines you and makes you part of a club.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:18:44 AM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:

Quoted:
This reminds me of when I've had rather heated discussions with certain other posters here in GD, then find out later that they are 15 years old.

I'm 13 and a half.

That would explain why you think Lamborghini's look better than Ferraris.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:19:40 AM EDT

[#20]

yeah, groups that help people remain accountable are SOOO stupid....

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:22:23 AM EDT

[#21]

Wasn't this group accused of advocating total domination of the household by the husband??? That doesn't seem right!...Does it???

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:25:55 AM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Divorce rates are over 50% and 80% of those divorces are initiated by women. It is necessary for some men to councel one another in being good spirtual leaders so as not lose their families. If you are married then you know already that marriage isn't easy.

I'm not a member of promise keepers but my uncle is and it helped save his marriage.

RR

Actually, it's around 50/50.

Actually it's near 80%. Seen figures with sources cited during a meeting at church about this very organization. I will try to find the sources if I can but since the introduction of no fault divorce and female takes all- the numbers are not in the males favor.

RR

I'm a divorce attorney. So is my father.

The numbers are around 50/50 and have been for some time.

There is no such thing as "female takes all."

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:27:03 AM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Some people need rules and a program.

Some people had shitty dads and have no idea how to treat women. Those people may have a genuine need for a program or positive role models.

If the program is moderately difficult, they will fail and come back for more because of the guilt associated with failure.

I've never understood promise keepers. As Mr. Chris Rock says, "You want a cookie?!"

I've also noted a nearly 1 to 1 correlation between an "I love my Wife" bumper sticker and a passenger seat occupied by sour faced woman pushing 300 lbs. YMMV

But, I've been told that I have a low tolerance for deviancy, and that I'm an unsympathetic jerk. [://

I see many here didn't bother learning about promise keepers before they made judgments.

Oh, I grew up in a conservative church, my father's a minister, and my wife and I are currently pulling nursery duty at our local church every Sunday, all summer. We are faithful attending, contributing and participating members.

I'm familiar, but, as stated "I'm an unsympathetic jerk."

If it works....fine.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:27:13 AM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:

Quoted:
This reminds me of when I've had rather heated discussions with certain other posters here in GD, then find out later that they are 15 years old.

I'm 13 and a half.

That would explain why you think Lamborghini's look better than Ferraris.

I'm 32 and I think that. What can I say - I like that angular look

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:28:22 AM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Divorce rates are over 50% and 80% of those divorces are initiated by women. It is necessary for some men to councel one another in being good spirtual leaders so as not lose their families. If you are married then you know already that marriage isn't easy.

I'm not a member of promise keepers but my uncle is and it helped save his marriage.

RR

Actually, it's around 50/50.

Actually it's near 80%. Seen figures with sources cited during a meeting at church about this very organization. I will try to find the sources if I can but since the introduction of no fault divorce and female takes all- the numbers are not in the males favor.

RR

Religion doesn't appear to make much of a difference when it comes to willingness to divorce atheism.about.com/od/atheistfamiliesmarriage/a/AtheistsDivorce.htm

11% of all American adults are divorced
25% of all American adults have had at least one divorce

27% of born-again Christians have had at least one divorce
24% of all non-born-again Christians have been divorced

21% of atheists have been divorced
21% of Catholics and Lutherans have been divorced
24% of Mormons have been divorced
25% of mainstream Protestants have been divorced
29% of Baptists have been divorced
24% of nondenominational, independent Protestants have been divorced

27% of people in the South and Midwest have been divorced
26% of people in the West have been divorced
19% of people in the Northwest and Northeast have been divorced

Course those figures are almost 10 years old, but I'd bet educational background, income and age when married are probably more relevant to predicting whether a couple will divorce.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:29:10 AM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Divorce rates are over 50% and 80% of those divorces are initiated by women. It is necessary for some men to council one another in being good spiritual leaders so as not lose their families. If you are married then you know already that marriage isn't easy.

I'm not a member of promise keepers but my uncle is and it helped save his marriage.

RR

Actually, it's around 50/50.

