User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 3:31:03 PM EDT
[#1]
Just a though, could this be armed robbery? I would think they were armed when they made the stops.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 3:31:29 PM EDT
[#2]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm ashamed to say that I know the (former) Sheriff Jones. I always thought that he was a good cop. Guess I might have been wrong.  I can only cast so much blame. If I stopped a drug smuggler and he had lots of drugs and 1 million in cash....well....I'm only human, and man enough to admit it. DAMN hard thing to walk away from! PLEASE say you will NEVER be a cop. Was the guy in "No country for old men" a bad person for taking the money? He was deaded, I guess it didn't matter in the long run. 
please answer the question. I want to see where your morals tell you it's ok, if ever. How about the 100 million in Saddams palace? One tiny stack could be 20K and ELIMINATE you and your wife's credit card debt/ put a nice down payment on a home/whatever...would you take it? One tiny stack that could easily fit in your pocket. Can you imagine this scenario? You are staring at at least 100 million in $100 dollar bills that belonged to a cruel Dictator. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 3:31:44 PM EDT
[#3]
Sadly, if it's your word against a Law Enforcement Officer, your word loses. I don't believe these "officers of the court" should get such automatic credibility. Imperfect world. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 3:34:32 PM EDT
[#4]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm ashamed to say that I know the (former) Sheriff Jones. I always thought that he was a good cop. Guess I might have been wrong. I can only cast so much blame. If I stopped a drug smuggler and he had lots of drugs and 1 million in cash....well....I'm only human, and man enough to admit it. DAMN hard thing to walk away from! Could you break through a wall in Saddam's palace and find 100 million dollars and NOT take a single bill? Asset forfeiture is bad for a whole host of reasons but this is a big one. There's just WAY too much temptation that's there every day to do something bad, and way to many justifications for doing it. Just like lots of other bad laws, it tends to create crime/evil where none would exist otherwise. I would disagree with that, mainly because the 'temptation' to steal evidence is there either way... A cop who would steal asset-forfeiture money would just as soon steal any other evidence money..... I don't think so. I know I wouldn't. However - pulling over a drug dealer with tens of thousands of dollars that he likely hasn't even counted...hmmmmm. He'll be put away for the drugs alone. Can you tell me you wouldn't take 20K out of about 250K? Damn...it would be hard not to. I'm just trying to be realistic here. It would be easy to say I never would, but if I'm honest with myself, I can't say I wouldn't. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 3:50:40 PM EDT
[#5]
Quoted:
I can only cast so much blame. If I stopped a drug smuggler and he had lots of drugs and 1 million in cash....well....I'm only human, and man enough to admit it. DAMN hard thing to walk away from! Why? That money isn't yours. You have no claim to it. You lose nothing by turning it in as evidence. You could plop a trillion dollars in front of me and I wouldn't even blink. You know why? Because it's not mine, and stealing it would never cross my mind. Could you break through a wall in Saddam's palace and find 100 million dollars and NOT take a single bill?
Yes, because again, it's not mine. Was the guy in "No country for old men" a bad person for taking the money? He wasn't bad, but he sure as hell wasn't good. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 3:58:46 PM EDT
[#6]
Welcome to Southeastern Oklahoma!
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 3:59:53 PM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
LEO's claim to hold themselves to a higher standard, however when one succumbs to corruption shouldn't the punishment be more severe due to the "higher standard"? Of course it should... Nothing wrong with stricter punishment for thieves, ever... And in many cases, 'Theft under color of law' IS a more serious crime.... Not to mention civil rights charges (which don't apply to ordinary theives)... Based on the information given here, it is VERY likely that these guys WILL get significantly more prison time because of using their badges to steal.... I'd bet they get little to no time myself. Less then a year easily. Not so sure about that. Also generally speaking LEO's are sentenced to greater punishment than the average citizen. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 4:48:38 PM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I can only cast so much blame. If I stopped a drug smuggler and he had lots of drugs and 1 million in cash....well....I'm only human, and man enough to admit it. DAMN hard thing to walk away from! Why? That money isn't yours. You have no claim to it. You lose nothing by turning it in as evidence. You could plop a trillion dollars in front of me and I wouldn't even blink. You know why? Because it's not mine, and stealing it would never cross my mind. Could you break through a wall in Saddam's palace and find 100 million dollars and NOT take a single bill?
Yes, because again, it's not mine. Was the guy in "No country for old men" a bad person for taking the money? He wasn't bad, but he sure as hell wasn't good. 1 trillion in drug money. Nobody will ever know. you wouldn't take a dime. IF that is true, you are as solid as an OAK! ...and just as dumb. Honest to a fault, sorry to say. I respect you immensely (if it's true) 
The lady that cut her babys arms off in Plano Texas...I would have killed her had I walked in on it. 1 trillion dollars that belongs to a drug dealer, and there's NO DOUBT that I would get away with it...I would steal it. (maybe not if I was a cop...) |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 4:55:11 PM EDT
[#9]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Thieves with badges. This. But wait! Police officers would never do this!! 
