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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:04:38 PM EDT
[#1]
It looks to me like the .50 on the turret is pinned between the turret, the track and the ground.
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:09:30 PM EDT
[#2]
wow
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:13:27 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Jagdpanzer IV, the Stug's replacment. The eight lower road wheels are the giveaway. http://www.missing-lynx.com/articles/german/jll70/Image415.jpg Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
JagdTiger http://www.100thww2.org/overview/Deadtnk2.jpg StuG http://www.100thww2.org/overview/Deadtank.jpg Jagdpanzer IV, the Stug's replacment. The eight lower road wheels are the giveaway. http://www.missing-lynx.com/articles/german/jll70/Image415.jpg No, the other image is a Stug IV. Look at the remains of the superstructure. The Jagdpanzer IV's armor was more sloped. Best books I've found on German armor is the Walter Spielberger series on German Armor. I have them all. 
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:21:40 PM EDT
[#4]
Okinawa 1945 - There is a longer version of this - the TC (guy in green t shirt w/pistol) was blown out turret when Sherman hit a mine. Tank flipped and caught on fire. The other four crew members burned. The section not shown here is them pulling the dead crew out in pieces.
The Death of a Tank |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:21:48 PM EDT
[#5]
I saw this in another thread...it is unusual how the tread is laid out in front of the tank and the turret is resting on it.
Possibility is the tank hit a small mine on the left side. The tread snapped, and the links spit the tread out in front of the tank. They tried to repair it, but couldn't, so put a large demo charge in the turret that set it all off. |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:24:17 PM EDT
[#6]
Hmmm, the M-2 looks salvageable.
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:25:53 PM EDT
[#7]
Maybe a direct hit with a 500kg bomb from a Stuka divebomber.
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:29:30 PM EDT
[#8]
 Sherman hit with an 88. Went in through the front and all the way out the back.  Tiger destroyed.  Tiger tank knocked out by 16' naval shell.  Unusual shot of a Russian AT round lodged into the gun mantel of a German tank.  Knocked out Tiger tank in Sicily.   Naval guns vs german armor.  He shows lieutenant Lihniakevich, who's destroyed two German tanks himself in the last battle, a hole from his shell in the "Tiger"'s turret. |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:38:34 PM EDT
[#9]
How did those tanks get hit by naval guns? Lucky rounds?
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:40:51 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How did those tanks get hit by naval guns? Lucky rounds? probably had a forward observer call in corrections. just a guess though. |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:41:42 PM EDT
[#11]
Quoted:
Damn, wonder what actually hit it.
I seriously doubt anybody survived if they were still in there. 
The photo is from a British book about the battle for Kasserine Pass. <a href="http://s21.photobucket.com/user/bytor94/media/10456024_631019320321417_3442145137_zps8ccb8486.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b265/bytor94/10456024_631019320321417_3442145137_zps8ccb8486.jpg</a> Bad welding 
Sorry ... |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:44:05 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Got derped by a KV-2.  |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:51:40 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I remember reading a story about that battle that the Germans were using their long-range artillery like civil-war canon, meaning they were shooting at things with a level barrel. I forget which artillery and which story, though. Might explain what hit the Sherman, though. I know they used their anti-aircraft 88 guns on allied tanks. ..."An American military observer who had many opportunities to witness this gun in Germany in 1940, speaks of this weapon as follows: "The 88 MM is basically a gun for firing on moving targets. The crew is also specially trained for firing on highly rapid moving targets, primarily on airplanes. The whole control apparatus is designed for fast moving targets with a very rapid rate of fire: 25 rounds per minute. The gun is capable of great volume fire and extreme accuracy against moving targets of any type. It is equally efficient on targets on the ground as well as in the air. For attacks on armored vehicles, it is provided with a special armor-piercing shell."..." Link |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:52:01 PM EDT
[#14]
Or.............someone inside fired a Glock.
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Posted: 6/6/2014 1:56:43 PM EDT
[#15]
  A tank hit by an 88-shell. The driver had poked his head out, his remains, completely shrunken and charred.  Tiger hit with a 105mm HE-T round.  2nd hit the right side of the turret and blew off the coupla.  HE hit on the side of the turret on this Cromwell.  Destroyed Panzer IV during Dec 1944 German Ardennes Offensive in Belgium and Luxembourg. Tank ripped apart by secondary catastrophic internal ammunition.  King Tiger vs 122mm AP shells.  Soviet officers standing on King Tiger.    |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 4:34:20 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Jagdpanzer IV, the Stug's replacment. The eight lower road wheels are the giveaway. http://www.missing-lynx.com/articles/german/jll70/Image415.jpg Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
JagdTiger http://www.100thww2.org/overview/Deadtnk2.jpg StuG http://www.100thww2.org/overview/Deadtank.jpg Jagdpanzer IV, the Stug's replacment. The eight lower road wheels are the giveaway. http://www.missing-lynx.com/articles/german/jll70/Image415.jpg Except the blowed up one has nine interwoven road wheels, and the wheels are much larger than on the one you show. Just sayin'. |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 4:44:52 PM EDT
[#17]
Older guy my Dad drove trucks with had hauled destroyed tanks from all over Europe to be melted down after the war.
