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Posted: 1/27/2021 2:04:38 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I would disagree with the supposed advantage of a spearman against a sword and shield, it's not so easy hitting a sword and shield fighter with a spear as some would believe Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Throw your pommel at him! Seriously, in an actual melee fight, I think you're screwed. If he has a pike he can easily hit you from out of your weapon range, unless of course you also have a pike. So run, run far away! Pray if he decides to chase you, he tires out first, THEN maybe try and rush in for the kill. I would disagree with the supposed advantage of a spearman against a sword and shield, it's not so easy hitting a sword and shield fighter with a spear as some would believe |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 2:06:13 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: +1 and @spearweasel Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Stick jocks foreva  +1 and @spearweasel Someone invoked my name in a discussion of spears? I likes 'em, yessir.  Attached File Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 2:07:52 AM EDT
[#3]
Killdozer.
Killdozer does not require a crew to run, so it keeps the 1 on 1. Killdozer is not a projectile weapon. Per the reports, killdozer doesn't classify as a vehicle but instead as a weapon of mass destruction. Historically, until blows a transmission, killdozer is quite resistant to all infantry attacks. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 2:13:29 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sometimes silly arguments have there own rewards  Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Being attacked by a man with a spear while I'm barred from using projectile weapons is sillier. Sometimes silly arguments have there own rewards |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 2:33:36 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Most would be carrying a long slim spike or dagger made just for going through chinks and eyeslots after the grapple but yes that is the method used as long as the spearman does not retreat Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Be in full plate armor, I'm talking late 15th early 16th, Maximillian style or later. You are going to be basically impervious to your basic spear. Rush the spearman, knock him down, use any of your weapons to kill him. Spearman would probably be best off taking the spearhead off the shaft and creating a dagger, then use his greater maneuverability (but note properly fitted armor doesn't restict you much, guys can do cartwheels in them) and especially visibility to stab him in the armpit or visor slits. Most would be carrying a long slim spike or dagger made just for going through chinks and eyeslots after the grapple but yes that is the method used as long as the spearman does not retreat Also, spearman starting out with spear in his hand would be slightly behind the curve if he has to drop spear and fish out his dagger vs already having the best weapon in hand. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 2:55:19 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes, but now you are adding in rules. You never said 'a man armed with a spear and dagger' you said a man armed with a spear. What's next? Include that Also, spearman starting out with spear in his hand would be slightly behind the curve if he has to drop spear and fish out his dagger vs already having the best weapon in hand. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Be in full plate armor, I'm talking late 15th early 16th, Maximillian style or later. You are going to be basically impervious to your basic spear. Rush the spearman, knock him down, use any of your weapons to kill him. Spearman would probably be best off taking the spearhead off the shaft and creating a dagger, then use his greater maneuverability (but note properly fitted armor doesn't restict you much, guys can do cartwheels in them) and especially visibility to stab him in the armpit or visor slits. Most would be carrying a long slim spike or dagger made just for going through chinks and eyeslots after the grapple but yes that is the method used as long as the spearman does not retreat Also, spearman starting out with spear in his hand would be slightly behind the curve if he has to drop spear and fish out his dagger vs already having the best weapon in hand. The scenario posed appears geared mostly towards a duel 1-on-1. The majority if the posters tend to be viewing the topic from their perspective interests, which tends mostly towards medieval tactics/weaponry, and the common practice would be to carry a dagger or long bladed knife of some sort, regardless of what the primary weapon was. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 8:02:28 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sure it is! That shield is a big target and easy to hit! Other than a feint, the man in armor is the target, no?, it would be like attacking the weapon as so many Hollywood movies show 
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Posted: 1/27/2021 8:03:27 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Someone invoked my name in a discussion of spears? I likes 'em, yessir. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/17212/1916797_166687537284_3194754_n_jpg-1798754.JPGhttps://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/17212/1916797_166688417284_8014550_n_jpg-1798756.JPGhttps://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/17212/1928725_47136042284_5147_n_jpg-1798757.JPG Nice
