Quoted: Im reading directly from beyonds the lions den and in UFC3 gracie threw in the towel on his second fight . Shamrock never agreed to the time limit said he wanted 2 hour fight but owners changed it. Your right about draw but gracie was carried from ring by his brothers if you watch it. Im not saying BJJ isnt effective , ive trained a little in it and I have a friend whos hardcore into it. And i will look forward to Gracies fight on News Year. And 2 of the  champs in the UFC right now, Liddell, and Frankin are strikers not grapplers. Not trying to start a fight over one martial art be superior to another.

Funny enough, Liddell is a purple belt in BJJ.

http://www.boxinginsider.com/mma/eddiebravo/stories/109318223.php

Quoted: Quoted: IMHO if there had been no time limit the odds were definitely in Royce's favor. LB Maybe... Royce is a good fighter but IIRC at the end of the fight Royce was basically carried away while Ken stayed to do an interview. I thought at the time that Ken could have won that one. The Gracies are good but they have an almost godlike reputation that is a bit overblown.

They are experts at self-promotion.  But unlike a lot of other flashes in the pan, their shit is the real shit.  Not only did they define MMA arena, absolutely no one steps into the octagon or the ring or the cage these days without some ground fighting training.  What was funny about the early UFCs is you had a lot of black belts, so called experts in their martial arts, and when the adrenaline started pumping, all their crisp forms turned into something that looked very similar to throwing wild punches and slugging it out like any other brawl.  The guys that showed technique, and showed everyone else technique were the BJJ guys.  Now everyone in MMA learns BJJ, and so there's been a dramatic levelling of the field.  The Gracies don't dominate anymore because better atheletes have come along and a lot of BJJ black belts have come to the US and elsewhere to teach.