MSNBC: GWB suspends posse comitatus in Gulf region -- 7,000 active duty 82nd Airborne deployed - Page 2

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - MSNBC: GWB suspends posse comitatus in Gulf region -- 7,000 active duty 82nd Airborne deployed (Page 2 of 2)

Posted: 9/3/2005 8:30:17 AM EDT

[#1]

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It has no place in modern times, where all it does is prevent the use of the regular Army in situations like the present disaster relief.

Yeah, the founding fathers didn't understand that whole "freedom" thing did they....

You do understand that the FF's have nothing to do with this act. It was put in place after the civil war.

Using that phrase "founding fathers" over and over is just making you appear to be an idiot.

Posted: 9/3/2005 8:34:58 AM EDT

[#2]

About time. Everyone jumped down my throat yesterday when I suggested this, including one moron who assumed this meant they would do a combat drop into New Orleans.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=5&t=385621

Posted: 9/3/2005 8:39:53 AM EDT

[#3]

Quoted:
Using that phrase "founding fathers" over and over is just making you appear to be an idiot.

And totally forgetting the concept "In order to form a more perfect Union" makes you smart?

Posted: 9/3/2005 8:43:16 AM EDT

[#4]

Guarandamntee you No is going to sue the gummit.

Posted: 9/3/2005 9:04:42 AM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:

You do understand that the FF's have nothing to do with this act. It was put in place after the civil war.

Using that phrase "founding fathers" over and over is just making you appear to be an idiot.

You can read, but you don't understand. It is true that the PC act was put in place after the Civil War and for a reason. The aftermath of the Civil War was the first time that this country had a large standing army in peacetime - something the founding fathers warned against.

That said, I think that it is appropriate to suspend the act in the region affected by Katrina. Local and state PDs don't have the resources to deal with the complete lack of infrastructure in the area. This isn't a seizure of power by the Feds, it is the Feds filling a vacuum.

The ROE will likely be restrictive. Haven't seen it, but I would imagine that lethal force will be reserved for self defense.

Posted: 9/3/2005 9:12:33 AM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Using that phrase "founding fathers" over and over is just making you appear to be an idiot.

And totally forgetting the concept "In order to form a more perfect Union" makes you smart?

And Lets not forget that "Taxation without Representation" sprang from a war with the French, started by a Militia LTC from Virgina asasinating a French Diplomat. I can never remember the milita officers name, perhaps it will come to me
...........................................................................George something or other

Posted: 9/3/2005 9:13:19 AM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
Guarandamntee you No is going to sue the gummit.

Guarandamntee you they can pound sand.

Posted: 9/3/2005 9:45:47 AM EDT

[#8]

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Just heard it on MSNBC. GWB has suspended posse comitatus and is deploying 82nd.

www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9186823/

You are wrong, nowhere does the story says that this law has been suspended. I think that would be precedant setting IF he did. During the 1992 Los Angeles Riots, the National Guard was deployed and they complied with the act, the only thing was that the military could not have fully automatic weapons, and one thing that kept the NG from deploying was they need to install the flimsy sheet metal plates to prevent full-auto fire on the M16s. It took the authorities at least one whole before they can deploy the Guard.

Read later down... I already stated that it was on the air that the talking heads stated posse comitatus was suspended. That's how it got my attention to begin with.

Oh sorry, I thought it in the story. But, any who, I would not put too much stock into those talking heads and know it when they are away from their pre-written script and are ad-libbing, those folks are "loose as a goose with facts and figures." Judging in the past how they report gun-related stories on how they got it all wrong.

Posted: 9/3/2005 10:07:27 AM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:
It has no place in modern times, where all it does is prevent the use of the regular Army in situations like the present disaster relief.

Doesn't seem to be preventing them from helping now.

Posted: 9/3/2005 10:35:09 AM EDT

[#10]

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When and if they have to shoot some of these barbarians the media will claim they would not have been killed if they were white.

I think what will happen is the looters and shooters will suddenly turn into meek little victims. So, the situation will be under control and everyone can say that Bush should have done this days ago.

