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Posted: 1/13/2021 12:56:52 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Impeach means to bring the charges against them not to convict them. Fine, but that will not affect him seeking future office, because he was not successfully impeached. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 1:04:05 PM EDT
[#2]
Not sure how this is going to play out.
Turtle said that he was down to vote, but it would be about 30 days out (obviously Trump wouldn't be in office then so it was Constitutionally not applicable). But as of last night it sounded like he was considering moving the timeline up. Alan Dershowitz (Trump's lawyer on peachmints v1.0) said that impeaching/convicting a former president after he left office was not Constitutionally sound). But given that we are in a post Constitutional world now, I think anything is possible. The left AND right are both terrified of the idea of Trump 2024, a MAGA party and Trump generally being a thorn in their side. Making him ineligible to run again and essentially a convicted felon would really clip his wings. It would also serve as a warning to anybody considering following in his footsteps. The idea of that pleases them. Even if Trump escapes that minefield, he has the SDNY to deal with over the tax investigation, GA was looking at him for something (dunno what) and it is possible DC comes after him civilly and/or criminally over the Capitol protest. There is a decent shot he will be the first former president to die in prison. 
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Posted: 1/13/2021 1:08:41 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I would agree, BUT the people doing this only use the constitution as a door mat. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: The house may vote to impeach but there isn't time for the senate to remove him. Unless they don't think he plans on leaving next week Eta: just wasting more money The senate can impose two sanctions: removal from office, and disqualification from holding office in the future. Obviously there isn't enough time for congress to accomplish the first, but holding a senate trial after Trump leaves office could still accomplish the second. I would agree, BUT the people doing this only use the constitution as a door mat. Sadly I have to agree with your post. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 1:13:33 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not to nitpick . But it does not say or it says and. In my somewhat feeble mind that would mean the second punishment can only follow the first. If a private citizen cannot be removed from office the whole punishment part would be moot. You may have a point. But for the sake of argument, let’s say a President commits a high crime or misdemeanor on his last day in office. Or that the offense isn’t even discovered until after the President has already left office. Surely, the founders would have intended for the congress to possess the authority to deny the offender the opportunity to hold public office again, were such a situation to manifest. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:00:15 PM EDT
[#5]
They will impeach Trump a second time. They can do this because they're in majority now of the house.
It is all for partisans political purposes. To say, see we have been telling you he was bad from the beginning. He is the only president to have been impeached twice. Once for abuse of power. Which was actually done by our Biden when he was the VP. The second time for. Inciting violence and the attack on the US Capitol. Which by any reasonable persons measures does not meet any criteria for inciting. But hey. Trump bad. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:01:55 PM EDT
[#6]
Next week when Joe needs all good cabinet picks appointed, well sorry we have this impeachment trial thing to do. Probably take a full month.
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:05:19 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They can impeach him after leaving office and bar him from running again. Thats the game. As well as strip him of US Secret Service protection and the former presidential salary. ~Will |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:20:07 PM EDT
[#8]
It has all become meaningless to me if Democrats can take over power by fraud and deceit.
It's now the biggest kid on the playground rules. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:22:31 PM EDT
[#9]
There is precedent for holding a trial AFTER someone has left office.
In 1876, Secretary of War William Belknap was investigated by the House for corruption. Just minutes before the House was set to vote on his impeachment, he raced to the White House and handed his resignation to President Ulysses Grant. The House went ahead and impeached him anyway, and the Senate proceeded to have a trial. A majority voted to convict, but not the two-thirds required, so he was acquitted. 8nBAIT |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:25:52 PM EDT
[#10]
It would be flat out unconstitutional for democrats to impeach Trump in the Senate after he leaves office. He would be unable to mount a defense which goes against impeachment proceedings detailed in the Constitution, and it would be a civil rights violation.
And the precedent it would set would be even worse. Once the GOP gets the house/senate/potus again they could impeach obama. Hell, nothing to stop them from impeaching Obama and making it retroactive to 12:00pm on Jan 20th 2009 as though he never took office. Then go back and impeach every democrat president. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:30:20 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not sure they could get the votes in the senate anyway. It requires a two-thirds majority. Then again, there is no shortage of weak dick republicans in the senate, so who knows? Trump should just fuck with them by waiting until 11:59 PM on the 19th, then issue his resignation. Along with a truck load of pardons |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:33:54 PM EDT
[#12]
Anything is possible and it's not like the Supreme court will rule it is unconstitutional since no high crime or misdemeanors was committed. That said, it would take a lot of Republican cuck senators to pull it off.