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Posted: 1/27/2021 8:06:01 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: then a 'silly' but highly effective solution to a silly question should be accepted with grace. A mine is hardly a good choice in this situation, as it would require pre planning and tech not generally avalible to a medieval spearman |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 8:06:48 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes, but now you are adding in rules. You never said 'a man armed with a spear and dagger' you said a man armed with a spear. What's next? Include that Also, spearman starting out with spear in his hand would be slightly behind the curve if he has to drop spear and fish out his dagger vs already having the best weapon in hand. See post below yours |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 8:35:59 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Be in full plate armor, I'm talking late 15th early 16th, Maximillian style or later. You are going to be basically impervious to your basic spear. Rush the spearman, knock him down, use any of your weapons to kill him. Spearman would probably be best off taking the spearhead off the shaft and creating a dagger, then use his greater maneuverability (but note properly fitted armor doesn't restict you much, guys can do cartwheels in them) and especially visibility to stab him in the armpit or visor slits. Again, the assumption that only one side can be mobile... |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 8:48:31 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I would disagree with the supposed advantage of a spearman against a sword and shield, it's not so easy hitting a sword and shield fighter with a spear as some would believe Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Throw your pommel at him! Seriously, in an actual melee fight, I think you're screwed. If he has a pike he can easily hit you from out of your weapon range, unless of course you also have a pike. So run, run far away! Pray if he decides to chase you, he tires out first, THEN maybe try and rush in for the kill. I would disagree with the supposed advantage of a spearman against a sword and shield, it's not so easy hitting a sword and shield fighter with a spear as some would believe Who will tire faster, the guy with the spear, or the guy toting a sword and board? Shields be heavy, yo... or so I’ve been told. That said, an overlooked part of this conversation is that, in reality, most one-on-one fights (whether between our fictional sword vs spear opponents, a couple of thugs in a knife fight, or a fistfight at the local ranch party kegger) are really short, and the first to land a solid blow almost always wins the fight. For the most part, prolonged duels are the product of hollywood. Nobody says a spear is a magic wand that makes problems disappear, but in a contest that requires contact, having a reach advantage is, in fact, an advantage. That won’t mean anything if you don’t know how to use it effectively, but that’s a whole different discussion. Having more skill is an even bigger advantage, but goes both ways. There are a number of reasons why the pointy stick was a mainstay of organized warfare from the beginning of written history until the age of the firearm (arguably, up to the 19th century, firearms were mostly noisemakers that eventually became clubs and spears once it inevitably became a melee anyway). It’s easy to imagine a hundred scenarios where either side wins in this hypothetical situation, and most of them are feasible. You can insert a million “what ifs” that give advantage to either contestant. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 8:57:53 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Who will tire faster, the guy with the spear, or the guy toting a sword and board? Shields be heavy, yo... or so I’ve been told. That said, an overlooked part of this conversation is that, in reality, most one-on-one fights (whether between our fictional sword vs spear opponents, a couple of thugs in a knife fight, or a fistfight at the local ranch party kegger) are really short, and the first to land a solid blow almost always wins the fight. For the most part, prolonged duels are the product of hollywood. Nobody says a spear is a magic wand that makes problems disappear, but in a contest that requires contact, having a reach advantage is, in fact, an advantage. That won’t mean anything if you don’t know how to use it effectively, but that’s a whole different discussion. Having more skill is an even bigger advantage, but goes both ways. It’s easy to imagine a hundred scenarios where either side wins in this hypothetical situation, and most of them are feasible. You can insert a million “what ifs” that give advantage to either contestant. Yes, shield is heavy, many different ways to sling it to help, the reach is what's nice about the spear and freedom of movement/ vision , usually spear is trying for lower legs,face,sword arm, not much else unless you close and circle, the shieldman has to close and wait for a strike and then rush in, it's usually waiting for the mistake that decides it |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 9:00:51 AM EDT
[#14]
Depth charges.
Or are we talking about on land? |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 9:20:46 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Frying pan. Pan shot! |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 9:40:38 AM EDT
[#16]
Another great weapon to use against the spear, the maduva or madu, it combines both the shield and the spear and can be used in combination with a sword, very ancient weopon from India, it's a great weapon often overlooked as it can be complicated to use
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Posted: 1/27/2021 9:56:40 AM EDT
[#17]
What kind of swordsman? What kind of spearman?
