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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:41:00 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:Goading people in to starting shit from the sidelines is easy. This isn't about risk. It's about risk / reward / the actual fight. There's no AWB on the docket this year. They aren't even there and there's no mass rally and vcdl has some dumb shit drive around in circles thing going on. But by all means, goad your brothers into a setup. This shit, right here......ALL of it. The internet keyboard warriors that NEVER show up anywhere are the first to urge others to jump into the fire...... |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:43:35 PM EDT
[#2]
I was there last year, incredible experience and nice to meet you fellas. Last year our vote mattered. Last year we had a Republic, or at least most of us there thought we did. This is different. One scoped rifle from an elevated position and you’re done. 50 and it’s all over. Save your ammo. Don’t stand on the X. God’s speed gentlemen. Let’s win this fucking thing.
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:43:54 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted: Recently our leadership has become aware of some information which has led us to determine that our resources (both tangible and intangible) are better focused elsewhere than Richmond in the immediate future. What is this information? |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:44:02 PM EDT
[#4]
Ban every person in this thread who is screaming cowardice.
Carry on. |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:44:34 PM EDT
[#5]
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:45:16 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Agreed. Yes many people were part of the Silent Brigade but 99.9% of the people were not. I'm sure the lack of participation from APC will not be noticed in the turnout. I'm planning on going solo this time. Yeah, we were there with 4 last year, it would be easier alone, for sure. |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:45:31 PM EDT
[#7]
As it stands, Lobby Day this year is a known trap designed to take us out of the fight.
Legally and physically. If you still wish to go, please assess your goals and objectives for the day. And have your own extract and contingency plans. Lobbying is out of the question, as there is noone there to Lobby. The networking activities on the local and national level that occured last year is still in place, and it's up to each of us to continue doing so, independent of Richmond. There is merit to retaking the square, so to speak, as the MMM acquired their reservations through rule breaking (TBD if it was in violation of the law), but if you do manage to take the podium, know what you want to do and say before hand. And be ready for the consequences. Final point is a quote from Sun Tzu. Realize you are confronting an opponent where they are strong and prepared. If your enemy is secure at all points, be prepared for him. If he is in superior strength, evade him. If your opponent is temperamental, seek to irritate him. Pretend to be weak, that he may grow arrogant. If he is taking his ease, give him no rest. If his forces are united, separate them. If sovereign and subject are in accord, put division between them. Attack him where he is unprepared, appear where you are not expected. |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:46:22 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I understand the strategic picture right now. I think this is wise in the short term. |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:46:47 PM EDT
[#9]
This is a smart move...
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:47:42 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: As it stands, Lobby Day this year is a known trap designed to take us out of the fight. Legally and physically. If you still wish to go, please assess your goals and objectives for the day. And have your own extract and contingency plans. Lobbying is out of the question, as there is noone there to Lobby. The networking activities on the local and national level that occured last year is still in place, and it's up to each of us to continue doing so, independent of Richmond. There is merit to retaking the square, so to speak, as the MMM acquired their reservations through rule breaking (TBD if it was in violation of the law), but if you do manage to take the podium, know what you want to do and say before hand. And be ready for the consequences. Final point is a quote from Sun Tzu. Realize you are confronting an opponent where they are strong and prepared. Concur. I will not be going. |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:47:47 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This shit, right here......ALL of it. The internet keyboard warriors that NEVER show up anywhere are the first to urge others to jump into the fire...... Sometimes I think some people here want martyrs in the hopes that something will spark, as long as it isn't them. I'm sure you'll have plenty of opportunity for that considering we are in for at least 2 years of governance by spite and revenge. |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:49:17 PM EDT
[#12]
What, not charging into an ambush?
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:49:52 PM EDT
[#13]
Wise Decision! I'm sure this Decision was not made lightly.