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:38:50 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They can impeach him after leaving office and bar him from running again. Thats the game. Exactly |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:40:39 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If it’s just the house that impeached Trump why do they call him impeached if the senate doesn’t do it. A bill doesn’t get passed just because the house votes for it. They need the senate also Because impeachment is by definition the House voting to impeach. It is essentially the political equivalent of being charged or indicted. CONVICTION is what happens in the Senate. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:40:51 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Anything is possible and it's not like the Supreme court will rule it is unconstitutional since no high crime or misdemeanors was committed. That said, it would take a lot of Republican cuck senators to pull it off. Mitch is signalling that he will vote to convict. The votes will be there. Mitch wants Trump to never be able to run again which means he has no chance to run the R party. 8nBAIT |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:41:26 PM EDT
[#16]
Nope.
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:42:22 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There is precedent for holding a trial AFTER someone has left office. In 1876, Secretary of War William Belknap was investigated by the House for corruption. Just minutes before the House was set to vote on his impeachment, he raced to the White House and handed his resignation to President Ulysses Grant. The House went ahead and impeached him anyway, and the Senate proceeded to have a trial. A majority voted to convict, but not the two-thirds required, so he was acquitted. 8nBAIT Article I and II of the constitution do not specifically mention any cabinet or other offices except the President and Vice President....On January 20th after Biden is sworn in, Trump will no longer be President. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:47:58 PM EDT
[#18]
I figure the House will debate it for longer than a month unless they just vote it down and say to get on with actual work instead of this crap. I'd rather they hash it out long as possible at this point at least it's that much less getting done. Can they charge Trump after he's out of office for for anything that happened while he was in office? If so I'd look for a bunch of scrummed up crap by D.C. , maybe civil suits even. They won't quit hounding unless they are somehow made to to quit.
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:49:25 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Any congresscritters who oppose the impeachment or conviction have already been threatened with being blacklisted from everything. I bet they won't even be able to get a coffee at Starbucks at this rate. Trump still has a lot of support among the people. Republicans voting for impeachment or to convict in the Senate will have to face their voters. And, its a different country now than in October. There are a lot of people who now believe their vote doesn't count anymore. So the old argument "who else are you going to vote for" from Republicans really doesn't apply anymore. AND, after last week, the Democrats are going to do bad things either with or without Republican help, so it doesn't matter if you vote, don't vote or vote 3rd party, the results are going to be the same. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 2:53:23 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: theater to make the country still think there's two parties You sir get the gold star for today. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:06:38 PM EDT
[#21]
Can a successful impeachment be reached once he is out of office? I have not seen a definitive answer on this from the talking media heads so not sure if it’s still possible; of course along with the symbolic reasons for doing so - only prez to be impeached twice...fool everyone into thinking two opposing parties can work together and agree on something...controlling the narrative like the left is masterful at...the most significant benefit I can see is under a successful impeachment along with losing his lifetime salary & travel stipend & SS protection, he would be prohibited from running for federal office in future since he would essentially be a convicted felon from an electoral standpoint. Not sure where his mind is right now but I believe he can accomplish more for where he thinks the country should be by staying in private sector rather than back in office.
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:12:59 PM EDT
[#22]
Interesting thought.
If the house votes to impeach (and they will), his term ends, they have basically made their case (house) while he was still POTUS and sent it to the jury (senate) for dismissal or conviction. Would seem almost like a CEO stepping down during court proceedings. Not like the trial ends because he left his job. I haven't been watching it at all (shit is stressful enough as is) but has Trump had any sort of representation/council present or is this basically a kangaroo court at this point? |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:16:10 PM EDT
[#23]
I don't see how it could. The idea is to strip him of his office. How is it possible to do that if he is no longer in office? It's all political kabuki theatre. If he is no longer in the theatre how is that possible?