German tanks, British tanks, American tanks, French tanks. They were scattered all over the place. He said he looked into a few. The worst part was the hair. The bodies had been removed, the blood had washed away...but the hair was still there. Pretty gruesome. |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 5:00:09 PM EDT
[#18]
Doesn't look like the Sherman went through a cook off fire. The rubber block on the tracks are still intact and not melted. If it's Kasserine then t must be an early M4A3 with the trailing idler and direct vision slots. What you guys think might be shell hole in the radio hatch looks to me like the direct vision slot wide open.
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Posted: 6/6/2014 5:01:31 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Doesn't look like the Sherman went through a cook off fire. The rubber block on the tracks are still intact and not melted. If it's Kasserine then t must be an early M4A3 with the trailing idler and direct vision slots. What you guys think might be shell hole in the radio hatch looks to me like the direct vision slot wide open. Wouldn't a mine have broken the track? |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 5:12:42 PM EDT
[#20]
You can't see the right side damage but the right track looks broken. It's under the turret but the rubber blocks are still not melted.
This Sherman burned. You can see the metal skeleton remaining after the rubber block burned
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Posted: 6/6/2014 5:15:25 PM EDT
[#21]
Pop goes the Wiesel...
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Posted: 6/6/2014 5:30:19 PM EDT
[#22]
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Posted: 6/6/2014 5:33:22 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That takes one hell of a boom to open that thing up like a can like that. It peeled the armor plates at the weld just like they were a zip lock bag! The gear box and transmission is pulled away and separated from the hull. If there was a crew in there when it went up there isn't much left of them. 
No, the transmission is firmly in place - it's the lower part of the glacis with the drive wheels on the front. It's firmly in place. The big thing on the ground in front of the tank is the turret. |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 6:17:53 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My first wife's Dad was the only survivor of his tank crew in North Africa.He spent 27 months as a POW in Germany. I THINK his tank was an M3 ......but I don't remember for sure.He rarely said anything about it. He was one of the toughest guys I've ever known. Had a great uncle who was a tanker in N Africa, 3 purple hearts twice the only survivor of his crew. Had a nervous blink/tick and never had children because of it. Opened up to me one time while I was on leave, would talk a minute and trail off into a stare for a few seconds then move on to another memory. It was very rough for them early in the war he said he had a total of 8 wks training and strait to N Africa. The cost to ill prepared troops was high, and they were sent to buy time with blood. I pray it never happens to American young men again. |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 6:25:16 PM EDT
[#25]
No penetration on the hull welds either. They just un-zipped.
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Posted: 6/6/2014 6:31:47 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
All above destroyed by hyperkinetic rail gun rounds. Like so many "modern" weapons and other technology, these were developed and proven out in WWII but kept secret. Only later were they re-invented by non-Govt entities who made them public. Night vision equipment is another example. Well, you're partly right. The germans did have some night vision devices in use during WW II. http://www.achtungpanzer.com/german-infrared-night-vision-devices-infrarot-scheinwerfer.htm |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 6:59:27 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Had a great uncle who was a tanker in N Africa, 3 purple hearts twice the only survivor of his crew. Had a nervous blink/tick and never had children because of it. Opened up to me one time while I was on leave, would talk a minute and trail off into a stare for a few seconds then move on to another memory. It was very rough for them early in the war he said he had a total of 8 wks training and strait to N Africa. The cost to ill prepared troops was high, and they were sent to buy time with blood. I pray it never happens to American young men again. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
My first wife's Dad was the only survivor of his tank crew in North Africa.He spent 27 months as a POW in Germany. I THINK his tank was an M3 ......but I don't remember for sure.He rarely said anything about it. He was one of the toughest guys I've ever known. Had a great uncle who was a tanker in N Africa, 3 purple hearts twice the only survivor of his crew. Had a nervous blink/tick and never had children because of it. Opened up to me one time while I was on leave, would talk a minute and trail off into a stare for a few seconds then move on to another memory. It was very rough for them early in the war he said he had a total of 8 wks training and strait to N Africa. The cost to ill prepared troops was high, and they were sent to buy time with blood. I pray it never happens to American young men again. Yikes! There was something recently on the ? History Channel about this. The way they described what they went through was brutal. There is something to be said about experienced vs. inexperienced troops. |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 7:08:20 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Wouldn't a mine have broken the track? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Doesn't look like the Sherman went through a cook off fire. The rubber block on the tracks are still intact and not melted. If it's Kasserine then t must be an early M4A3 with the trailing idler and direct vision slots. What you guys think might be shell hole in the radio hatch looks to me like the direct vision slot wide open. Wouldn't a mine have broken the track? Depends on the mine |
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Posted: 6/6/2014 7:25:00 PM EDT
[#29]
Damn
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Posted: 6/6/2014 8:26:41 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryNearly cut the first guy in half. Second guy had his head turned into s shredded mess. Almost no head there. WWII tank warfare wasn't pretty. |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 2:57:47 AM EDT
[#31]
That's one of a series of pictures of U.S. 1st Armored Division Shermans that were knocked out and abandoned during the Feb 14, 1943 tank battle at Sidi Bouzid, Tunisia. German combat engineers placed demo charges in them to prevent them from being recovered and repaired.
