10 years ago today we lost our handguns… - Page 2

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - 10 years ago today we lost our handguns… (Page 2 of 2)

Posted: 3/13/2006 10:16:40 PM EDT

[#1]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

As an aside - did it ever...cross your minds that perhaps this shooting was a reichstag fire of sorts?

I'm starting to learn that you have a real love for conspiracy theories don't you?

And who might you be?
A friend of Johninaustin?
I find most "conspiracy theories" to be redicilous.
I do not think it is rediculous to consider the possibility of an arranged event.
After all - a bunch of muslims took flying lessons, but did not want to learn how to land, was ignored.
And the label of "conspiracy theory" is a convenient way to discredit the idea without having to address it.
Of course, you probably think the Branch Davidians all shot themselves and torched their church.

I alos find the incidences of firearms massacres in relation to firearms bans to be quite interesting.
The police knew he was a bad guy, knew he was unstable, yet did nothing to keep an eye on him.
He goes and kills a bunch of people, then offs himself at the scene.
Just something to consider is all.

Not only a friend of John, a neighbor as well. Also a friend of other members. All of them a lot more rational and mature than you.

Gotta love a neighbor that holds BBQ's and requires that guests bring their favorite battle rifle to match the evening's war movie.

Posted: 3/13/2006 10:18:50 PM EDT

[#2]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

As an aside - did it ever...cross your minds that perhaps this shooting was a reichstag fire of sorts?

I'm starting to learn that you have a real love for conspiracy theories don't you?

And who might you be?
A friend of Johninaustin?
I find most "conspiracy theories" to be redicilous.
I do not think it is rediculous to consider the possibility of an arranged event.
After all - a bunch of muslims took flying lessons, but did not want to learn how to land, was ignored.
And the label of "conspiracy theory" is a convenient way to discredit the idea without having to address it.
Of course, you probably think the Branch Davidians all shot themselves and torched their church.

I alos find the incidences of firearms massacres in relation to firearms bans to be quite interesting.
The police knew he was a bad guy, knew he was unstable, yet did nothing to keep an eye on him.
He goes and kills a bunch of people, then offs himself at the scene.
Just something to consider is all.

Not only a friend of John, a neighbor as well. Also a friend of other members. All of them a lot more rational and mature than you.

Gotta love a neighbor that holds BBQ's and requires that guests bring their favorite battle rifle to match the evening's war movie.

Coming from someone who doubts the veracity of the FBI's trophy pics from Waco, that means about jack shit.
BBQs? I trust you invite the local FBI and ATF agents. I hear they are quite good at that kind of thing.

Posted: 3/13/2006 10:31:01 PM EDT

[#3]

Looks like the Doc gives just as good as he gets.

Posted: 3/13/2006 11:02:21 PM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
You didn't lose them, you gave them up.
You could have fought back - you would have most likely died, but is that not preferable to living as slaves?
Now your government puts cameras on your street corners, and you are forced to use clubs to defend your homes and lives.
Your example has galvanized many of us here in the states.

OK 'Mr Big' go buy yourself a full auto machine gun, ring the Feds and tell them you have a 'right under the Constitution' to own it' and come and take it from your cold dead hands……

I'll be waiting to see the report on FOX NEWS (Yes, I do get FOX over here)…

But I expect it will be a long (make that never) time before you do that… Talk is cheap when you don't have to put your life where you internet mouth is.

Uh, WE CAN go buy ourselves full-autos. We just can't get any NEW ones.

Uh reading comrehension is vital… did I say a REGISTERED NFA one? Nope… I said go and buy one THEN tell the Feds you have it and they can come and try take it off you………

Same with a rifle or shotgun, I can take a hacksaw and saw the end off my rifle and make it 12" long without problem, go into your basement and hacksaw the end off yours, then ring the Feds and say 'you have the right' and see what happens…

Posted: 3/13/2006 11:04:04 PM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
You gun owners should not have bent over while supplying the vaseline. People need to understand the gobberment rules by fear, picking off somebody and making a big scene. If people unite and say no, the gobberment can do nothing. The key is to unite and stick together.

For instance if the people of Kalifornia owning "assault weapons" had told the state to go screw itself and all stuck together, the state would not have thrown hundreds of thoudands owners in jail and the law would have gone away. Same for New York, etc. There is strength in numbers.

There was only 57,000 of us…

ETA;

57,000 handgun owners.
150,000 rifle owners.
650,000 shotgun owners.