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:20:19 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They aren’t thinking this thru....... https://media3.giphy.com/media/5yLgocCOWDywCQi2g6Y/200.gif See, this is what I'm thinking. You're taking a bunch of disenfranchised people and creating a martyr of their hero. I dont understand what they think this will do to benefit their pocket books, much less the greater good. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:21:26 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I haven't been watching it at all (shit is stressful enough as is) but has Trump had any sort of representation/council present or is this basically a kangaroo court at this point? The House part is equivalent to a grand jury preceding. Only the prosecution is heard. Trump is not represented. He will when the Senate holds a trail before Jan 20th if Mitch were to call the Senate out of recess or after the 20th if he does not. Chuck will be in charge after the 20th so there WILL be a trail. 8nBAIT |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:21:42 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don't see how it could. The idea is to strip him of his office. How is it possible to do that if he is no longer in office? It's all political kabuki theatre. If he is no longer in the theatre how is that possible? They want to strip him of secret service protection. So that they can, er, delete him. The swamp has no idea what part of their shit he's had eyes on. They want him gone. Its as simple as that. 
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:25:39 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Exactly Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: They can impeach him after leaving office and bar him from running again. Thats the game. Exactly You can’t impeach someone who isn’t holding an office. 
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:26:56 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes. I don't think there is anything preventing proceedings from going forward after he leaves office. Yes it does. You can't impeach a private citizen, which DJT becomes upon Biden's inauguration. I think this is a hail mary attempt to impeach and convict him so that he's not eligible for office in the future. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:30:13 PM EDT
[#29]
Anything’s possible when the rules no longer apply...
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:33:46 PM EDT
[#30]
SCOTUS needs to set the bar back up to a high standard. Otherwise, demorat politicians like Schiff will impeach any opposition president simply because he had a wet dream about doing so the night before.
If not, every opposition president will be impeach by a demorat controlled House going forward. I do expect every opposition president will be impeached by a demorat House in my life time. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:38:14 PM EDT
[#31]
These asshole dems that are talking about impeaching him today without any evidence or witnesses and waiting until the new democrat senate is seated is insane.
Think about the precedent that sets. That you can convict a former president after he is out of office. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:38:55 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: theater to make the country still think there's two parties These cunts have done fuck all for the working American people over the past year, when people really needed it. Sat by and watched people's lives and businesses ruined. But they've sure got energy and resources to fuck around with this shit. Buncha cunts, all of them, and the best I can hope for is that it helps open the eyes of another million or two people to that fact. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:41:54 PM EDT
[#33]
watching the hearing, the fucking democrats are going FULL SEND on impeachment.
I think they saw the level of support he had at the demonstration, and I think their only goal is to prevent him from holding office again. And right now is their best chance to get a full impeachment with conviction, which keeps him from coming back in 2024. Which they are scared of. 4 years of him on open media, and with the trainwreck biden is gonna be, he's got a good chance of return in 2024, they are trying to put a bullet him him while he's down. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:43:20 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: watching the hearing, the fucking democrats are going FULL SEND on impeachment. I think they saw the level of support he had at the demonstration, and I think their only goal is to prevent him from holding office again. And right now is their best chance to get a full impeachment with conviction, which keeps him from coming back in 2024. Which they are scared of. 4 years of him on open media, and with the trainwreck biden is gonna be, he's got a good chance of return in 2024, they are trying to put a bullet him him while he's down. 8nBAIT |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:44:29 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not enough time to go from House to Senate and once he's out, cannot impeach a private citizen. At least that's what I read on the internet, so it must be true. Wanna bet? Especially if they declare that makes him ineligible to run for office again, which they already have. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:50:25 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think that is a possible outcome. It's an interesting legal question as to whether the other things that go along with impeachment besides removal from office would also attach with a conviction. Congress does not have the authority to impeach a private citizen. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:50:34 PM EDT
[#37]
Just a waste of money.
FJB, FKH, and FNP. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:51:18 PM EDT
[#38]
It would require 60 votes in the senate.