“Arizona State University psychologist Sanford Braver has shown that at least two-thirds of American divorces are initiated by women. Moreover, few of these divorces involve grounds such as desertion, adultery, or violence. The reasons most often given are ‘growing apart’ or ‘not feeling loved or appreciated.’ Other studies have reached similar conclusions. The proportion of divorces initiated by women climbed to more than 70 percent when no-fault divorce was introduced, according to Margaret Brinig of the University of Iowa and Douglas Allen of Simon Fraser University. Mothers ‘are more likely to instigate separation, despite a deep attachment to their children and the evidence that many divorces harm children.’” ©2003 Level Wise powered by WordPress and Ad Clerum AdSense Theme + SEO

www.levelwise.org/women-divorce-and-domestic-violence.html

Stats today show the number is climbing around 80% female initiated no-fault divorce. The reason, primarily the shift is now that "staying together" isn't necessary for the benefit of the children.

RR

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:31:53 AM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:

I think the premise is pretty cool but if memory serves they are deeply religious being the wife of a promise keeper seems to be a fairly subserviant role.

It's my understanding that "traditional religious values" suggests the marital relationship be one where the wife does everything she can to serve her husband, and the husband does everything he can to support the wife. Definitely a two way street... equal effort required by both. Of course, that's just one guys lay opinion...

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:32:14 AM EDT

[#28]

Quoted:
Don't know if you've seen this organization, but it is a Christian men's group that focuses on how tough it is to be a man in today's world or something.

The thing that kills me is these stupid bumper stickers that I see on their cars. They say "I love my Wife".

Why on earth they feel the need to brag about something that they are supposed to do is beyond me. you don't see me with a bumper sticker that says "I pay my bills" or "I feed my dog". You're supposed to love your wife. You get no points from me for telling the world about it.

/rant

LOL. A sticker like that might get you some trouble in the ghetto.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:32:29 AM EDT

[#29]

I'm sure I'll get hammered for this comment but.......... To me this is another instance of a Secular Progressive that feels they have to bash anything that has to do with Christianity. So what if someone has "I love my wife" on their bumber. Why is it that some on here feel that they just have to bash Christian ideas? And before someone says well because they are hypocrites. Please. So is everybody else in some form or another.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:32:36 AM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:

Quoted:

I think the premise is pretty cool but if memory serves they are deeply religious being the wife of a promise keeper seems to be a fairly subserviant role.

It's my understanding that "traditional religious values" suggests the marital relationship be one where the wife does everything she can to serve her husband, and the husband does everything he can to support the wife. Definitely a two way street... equal effort required by both. Of course, that's just one guys lay opinion...

And pretty darn accurate at that.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:34:11 AM EDT

[#31]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Divorce rates are over 50% and 80% of those divorces are initiated by women. It is necessary for some men to councel one another in being good spirtual leaders so as not lose their families. If you are married then you know already that marriage isn't easy.

I'm not a member of promise keepers but my uncle is and it helped save his marriage.

RR

Actually, it's around 50/50.

Actually it's near 80%. Seen figures with sources cited during a meeting at church about this very organization. I will try to find the sources if I can but since the introduction of no fault divorce and female takes all- the numbers are not in the males favor.

RR

Religion doesn't appear to make much of a difference when it comes to willingness to divorce atheism.about.com/od/atheistfamiliesmarriage/a/AtheistsDivorce.htm

11% of all American adults are divorced
25% of all American adults have had at least one divorce

27% of born-again Christians have had at least one divorce
24% of all non-born-again Christians have been divorced

21% of atheists have been divorced
21% of Catholics and Lutherans have been divorced
24% of Mormons have been divorced
25% of mainstream Protestants have been divorced
29% of Baptists have been divorced
24% of nondenominational, independent Protestants have been divorced

27% of people in the South and Midwest have been divorced
26% of people in the West have been divorced
19% of people in the Northwest and Northeast have been divorced

Course those figures are almost 10 years old, but I'd bet educational background, income and age when married are probably more relevant to predicting whether a couple will divorce.

I am willing to bet that 90% of Arfcom would claim to be Christian or associated another family centric religion. Though less than 25% actually attend spiritual services more than once a month and even fewer are actually involved with church past this point. I am also willing to bet that 70%+ of married males on this board view porn on a regular basis and have had marriage problems. Just because someone states they are Christian, Jewish, or even Muslim- doesn't necessarily mean they are the spiritual leaders of their household.

RR

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:34:41 AM EDT

[#32]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Divorce rates are over 50% and 80% of those divorces are initiated by women. It is necessary for some men to council one another in being good spiritual leaders so as not lose their families. If you are married then you know already that marriage isn't easy.

I'm not a member of promise keepers but my uncle is and it helped save his marriage.

RR

Actually, it's around 50/50.

