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Posted: 9/13/2017 1:33:21 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Chain of custody... |
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Posted: 9/13/2017 2:33:49 PM EDT
[#2]
If the cop were so concerned about the draw for the DOT I can see him asking for them to collect a sample and hold it for the patient's consent. They would have already established an IV at that point so they'd have access. But I honestly don't believe anyone would be that concerned about what is really the driver and employer's problem. And I can never remember asking for a professional courtesy by threatening to arrest anyone.
Someone stepped on his own dick quite heavily. If he's lucky he'll get to be a meter maid for a few years until retirement. |
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Posted: 9/13/2017 3:13:18 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If the cop were so concerned about the draw for the DOT I can see him asking for them to collect a sample and hold it for the patient's consent. They would have already established an IV at that point so they'd have access. But I honestly don't believe anyone would be that concerned about what is really the driver and employer's problem. And I can never remember asking for a professional courtesy by threatening to arrest anyone. Someone stepped on his own dick quite heavily. If he's lucky he'll get to be a meter maid for a few years until retirement. Who knows what Det Payne was thinking but the DOT/employer angle is pretty ridiculous. I'd actually have some respect for him if he just came out and said "look I thought it was necessary and lawful but in retrospect let my anger get the best of me. I'm sorry I fucked up." |
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Posted: 9/13/2017 3:15:33 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
http://i.imgur.com/diY0yEz.png http://www.sltrib.com/news/2017/09/09/watch-commander-on-duty-during-nurse-arrest-has-been-placed-on-leave-attorney-says-hes-received-death-threats-and-asks-for-patience/ 
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Posted: 9/13/2017 3:25:47 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
http://i.imgur.com/AvgQZHY.png http://www.wthr.com/article/officer-arrested-utah-nurse-after-he-was-told-to-let-her-go-police-chief-says Quote HistoryQuoted:
http://i.imgur.com/AvgQZHY.png http://www.wthr.com/article/officer-arrested-utah-nurse-after-he-was-told-to-let-her-go-police-chief-says SALT LAKE CITY — A Utah police officer whose rough arrest of a hospital nurse has drawn condemnation put the woman in handcuffs even after investigators told him not to worry about getting a blood sample he was seeking from a patient, the chief whose department asked for it said Friday. |
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Posted: 9/13/2017 3:27:05 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Obviously I don't speak for all nurses but we don't normally draw blood from existing peripheral IVs. Sometimes it's done as you're inserting the IV initially but I'm guessing this patient already has some and is getting continuous fluids. If the patient has a PICC (peripherally inserted central catheter) or other central line you may get it from there. Who knows what Det Payne was thinking but the DOT/employer angle is pretty ridiculous. I'd actually have some respect for him if he just came out and said "look I thought it was necessary and lawful but in retrospect let my anger get the best of me. I'm sorry I fucked up." |
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Posted: 9/13/2017 4:49:47 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Obviously I don't speak for all nurses but we don't normally draw blood from existing peripheral IVs. Sometimes it's done as you're inserting the IV initially but I'm guessing this patient already has some and is getting continuous fluids. If the patient has a PICC (peripherally inserted central catheter) or other central line you may get it from there. Who knows what Det Payne was thinking but the DOT/employer angle is pretty ridiculous. I'd actually have some respect for him if he just came out and said "look I thought it was necessary and lawful but in retrospect let my anger get the best of me. I'm sorry I fucked up." |
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Posted: 9/13/2017 10:17:39 PM EDT
[#8]
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Posted: 9/13/2017 11:56:10 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryThe IA report is at that link. Payne, his LT, and another guy are fucked.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 12:01:26 AM EDT
[#10]
Guy in the burn ward is gonna be pissed when he wakes up.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 12:07:01 AM EDT
[#11]
Sounds like Payne will have plenty of time off to work on growing out his skullet.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 12:16:22 AM EDT
[#12]
The tide appears to be changing. At this point with the fbi investigating and IA coming back with this report I'm thinking we see resignations soon.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 12:56:29 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The IA report is at that link. Payne, his LT, and another guy are fucked. Quote HistoryQuoted:
“You demonstrated extremely poor professional judgment (especially for an officer with 27 years of experience), which calls into question your ability to effectively serve the public and the Department in a manner that inspires the requisite trust, respect, and confidence,” the report adds. Bye Felicia. The ignorant defenders that posted here should be ashamed. I do fear they will be allowed to resign and get jobs somewhere else. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 1:00:40 AM EDT
[#14]
Looks like their "contempt of cop" catch all bit them in the ass...