Middle Kingdom Egyptian spearman wearing nothing but a loincloth with a dinky bronze spear, hoplite, or 17th century pikeman? Very different gear, very different weapon. Sherdan swordsmen, legionnaires, medieval knights, 19th century cavalry sabre? All very different swordsmen. There weren’t any restrictions on era, yet both weapons have a spectrum of development that spans centuries. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 10:03:20 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What kind of swordsman? What kind of spearman? Middle Kingdom Egyptian spearman wearing nothing but a loincloth with a dinky bronze spear, hoplite, or 17th century pikeman? Very different gear, very different weapon. Sherdan swordsmen, legionnaires, medieval knights, 19th century cavalry sabre? All very different swordsmen. There weren’t any restrictions on era, yet both weapons have a spectrum of development that spans centuries. That's were it gets complicated, 1000s of combinations of arms and armor, but my scenario would assume both armored head to toe, 14 to 15 century? European, that's where the thought in this comes in, I'm mainly questioning the supremacy of the spear over everything else |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 10:19:41 AM EDT
[#19]
My other idea for a thread was a Japanese samurai against a Spanish or Portuguese soldier ala 1600, a lot of controversy on that one
 Edit...... Rapier vs katana
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Posted: 1/27/2021 10:24:11 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My other idea for a thread was a Japanese samurai against a Spanish or Portuguese soldier ala 1600, a lot of controversy on that one Biggest factor there is all the mythology, folklore, and emotional nonsense associated with samurai (and many Asian things) in American culture. Oddly enough, there is very little of that associated with conquistadores. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 10:27:06 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Biggest factor there is all the mythology, folklore, and emotional nonsense associated with samurai (and many Asian things) in American culture. Oddly enough, there is very little of that associated with conquistadores. Yes, Hollywood is a very poor historical reference for sword fighting , but I tend to believe the accounts of the Portuguese defeating the samurai
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Posted: 1/27/2021 11:06:46 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yes, Hollywood is a very poor historical reference for sword fighting , but I tend to believe the accounts of the Portuguese defeating the samuraiQuote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Biggest factor there is all the mythology, folklore, and emotional nonsense associated with samurai (and many Asian things) in American culture. Oddly enough, there is very little of that associated with conquistadores. Yes, Hollywood is a very poor historical reference for sword fighting , but I tend to believe the accounts of the Portuguese defeating the samuraiHistorically, the Portuguese did surprisingly well militarily. During the 16th century, the Portos fought a bunch of folks, while Japanese only fought other Japanese. The Portuguese also had real naval doctrine at the time, while the Japanese did not. I think the Japanese were extremely good within the narrow scope of what they did, but hollywood/folklore (and a healthy dose of Japanese ethnocentrism in their accounts of things) has turned them into mythical, godlike, uberwarriors. Thing is, fights are funny, chaotic, things. In general, individual fights go to the better (more trained, more conditioned, bigger, stronger, meaner) fighter, but shit happens, so not always. Skirmishes generally go to the side with superior doctrine/training, but sometimes shit happens. Wars tend to go with the side that can move people better and keep them fed/equipped ... well, always... so there is where the model breaks down... The baddest dude I know got his ass kicked in a fight with a dumbass who broke his leg with a barstool. My friend was bigger, stronger, more experienced, and had a multitude of training and experience. I figure 99 times out of a hundred that situation goes the other way, but this particular time it turned out the way it did (from an external standpoint, his biggest error was getting in a bar fight in the first place, but that’s