“Arizona State University psychologist Sanford Braver has shown that at least two-thirds of American divorces are initiated by women. Moreover, few of these divorces involve grounds such as desertion, adultery, or violence. The reasons most often given are ‘growing apart’ or ‘not feeling loved or appreciated.’ Other studies have reached similar conclusions. The proportion of divorces initiated by women climbed to more than 70 percent when no-fault divorce was introduced, according to Margaret Brinig of the University of Iowa and Douglas Allen of Simon Fraser University. Mothers ‘are more likely to instigate separation, despite a deep attachment to their children and the evidence that many divorces harm children.’” ©2003 Level Wise powered by WordPress and Ad Clerum AdSense Theme + SEO

www.levelwise.org/women-divorce-and-domestic-violence.html

Stats today show the number is climbing around 80% female initiated no-fault divorce. The reason, primarily the shift is now that "staying together" isn't necessary for the benefit of the children.

RR

First, you said 80% of divorces were initiated by women. Not 80% of no faults, 80% of divorces.

Second, without a citation to the study and its methodology the section you quote is meaningless.

Third, where are the stats on the 80%?

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:39:27 AM EDT

[#33]

Quoted:

Quoted:

I think the premise is pretty cool but if memory serves they are deeply religious being the wife of a promise keeper seems to be a fairly subserviant role.

It's my understanding that "traditional religious values" suggests the marital relationship be one where the wife does everything she can to serve her husband, and the husband does everything he can to support the wife. Definitely a two way street... equal effort required by both. Of course, that's just one guys lay opinion...

And pretty darn accurate at that.

The Bible says that wives submit to your husbands. But that does not mean that wives are a servant to the husband or under him. It means that the husband needs to be the spiritual leader and an example for the family. However, many people including N.O.W., fail to read the rest of the paragraph. If you read on, it also states that men love your wife like Christ loved the church and gave his life for it. To me, it seems like men have a lot to live up to in regard to how they need to treat their wives.

EDIT: I am not a member of PK.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:42:28 AM EDT

[#34]

Quoted:

Quoted:

I think the premise is pretty cool but if memory serves they are deeply religious being the wife of a promise keeper seems to be a fairly subserviant role.

It's my understanding that "traditional religious values" suggests the marital relationship be one where the wife does everything she can to serve her husband, and the husband does everything he can to support the wife. Definitely a two way street... equal effort required by both. Of course, that's just one guys lay opinion...

And pretty darn accurate at that.

The Bible says that wives submit to your husbands. But that does not mean that wives are a servant to the husband or under him. It means that the husband needs to be the spiritual leader and an example for the family. However, many people including N.O.W., fail to read the rest of the paragraph. If you read on, it also states that men love your wife like Christ loved the church and gave his life for it. To me, it seems like men have a lot to live up to in regard to how they need to treat their wives.

I could not agree more with that statement.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:43:34 AM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:
yeah, groups that help people remain accountable are SOOO stupid....

not the group but the people that feel the NEED for such a group seldom live by the principles. as with most things in our society they use the sound bites and bumper stickers to make themselves riteous.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:45:09 AM EDT

[#36]

Quoted:

It's my understanding that "traditional religious values" suggests the marital relationship be one where the wife does everything she can to serve her husband, and the husband does everything he can to support the wife. Definitely a two way street... equal effort required by both. Of course, that's just one guys lay opinion...

One serves and the other supports? Doesn't much sound like a two way street to me, but if both are happy then I am not judging. I just know that shit wouldn't fly in my house and I'm glad for that.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:46:30 AM EDT

[#37]

lesser men always hate those greater than them.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:47:35 AM EDT

[#38]

Quoted:

I am willing to bet that 90% of Arfcom would claim to be Christian or associated another family centric religion. Though less than 25% actually attend spiritual services more than once a month and even fewer are actually involved with church past this point. I am also willing to bet that 70%+ of married males on this board view porn on a regular basis and have had marriage problems. Just because someone states they are Christian, Jewish, or even Muslim- doesn't necessarily mean they are the spiritual leaders of their household.

RR

That might work to explain the difference btw atheists and baptists since no one is going to lie about being an atheist, while someone might claim to be a baptist and be non observant. However that would fail to explain baptists divorcing more often than catholics. Either you assume each group has the same percentage of people who claim to belong and don't follow the rules, or you have to assume that there are more divorcing non church going people among those who claim to be baptists, than among those who claim to be catholic and other religions.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:48:33 AM EDT

[#39]

Quoted:
lesser men always hate those greater than them.

greatness in this regard is hghly debateable.

it's not what you belong to but who you are.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:48:39 AM EDT

[#40]

Quoted:
Some people go out of their way to look for things to take offense at.