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Posted: 9/14/2017 1:06:30 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Investigators wrote Payne’s conduct was ”inappropriate, unreasonable, unwarranted, discourteous, disrespectful, and has brought significant disrepute on both you as a Police Officer and on the Department as a whole. “You demonstrated extremely poor professional judgment (especially for an officer with 27 years of experience), which calls into question your ability to effectively serve the public and the Department in a manner that inspires the requisite trust, respect, and confidence,” the report adds. Bye Felicia. The ignorant defenders that posted here should be ashamed. I do fear they will be allowed to resign and get jobs somewhere else. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 1:22:08 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Salt Lake district attorney asks FBI to investigate confrontation between cop and nurse for potential civil-rights violations http://www.sltrib.com/news/2017/09/07/district-attorney-sim-gill-asks-fbi-to-investigate-blood-draw-episode-for-potential-civil-rights-violations/ |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 1:27:48 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Shit's getting real now...looks like even the LEO's standing there "doing nothing" will be investigated for not intervening as well. Good for them. I don't expect any criminal charges after all is said and done but I think there will be civil lawsuits in the end. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 1:54:35 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Good. They stood by and watched a fellow officer violate this nurse's civil rights. They should all be fired and potentially prosecuted. But if there were three or four other cops standing around tacitly approving of Officer Douchebag's actions, I would lose respect and trust of pretty much all the LE agencies involved. Fuck them. We are supposed to be on the same fucking team. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:03:43 AM EDT
[#19]
The IA report is a good read. The nurse is complemented for the way she handled the interaction. Payne and Tracy are fucked...
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:55:08 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is why  |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:59:55 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
@Balista Care to comment? Quote HistoryQuoted:
@Balista Care to comment? |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 12:22:13 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
@Balista Care to comment? |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 12:33:28 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you care to come out of your safe space long enough to read this then yes. They did their best to bury the story and just forget the whole thing. The chief came out and pretended to care only when he had no other choice. Absent a body cam there would be no story here. Well, I suppose there's the possibility of video from the hospital cameras, but it's not going to be quite as impressive as the bodycam's recording. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 2:51:13 PM EDT
[#24]
I'm going to assume the hospital or nurse used the hospital footage for leverage to get the bodycam footage released.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 2:54:39 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Obviously I don't speak for all nurses but we don't normally draw blood from existing peripheral IVs. Sometimes it's done as you're inserting the IV initially but I'm guessing this patient already has some and is getting continuous fluids. If the patient has a PICC (peripherally inserted central catheter) or other central line you may get it from there. Who knows what Det Payne was thinking but the DOT/employer angle is pretty ridiculous. I'd actually have some respect for him if he just came out and said "look I thought it was necessary and lawful but in retrospect let my anger get the best of me. I'm sorry I fucked up." That would garner some respect from me, but not enough to want him to keep his job. 
