User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 7:56:20 AM EDT
[#1]
Bats are not an easy weapon for even a strong adult in their prime to use well. You need room and time to wind up and swing it to do any real damage. I wasn't there, so I don't know if there were mitigating circumstances, but I would say that it's very possible for an adult male who's strong enough to be a police officer to disarm an older woman wielding a baseball bat without using lethal force. Unless he was afraid she had another, concealed weapon or could conceivably take his gun, I think using a stun gun before drawing his pistol would probably have been wiser.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 8:59:50 AM EDT
[#2]
Shooting someone with a bat? Good thing it didn't happen in an area where Jeanine Pirro is the DA.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 9:01:19 AM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
As someone whose been hit in the head by a nice swing with a baseball bat, its not something you will soon forget. I promise you that.  Yep, BTDT. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 9:01:25 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Bats are not an easy weapon for even a strong adult in their prime to use well. You need room and time to wind up and swing it to do any real damage. I wasn't there, so I don't know if there were mitigating circumstances, but I would say that it's very possible for an adult male who's strong enough to be a police officer to disarm an older woman wielding a baseball bat without using lethal force. Unless he was afraid she had another, concealed weapon or could conceivably take his gun, I think using a stun gun before drawing his pistol would probably have been wiser. What exactly, is a "stun gun" and did the officer have one in the first place? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 9:04:17 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What exactly, is a "stun gun" and did the officer have one in the first place? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Bats are not an easy weapon for even a strong adult in their prime to use well. You need room and time to wind up and swing it to do any real damage. I wasn't there, so I don't know if there were mitigating circumstances, but I would say that it's very possible for an adult male who's strong enough to be a police officer to disarm an older woman wielding a baseball bat without using lethal force. Unless he was afraid she had another, concealed weapon or could conceivably take his gun, I think using a stun gun before drawing his pistol would probably have been wiser. What exactly, is a "stun gun" and did the officer have one in the first place? Reports say he had a Taser and he is already getting second guessed for not using it. He's been placed on modified duty and stripped of his badge and all pistols. Pols are already trying to compare it to the Eleanor Bumpurs case and to get him charged. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 9:16:49 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not a bat, but, I was hit across the face with a golf driver once, by a grown man and not a 66 year old woman. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: What kind of a pussy do you have to be to shoot a 66 year old woman that has a baseball bat? Ever get your head cracked open by a baseball bat? Here's your sign. Yes, the fact that you've suffered a traumatic head injury is very evident when I read your posts in this thread. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 9:20:48 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What kind of a pussy do you have to be to shoot a 66 year old woman that has a baseball bat? You get hit with a baseball bat and get back to us. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 9:24:51 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Pick any 66 year old woman, give her any kind of bat you chose, put us both in a room with instructions for her to harm me, and I guarantee I will leave the room with the bat with us both unharmed. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Threads like these are funny. Cop shoots an aggressive dog, GD wants to burn him at the stake. Cop shoots a 66 year old woman with a bat, who can do less damage than the dog ever could, and GD says she had it conning. I've never seen a dog give you a split skull and a concussion. I've seen a 11-year old girl do just that to a adult woman (Her teacher) with a softball bat. Crippled her for life. Do you think a pre-teen is stronger than a 66-year old woman? You just keep on making stupid statements and we'll point and laugh at you. Insert "oh we got a badass over here" meme here. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 9:32:03 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Insert "oh we got a badass over here" meme here. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Pick any 66 year old woman, give her any kind of bat you chose, put us both in a room with instructions for her to harm me, and I guarantee I will leave the room with the bat with us both unharmed. Insert "oh we got a badass over here" meme here. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 9:58:01 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is where I see you're failing at applying critical thinking skills to this scenario. The problem is not whether or not you are strong enough to wrestle the bat from her hands after you get control of it, the problem is can you guarantee without a single doubt that you will be able to get a hold of the bat before she is able to land a strike. 9 times out of 10 that answer would be yes for most all of us here. When you make a living putting yourself in these situations, however, you are going to run in to that 10th time eventually if you keep taking stupid chances. This |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 10:20:52 AM EDT
[#11]
If they were in an open area such as a parking lot with a car between them then yes, the time, the distance and a barrier between them could have offered the cop another option such as more verbal commands, mace, taser, waiting her out or even retreating.