And this Christian says those haters can go to hell.

da-da-damn, St. Paul, okay, I'll pray for them... till they change their ways or DO go to hell.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:49:58 AM EDT

[#41]

I was at a PK conference in Knoxville years ago.
There was a bookstore set up in a tent out in the parking lot, and loudspeakers were set up so you wouldn't miss any of the speakers while you were out buying books, teeshirts, bumpers stickers, etc.

There were also about 6 NOW protesters there when the conference started on Saturday morning.
(They were actually carrying signs and everything.)
In short order, here's what the NOW protesters heard come out of the loudspeakers:
You don't hit your wife, you don't make financial decisions without your wife, you don't focus sexual attention on women other than your wife, you need to cherish your wife, you put your wife's needs before yours, and on and on.....

The NOW protesters apparently couldn't figure out what they were supposed to be protesting.

They left.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:50:38 AM EDT

[#42]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Divorce rates are over 50% and 80% of those divorces are initiated by women. It is necessary for some men to councel one another in being good spirtual leaders so as not lose their families. If you are married then you know already that marriage isn't easy.

I'm not a member of promise keepers but my uncle is and it helped save his marriage.

RR

Actually, it's around 50/50.

Actually it's near 80%. Seen figures with sources cited during a meeting at church about this very organization. I will try to find the sources if I can but since the introduction of no fault divorce and female takes all- the numbers are not in the males favor.

RR

Religion doesn't appear to make much of a difference when it comes to willingness to divorce atheism.about.com/od/atheistfamiliesmarriage/a/AtheistsDivorce.htm

11% of all American adults are divorced
25% of all American adults have had at least one divorce

27% of born-again Christians have had at least one divorce
24% of all non-born-again Christians have been divorced

21% of atheists have been divorced
21% of Catholics and Lutherans have been divorced
24% of Mormons have been divorced
25% of mainstream Protestants have been divorced
29% of Baptists have been divorced
24% of nondenominational, independent Protestants have been divorced

27% of people in the South and Midwest have been divorced
26% of people in the West have been divorced
19% of people in the Northwest and Northeast have been divorced

Course those figures are almost 10 years old, but I'd bet educational background, income and age when married are probably more relevant to predicting whether a couple will divorce.

Those statistics really have NO relevance. People claim they are one denomination or another - though they may not be active in it at all. OR they may have been divorced before they became involved with the church.

To see if religious counseling helps marriages one would have to follow a study that tracks that specifically.

Personally - I have seen where strong faith of both parties have served as a foundation to fix problems. I also know that from a personal view point, I am not as religious as my wife, and she would like me to take a more dominant role in directing our spirituality.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:51:06 AM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:
I'm sure I'll get hammered for this comment but.......... To me this is another instance of a Secular Progressive that feels they have to bash anything that has to do with Christianity. So what if someone has "I love my wife" on their bumber. Why is it that some on here feel that they just have to bash Christian ideas? And before someone says well because they are hypocrites. Please. So is everybody else in some form or another.

yes, because only Christians can love their wives.

Actually, you unintentionally hit on the reason the Promise Keepers DO bother people. it is yet one more example where "Christians" look down on the "heathen" masses.

Just like many "Christians" here on arfcom insist that a man cannot be moral unless he is Christian - or at least theist - Promise Keepers often act as if the only alternative to their group is adultery and spousal neglect. This is classic weak-minded projection, and is akin to the anti-gunners who do not want us armed since they fear that if THEY had a gun, they would go on a shooting rampage.

The fact that plenty of people go though life and marriage just fine without joining Promise Keepers, and have perfectly happy marriages, is just simply not considered. It is the same mental exercise as when "Christians" ignore the atheists who go through life treating their fellow man with respect and dignity, while making a big issue out of people who are psychopaths.

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:56:22 AM EDT

[#44]

Quoted:
Promise Keepers goes way beyond bragging about loving their wives.

They have been around for a LONG time and are a fairly big org. Or at least they were haven't heard much about them since they had a ton of public attention in the 90s.

I think the premise is pretty cool but if memory serves they are deeply religious being the wife of a promise keeper seems to be a fairly subserviant role.

Per God's word, husbands and wives have different roles in the family. The wife is subordinate tto the husband - this is as it should be, since it is the husband's duty to die for her, if needed to protect her. Thus, if the husband orders her to "shut up and get back in the house" in the middle of a confrontation with the neighbors, she needs to get to steppin', and not continue to mouth off and escalate the situation, for one....