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Posted: 9/14/2017 2:56:53 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Guy in the burn ward is gonna be pissed when he wakes up. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 4:41:31 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That would garner some respect from me, but not enough to want him to keep his job. I can't accept when someone fails they try to skate responsibility. I do applaud internal affairs and the civilian review board. Frankly I don't think they had a choice on this one though.... How long until he blames ptsd? |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 4:46:48 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Oh? That's an issue in DOT civil matters? Where they normally have the test performed by a private facility hired by the employer? Tell me more. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Chain of custody... Then the lawyer gets the people involved in the testing on the stand and asks them various questions about procedures, identification procedures, instrumentation, preventative maintenance etc. I know a couple people that have been drug to court over these things. Hospitals don't like to go to court. It would only help in the defense so it doesn't make any sense to begin with. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 4:49:21 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
All a lawyer would have to do is get the error records of the lab. They are required to keep them. Everytime there is a corrected report there is a record of it. Then the lawyer gets the people involved in the testing on the stand and asks them various questions about procedures, identification procedures, instrumentation, preventative maintenance etc. I know a couple people that have been drug to court over these things. Hospitals don't like to go to court. It would only help in the defense so it doesn't make any sense to begin with. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Chain of custody... Then the lawyer gets the people involved in the testing on the stand and asks them various questions about procedures, identification procedures, instrumentation, preventative maintenance etc. I know a couple people that have been drug to court over these things. Hospitals don't like to go to court. It would only help in the defense so it doesn't make any sense to begin with. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 5:07:03 PM EDT
[#30]
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Posted: 9/14/2017 5:20:04 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
@Balista Care to comment? B) If you had actually read the thread; you would see I was answering a poster asking why the Utah state police don't investigate themselves and the meme illustrates why. They don't want to be accused of covering up. C) The Salt Lake City department had to be forced to apologize only after the victims attorney got the officers bodycam released. The department took no action to suspend the Salt Lake City detective until the victim had to hire an attorney to make them do the right thing. Utah State police did the right thing while the Salt Lake City police department didn't. In fact, the Chief admits he does not have an excuse. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 5:47:36 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A) I have no idea what your point is? B) If you had actually read the thread; you would see I was answering a poster asking why the Utah state police don't investigate themselves and the meme illustrates why. They don't want to be accused of covering up. C) The Salt Lake City department had to be forced to apologize only after the victims attorney got the officers bodycam released. The department took no action to suspend the Salt Lake City detective until the victim had to hire an attorney to make them do the right thing. Utah State police did the right thing while the Salt Lake City police department didn't. In fact, the Chief admits he does not have an excuse. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
@Balista Care to comment? B) If you had actually read the thread; you would see I was answering a poster asking why the Utah state police don't investigate themselves and the meme illustrates why. They don't want to be accused of covering up. C) The Salt Lake City department had to be forced to apologize only after the victims attorney got the officers bodycam released. The department took no action to suspend the Salt Lake City detective until the victim had to hire an attorney to make them do the right thing. Utah State police did the right thing while the Salt Lake City police department didn't. In fact, the Chief admits he does not have an excuse. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:00:35 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryInteresting they are saying Payne and LT were not sufficiently trained, nor updated on current law and so they are putting that back on the PD. And it is local SOP to obtain blood samples from everyone involved in a major accident.
The CRB report basically boils down to they think Payne was rude and failed to file one report properly and the LT was not properly trained to know current rules on blood draws. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:26:24 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting they are saying Payne and LT were not sufficiently trained, nor updated on current law and so they are putting that back on the PD. And it is local SOP to obtain blood samples from everyone involved in a major accident. The CRB report basically boils down to they think Payne was rude and failed to file one report properly and the LT was not properly trained to know current rules on blood draws. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:39:06 PM EDT
[#35]
50 pages of mess.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:43:00 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
SOP? How is that legal? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Interesting they are saying Payne and LT were not sufficiently trained, nor updated on current law and so they are putting that back on the PD. And it is local SOP to obtain blood samples from everyone involved in a major accident. The CRB report basically boils down to they think Payne was rude and failed to file one report properly and the LT was not properly trained to know current rules on blood draws. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:43:54 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A) I have no idea what your point is? B) If you had actually read the thread; you would see I was answering a poster asking why the Utah state police don't investigate themselves and the meme illustrates why. They don't want to be accused of covering up. C) The Salt Lake City department had to be forced to apologize only after the victims attorney got the officers bodycam released. The department took no action to suspend the Salt Lake City detective until the victim had to hire an attorney to make them do the right thing. Utah State police did the right thing while the Salt Lake City police department didn't. In fact, the Chief admits he does not have an excuse. Also, I believe the SLPD Chief position should now be looked at as a 'temporary position' for the setting chief. He cooked his goose there... |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:44:50 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
SOP? How is that legal? |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:50:47 PM EDT
[#39]
He did this to an ER nurse in the middle of the ER, surrounded by medical staff and other cops, knowing he was being videotaped. Imagine the things he's done to lesser folk when there was nobody around.