Cops are human just like the rest of us - there are bad apples.... Hopefully, the action of the FBI here will help to keep some of those bad apples in line, via fear of getting caught.... I 100% agree. Now good luck in getting the "Usual Suspects" of officers here to admit that. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 5:30:47 PM EDT
[#10]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'm ashamed to say that I know the (former) Sheriff Jones. I always thought that he was a good cop. Guess I might have been wrong. I can only cast so much blame. If I stopped a drug smuggler and he had lots of drugs and 1 million in cash....well....I'm only human, and man enough to admit it. DAMN hard thing to walk away from! PLEASE say you will NEVER be a cop. Was the guy in "No country for old men" a bad person for taking the money? He was deaded, I guess it didn't matter in the long run.
please answer the question. I want to see where your morals tell you it's ok, if ever. How about the 100 million in Saddams palace? One tiny stack could be 20K and ELIMINATE you and your wife's credit card debt/ put a nice down payment on a home/whatever...would you take it? One tiny stack that could easily fit in your pocket. Can you imagine this scenario? You are staring at at least 100 million in $100 dollar bills that belonged to a cruel Dictator. Would I do it? Nope, I might play "what if I had that kind of money" later but I wouldn't take it. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 5:32:01 PM EDT
[#11]
So..... did all the money pay for ammo to shoot dogs? Cause then it'd be a full circle
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 5:32:36 PM EDT
[#12]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
LEO's claim to hold themselves to a higher standard, however when one succumbs to corruption shouldn't the punishment be more severe due to the "higher standard"? Of course it should... Nothing wrong with stricter punishment for thieves, ever... And in many cases, 'Theft under color of law' IS a more serious crime.... Not to mention civil rights charges (which don't apply to ordinary theives)... Based on the information given here, it is VERY likely that these guys WILL get significantly more prison time because of using their badges to steal.... I'd bet they get little to no time myself. Less then a year easily. Not so sure about that. Also generally speaking LEO's are sentenced to greater punishment than the average citizen. I wish you were right, I really do, especially when they destroy the public trust like scum like this do. I just have to disagree with you on this one. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 5:52:55 PM EDT
[#13]
Quoted:
Based on the information given here, it is VERY likely that these guys WILL get significantly more prison time because of using their badges to steal.... What color is the sky on your world? |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 5:54:53 PM EDT
[#14]
ETA: read it wrong but I still think individual officers should get a piece of the pie when they take large amounts of money that come from drugs and what not |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:16:42 PM EDT
[#15]
Quoted: ETA: read it wrong but I still think individual officers should get a piece of the pie when they take large amounts of money that come from drugs and what not Congratulations. You just gave them an INCENTIVE to steal, and abuse and violate the rights of the people. That is an extremely slippery slope. I'm not conceptually opposed to cutting officers in on the bust's loot, but it has to be done very carefully and with intensive oversight of the entire process by absolutely trustworthy people who are cross-checking each other every step of the way. How many times have you heard of someone getting the cash in their wallet confiscated out of suspicion that it was drug money? You're going to buy a used motorcycle for 2K in cash. You get stopped and searched and the officer thinks that 2K is too much for ordinary citizens to have unless they're into the drug trade. Poof...your money's in the evidence locker and you're in a holding cell. Even if you have the ad for the motorcycle with you in the car, "that's just a cover story meant to mislead officers who aren't as smart as me.". Never leave the door open for abuse, because someone will exploit it. CJ |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:21:13 PM EDT
[#16]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Thieves with badges. This. But wait! Police officers would never do this!!
Cops are human just like the rest of us - there are bad apples.... Hopefully, the action of the FBI here will help to keep some of those bad apples in line, via fear of getting caught.... I 100% agree. Now good luck in getting the "Usual Suspects" of officers here to admit that. Who has said there are no bad cops out there? |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:25:16 PM EDT
[#17]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
LEO's claim to hold themselves to a higher standard, however when one succumbs to corruption shouldn't the punishment be more severe due to the "higher standard"? Of course it should... Nothing wrong with stricter punishment for thieves, ever... And in many cases, 'Theft under color of law' IS a more serious crime.... Not to mention civil rights charges (which don't apply to ordinary theives)... Based on the information given here, it is VERY likely that these guys WILL get significantly more prison time because of using their badges to steal.... I'd bet they get little to no time myself. Less then a year easily. Not so sure about that. Also generally speaking LEO's are sentenced to greater punishment than the average citizen. I wish you were right, I really do, especially when they destroy the public trust like scum like this do. I just have to disagree with you on this one. You are more than welcome to disagree. However, I disagree with your disagreement. 