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:54:56 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not enough time to go from House to Senate and once he's out, cannot impeach a private citizen. At least that's what I read on the internet, so it must be true. Quote HistoryQuoted: Not enough time to go from House to Senate and once he's out, cannot impeach a private citizen. At least that's what I read on the internet, so it must be true. Quoted: Wanna bet? Especially if they declare that makes him ineligible to run for office again, which they already have. Its not even REALLY about running again (well, maybe for the RINOs it is). The Dems want to strip him of his security detail. They want him to be a target. They want to punish him by actual deletion. They don't EVER want someone to rise outside of the machine politics framework again. They want him gone. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 3:56:55 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Congress does not have the authority to impeach a private citizen. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I think that is a possible outcome. It's an interesting legal question as to whether the other things that go along with impeachment besides removal from office would also attach with a conviction. Congress does not have the authority to impeach a private citizen. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 4:01:51 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: See 8nBAIT's post above. It looks like there is precedent. Precedent that has never been addressed by the courts. I think any such impeachment that resulted in conviction would stand to be overturned if challenged. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 4:02:53 PM EDT
[#42]
At this point.....who gives a shit?
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Posted: 1/13/2021 4:05:43 PM EDT
[#43]
I believe with as far as they are pushing everything they will stop him from running next time. After the 20th Mitch will vote to not impeach while still getting what he really wants.
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Posted: 1/13/2021 4:11:16 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Precedent that has never been addressed by the courts. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: See 8nBAIT's post above. It looks like there is precedent. Precedent that has never been addressed by the courts. The courts that wouldn't look at the vote statistical anomaly cases on the merits? You think THOSE courts would uphold a case by Trump to add some due process to what the dems are going to do? Really? |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 4:14:58 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You have too much faith in Republicans. I'm 100% they are going to continue throwing Trump and Trump supporters under the bus. They don't realize that the future of the GOP Rests with Trump supporters. If they alienate Trump's supporters, they might as well go and disband the GOP, and join the DNC. IMO the future of the GOP is to be just to the right of the DNC. And it's pretty apparent that the DNC in the next 2 years go full on communist, that will make the GOP America's version of Euro Socialism. Any future conservative party will be labeled the same as Trump supporters are now. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 4:17:28 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Precedent that has never been addressed by the courts. I think any such impeachment that resulted in conviction would stand to be overturned if challenged. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: See 8nBAIT's post above. It looks like there is precedent. Precedent that has never been addressed by the courts. I think any such impeachment that resulted in conviction would stand to be overturned if challenged. The same courts that just turned their heads and signed off on massive election irregularities. Those courts. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 4:18:38 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Precedent that has never been addressed by the courts. I think any such impeachment that resulted in conviction would stand to be overturned if challenged. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: See 8nBAIT's post above. It looks like there is precedent. Precedent that has never been addressed by the courts. I think any such impeachment that resulted in conviction would stand to be overturned if challenged. On February 2, 1877, Belknap visited Grant and pleaded for his indictment to be dismissed. The next day Grant asked his cabinet for advice; Secretary of State Hamilton Fish was furious at Belknap and wanted him to be tried. Grant decided otherwise, and wrote to Taft that the District Attorney should be directed to dismiss the case. Following Grant's instructions, Taft told Washington, D.C. District Attorney Henry H. Wells that the evidence against Belknap would not sustain a conviction, and that Belknap had suffered enough during the Senate trial. Wells moved for dismissal; on February 8, 1877, Belknap's case, indictment No. 11,262, was dismissed by Justice Arthur MacArthur Sr. No longer facing the possibility of conviction and imprisonment, Belknap decided not to follow through on his threat to sue Pierrepont. |
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Posted: 1/13/2021 4:26:24 PM EDT
[#48]
Have they accused him of lighting the Reichstag on fire yet?
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Posted: 1/13/2021 4:56:21 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Pretty much this. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: This is merely a move for history books. “A president so horrible and corrupt, he was impeached twice!” Pretty much this. But he's not corrupt. May have a big mouth. The Swamp/Bureaucracy is the corruption. But we all hopefully know this. 
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Posted: 1/13/2021 4:57:19 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The courts that wouldn't look at the vote statistical anomaly cases on the merits? You think THOSE courts would uphold a case by Trump to add some due process to what the dems are going to do? Really? It costs them nothing and functionally changes nothing so yeah, I think they would. It only takes 4 to hear a case. |
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