The gun banners got up a petition with 1,000,000 signatures…… we lost.

Posted: 3/13/2006 11:07:30 PM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
On a serious note, did you guy get to keep them (grandfathered) or did you have to turn them in?

All turned in and melted down into manhole covers except for the Glocks, SIG's and Hi-Powers that were kept by the Police for their use…

Posted: 3/13/2006 11:13:32 PM EDT

[#7]

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And no-one is any safer now then they were then. That is the unfortunate truth.

Never was about BEING safer, it's ALWAYS about making Joe Sheeple and Jane Soccer Mommie FEEL safer, FEEL like the politicians are DOING SOMETHING. Doesn't mean jack shit to any of them if the problem is solved, just that "something was done".

A vast majority of the population simply will not allow themselves to understand that there are a percentage of people out there that are demented, unbalanced, evil or otherwise not willing or able to be a part of civilized society and that they will ALWAYS prey upon those that refuse to defend themselves.

To admit that one must be prepared to defend themselves they have face uncomfortable realities that they simply will not do, hence they eagerly give up freedoms in the blind hope that government will protect them.

Fuck that shit.

Ding! Ding! We have a winner!!!!

It was NOTHING to do with safety it was EVERYTHING to do with an election due that year and the need to show the sheeple that the Goobermint was there to 'protect them'… and the sheep fell for it.

Since they banned private ownership of handguns criminal use of handguns has gone up by 2,300%……… no that's not a mistake 2,300%!!!!!!

ANdy

ANdy

Posted: 3/13/2006 11:15:42 PM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:
Gun owners were made a scapegoat by an incompetent Police Force and corrupt politicians.

That sums it up.

No actually it just tries to scapegoat other people.

Where are the "corrupt politicians"? What did they gain by having this happen? How did their actions make it happen?

Incompetent police force, yeah because they didn't pull this guys guns based on what he MIGHT do, prior to the incident?

It is the murderer's fault. He used guns, but the guns are no more at fault thatn a dunker driver's motor is at fault. The problem was the violent outburst by the murderer.

Posted: 3/13/2006 11:15:45 PM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:
Quoted:
On a serious note, did you guy get to keep them (grandfathered) or did you have to turn them in?

All turned in and melted down into manhole covers except for the Glocks, SIG's and Hi-Powers that were kept by the Police for their use…

Oh man, i am sorry to hear that... Did they at least financially compensate you? PLEASE tell me they at LEAST did that.

Posted: 3/13/2006 11:15:48 PM EDT

[#10]

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You mean 9 years ago.

The Conservatives did not ban all handguns.

Tony Blair and Labour did.

So torries are "good" and labourers are "bad" and the there is the house of lords and house commons? So what is what?

Brit Politics 101

1) Queen is a figurehead, PM runs things

2) PM is elected by Parliment, NOT by the people. He is usually a senior legislator from a 'safe' district - If we had their system of government, Bill Frist, Trent Lott, or Dick Hastert would have become President in 00, Gebhardt would have gotten the job in 02, back to the GOP in 04, and so on...

3) House of Commons is elected by the population, they have the majority of the political power

4) House of Lords is composed of the assorted noblemen from the feudal/direct-monarchy days... They are, IIRC, slowly but surely becoming just as symbolic as the Queen...

5) Elections must happen at a minimum of every-so-many-years, but they CAN happen at any time, if a vote of no-confidence is passed thru Parliment... No-confidence basically like a recall election, if you fuck up bad enough (or if enough people want another election) they just call an election, and let the people decide if your party should stay in power...

Posted: 3/13/2006 11:28:50 PM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:
Looks like the Doc gives just as good as he gets.

Actually, it looks like the doc needs to grow up.

Take it back to the militia posts, no need to hijack Vito's thread.

Posted: 3/13/2006 11:33:25 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Looks like the Doc gives just as good as he gets.

Actually, it looks like the doc needs to grow up.

Take it back to the militia posts, no need to hijack Vito's thread.

If you can't take the heat....

Posted: 3/13/2006 11:37:57 PM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Looks like the Doc gives just as good as he gets.

Actually, it looks like the doc needs to grow up.

Take it back to the militia posts, no need to hijack Vito's thread.

If you can't take the heat....

...try and try again?

or is it good for the gander?

Eh... I forget

Posted: 3/13/2006 11:46:15 PM EDT

[#14]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Looks like the Doc gives just as good as he gets.