Dont count on that, they have freedom to run NOLA like Somali warlords right now, and when the 82nd starts taking that away there will definetly be shooting. The good news being that Airborne units WONT hunker down and wait, they will shoot, displace, COMMUNICATE, flank, and overcome the threat.

Shoot, move, communicate.

[shithouse lawyer] But...but...but.... the Army can't have any ammo in their weapons! Only the Marines and Navy can do that! [/shithouse lawyer]

OK FINE....Happy now?

De-wad your frilly pink panties, troop!

It was just a general statement not directed at you.

Carry on!

Posted: 9/3/2005 10:49:19 AM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
Actually, I listened to the president just now and all he said was active duty forces were being deployed, not that they were going to be used for law enforcement functions. Did I miss something? The courts have ruled that it is not a violation of posse comatatus to use the active duty forces for humanitarian purposes and thus freeing up civilian police and national guard to handle law enforcement.

DING DING DING, we have a winner

the .mil will not be doing "law enforcement" They will be on a "humanitarian" mission.

Posted: 9/3/2005 12:52:34 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Guarandamntee you No is going to sue the gummit.

Guarandamntee you they can pound sand.

YUP!

Posted: 9/3/2005 12:53:32 PM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Guarandamntee you No is going to try to sue the gummit.

Guarandamntee you they can pound sand.
YUP!

All of those school buses.

Posted: 9/3/2005 1:07:16 PM EDT

[#14]

.

Posted: 9/3/2005 1:11:19 PM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Actually, I listened to the president just now and all he said was active duty forces were being deployed, not that they were going to be used for law enforcement functions. Did I miss something? The courts have ruled that it is not a violation of posse comatatus to use the active duty forces for humanitarian purposes and thus freeing up civilian police and national guard to handle law enforcement.

DING DING DING, we have a winner

the .mil will not be doing "law enforcement" They will be on a "humanitarian" mission.

Yep. And if they just happen to be sweeping the area for survivors in need of rescue and armed undocumented shoppers start shooting at them.... well, they have to defend themselves.

Posted: 9/3/2005 1:56:36 PM EDT

[#16]

first they aint suspending pca, the exercising the parts of the act that allow for army units to be used as a pc.

second about the looters.. everyone wants to see dead thugs.. i'm sorry. these guys are mostly cowards and cocroaches. they might catch a few but the vast majority prolly have long since scurried into the cracks and dark corners...

this is prolly just bush's way of taking over and making a bit of a statement because the governor is basically a dumb twit deer caught in the headlights and the mayor is a blithering corrupt idiot and enough is enough already...

Posted: 9/3/2005 2:01:36 PM EDT

[#17]

From the MSNBC story:

Deployment specifics
The first plane carrying soldiers from the 82nd Airborne was due to arrive in New Orleans on Saturday afternoon, said Lt. Gen. Joseph Inge, deputy commander of Northern Command. Soldiers from the 1st brigade of the 1st Cavalry Division would begin arriving within 48 hours.

Active-duty soldiers would not be involved in law enforcement, Inge said, but would provide a variety of security and humanitarian assistance. He said it had not yet been decided whether all 7,200 extra active-duty troops would be sent to Louisiana or whether some would go to Mississippi.

The 82nd Airborne will send about 2,500 soldiers, the 1st Cavalry about 2,700, and the 1st Marine Expeditionary Force in Camp Pendleton, Calif., and the 2nd Marine Expeditionary Force at Camp Lejeune, N.C., would send 1,000 each.

Posted: 9/3/2005 2:21:10 PM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:
Actually, I listened to the president just now and all he said was active duty forces were being deployed, not that they were going to be used for law enforcement functions. Did I miss something? The courts have ruled that it is not a violation of posse comatatus to use the active duty forces for humanitarian purposes and thus freeing up civilian police and national guard to handle law enforcement.

Don't ding him too hard. I heard the same MSNBC announcement that POTUS was suspending Posse Comitatus in the Gulf Coast region. Thanks for clearing things up though.

Posted: 9/3/2005 5:42:15 PM EDT

[#19]

Humanitarian mission - with very sharp teeth.