a separate argument). |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 11:11:55 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Historically, the Portuguese did surprisingly well militarily. During the 16th century, the Portos fought a bunch of folks, while Japanese only fought other Japanese. The Portuguese also had real naval doctrine at the time, while the Japanese did not. I think the Japanese were extremely good within the narrow scope of what they did, but hollywood/folklore (and a healthy dose of Japanese ethnocentrism in their accounts of things) has turned them into mythical, godlike, uberwarriors. Thing is, fights are funny, chaotic, things. In general, individual fights go to the better (more trained, more conditioned, bigger, stronger, meaner) fighter, but shit happens, so not always. Skirmishes generally go to the side with superior doctrine/training, but sometimes shit happens. Wars tend to go with the side that can move people better and keep them fed/equipped ... well, always... so there is where the model breaks down... The baddest dude I know got his ass kicked in a fight with a dumbass who broke his leg with a barstool. My friend was bigger, stronger, more experienced, and had a multitude of training and experience. I figure 99 times out of a hundred that situation goes the other way, but this particular time it turned out the way it did (from an external standpoint, his biggest error was getting in a bar fight in the first place, but that’s a separate argument). Luck does have a lot to do with it, and I love those long Portuguese rapiers, and I've seen sword fights were a novice would take out a very experienced fighter because he did something totally of the wall and it worked |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 11:13:54 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My other idea for a thread was a Japanese samurai against a Spanish or Portuguese soldier ala 1600, a lot of controversy on that one Edit...... Rapier vs katana We tested that one too. The rapier evolved to what it was, for a reason. They weren't that common in fully armored combat. Edged weapons, unarmored vs unarmored, speed wins. While good kendoka are fast and can potentially score hits first on occasion (and double touches which might result in 2 deaths in a real duel), the overwhelming majority of the time, the person with the rapier could strike the kendoka's hands first. As mentioned, I already had a background in Kendo when we started sparring with replica weapons. Naturally, we tried the different sword types. Katana vs arming sword, bastard sword, claymore, saber, epee, rapier/foil etc. Even though I never formally trained in fencing, I did better with the rapier vs one of my kendoka buddies, than with the shinai against someone with a rapier who had training in some form of swordsmanship. Katana vs bastard sword was more interesting. Katana vs sword and shield...
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Posted: 1/27/2021 11:20:46 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: We tested that one too. The rapier evolved to what it was, for a reason. They weren't that common in fully armored combat. Edged weapons, unarmored vs unarmored, speed wins. While good kendoka are fast and can potentially score hits first on occasion (and double touches which might result in 2 deaths in a real duel), the overwhelming majority of the time, the person with the rapier could strike the kendoka's hands first. With the reduction in armor and unarmored duels the rapier kinda developed into a particularly nasty weapon carried on the person, big heavy swords went out of style as well as armor, all that weight 
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Posted: 1/27/2021 11:25:36 AM EDT
[#26]
Blue Bonnet Spearman?
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Posted: 1/27/2021 11:27:39 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Blue Bonnet Spearman?  had to edit.....all hat no spear
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Posted: 1/27/2021 11:34:14 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: With the reduction in armor and unarmored duels the rapier kinda developed into a particularly nasty weapon carried on the person, big heavy swords went out of style as well as armor, all that weight Speed kills, when you only have to deal with the squishy bits. Still, some visuals just convey a sense of elemental savagery... 