I met Ben last year @LD2020, I'd lead under his command any day! |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:50:42 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Does anyone here believe another violent protest at a State capitol is just the ticket? Don't fight dumb. Everything right now needs to be about making THEM look like the extremists. Which they are. So when are we going to fight? When are we going to simply make our voices heard? Speak up, when all avenues are censored? All year long BLM, Antifa, and Communist groups burned police stations, looted buildings, attacked members of the public, shot people, stabbed people, and beat people in front of cameras and in front of the police. Were they called extremists? Were they called Terrorists? Insurrectionists? Were their faces plastered across the evening news and were they hunted down one by one? No, they were not. And they NEVER will be. The control of the perspective is not in our hands, and what they portray us to be will not shift based upon our actions. Do you have any way to refute the outrageous categorization of ourselves when you can’t even comment on a news article anymore? You can’t make a post on Facebook anymore, saying hey this is simply not right! When is the time to organize, to communicate, and to peaceably protest? To show that we are not afraid? When the suppressed left Facebook and Twitter due to censorship they were called racists and extremists. They found a new home on Parler which was unacceptable, so it had to be suppressed as well. Now they are called domestic terrorists. Maybe we can finally protest when they make firearm ownership illegal? Perhaps not, that might be too soon. |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:52:00 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." ding ding ding. |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:53:08 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I understand the strategic picture right now. I think this is wise in the short term. |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:53:11 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What, not charging into an ambush? Ironically, that is indeed the correct method of dealing with an ambush. I am not sure how I feel about Lobby Day this year. Truthfully time is getting short and we may already be past its usefulness. |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:54:08 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." If you want to go, go. I’m not 100% out, but without a plan or local resources, it sure makes my venture 600+ miles plays into things. Last year I felt like I had at least 3 dozen of my friends from arfcom to stand with and it built my confidence to stand in a city far from home against their government. |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:54:24 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."  "Oh fuck that's a lot of Indians!" |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:57:07 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://www.ar15-backup.com/media/mediaFiles/14563/0041B2C3-EFB7-4242-A071-16F52556E3BE-1775713.jpg "Oh fuck that's a lot of Indians!" Or, "Oh fuck, that's a sharp sword!" |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:57:56 PM EDT
[#21]
If you go, remember you will not have the high ground.
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:58:08 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: cucks and cowards That is me. The guy who founded a nonprofit that has been decried by many as a thinly veiled militia and repeatedly been harassed by ATF and others, to include ANTIFA threatening me and following me around town. The guy who carried a bunch of NFA items at lobby day last year and ended up on news across the world leading hundreds as I stepped into the street in front of the local and state police telling us we could not. The coward who gave an immense amount of information on himself, including some that subsequently made my family and I targets both proverbially and literally, in a public meeting that turned into a youtube video with massive views, in an effort to stave off the folly that would surely lead to massive organized violence. I've only been to wars in 4 countries. But suddenly, I'm a coward and a cuck. You figured me out. Or I'm a competent Officer of Marines who recognizes that maneuver warfare is the only option when you are operating at a disadvantage, and I make decisions based on the mission and our desired effects, and not how others feel about me. I'm sure you know better. Maybe you should step up and take charge? |
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:58:35 PM EDT
[#23]
It's time to be more tactical. You will never duplicate the original Lobby Day.
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Posted: 1/11/2021 11:58:45 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That's not new. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Every conservative rally/protest/demonstration will be reported by the news as a possible domestic terror event from now on. That's not new. Nor is it our reason for not participating. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:00:23 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Dems are trying goad gun owners into a violent conflict. The British wanted our founding fathers to fight in the open too. Great point. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:01:12 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's time to be more tactical. You will never duplicate the original Lobby Day. Exactly. It seems that people assume us not going to Richmond means we are doing nothing. I'm all ears for explanations of what we would accomplish by repeating last year's plan. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:01:40 AM EDT
[#27]
To all those saying not going is cowardice, remember that there wasn't going to be a huge in-person event this year. They were essentially organizing a state-wide vehicle parade, all roads leaving to Richmond, and they were going to get blocked by jersey walls before they even got close to the capitol anyway.