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Posted: 6/7/2014 3:36:11 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryThose few seconds of film are a lot more instructive about war than that Saving Private Ryan movie that you guys seem to worship. |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 3:46:28 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
there's a hole above the front MG mount, just below the radio operators hatch. Is that a entry hole from an 88? edit: beat to it No, that's an early M4 with direct vision slots. That's not a hole, it's a vision slot. |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 4:29:40 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Entirely possible that the tank was immobilized and the allies didn't have time to recover it before unassing the area. In that case, engineers could have packed in a bunch of explosives and destroyed it rather than let the enemy get it. (Germans were known to put captured tanks into service) Most of the catastrophic damage pics of Abrams tanks you'll find on the internet were from us destroying them in place after they became disabled. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Damn, wonder what actually hit it.
I seriously doubt anybody survived if they were still in there.
The photo is from a British book about the battle for Kasserine Pass. <a href="http://s21.photobucket.com/user/bytor94/media/10456024_631019320321417_3442145137_zps8ccb8486.jpg.html" target="_blank">http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b265/bytor94/10456024_631019320321417_3442145137_zps8ccb8486.jpg</a> Seriously doubt?. Surviving that isn't a consideration. Entirely possible that the tank was immobilized and the allies didn't have time to recover it before unassing the area. In that case, engineers could have packed in a bunch of explosives and destroyed it rather than let the enemy get it. (Germans were known to put captured tanks into service) Most of the catastrophic damage pics of Abrams tanks you'll find on the internet were from us destroying them in place after they became disabled. Wouldn't they have taken the .50 cal with them? (I ASSume if they had time to plant explosives on the tank, they would have had time to dismount the machine gun) |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 4:33:19 AM EDT
[#35]
if it was in africa, shermans did not have wet ammo storage yet, regardless that an AT mine would not blow the tank anyway.
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Posted: 6/7/2014 4:37:24 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
probably had a forward observer call in corrections. just a guess though. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
How did those tanks get hit by naval guns? Lucky rounds? probably had a forward observer call in corrections. just a guess though. no 16 inchers at D-day on the US beach, but BB-59 served in Africa in 42 |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 4:46:23 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No, the transmission is firmly in place - it's the lower part of the glacis with the drive wheels on the front. It's firmly in place. The big thing on the ground in front of the tank is the turret. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
That takes one hell of a boom to open that thing up like a can like that. It peeled the armor plates at the weld just like they were a zip lock bag! The gear box and transmission is pulled away and separated from the hull. If there was a crew in there when it went up there isn't much left of them.
No, the transmission is firmly in place - it's the lower part of the glacis with the drive wheels on the front. It's firmly in place. The big thing on the ground in front of the tank is the turret. This. If the transmission were separated, the entire lower-front "corner" on the hull would be pulled off. Frontal transmission, which while it did have the negative consequence of raising the vehicle's overall height, made maintenance relatively easy and put the additional metal of the tranny and final-drive in front of the crew in the hull. |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 5:47:23 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
no 16 inchers at D-day on the US beach, but BB-59 served in Africa in 42 Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
How did those tanks get hit by naval guns? Lucky rounds? probably had a forward observer call in corrections. just a guess though. no 16 inchers at D-day on the US beach, but BB-59 served in Africa in 42 No 16" but there were 14" and 12" on the Texas and Arkansas respectively. |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 6:19:40 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That's one of a series of pictures of U.S. 1st Armored Division Shermans that were knocked out and abandoned during the Feb 14, 1943 tank battle at Sidi Bouzid, Tunisia. German combat engineers placed demo charges in them to prevent them from being recovered and repaired. broken track off). |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 6:28:40 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What vehicle is that? E-100, Maus? |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 8:18:05 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What vehicle is that? E-100, Maus? Quote HistoryQuoted:
What vehicle is that? E-100, Maus? Elephant maybe...? just my WAG. |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 8:25:42 AM EDT
[#42]
tag
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Posted: 6/7/2014 8:36:18 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What vehicle is that? E-100, Maus? Quote HistoryQuoted:
What vehicle is that? E-100, Maus? GW Tiger, huge self propelled gun that never made it past prototype tests. 