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Posted: 1/27/2021 11:41:55 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Speed kills, when you only have to deal with the squishy bits. Still, some visuals just convey a sense of elemental savagery... https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/69531/D593A378-C43C-4B4D-A08A-1ECC63C11083-1798996.jpg Hard thing with axes in armored combat is controlling that leading edge, it usually just gets used like a mass weapon like a mace, and that's another thing about sword fighting is controlling the edge, both front and back, gets difficult at times, a lot of modern medieval combat turns into club fighting sometimes 
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:00:34 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Hard thing with axes in armored combat is controlling that leading edge, it usually just gets used like a mass weapon like a mace, and that's another thing about sword fighting is controlling the edge, both front and back, gets difficult at times, a lot of modern medieval combat turns into club fighting sometimes Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Speed kills, when you only have to deal with the squishy bits. Still, some visuals just convey a sense of elemental savagery... https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/69531/D593A378-C43C-4B4D-A08A-1ECC63C11083-1798996.jpg Hard thing with axes in armored combat is controlling that leading edge, it usually just gets used like a mass weapon like a mace, and that's another thing about sword fighting is controlling the edge, both front and back, gets difficult at times, a lot of modern medieval combat turns into club fighting sometimes Axes make better clubs than swords. Axes that can hook stuff out of the way and have a pokey side make me happy. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:06:45 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Axes make better clubs than swords. Axes that can hook stuff out of the way and have a pokey side make me happy. Mass weapons are good, also why don't sword fighters use the wrap shots more often? Being able to hit your opponent in the back of the leg/head/back when in close is a great tactic as well as loosening up the wrist and using it like a whip for speed, good for face shots, don't see these techniques used outside of some organizations |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:08:18 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Mass weapons are good, also why don't sword fighters use the wrap shots more often? Being able to hit your opponent in the back of the leg/head/back when in close is a great tactic as well as loosening up the wrist and using it like a whip for speed, good for face shots, don't see these techniques used outside of some organizations Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Axes make better clubs than swords. Axes that can hook stuff out of the way and have a pokey side make me happy. Mass weapons are good, also why don't sword fighters use the wrap shots more often? Being able to hit your opponent in the back of the leg/head/back when in close is a great tactic as well as loosening up the wrist and using it like a whip for speed, good for face shots, don't see these techniques used outside of some organizations I did. Wraps and draw cuts FTW. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:10:37 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I did. Wraps and draw cuts FTW. Spin shots and crossing arms for left hand fighters as well, and a lot do not like close in grappling
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:12:30 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Spin shots and crossing arms for left hand fighters as well, and a lot do not like close in grappling Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I did. Wraps and draw cuts FTW. Spin shots and crossing arms for left hand fighters as well, and a lot do not like close in grappling Most of my background in that respect is Olympic style fencing, where that stuff is frowned upon... |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:13:13 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Other than a feint, the man in armor is the target, no?, it would be like attacking the weapon as so many Hollywood movies show I think he is joking but both of you have brought up my Hollywood pet peeves! Attacking the weapon or swinging in way that does not threaten the opponent. It's lazy choreography! Also when a sword and shield guy attacks with the sword and the shield rotates backwards out of blocking range as they swing. It's very natural to do for balance reasons but we train hard to prevent that because it will get you killed. Shield should always present some kind of DEFENSE. Don't get me started on people standing behind the wheels of a cannon when it is firing! |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:15:24 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Most of my background in that respect is Olympic style fencing, where that stuff is frowned upon... I tried fencing, unfortunately it was after fighting heavy for a long time, hard to acknowledge a shot, and got a lot of holes poked in myself, epee, sabre much better |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:28:06 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I tried fencing, unfortunately it was after fighting heavy for a long time, hard to acknowledge a shot, and got a lot of holes poked in myself, epee, sabre much better Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Most of my background in that respect is Olympic style fencing, where that stuff is frowned upon... I tried fencing, unfortunately it was after fighting heavy for a long time, hard to acknowledge a shot, and got a lot of holes poked in myself, epee, sabre much better I had about a decade of saber (including a disturbing number of North American circuit events and a bunch of frequent flyer miles), but have done all three. Besides, saber fencers got all the girls and partied the hardest. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:33:06 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I had about a decade of saber (including a disturbing number of North American circuit events and a bunch of frequent flyer miles), but have done all three. Besides, saber fencers got all the girls and partied the hardest. Girls loved guys in armor too that and the beards most of us would sport
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:38:32 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Girls loved guys in armor too that and the beards most of us would sportQuote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I had about a decade of saber (including a disturbing number of North American circuit events and a bunch of frequent flyer miles), but have done all three. Besides, saber fencers got all the girls and partied the hardest. Girls loved guys in armor too that and the beards most of us would sportSadly, both fencing groupies and renfair chicks (with some exceptions) don’t tend to be tier 1. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:43:27 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sadly, both fencing groupies and renfair chicks (with some exceptions) don’t tend to be tier 1. This is true , used to live in Norman ok though had a medfaire every year that we did demos for, hundreds of collage age girls
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:47:21 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is true , used to live in Norman ok though had a medfaire every year that we did demos for, hundreds of collage age girlsQuote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Sadly, both fencing groupies and renfair chicks (with some exceptions) don’t tend to be tier 1. This is true , used to live in Norman ok though had a medfaire every year that we did demos for, hundreds of collage age girlsA friend of mine owns one of the faires here in Texas. They do throw some wild parties, though. I’m too old for that shit now. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:50:33 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A friend of mine owns one of the faires here in Texas. They do throw some wild parties, though. I’m too old for that shit now. We all age and usually get married, all grey now myself |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:52:35 PM EDT
[#43]
In no particular order: a longer spear, toss sand into his eyes, throw a rock, or grab his spear if he lounges and misses if you're just out of his range when he strikes.
