When it comes to antigun laws, I suspect his gun czar, Pedo O'Rourke, will do his dirty work, with the goal of making the laws permanent, unlike the AWB.

legally not much as there is this old worthless document called the constitution which should get in his way when it comes to domestically but with things the way they are I don't think it will slow him down. And don't count on the SCOTUS they have a bad history of suddenly going left.

Ever bought steel-cased ammo?

I really don't care what that very temporary occupant of the WH has to say.....I'll be marching to the beat of my own drum thank you very much ....That goes for double when the Ho takes his place too.

Fuck that prick cock sucker right in his geriatric pussy.

I have never seen a regulation interpretation EO on 2A be removed. EVER!

These are the ones that did EO on firearms and ammunition: ( I am not 100% sure but, most were done by using reinterpreted existing regulations of BATF )

GW Bush Sr. (R)
Bill Clinton (D)
Barack Hussein Obama (D)
Donald Trump(R)
Bidet (D)

I've red teamed the following courses of action for Xiden:

Make no mistake, he intends to screw us over somehow during his Administration; he's invested too much into it, both on the Campaign Trail (see his Gun Safety Plan on his Campaign Website, which we've all talked about, especially the AR15s on NFA part), followed by his appointing a top Beto O'Rourke campaign official to be his Deputy Chief of Staff.

So, without further ado; here is some "Red Teaming" from my not-so-genius level intellect on how he will likely go about gun control.

1.) Stopping Online Sales of Firearms/Firearms Parts

We've all been focused on "he won't have control of the Senate, and his control of the House will not be decisive enough" that we've missed a major point.

This campaign plank doesn't even need any legislation or action by him.

How is that possible?

Well, remember how the Democrat party has the entire big tech/big corp sector in lockstep with them?

What's the biggest weak spot any online storefront has?

A trusted,  secure method of payment that can be used to electronically transfer funds so that shipping can be expedited.

What's going to happen is that after the next mass shooting (if it's big enough); is that the Biden Administration will talk (unofficially) of course with certain financial/technological companies; and a week or two later, all the major online vendors of payments:

PayPal, VISA, MASTERCARD, DISCOVER, Venmo, Patreon; etc

will unveil a new Terms of Service (TOS) that will exclude sales of certain "dangerous" items from using their platform(s) or service(s) if they are "virtual" online storefronts.

Brownells will basically get... Brownelled by this new TOS, but the local gun store, since it's a "Brick and Mortar" business, can continue using credit cards for parts sales; causing many LGS owners to support it as it eliminates that pesky online competitor.

The lawsuits will take years to resolve at which point, even Brownells would be severely diminished.

The left's counter to this will be: "We're not stopping sales! You can just send a check or money order!" similar to how "There's one FFL in Washington DC (the Metropolitan Police), so people's rights aren't being infringed!"

2. ) Regulate possession of existing assault weapons under the National Firearms Act -- Ban the manufacture and sale of assault weapons and high-capacity magazines.

I think with this, he will not go through Congress or through his allies in Big Corp/Big Tech, but rather go through the regulatory state of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.

It all hinges on the definition of “readily convertible”, which has been defined as the length of time it takes to convert a firearm to fire automatically.

Courts, naturally have different rulings on the meaning of the term, shown below; which was taken from the following website (LINK)

United States v. Woodlam, 527 F.2d 608 (6th Cir. 1976) held that it was 2~ minutes.

United States v. Smith, 477 F.2d 399 (8th Cir. 1973) held that it was a standard 8 hour working day in a machine shop.

United States v. Cook, 1993 WL 243823 (6th Cir. 1993) held that a disassembled weapon, which was missing a necessary part, was considered “readily restored” simply because the necessary part was available on the open market.  

United States v. TRW Rifle 7.62x51mm Caliber, One Model 14, 447 F.3d 686 (9th Cir. 2006) held that it was a two hour process which required simple tools and a stick welder.

United States v. one TRW Model M14, 7.62 Caliber Rifle from William K. Alverson, 441 F.3d 416 (6th Cir. 2006) held that it was the ability to manufacture the required parts in four to six hours with a properly equipped machine shop or in two to three hours by hand.