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Posted: 9/14/2017 6:55:33 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Seems to me they did not update their own policy and training after that court decision many years ago. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:13:07 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't think I'd be able to get away with not knowing the law...they won't either. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Seems to me they did not update their own policy and training after that court decision many years ago. But I think it gives some insight into possible future issues. It seems to be strong on the emotional side and very lacking in substance. It does not IMO give any credence to criminal actions and only their own perceived policy violations which again might be a stretch. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 7:20:41 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't think I'd be able to get away with not knowing the law...they won't either. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Seems to me they did not update their own policy and training after that court decision many years ago. Too many of these recent incidents are done by people who, sometimes plainly, shouldn't be cops. When somebody that shouldn't be a cop is hired, the onus is on the chain of command that did the hiring. Now, nobody is perfect at hiring & a few are always going to slip through, but when even one does, that chain of command HAS to review its own system to try to improve. When those rare people that shouldn't be cops get through the system & into a dept, the onus is then on the immediate chain of in field command staff. Those people that aren't working out HAVE to either be moved out altogether or moved to another area where their chances of doing harm are minimized = meter maid duty till they do retire. I'm not saying anywhere that an individual isn't responsible for their own actions, but I am saying 'the buck doesn't stop there'. I pushed this same system of responsibility when I was on our schools board. We had WAY too many bad hires. The problem was NOT with the applicant pool, the problem was with the people that did the hiring! Edit to update sig line- didn't work |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:45:22 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's a Civilian Review Board report. It has no bearing on actual criminal court matters. But I think it gives some insight into possible future issues. It seems to be strong on the emotional side and very lacking in substance. It does not IMO give any credence to criminal actions and only their own perceived policy violations which again might be a stretch. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 8:45:41 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why would I need to post a link that a course in drawing a blood sample is equal to a 2 year or more course in anything, that also includes much more in depth studies in blood drawing, including but not limited to, different anticoagulants, tube draw sequence, sterility, chemistry, etc and so on. There are plenty of posts that imply just because you have a badge it is assumed you can go anywhere and do anything you want. Look at them yourself. If this were a case of gun confiscation during a hurricane, or some other gun or property related seizure the same people would be triggered. But since it's mah drug screen (on an innocent person) not only are people OK with it, they put it above all else, including jeopardizing a patients life. The hills people choose to die on are astounding. No wonder the republican party is full of jeb bushes and Lindsay Graham's.  Thank you. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 9:21:18 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's a Civilian Review Board report. It has no bearing on actual criminal court matters. But I think it gives some insight into possible future issues. It seems to be strong on the emotional side and very lacking in substance. It does not IMO give any credence to criminal actions and only their own perceived policy violations which again might be a stretch. |
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Posted: 9/14/2017 11:09:56 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
SOP? How is that legal? |
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Posted: 9/15/2017 12:28:54 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting they are saying Payne and LT were not sufficiently trained, nor updated on current law and so they are putting that back on the PD. And it is local SOP to obtain blood samples from everyone involved in a major accident. The CRB report basically boils down to they think Payne was rude and failed to file one report properly and the LT was not properly trained to know current rules on blood draws. Quote HistoryQuoted:
The CRB report basically boils down to they think Payne was rude and failed to file one report properly and the LT was not properly trained to know current rules on blood draws. “You demonstrated extremely poor professional judgment (especially for an officer with 27 years of experience), which calls into question your ability to effectively serve the public and the Department in a manner that inspires the requisite trust, respect, and confidence,” the report adds. |
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Posted: 9/15/2017 12:41:59 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Wow. Thats what you got from the CRB report? I got a bit more than that..... “You demonstrated extremely poor professional judgment (especially for an officer with 27 years of experience), which calls into question your ability to effectively serve the public and the Department in a manner that inspires the requisite trust, respect, and confidence,” the report adds. |
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Posted: 9/15/2017 2:53:41 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Bama will get from the report what makes him feel better about his job. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Wow. Thats what you got from the CRB report? I got a bit more than that..... “You demonstrated extremely poor professional judgment (especially for an officer with 27 years of experience), which calls into question your ability to effectively serve the public and the Department in a manner that inspires the requisite trust, respect, and confidence,” the report adds. 
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Posted: 9/15/2017 9:53:42 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If I said to someone "I don't like that I cannot get my way and am blaming you" and then proceeded to secure their arms and stuff them in my car with the threat of taking them off somewhere else what would I be charged with? Would the target abductee be justified in using lethal force against me? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
It's a Civilian Review Board report. It has no bearing on actual criminal court matters. But I think it gives some insight into possible future issues. It seems to be strong on the emotional side and very lacking in substance. It does not IMO give any credence to criminal actions and only their own perceived policy violations which again might be a stretch. |
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