More likely that they were in a tiny cluttered apartment standing only a few feet apart and the cop had 4 or 5 other cops standing right behind him in the doorway and couldn't even take a step backward without tripping over his 'backup' I say good shoot. Unfortunate that SHE put him in this situation and forced him to shoot her. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 10:34:02 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
"The sergeant was armed with a Taser. It was not deployed, and the reason it was not deployed will be part of the investigation and review," said Assistant Chief Larry Nikunen." Next question is: Did he have time/space to deploy it, and were other officers at the scene and in position to provide lethal force cover? Tasers are highly unreliable, IME, and shouldn't be deployed in a "lethal force" situation unless other officers can cover the threat with lethal force. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 10:35:17 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Bats are not an easy weapon for even a strong adult in their prime to use well. You need room and time to wind up and swing it to do any real damage. I wasn't there, so I don't know if there were mitigating circumstances, but I would say that it's very possible for an adult male who's strong enough to be a police officer to disarm an older woman wielding a baseball bat without using lethal force. Unless he was afraid she had another, concealed weapon or could conceivably take his gun, I think using a stun gun before drawing his pistol would probably have been wiser. Sorry but I am not using LTL tools against someone attempting to use deadly force on me. You can sign up and do that all you want though. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 11:12:03 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sorry but I am not using LTL tools against someone attempting to use deadly force on me. You can sign up and do that all you want though. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Bats are not an easy weapon for even a strong adult in their prime to use well. You need room and time to wind up and swing it to do any real damage. I wasn't there, so I don't know if there were mitigating circumstances, but I would say that it's very possible for an adult male who's strong enough to be a police officer to disarm an older woman wielding a baseball bat without using lethal force. Unless he was afraid she had another, concealed weapon or could conceivably take his gun, I think using a stun gun before drawing his pistol would probably have been wiser. Sorry but I am not using LTL tools against someone attempting to use deadly force on me. You can sign up and do that all you want though. I wouldn't sign up at my age...too hard to recovery from injuries once you get past 50. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 2:20:46 PM EDT
[#15]
Link
The sergeant who fatally shot a troubled 66-year-old Bronx woman did not follow NYPD procedures on how to handle the mentally ill, the city’s top cop said Wednesday.
"We do have policies and procedures for emotionally disturbed people and it appears those procedures weren’t followed,” NYPD Commissioner James O’Neill told reporters about the death following a breakfast sponsored by the Citizens Crime Commission of New York City. Sgt. Hugh Barry was stripped of his badge and gun after he fatally shot Deborah Danner inside her Pugsley Ave. apartment Tuesday evening in Castle Hill. Mayor de Blasio echoed his newly-appointed top cop in assessing the fatal shooting. ....and in related news.... 
Link A record number of NYPD cops looked into retirement from the department Tuesday night, as hundreds packed a Queens banquet hall for a pension benefit seminar. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 2:22:42 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What kind of a pussy do you have to be to shoot a 66 year old woman that has a baseball bat? Cleaning the gene pool kind? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 2:23:25 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ever get your head cracked open by a baseball bat? Here's your sign. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
What kind of a pussy do you have to be to shoot a 66 year old woman that has a baseball bat? Ever get your head cracked open by a baseball bat? Here's your sign. And coloring books.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 2:29:43 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A record number of NYPD cops looked into retirement from the department Tuesday night, as hundreds packed a Queens banquet hall for a pension benefit seminar. I believe some members on here have said that it has nothing to do with the current climate. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 6:20:58 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Bats are not an easy weapon for even a strong adult in their prime to use well. You need room and time to wind up and swing it to do any real damage. I wasn't there, so I don't know if there were mitigating circumstances, but I would say that it's very possible for an adult male who's strong enough to be a police officer to disarm an older woman wielding a baseball bat without using lethal force. Unless he was afraid she had another, concealed weapon or could conceivably take his gun, I think using a stun gun before drawing his pistol would probably have been wiser. Yet people claim LE is using deadly force when the ASP or PR-24 comes out............. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 6:22:34 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yet people claim LE is using deadly force when the ASP or PR-24 comes out............. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Bats are not an easy weapon for even a strong adult in their prime to use well. You need room and time to wind up and swing it to do any real damage. I wasn't there, so I don't know if there were mitigating circumstances, but I would say that it's very possible for an adult male who's strong enough to be a police officer to disarm an older woman wielding a baseball bat without using lethal force. Unless he was afraid she had another, concealed weapon or could conceivably take his gun, I think using a stun gun before drawing his pistol would probably have been wiser. Yet people claim LE is using deadly force when the ASP or PR-24 comes out............. Had a guy who had a 5 foot "walking stick" swing at me with it. I blocked it with a swing from my PR-24 and knocked it out of his hand. His eyes grew big, he screamed and ran off. I was laughing too hard to give chase. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 6:24:02 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Better her than him. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
As the 66 year old woman armed with a baseball bat menacingly advanced towards the officer... Better her than him. Agreed. OP likely has never seen the results of somebody struck in the head/face with a baseball bat. The end result of such an attack would be death or serious bodily injury (which SHOCKER!) is the very basis for self-defense with a firearm. Quoted:
What kind of a pussy do you have to be to shoot a 66 year old woman that has a baseball bat? Again. Why do we have to keep doing this to ourselves? You have no idea what the 66 year old looked like, what kind of physical condition she was in, and the like. Stop falling into this sort of stupid behavior and just pay attention to what the law in almost every state has to say on the subject. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 6:30:57 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Threads like these are funny. Cop shoots an aggressive dog, GD wants to burn him at the stake. Cop shoots a 66 year old woman with a bat, who can do less damage than the dog ever could, and GD says she had it conning. Truth at its finest 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 10:07:45 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not a bat, but, I was hit across the face with a golf driver once, by a grown man and not a 66 year old woman. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
What kind of a pussy do you have to be to shoot a 66 year old woman that has a baseball bat? Ever get your head cracked open by a baseball bat? Here's your sign. It shows. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 10:12:27 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What kind of a pussy do you have to be to shoot a 66 year old woman that has a baseball bat? So you just stand there and take the hit? And when you get knocked the fuck out, and she takes your gun, what then? My wife is 65, and she could take your fucking head off with a bat. So maybe get off your high horse. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 10:13:59 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I know exactly what a bat can do. If you are a grown man and a 66 year old woman with a bat scares you enough to shoot her, you have no business as a LEO. Just because you can justifiable shoot someone does not always mean you should. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: What kind of a pussy do you have to be to shoot a 66 year old woman that has a baseball bat? Says the guy that's never seen what someone with a bat can do to you. Put down the bong son, you are high. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 10:31:06 PM EDT
[#26]
As some people here may know, I'm quite against cops unnecessarily escalating the situation.