United States v. Seven Misc. Firearms, 503 F.Supp. 565 (D.D.C. 1980) held that a firearm is not considered “readily” restorable when conversion would require an expert gunsmith with tools costing up to $65,000, working between “four and perhaps in excess of thirty hours,” using essential parts that can not be found in this country and doing modifications that could damage or destroy the firearm and cause injury to the shooter upon firing.

Guess what's being disseminated now for the AR15 across the internet?

Attached File


Yep. 3D printed "AR15" Auto Sears (aka Coat Hangers) that "drop right in".

Under all of the cases listed above, the existence of 3D printed autosears renders just about every AR15 pattern rifle "readily convertible" to a machine gun, and thus regulatorily subject to the National Firearms Act, with no legislative action required.

Furthermore, many AR15 lower receivers have "milspec" fire control group cavities; making converting them to a machine gun rather simple through:

A.) The availability of M16 full auto trigger packs / sears at gun shows

B.) The availability of drill jigs to drill out the needed "third hole" at gunshows.

The fact that people RIGHT NOW are milling out 80% lowers and then converting them to a functional firearm via installing Semi-Auto Lower Parts Kits (LPK's) effectively also makes AR15's "readily convertible" into machine guns, since it doesn't take that much more effort to either mill out the fire control group cavity in non-milspec receivers (they have router jigs precisely for this purpose now) or drill that third hole.

Once AR15's are regulatorily determined to be "readily convertible" to Machine Guns by the BATFE, Biden can then, out of the generosity of his heart, write an executive order authorizing BATFE to offer a no questions asked "buyback" program to eliminate the legal liabilities of people who find themselves in possession of a machine gun as defined by ATF regulations.

3.) Legislative Action

He is likely to propose (and/or push) a new 2020/2021 Crime Bill, which will have a copy N paste from all the last couple of AWBs proposed by Feinstein; and combine it with a Universal Background Check and Red Flag subsection.

Now, you might say:

"But that won't pass!"

Actually, Grasshopper; the goal ISN'T for the bill to pass as written.

It's going to be designed to be as outrageous as possible, so that when vast parts of it are stripped or removed legislatively; the NRA and the GOP(E) will say "look at what we did! We stopped that Joe Biden from Banning YER GUNZ!"

Everything (Magazine Bans/Limits, AWB ban, one gun a month) is going to be sacrifical, except for the Universal Background Check portion.

Everything else is expendable.

That's how Northam and the Virginia Democrats did it in 2020; they proposed a massive AWB ban as part of their crime bills, but were more than happy to let the AWB die, because they got what they wanted:

1.) An end to legal private sales for all guns in Virginia (UBC passed).
2.) Allowing municipalities and localities within Virginia to set their own firearms laws (Firearm Law Pre-emption nullified)

The current push for Universal Background Checks (UBCs) is the result of the NRA saying "we like background checks" almost twenty-five years ago; as part of the "keep the guns out of the hands of criminals" bit they've played for so long.

See, back in 1993/94, there was going to be a "7 day waiting period" imposed by the Brady Bill, but the NRA added language to have that waiting period only last until a new NICS system was in place; and went "SEE, WE SAVED YOUR RIGHT TO BUY GUNS WITH NO WAITING PERIOD!!!"

The NRA got strategically out-thought on this; for:

A.) A generation of NICS for FFL sales got people used to background checks on a right and "normalized" it.

B.) nobody ever thought to ask the NRA leadership in 1994 this question:

"Riddle me this, why is it OK to call for a background check for a gun bought from a dealer, but not one from a private individual?"

The NRA walked right into it. This was a trap 25 years in the making.

Why is UBC so important to them?

Once we get UBCs, an all-out assault on our firearm rights will occur 10 to 20 years down the line.

Why?

They are waiting for the "kill chain" to be completed before they move on to major bans. Right now on a national scale, the NICS system and e4473s only capture a fraction of trades; with face to face sales, you can say "I sold that years ago" and they have no way of legally bringing the pain on you or calling you on that claim.

When UBCs come along, that kill chain will be "closed" and they'll be able to say "Jimbo, we know you haven't completed any NICS transfers as a transferor for rifles in the last 5 years, it's all been receiving purchases. So Jimbo, cough up the guns or we send you to Federal Prison."