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Posted: 6/7/2014 8:37:35 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What vehicle is that? E-100, Maus? Quote HistoryQuoted:
What vehicle is that? E-100, Maus? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geschützwagen_Tiger |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 8:45:24 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Those few seconds of film are a lot more instructive about war than that Saving Private Ryan movie that you guys seem to worship. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Those few seconds of film are a lot more instructive about war than that Saving Private Ryan movie that you guys seem to worship. Especailly if you have ever done Body recovery on a freindly.
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Posted: 6/7/2014 8:55:57 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A Teller mine? Weren't those the big huge anti tank mines? Yeah, set off the ammunition storage, with probably some HE in there. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
A mine probably. That's most likely. A rather large one at that. A Teller mine? Weren't those the big huge anti tank mines? Yeah, set off the ammunition storage, with probably some HE in there. Possible, but there's absolutely no frag deformation that I can see on the armor....from neither the inside or outside. Just looks blown out from the back/bottom. |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 9:31:12 AM EDT
[#47]
Japanese tanks knocked out on Agat-Sumay Road by U.S. medium tanks.
 A knocked-out German PzKpfw IV tank with the burnt bodies of two of its crew.  German tank, across the Senio River. The Tiger was attacked by Piat mortar fire from a member of the 24th Battalion.  German Panthers knocked out near le Désert, 11 July. armored columns, claimed 19 tanks destroyed.    3 Squadron, 2nd (Armoured) Irish Guards, killed when his Sherman tank was knocked out during the advance towards Eindhoven, Operation 'Market-Garden'.   Marines examining destroyed tank, which was knocked out by a battery from the 10th Marines.  M-26 Tractor retrieving a knocked-out M-4 Sherman tank near Bastogne, Belgium, December 1944.  The T-34 '1941 version' lacked the vision cupola found on German tanks.  Knocked out Jagdpanther, East Prussia.  |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 11:41:07 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Is that a welded corner joint along the sides or cold-rolled? Is the thicker frontal plate riveted on? thoughts? just found one variant was cast and the remaining welded. that photo is symmetrically split opened along the welded seam. like someone mentioned, hopefully the crew was able to get out before or died instantly. God Bless! That is a rolled/welded hull Sherman. The row of "rivets" are actually bolts. The Sherman was front drive, so to get to the final drive and steering gear for service the curved part of the lower front hull was a bolted on removable section of cast armor on all models of Sherman. There were two styles of nose, a one piece casting and a three piece casting, the three piece design being almost the same as the Grant/Lee nose. This looks like a one piece nose, which I thought was only introduced after North Africa. However the turret is the right shape for 1942 production and there is no welded on applique armor on the sponson over the ammo racks (which did nothing but act as a aiming marker) And that does look like a shell hit that went into the right hull sponson, in 75mm gun Shermans there was a major ammo rack there holding about 3 dozen 75mm rounds horizontally with the shell noses pointing forward. 75mm gun Shermans carried either 99 or 101 rounds of 75mm depending on model, and to a certain extent on who is counting. That was an insane amount of ammunition packed into such a small hull. That incoming AP shot in that location had a high chance of hitting a 75mm HE round right on the nose in that position. I know the explosive that fills shells is supposed to be insensitive but... Also, that was most likely a PzGr 39 pattern APCBCHE shot from a long 75 or a 88mm. They had a HE bursting charge like naval AP shells, and the German fuzes worked as intended more often than not, unlike our 3"/76mm APCBCHE shells that had a strong propensity for premature detonation before they had penetrated the armor. That hit is positioned almost perfectly for the PzGr 39 to detonate right in the middle of the ammo rack on that side. |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 11:52:39 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's one of a series of pictures of U.S. 1st Armored Division Shermans that were knocked out and abandoned during the Feb 14, 1943 tank battle at Sidi Bouzid, Tunisia. German combat engineers placed demo charges in them to prevent them from being recovered and repaired. IT could be a picture from that series. But there is a shot hole in this particular Sherman to the right of the ball MG. I am not sure that this particular Sherman needed those charges. If it had been one that the Pionere demolished, I would think that they would take the .50 cal. with them, and not just guess that the turret would fall on it . |
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Posted: 6/7/2014 12:00:05 PM EDT
[#50]
I tell ya....as a former light infantryman....you gotta have B-B-B-BALLS OF STEEL to do armor or submarines, IMO.
B-B-B-BALLS OF STEEL, I say!!! |
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