I do however believe most people have an unrealistic expectation of sentencing for criminal acts. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:26:11 PM EDT
[#18]
Quoted:
ETA: read it wrong but I still think individual officers should get a piece of the pie when they take large amounts of money that come from drugs and what not I disagree. ETA: The reward is getting better assignments and advancement. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:26:43 PM EDT
[#19]
Quoted:
Quoted:
ETA: read it wrong but I still think individual officers should get a piece of the pie when they take large amounts of money that come from drugs and what not Congratulations. You just gave them an INCENTIVE to steal, and abuse and violate the rights of the people. That is an extremely slippery slope. CJ maybe maybe not The way I see it is 1: the vast majority of officers are good people 2: the department gets 10% (I think) anyway 3: officers who do the hard work should get some of the reward, they dont right? 4: PDs should have found out and eliminated the assholes with their background checks anyway maybe I am naive or read your post wrong but I think the po-pop should be cut into How many times have you heard of someone getting the cash in their wallet confiscated out of suspicion that it was drug money?
never |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:30:48 PM EDT
[#20]
Well if you could only incarcerate the scumbag politicians that are stealing way more money than that every fricken day from taxpayers working stiffs and reallocating it to those who's votes are easily bought.
They're stealing our money under the color of law and converting it to personal and political benefit. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:31:34 PM EDT
[#21]
Quoted:
Quoted:
ETA: read it wrong but I still think individual officers should get a piece of the pie when they take large amounts of money that come from drugs and what not I disagree. ETA: The reward is getting better assignments and advancement. I dont know how it works there but in my other post I stated I was under the assumption the department go 10% of confiscated cash why shouldnt the officers get some? |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:34:24 PM EDT
[#22]
Quoted: Quoted: Based on the information given here, it is VERY likely that these guys WILL get significantly more prison time because of using their badges to steal.... What color is the sky on your world? Grey... Occasionally blue... It's western WA, you see... The fact is, that a common citizen who embezzled 5k while transporting it for his employer (this is where the crime comes from - not the siezure of the money, but the failure to turn it all in to evidence) would be charged with one crime (let's say grand theft, but it varies by state)... An LEO who does the same thing would be charged with theft under color of law... Far more serious.... IF it is determined that this is a habitual thing, and that suspects are being 'targeted' for siezures specifically so that money can be stolen, then you add civil rights violations... Which is the case here, according to the article... The cops are being charged with 2 crimes, where a normal citizen would be charged with ONE far less serious one... |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:35:05 PM EDT
[#23]
The kinda funny/ironic thing is that if some new member with about 40 posts came in here with a story "HEY! I was driving near Muskokee OK and I was going to Vegas and I had a 30K in cash hidden in my wheel well so that if I got robbed nobody would find it but when everything was said and done there was only 25K reported....... We'd see. "so what were you REALLY doing with 30K in cash"? "TROLL, trying to stir up crap huh?" "You are a drug dealer, good thing you got busted. SURE there was actually 30K "TROLL!" |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:37:26 PM EDT
[#24]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
ETA: read it wrong but I still think individual officers should get a piece of the pie when they take large amounts of money that come from drugs and what not I disagree. ETA: The reward is getting better assignments and advancement. I dont know how it works there but in my other post I stated I was under the assumption the department go 10% of confiscated cash why shouldnt the officers get some? IMO, it puts officers in a sitaution to make thin cases thinking they might get part of the money. That should not be an officers motivation to do his job. LE is not about bonus money. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:39:02 PM EDT
[#25]
Quoted:
IMO, it puts officers in a sitaution to make thin cases thinking they might get part of the money. That should not be an officers motivation to do his job. LE is not about bonus money. I can see what you are saying but doesnt background checks/polygraphs make sure the department doesnt hire these kind of people? Also I'm not saying it should be about bonus money but they should get a % if the department does |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:39:19 PM EDT
[#26]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Based on the information given here, it is VERY likely that these guys WILL get significantly more prison time because of using their badges to steal.... What color is the sky on your world? Its reality. Try it sometime you may grow to like it. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:48:38 PM EDT
[#27]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
ETA: read it wrong but I still think individual officers should get a piece of the pie when they take large amounts of money that come from drugs and what not I disagree. ETA: The reward is getting better assignments and advancement. I dont know how it works there but in my other post I stated I was under the assumption the department go 10% of confiscated cash why shouldnt the officers get some? IMO, it puts officers in a sitaution to make thin cases thinking they might get part of the money. That should not be an officers motivation to do his job. LE is not about bonus money. Agree totally. No need to put temptation in the mix. It's much the same as corporations now forbidding purchasing agents to get any gifts. Heck, a lot of employees can't even go to lunch with other people unless they pay for their own. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:52:44 PM EDT