I'm not trying to be a "Debbie Downer" here; but a brutal realist.

Let's look at the most common claim I hear about Biden -- that it won't be that bad -- per  Jason280 in another thread:


Unlike Republicans, Democrats actually deliver to their base on various "pet" issues.

There's a downside to getting "pet causes" passed however. Doing so requires an enormous amount of effort; ranging from under the table bribes to outright threats to keep recalcitrant party members in line.

Because of this; generally, when a party seizes near complete control; not much actually gets done other than about 1.5 things.

In 2008-2010, that was Obamacare; and it took the democrats two years to get it passed; and Obamacare actually had serious opposition from the GOP; because $$$ talks; and Obamacare was a big threat to a lot of small businesses, etc.

Why Obama didn't do much is three factors:

1.) They spent so much political capital on Obamacare that when Sandy Hook came around in 2012; the Democrats hadn't fully recovered from the expenditure of political power on Obamacare two years prior.

2.) The Democratic party of 2010-2012 is much different than the Democratic Party of 2020. All of the old rural Democrats have been purged over the last decade; all of their major stars are from Urban areas like AOC.

3.) Obama while he was pro-gun control and did talk in vague generalities; he wasn't as outspoken as Biden and the Democrats have been this Campaign Cycle.

In August 2008; this was Obama's entire public campaign stance on guns:


I can't find Obama's 2012 Re-election Website on the internet archive -- it's stuck in a redirect loop; but you can just go to Joe Biden's Website:

https://joebiden.com/gunsafety/

There's a night and day difference -- note that back in 2008, Obama was quite vague and kept his gun policy proposals down to just a single vague paragraph of "I really don't like 'assault weapons' and I'd like to reinstate the ban".

But by 2020, the Overton Window inside the Democratic party has shifted so much that stuff that would've been unthinkable outside of strident anti-gun crusaders has been normalized enough that Sleepy Joe is going into lengthy detail with quite specific policy proposals, which now also include "put stuff on the National Firearms Act List"; something that has never actually been seriously proposed before at the national level, outside of gun control cranks.

Also, all of the Democratic candidates attempted to "one up" each other during the debates; anyone remember Beto O'Rourke's:

"Hell, yes, we're going to take your AR-15, your AK-47....We're not going to allow it to be used against our fellow Americans anymore."

Biden's new White House Deputy Chief of Staff (Jen O'Malley Dillon) was Campaign Manager for Beto O'Rourke's 2020 campaign from 2019 to Spring 2020.

Likewise, Biden's VP is none other than Kamala "Microstamping kills the CA Roster" Harris.

Finally, another factor is in play.

This time it's PERSONAL for the Democrats.

They want to extract their pound of flesh (and then some) from the Republican base for supporting OrangeManBad! Trump. You can't really go after evangelicals and such; but gun owners provide such a nice, easy, juicy target.

This is why when the next mass shooting occurs, things are going to go completely fucking nuts -- FULL BLAST CRAZY -- using the groundswell of "OMG we must do something" from the Karens to provide a tidal surge to overcome any dissent within Congressional circles to DO SOMETHING.

That SOMETHING is likely to be Universal Background Checks.

Don't worry; despite what the NRA will tell us -- "WE KEPT THEM FROM TAKING AMERICA'S RIFLE" -- the Democrats will have moved the ball 5 yards towards the end zone and run out the clock some more.

Executive orders are numbered. What were the EO numbers of the EOs that Trump put forth in regards to firearms and ammunition?

Democrats go to 9th circuit.  Republicans if they're smart will take grievances to 5th circuit IMO .

That wasnt done via executive order ..........

neither was the '89 import ban......

Everyone in these threads seems to be unaware of the power given to the ATF /DOJ by the 1968 GCA...... they can just about do anything they want.....no EO's or legislation required....

THE PRESIDENT CAN ORDER VARIOUS REGULATORY CHANGES WHICH DO NOT HAVE TO GO THROUGH CONGRESS.

After the first mass shooting that occurs during the Biden Administration; I expect the following regulatory changes:

1.) Ordering the BATFE to regulatorily re-determine pistol braces and AR/AK style pistols as illegal AOWs or illegal SBRs, and subject to the NFA.