This isn't some giant loss, and I'm sure Ben, the VCDL (which recently had its Facebook deactivated, right?) or whoever, will have a decent contingency plan if they're given time to work out logistics. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:01:40 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So when are we going to fight? When are we going to simply make our voices heard? Speak up, when all avenues are censored? All year long BLM, Antifa, and Communist groups burned police stations, looted buildings, attacked members of the public, shot people, stabbed people, and beat people in front of cameras and in front of the police. Were they called extremists? Were they called Terrorists? Insurrectionists? Were their faces plastered across the evening news and were they hunted down one by one? No, they were not. And they NEVER will be. The control of the perspective is not in our hands, and what they portray us to be will not shift based upon our actions. Do you have any way to refute the outrageous categorization of ourselves when you can’t even comment on a news article anymore? You can’t make a post on Facebook anymore, saying hey this is simply not right! When is the time to organize, to communicate, and to peaceably protest? To show that we are not afraid? When the suppressed left Facebook and Twitter due to censorship they were called racists and extremists. They found a new home on Parler which was unacceptable, so it had to be suppressed as well. Now they are called domestic terrorists. Maybe we can finally protest when they make firearm ownership illegal? Perhaps not, that might be too soon. Personally, I don't want to burn police stations, loot buildings, attack the public, shoot people, stab people or beat people in front of the cameras and police. Nor, do I want to fight on terms dictated by an opponent who wants to destroy me for my beliefs. Lobby day is historically important, but it is not the only pro-2A activity going on in Virginia. So, give them the false victory of standing around in the cold. If you like, be entrepreneurial and sell them hand warmers at $10 a pop. But don't goad people to walk into an obvious trap unprepared. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:02:43 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Does anyone here believe another violent protest at a State capitol is just the ticket? Don't fight dumb. Everything right now needs to be about making THEM look like the extremists. Which they are. Does not matter how they look if no one reports it.  |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:04:09 AM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That is me. The guy who founded a nonprofit that has been decried by many as a thinly veiled militia and repeatedly been harassed by ATF and others, to include ANTIFA threatening me and following me around town. The guy who carried a bunch of NFA items and ended up on news across the world leading hundreds as I stepped into the street in front of the local and state police telling us we could not. The coward who gave an immense amount of information on himself, including some that subsequently made my family and I targets both proverbially and literally, in a public meeting that turned into a youtube video with massive views, in an effort to stave off the folly that would surely lead to massive organized violence. I've only been to wars in 4 countries. But suddenly, I'm a coward and a cuck. You figured me out. Or I'm a competent Officer of Marines who recognizes that maneuver warfare is the only option when you are operating at a disadvantage, and I make decisions based on the mission and our desired effects, and not how others feel about me. I'm sure you know better. Maybe you should step up and take charge? No need for you to respond/Defend yourself to pettiness! Those of us who even slightly know you, or are of a Tactical mindset, know your Decision is sound. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:05:38 AM EDT
[#31]
yes, let's not learn from what just happened and repeat the same mistake
 A peaceful protest won't get any results and a violent one will only give our enemies ammo/what they want. don't be dumbasses! |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:05:47 AM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://www.ar15-backup.com/media/mediaFiles/14563/0041B2C3-EFB7-4242-A071-16F52556E3BE-1775713.jpg "Oh fuck that's a lot of Indians!" Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." "Oh fuck that's a lot of Indians!" You guys from NY are a poster child for “nows not the time, soon, but not now” when it comes to a fight. Actually, I take that back. You guys did manage to put up a fight when they limited you from 10 rounds to 7, good job. You managed to get it back to 10 rounds. 
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:06:35 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So roll over and let commies win  Who are you, again? |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:06:36 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Does not matter how they look if no one reports it. That's why I think this year's FIRST fight is about the right to free speech. Then we can be heard as we defend the right to bear arms. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:06:38 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I see we have lots of chest thumpers from out of state assembling here, who don’t understand the terrain and conditions. This was a toss-up at best even before 1/6 IMO. The legislators aren’t even there (due to covid) and there is a much more complicated legal thicket this year. This, knowing the area we local guys did not want anything to do with the half-baked caravan idea....It was pretty much "piss on that" from it's inception. The thought of joining in a march was looking good till it seemed to be co-opted by the overly enthusiastic and out of state battle-rattle crowd. Bad vibes born of questionable motives this go-round and that was decided before the goings-on at the Capital. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:08:04 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That is me. The guy who founded a nonprofit that has been decried by many as a thinly veiled militia and repeatedly been harassed by ATF and others, to include ANTIFA threatening me and following me around town. The guy who carried a bunch of NFA items and ended up on news across the world leading hundreds as I stepped into the street in front of the local and state police telling us we could not. The coward who gave an immense amount of information on himself, including some that subsequently made my family and I targets both proverbially and literally, in a public meeting that turned into a youtube video with massive views, in an effort to stave off the folly that would surely lead to massive organized violence. I've only been to wars in 4 countries. But suddenly, I'm a coward and a cuck. You figured me out. Or I'm a competent Officer of Marines who recognizes that maneuver warfare is the only option when you are operating at a disadvantage, and I make decisions based on the mission and our desired effects, and not how others feel about me. I'm sure you know better. Maybe you should step up and take charge? You’re good to go brother. Don’t even know u, but it’s clear as crystal it’s the right move. Gonna try to hook with u guys in May around Billings. Stay safe |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:08:36 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You guys from NY are a poster child for “nows not the time, soon, but not now” when it comes to a fight. Actually, I take that back. You guys did manage to put up a fight when they limited you from 10 rounds to 7, good job. You managed to get it back to 10 rounds. I understand your sentiment. Please dont take this wrong, you need to think with a Tactical mindset, not an emotional one. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:10:09 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ironically, that is indeed the correct method of dealing with an ambush. I am not sure how I feel about Lobby Day this year. Truthfully time is getting short and we may already be past its usefulness. There is no lobbying this year, nor major media coverage. So you show up and...what? Talk to each other while the capitol is empty? Provide a honeypot of people and information to potential opponents that you gain no positive conceivable benefit from? There are certainly people posting here that belong in amateur hour. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:10:41 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: cucks and cowards @Aimless CoC #6 pointed at a metric fuck ton of members of this website. Ban every one of them that posted this shit. CoC is CoC. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:13:09 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Every conservative rally/protest/demonstration will be reported by the news as a possible domestic terror event from now on. Yup |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:13:27 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So roll over and let commies win I wonder how many iterations of this were said when Washington engaged in tactical retreats. “Fuck, man, let’s roll over and let the limey fucks win Durh hurh” |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:13:40 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Does anyone here believe another violent protest at a State capitol is just the ticket? Don't fight dumb. Everything right now needs to be about making THEM look like the extremists. Which they are. Everything they are doing is designed to make them look POWERFUL. They don't give a shit if it's extremist or not, so long as it makes them look like they're in charge. That why they had their rabid dogs burning cities while police were made to kneel. That's why they had 'innocent mothers' lobbying corporations to cut ties to the 'wrong' businesses under threat of billionaire-backed-boycott. Stomping down a large Trump protest, then disemboweling non-left social media platforms in a scant two days, makes them look damn near omnipotent. "Work smarter not harder" sounds a lot like "we'll vote em out in four years" if you ask me. No I don't need to be privy to the plan, but at least some description of what the goal is at this point would be helpful for maintaining my motivation. Getting men in shape & trained in HAM isn't gonna cut it, I'm afraid. And remember, APC is explicitly non-political, so they CAN'T do anything too interesting in that department. Even though they & their members stand to be slandered as alt-white Nazi whateverthefucks the instant it's convenient to the authorities. Whether that happens before or after the APC makes its "smarter" move, who's to say? |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:13:55 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No need for you to respond/Defend yourself to pettiness! Those of us who even slightly know you, or are of a Tactical mindset, know your Decision is sound. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: That is me. The guy who founded a nonprofit that has been decried by many as a thinly veiled militia and repeatedly been harassed by ATF and others, to include ANTIFA threatening me and following me around town. The guy who carried a bunch of NFA items and ended up on news across the world leading hundreds as I stepped into the street in front of the local and state police telling us we could not. The coward who gave an immense amount of information on himself, including some that subsequently made my family and I targets both proverbially and literally, in a public meeting that turned into a youtube video with massive views, in an effort to stave off the folly that would surely lead to massive organized violence. I've only been to wars in 4 countries. But suddenly, I'm a coward and a cuck. You figured me out. Or I'm a competent Officer of Marines who recognizes that maneuver warfare is the only option when you are operating at a disadvantage, and I make decisions based on the mission and our desired effects, and not how others feel about me. I'm sure you know better. Maybe you should step up and take charge? No need for you to respond/Defend yourself to pettiness! Those of us who even slightly know you, or are of a Tactical mindset, know your Decision is sound. Much to my lovely wife's dismay, sometimes my inner tactics instructor comes out and I enjoy belittling people for doing or saying dumb stuff. My bad. 
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:13:57 AM EDT
[#44]
Can't say I don't understand.
Going last year was a no-brainer, and I'm glad I did. I wasn't really even considering making the trip down this year. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:14:33 AM EDT
[#45]
I felt the caravan concept was ineffective, but still booked to participate. It seems that the rolling caravans will be even less effective now. So, I’ll stand by to see what will be needed as this situation unfolds.
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:15:00 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: https://www.ar15-backup.com/media/mediaFiles/14563/0041B2C3-EFB7-4242-A071-16F52556E3BE-1775713.jpg "Oh fuck that's a lot of Indians!" Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." "Oh fuck that's a lot of Indians!" 
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:16:20 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You guys from NY are a poster child for “nows not the time, soon, but not now” when it comes to a fight. Actually, I take that back. You guys did manage to put up a fight when they limited you from 10 rounds to 7, good job. You managed to get it back to 10 rounds. Forgive me for not remembering, but were you with us last year in Richmond? |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:17:06 AM EDT
[#48]
I think you made the right call.
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:17:40 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This shit, right here......ALL of it. The internet keyboard warriors that NEVER show up anywhere are the first to urge others to jump into the fire...... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted:Goading people in to starting shit from the sidelines is easy. This isn't about risk. It's about risk / reward / the actual fight. There's no AWB on the docket this year. They aren't even there and there's no mass rally and vcdl has some dumb shit drive around in circles thing going on. But by all means, goad your brothers into a setup. This shit, right here......ALL of it. The internet keyboard warriors that NEVER show up anywhere are the first to urge others to jump into the fire...... Well last year, we were beset by people saying "it's not the right time, it's a bad idea, we have to work smarter not harder, Antifa will ensure it ends badly," and other excuses for not showing up on the appointed day. |
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Posted: 1/12/2021 12:18:18 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You guys from NY are a poster child for "nows not the time, soon, but not now" when it comes to a fight. Actually, I take that back. You guys did manage to put up a fight when they limited you from 10 rounds to 7, good job. You managed to get it back to 10 rounds. |
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