In this case, though, I'd say the shooting could have been justified. Would I shoot in the same situation? Probably not. I kinda know how to deal with a bat. Depends, though. And the fact cop got the lady to put down scissors tells me he was trying to deal with the problem peacefully before shit hit the fan. EDIT: I've had my ass kicked by a 66+ year old dude when I was 23 or so. Not ashamed to admit it, either. Oh, and I still have a dent in my skull from that girl with a metal pipe. Shit happens. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 10:34:46 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As some people here may know, I'm quite against cops unnecessarily escalating the situation. Here, though, I'd say the shooting could have been justified. Would I shoot in the same situation? Probably not. I kinda know how to deal with a bat. Depends, though. And the fact cop got the lady to put down scissors tells me he was trying to deal with the problem peacefully before shit hit the fan. EDIT: I've had my ass kicked by a 66+ year old dude when I was 23 or so. Not ashamed to admit it, either. Oh, and I still have a dent in my skull from that girl with a metal pipe. Shit happens. My father at 56 could kick my azz and I was just out of the academy. RIP dad. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/19/2016 10:42:03 PM EDT
[#28]
I would have shot the bat and the scissors out of her hands
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/20/2016 10:26:47 PM EDT
[#29]
Link
An official police firing-range target proves that a cop was justified in fatally shooting a bat-wielding, emotionally disturbed woman in The Bronx, an NYPD union leader said Thursday.
Ed Mullins of the Sergeants Benevolent Association released a copy of the target, which shows five male figures — including one armed with a baseball bat. “All members of this department receive firearms training twice a year. As you can see we are taught by this department that a baseball bat is a deadly weapon and as such Sgt. [Hugh] Barry reacted in accordance to the deadly physical force being used against him and the training we all receive,” Mullins said. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/20/2016 10:33:20 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted:
Link An official police firing-range target proves that a cop was justified in fatally shooting a bat-wielding, emotionally disturbed woman in The Bronx, an NYPD union leader said Thursday.
Ed Mullins of the Sergeants Benevolent Association released a copy of the target, which shows five male figures — including one armed with a baseball bat. “All members of this department receive firearms training twice a year. As you can see we are taught by this department that a baseball bat is a deadly weapon and as such Sgt. [Hugh] Barry reacted in accordance to the deadly physical force being used against him and the training we all receive,” Mullins said. Wat lol |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/20/2016 10:33:55 PM EDT
[#31]
Quoted:
They say a sergeant persuaded the woman to drop the scissors. They say after she put down the scissors she grabbed a baseball bat and tried to strike the sergeant, who fired two shots from his revolver and hit her in the torso. http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_POLICE_SHOOTING_BRONX?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2016-10-18-21-54-11 Mama always said don't run with scissors... |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/23/2016 9:56:33 AM EDT
[#32]
Link
But for the second time since those remarks, Mullins is pointing to hard evidence that police are trained to use deadly force when confronted by bat-wielding assailants.
Monday’s full page ad will feature “Question No. 6” from the Police Academy’s deadly physical force test, which Mullins says proves that cops are taught to shoot in situations similar to Danner’s. “With a baseball bat in his hands, an emotionally disturbed man charges at a police officer and threatens to break his nose,” the academy asks in a test question. “The officer is backed against a wall,” the question continues. “Based on the department’s guidelines on the use of force and deadly physical force . . .” The test-taker is then presented with a series of multiple-choice answers. The correct answer is, “Because the suspect is threatening imminent deadly physical force, the officer may shoot.” |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