Posted: 6/2/2008 7:59:14 AM EDT

[#45]

Quoted:

Quoted:

I think the premise is pretty cool but if memory serves they are deeply religious being the wife of a promise keeper seems to be a fairly subserviant role.

It's my understanding that "traditional religious values" suggests the marital relationship be one where the wife does everything she can to serve her husband, and the husband does everything he can to support the wife. Definitely a two way street... equal effort required by both. Of course, that's just one guys lay opinion...

To be honest with you, the misunderstanding hinted at by BadShovelhead is part of the genesis of the "I Love My Wife" slogan.

The other reason is the verses that state:
Wives submit yourselves to your husbands, and husbands love your wives as Christ loves the Church and gave himself up for her.

I fail to find anything offensive there.

Posted: 6/2/2008 8:00:05 AM EDT

[#46]

Quoted:

Per God's word, husbands and wives have different roles in the family. The wife is subordinate tto the husband - this is as it should be, since it is the husband's duty to die for her, if needed to protect her. Thus, if the husband orders her to "shut up and get back in the house" in the middle of a confrontation with the neighbors, she needs to get to steppin', and not continue to mouth off and escalate the situation, for one....

Man it's like you are living in 208 AD, not 2008. Societies evolve. (I realize that is a scary word for some people on here). While the above may work in some relationships, it is not right for everyone and to say otherwise is just plain ignorant.

Posted: 6/2/2008 8:01:23 AM EDT

[#47]

Quoted:
Wasn't this group accused of advocating total domination of the household by the husband??? That doesn't seem right!...Does it???

If you read the Bible, you would see that both the man and the woman have clearly defined roles in the family. Ultimate authority is vested in the man, as is the ultimate sacrifice, if necessary. Since that authority is from God, the man had better not use his authority given by God for trivial or selfish purposes, but rather to ensure the physical safety and spiritual grouth of his family. For example, he'd better not insist on watching the NASCAR race or NFL game just because that's what HE wants to watch - on the other hand, if he feels like a show like "Sid and Nancy" or "Wife Swap" is spiritually inappropriate for his family to watch, then he SHOULD change the channel to something else.

Posted: 6/2/2008 8:03:53 AM EDT

[#48]

"The Promise Keepers -----A bunch of LOSERS

Posted: 6/2/2008 8:06:23 AM EDT

[#49]

Quoted:

Quoted:
yeah, groups that help people remain accountable are SOOO stupid....

not the group but the people that feel the NEED for such a group seldom live by the principles. as with most things in our society they use the sound bites and bumper stickers to make themselves riteous.

So because it doesn;t work 100% of the time for 100% of the people, we should just chuck it, right? Goodbye AA, space program, trial by jury, ALL medical treatments, ....

Posted: 6/2/2008 8:08:36 AM EDT

[#50]

Quoted:

Quoted:
I'm sure I'll get hammered for this comment but.......... To me this is another instance of a Secular Progressive that feels they have to bash anything that has to do with Christianity. So what if someone has "I love my wife" on their bumber. Why is it that some on here feel that they just have to bash Christian ideas? And before someone says well because they are hypocrites. Please. So is everybody else in some form or another.

yes, because only Christians can love their wives.

Actually, you unintentionally hit on the reason the Promise Keepers DO bother people. it is yet one more example where "Christians" look down on the "heathen" masses.

Just like many "Christians" here on arfcom insist that a man cannot be moral unless he is Christian - or at least theist - Promise Keepers often act as if the only alternative to their group is adultery and spousal neglect. This is classic weak-minded projection, and is akin to the anti-gunners who do not want us armed since they fear that if THEY had a gun, they would go on a shooting rampage.

The fact that plenty of people go though life and marriage just fine without joining Promise Keepers, and have perfectly happy marriages, is just simply not considered. It is the same mental exercise as when "Christians" ignore the atheists who go through life treating their fellow man with respect and dignity, while making a big issue out of people who are psychopaths.

So just because someone has an "I love my wife" sticker on their car you think that they are telling you that you are immoral? WOW. And no where in my post did I say that only Christians love their wives. My whole point was that so what if someone had a sticker that says "I love my wife." I do however take some offense that just because I am a Christian I am weak minded. I am by far weak minded.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - What is up with "The Promise Keepers"??? (Page 2 of 4)

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