1A.) In many states (Maryland, Pennsylvania, etc) the State Police either officially (Maryland and Form 77R) or unofficially (Pennsylvania) keep a list of "handguns" sold in state. Guess what braced pistols are sold as?

2.) Order the BATFE to regulatorily determine whether or not an AR15 style weapon is "readily convertible" to a machine gun; and whether or not AR15 style receivers constitute illegal machine guns and are subject to the NFA.

He can crack down on FFLs and arms manufacturers .  Make it harder to get an FFL, do more inspections, and punish them for any mistakes.  FFLs are always worried about inspections and honest mistakes just happen to everyone.  

In Hawaii we have a RAP BACK program that works with the FBI to do continuous background checks on gun owners.  The FBI is resistant to participate in it, but Biden could encourage them to open it up to any state nationwide.

Biden can limit person to person sales on the amount of guns and ammo sold.

Inspect and enforce environmental regulations on ranges.  Divert pitman roberts fund money to environmental causes instead of hunting and ranges.

That's the process / system.
I did not say it works 100%...............

This can be done by ordering the BATFE to expand the current "buy many handguns/ARs in a border state with Mexico, a copy of a form sent to the ATF" to nationwide and lower it to just one item, and it doesn't require a new law.

(They had the same when Oblunder came into office)

I stand corrected none of the listed did any ban EO, it was all allowing the BATFE or whispering in their ear to ban them. No EOs were done. Corrected. Look I will say I am a Trump fan but the plastic bump stock is a machine gun is stupid and unconstitutional in a Scali time frame. Oh and I forgot William J. Bennett called the Treasury secretary Brady to "see what can be done using existing regulations".

FPNI.

Blatant fraud, followed by an inauguration with tens of thousands of troops and razor wire, loyalty purges in the military and public political statements from generals, and mass eviction of political opponents from various media and services...

I think OP doesn't quite understand what is going on here.   The only limit on Biden's power is what people are willing to put up with.   The letter of the law means fuckall.




We don't have 10 years before things start becoming more, er, decisive, either way.

The "but Obama didn't ban anything" and "Biden is just talk" crowd largely doesn't see the wave of political witch hunting rolling along through workplaces, yet.  Or the consequences of various banking regs being rolled back.  They're not after guns, they're after YOU.  Guns are just in the way - but they're not going to halt their offensive just to try and re-boil the 2A frog.

We are driving on into banana republic territory now.   It's effectively over and all we're waiting on is another shot heard 'round the world.

He will push for the states to change their laws.
If you have democrats in control, they will push gun control.

He (or his AG) can order the BATFE to “reinterpret” all sorts of laws (and now, the Hawaiian judge will not come to our rescue).

Not to mention:

Biden owns BOTH houses of Congress now.

Take away CCW in national parks.

I'm just curious how many here will defend/excuse/justify biden when he forces the atf to ban shit?

Will those of us that complain get dogpiled with "Muh 80%", "Muh brace", "Muh 10+round magazine" and such?

Or will it be different now?

So we need a bunch of obstructionist lawyers to tie everything up in red tape? Excellent, where are those patriots? (I know we have at least one here but we would need more).

No sir, that is gone. I seriously doubt anyone here voted for him and have the need to defend that decision with every other without separation.

OP is asking a question assuming that biden is going to play by the rules and there are still checks and balances in place

In the recent past, it didn't matter to many that POTUS was overreaching his intended authorities with EOs.  

Why does it suddenly matter now?

Let's not pretend to be patriots defending one type of illegal action and then criticizing another.

Actually, yes.

Once they pass a federal UBC law outlawing private sales unless done through a FFL/NICS...expect movement in 10-15 years.

It's been 25 years since MD got UBC for Handguns. This means outside of some crochety old fudds who were already collecting revolvers 40 years ago....

The majority of modern handguns are now known and registered with the Maryland State Police.

Case in point the FN FIVE SEVEN wasn't released till 1998, so there is no way for it to be "off the books". MD State Police knows exactly where about 95.62% of FN FIVE SEVENS are in Maryland (except for Cletus who moved in from WV and never registered, or Q-ball who bought it off the books in Baltimore).