[#28]
Quoted:
Quoted:
IMO, it puts officers in a sitaution to make thin cases thinking they might get part of the money. That should not be an officers motivation to do his job. LE is not about bonus money. I can see what you are saying but doesnt background checks/polygraphs make sure the department doesnt hire these kind of people? Also I'm not saying it should be about bonus money but they should get a % if the department does You are hiring people. Not robots. While background/polys (voodoo) will screen out a great deal of people who should not be in LE does not mean you get all of them or situations change after employment. No they should not get a percentage, the should be rewarded with commendations, assignments and advancement. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:55:33 PM EDT
[#29]
Quoted:
they only stole 5 grand? thats kinda measly i was expecting they would report like 10K and take the rest Actually, they stole 30 grand. 25 for the state government and 5 for themselves. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:57:16 PM EDT
[#30]
Quoted:
Quoted:
- isolated incident, - just a couple rogue's in a hick dept - 2% Oklahoma has 77 counties...take out Oklahoma County and Tulsa County and we have 75 "hick" counties. Thank God the biggest percent are good cops. We sure have had a couple of black eyes recently. I'd rather be dealing with a hick cop from Oklahoma than a cop from LA. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:58:07 PM EDT
[#31]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
IMO, it puts officers in a sitaution to make thin cases thinking they might get part of the money. That should not be an officers motivation to do his job. LE is not about bonus money. I can see what you are saying but doesnt background checks/polygraphs make sure the department doesnt hire these kind of people? Also I'm not saying it should be about bonus money but they should get a % if the department does No they should not get a percentage, the should be rewarded with commendations, assignments and advancement. I disagree but this is all based on personal experience, you have more than me but as a private citizen this is my belief and I give up as we will not see eye to eye ETA: are you saying polyg's are BS? if so and dont want to post here IM me, anyone, but i always heard they 90 some percent effective |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 6:59:27 PM EDT
[#32]
Quoted:
Quoted:
So how much money do you think they managed to steal before they finally got caught? Good question, I'd hate to think that he sold a career for a measly $5k. Reminds me of Duke Cunningham. Who knew a war hero congressman could be bought so cheaply? |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 7:05:54 PM EDT
[#33]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
IMO, it puts officers in a sitaution to make thin cases thinking they might get part of the money. That should not be an officers motivation to do his job. LE is not about bonus money. I can see what you are saying but doesnt background checks/polygraphs make sure the department doesnt hire these kind of people? Also I'm not saying it should be about bonus money but they should get a % if the department does No they should not get a percentage, the should be rewarded with commendations, assignments and advancement. I disagree but this is all based on personal experience, you have more than me but as a private citizen this is my belief and I give up as we will not see eye to eye ETA: are you saying polyg's are BS? if so and dont want to post here IM me, anyone, but i always heard they 90 some percent effective LE is not private business. I also work in the private business world and get a bonus based on performance. This should not translate to the LE world. Polys are interrogation tools, no I do not believe in them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 7:17:33 PM EDT
[#34]
[span style='font-weight: bold;']Quoted:[/
The undercover agent was told to sign a release of currency form if he wanted to avoid jail. –––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––– Nice.  
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 7:40:12 PM EDT
[#35]
Glad they got caught.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 9:03:39 PM EDT
[#36]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Based on the information given here, it is VERY likely that these guys WILL get significantly more prison time because of using their badges to steal.... What color is the sky on your world? I have to say, sometimes it seems like they get away with murder, and other times it seems like they get the shaft. most seem to get off light, but there are definitely two extreme outcomes. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/17/2009 9:04:40 PM EDT
[#37]
Quoted:
Quoted:
ETA: read it wrong but I still think individual officers should get a piece of the pie when they take large amounts of money that come from drugs and what not Congratulations. You just gave them an INCENTIVE to steal, and abuse and violate the rights of the people. That is an extremely slippery slope. I'm not conceptually opposed to cutting officers in on the bust's loot, but it has to be done very carefully and with intensive oversight of the entire process by absolutely trustworthy people who are cross-checking each other every step of the way. How many times have you heard of someone getting the cash in their wallet confiscated out of suspicion that it was drug money? You're going to buy a used motorcycle for 2K in cash. You get stopped and searched and the officer thinks that 2K is too much for ordinary citizens to have unless they're into the drug trade. Poof...your money's in the evidence locker and you're in a holding cell. Even if you have the ad for the motorcycle with you in the car, "that's just a cover story meant to mislead officers who aren't as smart as me.". Never leave the door open for abuse, because someone will exploit it. CJ yep. Totally agree with johnson on this. I know what your thinking, but it will end very very badly. |
|
|
|
Posted: 6/18/2009 3:49:17 AM EDT
[#38]
This obviously isn't the first time they did this. They have stolen drug money before. Drug money belongs to drug dealers. Prison is full of drug dealers, including ones they've stolen money from before. Enjoy your stay. 
|
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