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:55:04 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryAlways liked that odd movie. Pretty good computer graphics for 1989 or whatever it was. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 12:57:02 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In no particular order: a longer spear, toss sand into his eyes, throw a rock, or grab his spear if he lounges and misses if you're just out of his range when he strikes. Longer spears are awkward, your fighting that additional mass, shorter is generally better for 1 on 1 fighting, 6 foot to a max of 9 is about right, spear on spear usually turns into a fencing match |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 1:01:49 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In no particular order: a longer spear, toss sand into his eyes, throw a rock, or grab his spear if he lounges and misses if you're just out of his range when he strikes. Longer spears were generally for mass formations, and poorly suited for individual fighting. ETA oops, covered by smarter folks already. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 1:09:38 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In no particular order: a longer spear, toss sand into his eyes, throw a rock, or grab his spear if he lounges and misses if you're just out of his range when he strikes. lol If my opponent lounges I may have a chance. |
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Posted: 1/27/2021 1:11:19 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: lol If my opponent lounges I may have a chance. Like on a couch? 
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Posted: 1/27/2021 1:17:29 PM EDT
[#49]
Another thing about shields is that they had literally 100s of different types as well as slinging them in all manner, from center grip to handles to arm straps, they are the literal red headed stepchild of medieval weapons
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Posted: 1/27/2021 2:33:05 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Longer spears are awkward, your fighting that additional mass, shorter is generally better for 1 on 1 fighting, 6 foot to a max of 9 is about right, spear on spear usually turns into a fencing match Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: In no particular order: a longer spear, toss sand into his eyes, throw a rock, or grab his spear if he lounges and misses if you're just out of his range when he strikes. Longer spears are awkward, your fighting that additional mass, shorter is generally better for 1 on 1 fighting, 6 foot to a max of 9 is about right, spear on spear usually turns into a fencing match Yep. It's another one of those misconceptions that are common until you've actually tested that out; longer reach is an advantage, therefore, even longer must be better, right? Nope. If you're trying to stop/dissuade a cavalry charge, sure. One on one, the really long spears are too cumbersome. For the folks who've never actually sparred with them, I'll try to explain it briefly from the perspective of spear use. Sure, if one guy is using a 7' spear, and the other guy is using a 12' spear/pike, the guy with the 12' spear can make contact with his spear from 5' further away with a 2-handed thrust. The issue is with weight, inertia and control. While you can slide your hands along the shaft to vary your grip and the weapon's reach, from the standpoint of quick stabs/thrusts, you're still limited by the range of motion of your arm's length (i.e. a 6'6" guy with a 7' spear, can vary the 'danger-range' more than a 5' guy, with the much taller guy being able to tag a target from 1-2' further away, with the same spear). That danger-range of fast variation is about 3-4' on average, even with a longer spear. The longer spear has the disadvantage of mass, inertia and momentum. To illustrate; if both combatants start out from outside contact range for either person and then begin to close, the tips of both spears will cross before either can make an effective stab. The longer spear will be slower, and the thing that makes it more uneven is the inertia. If the guy with the shorter spear uses a beat (knocking the other spear aside), the guy with the long pike will not be able to recover quicky enough against the following attack. The guy with the shorter spear can either wait at the edge of the range of the longer spear, for the pikeman to attack, or they can cross and use a beat with the faster/more maneuverable spear. Like the short sword and buckler vs spear contests, I don't recall seeing someone trying a 12' or longer spear, win against someone with a 7-8' spear. |
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