So...let's say that the FN FIVE SEVEN is banned by the Democrats in 2022 because ZOMG IT CAN FIRE ARMOR PIERCING ROUNDS AND PENETRATE COP VESTS.

In most every state, non compliance is an option since nobody knows where they went, and with no UBC, you can plausibly say "I sold that years ago."

But since every handgun has been registered in MD for the last 25 years, all MSP has to do is send form letters to everyone:

"ATTN [$NAME]

You have FN FIVE SEVEN [$SERIAL].

Per (law) it is illegal. Turn it in.

Love and kisses,
MD State Police"

That's why they want UBCs; so that they can capture that huge market of firearms "on paper" in 4473s, which no doubt will soon at some point be mandated to be electronic (no more paper); since it makes banning things so much easier...

But in order for UBC backed confiscation to work, they have to have a large proportion of firearms "on paper". That's why waiting 10-15 years is so critical.

That has all changed.  Executive orders and fraudulent election results make that moot.

If no one stops him he has ultimate power.

From what I have seen the last handful of years, no one is stopping democrats.

Nothing more needed said here....

All of this has been discussed to nauseam for the last few months.

We now have to eat the shit sandwich we've been given....

Just wait till Biden opens the "domestic terrorism" investigation into Republicans. A lot of people will get visits from the ATF and FBI to hand over weapons. I expect Biden to ban "weapons of war" such as any semi AR/AK type rifle and hand guns.

Meanwhile, the flood gates will be open on immigration, the welfare state expanded and jobs killed with the new wave of environmental laws in the pipeline. He will actively work to expand his future voting base for the next election. Also expect more social media restrictions aimed at silencing the right and any opposition. Next 4 years should be interesting.....

Attached File

Absolutely this right here^^^^^10ring

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Most don't even see the hypocrisy of it...

Their leverage at the start of Obama's first term was much much stronger than the current situation.

They briefly had 60 senators, they now only have 50.

They had a larger margin in the House as well.

They also had a more sympathetic supreme court composition.

A lot of people here are seriously overestimating how much they are going to be able to do via legislation.

There will be unconstitutional infringements on our rights, but they will come via EO and ATF rules reinterpretations, which will put some limits on how much assfuckery they can do for the next two years.

Not much.  Now, laws passed and he signs, yes.  

But, gotta remember- only people who are willing to be ruled CAN be ruled.

Man, if only the courts took the unbiased view that all gun control is unconstitutional.

this

I guess he could just tell the ATF to reclassify thing arbitrarily like his predecessor.

To quote a daffy old bat "at this point what difference does it make".

Xiden and the government party run the show from end to end.

One of the resident moonbats could propose an outright ban and mandated turn in of all firearms and it would land on Xiden's desk for his signature with only token opposition from a couple of republicans.
The "rebellion" has given them all the justification they need for dropping their pretenses of being pro 2A.

SCOTUS (with the addition of the 3 new turtle approved Robertses making it effectively a 7-2 court against freedom) would punt or say "yeah, 2A means the militia, militia means the national guard".

Attached File

Well considering Obama said he couldn't do the DACA thing via EO, then did it, then somehow the courts GD said would save us all somehow said Trump didn't have the power resend that EO.....I'd say he can probably do whatever the fuck he wants.

having said that, how much will he do? little to none, same as Obama. If any new major gun laws come it'll be via congress.

lol none of them. Its different if a republican, especially the love of their lives in Trump, do it.

He could have signed an AWB and half of GD would still suck his cock. Thus, here we are again. True conservatives vis republicans and a GOP as a ship without a rudder. 2008 allllllllll over again. Called that shit.

As long as you scream MAGA and “America First!” as you push The Constitution into the shredder, it’s ok.

It’s only cool when my favorite politician or political party does it.

Biden: *assistant wipes drool away* "Hey ATF, remember when Trump told you all to use the nebulous definitions of 'readily restored' and 'readily converted', that aren't codified in law, to have you guys call a piece of plastic a machine gun under authority of Chevron? Let's do that again but with any rifle that has a full auto counterpart! Even Trump judges said that's okay so we're golden!"

I think you and I both pointed that out starting back when the reclassification was proposed. Any and all semi-auto firearm can be argued to be a MG - right now. With no change in law and no public notice needed.