Posted: 9/3/2005 6:54:46 PM EDT

[#20]

Why don't you idiots read the damn thing for effect. Notice that part about "unless authorized by Congress" whaddaya wanna bet that authorization was included in the Act PASSED by Congress and SIGNED by the Pres. In other words, they didn't annul, cancel, suspend the act. They just used the law as it is written.

And we have the idiots using terms like Zulus, I guess trying to impress us, but clearly not realizing that the Zulus as a term it doesn't work, and or he is trying to get the mouthbreathers piling in to what should be a peaceful and informative discussion of a point of law and get the thread locked.

You wanna bitch about looters find a bitch thread.

Posted: 9/3/2005 6:59:49 PM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:
Guarandamntee you No is going to sue the gummit.

For what ? the Mayor not using the authority he had to use the city and school buses for evacuating people, for not getting the assets he had to the hospitals in a timely manner to get the patients out, for the city not spending it's money on upgrading it's pumps instead of on Superdomes and casinos? for not making sure the city and parish hospitals put their emergency generators above sea level? because the city and parish codes didn't call for ERs above sea level?

oh that's right it's all George Bushes fault.

Posted: 9/3/2005 7:20:06 PM EDT

[#22]

That sucks... National Guard is ok,
but the US Army 82nd ABN?
Suspension is not necessary.

myit

Posted: 9/3/2005 7:25:55 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
IIRC the 82d has a pretty good record in being deployed stateside into urban centers populated by people not of european or asian lineage. Detroit? Arkansas College desegregation?

Birth of a euphemism.

PNoEoAL... hmm, bit of a mouthful, but apropos.

How about Not *asian (asian + Caucasians).

Posted: 9/3/2005 7:39:33 PM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Guarandamntee you No is going to try to sue the gummit.

For what ? the Mayor not using the authority he had to use the city and school buses for evacuating people, for not getting the assets he had to the hospitals in a timely manner to get the patients out, for the city not spending it's money on upgrading it's pumps instead of on Superdomes and casinos? for not making sure the city and parish hospitals put their emergency generators above sea level? because the city and parish codes didn't call for ERs above sea level?

oh that's right it's all George Bushes fault.[/quot) The mayor,govnr screwed up and they are pissed blaming bush for the post effect to shift the blame. No its not bushs fault one bit.

Posted: 9/3/2005 10:16:30 PM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Guarandamntee you No is going to try to sue the gummit.

For what ? the Mayor not using the authority he had to use the city and school buses for evacuating people, for not getting the assets he had to the hospitals in a timely manner to get the patients out, for the city not spending it's money on upgrading it's pumps instead of on Superdomes and casinos? for not making sure the city and parish hospitals put their emergency generators above sea level? because the city and parish codes didn't call for ERs above sea level?

oh that's right it's all George Bushes fault.[/quot) The mayor,govnr screwed up and they are pissed blaming bush for the post effect to shift the blame. No its not bushs fault one bit.

psst numbnuts I was being facetious.

Posted: 9/3/2005 10:19:26 PM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:
He suspended what?

Don't you watch any "James Bond 007 " movies, boy?

He meant PUSSY COMMUNISTS, at least that's what Sherrif Buford T. Justus calls it!

Posted: 9/3/2005 10:22:59 PM EDT

[#27]

The military can be deployed to maintain security for infrastructure. As long as they aren't out rying to arrest folks, they can stand guard all night long as much as they want. I never thought it was a good idea to put soldiers in the same line of work as LEO. The first time a group unloads on some "socio-nomically disenfranchised urban yutes" the SHTF.

Let the cops shoot em'.

Posted: 9/3/2005 10:31:25 PM EDT

[#28]

I would suspect that the active duty troops get used more for behind the scenes grunt work, like marshalling supplies, unloading trucks, pulling security on distribution points, and just plain releving some of the folks that have been going flat out for the last 5 or more days.

It's an infusion of fresh bodies, mostly. I doubt you will see any heavy equipment, but I am curious if the Marines will be bringing their AMTRACs. They seem like the perfect piece of gear for the situation in NO.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - MSNBC: GWB suspends posse comitatus in Gulf region -- 7,000 active duty 82nd Airborne deployed (Page 2 of 2)

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