Actually, it looks like the doc needs to grow up.

Take it back to the militia posts, no need to hijack Vito's thread.

If you can't take the heat....

...try and try again?

or is it good for the gander?

Eh... I forget

[boondocksaints]Doc, I got to get you a book of proverbs or something...this mix n match shit has got to go[/boondocksaints]

Posted: 3/14/2006 12:56:15 AM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
On a serious note, did you guy get to keep them (grandfathered) or did you have to turn them in?

All turned in and melted down into manhole covers except for the Glocks, SIG's and Hi-Powers that were kept by the Police for their use…

Oh man, i am sorry to hear that... Did they at least financially compensate you? PLEASE tell me they at LEAST did that.

They did compensate us… grudgingly…

Posted: 3/14/2006 1:06:46 AM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Gun owners were made a scapegoat by an incompetent Police Force and corrupt politicians.

That sums it up.

No actually it just tries to scapegoat other people.

Where are the "corrupt politicians"? What did they gain by having this happen? How did their actions make it happen?

Incompetent police force, yeah because they didn't pull this guys guns based on what he MIGHT do, prior to the incident?

It is the murderer's fault. He used guns, but the guns are no more at fault thatn a dunker driver's motor is at fault. The problem was the violent outburst by the murderer.

One the leading and most influential activists for gun control in Britain, Dr Mick North, who lost his daughter Sophie at the shooting at Dunblane now thinks the inquiry and ban was just a whitewash to protect the establishment…

"In an astonishing attack, Dr Mick North branded the original inquiry into the 1996 massacre of 16 schoolchildren and their teacher as a "piece of theatre" and an "exercise in damage limitation".

He said: "If it wasn't an outright cover-up or whitewash, it was at the very least a paint job by the establishment to brush out some of the worst failings of a system that had allowed Thomas Hamilton to remain free and keep his guns despite serious allegations about his conduct."

dunblane.50megs.com/north.htm

dunblane.50megs.com/dunblane_whitewash.htm

Posted: 3/14/2006 5:09:04 AM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:
Quoted:

As an aside - did it ever...cross your minds that perhaps this shooting was a reichstag fire of sorts?

I'm starting to learn that you have a real love for conspiracy theories don't you?

There is a lot wrong upstairs with thedoctors308

, conspiracy theories being only the beginning.

Posted: 3/14/2006 5:59:33 AM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Gun owners were made a scapegoat by an incompetent Police Force and corrupt politicians.

That sums it up.

No actually it just tries to scapegoat other people.

Where are the "corrupt politicians"? What did they gain by having this happen? How did their actions make it happen?

Incompetent police force, yeah because they didn't pull this guys guns based on what he MIGHT do, prior to the incident?

It is the murderer's fault. He used guns, but the guns are no more at fault thatn a dunker driver's motor is at fault. The problem was the violent outburst by the murderer.

One the leading and most influential activists for gun control in Britain, Dr Mick North, who lost his daughter Sophie at the shooting at Dunblane now thinks the inquiry and ban was just a whitewash to protect the establishment…

"In an astonishing attack, Dr Mick North branded the original inquiry into the 1996 massacre of 16 schoolchildren and their teacher as a "piece of theatre" and an "exercise in damage limitation".

He said: "If it wasn't an outright cover-up or whitewash, it was at the very least a paint job by the establishment to brush out some of the worst failings of a system that had allowed Thomas Hamilton to remain free and keep his guns despite serious allegations about his conduct."

dunblane.50megs.com/north.htm

dunblane.50megs.com/dunblane_whitewash.htm

And again, to preemptively restrict someone's Right or Privileges, based on what he MIGHT do isn't seen as proper conduct by "the gub'ermint" by most people.

Retrospectively, the warning signs are always clearer............................. Of course once someone has gone "postal" there's a whole bunch of people coming out of the woodwork telling stories about what they "saw", who also didn't report anything PRIOR to the "postal" incident.

Putting the police in a position to be responsible for what any person they investigate MAY do, is a sure way to get the police to over-react to every person they contact.

Posted: 3/14/2006 6:08:10 AM EDT

[#19]

A report from BBC News:
BBC-The 10th anniversary UK massacre of 17 in Dunblane Primary School remembered in private

Posted: 3/14/2006 6:18:35 AM EDT

[#20]

tag

Posted: 3/14/2006 6:50:58 AM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

And again, to preemptively restrict someone's Right or Privileges, based on what he MIGHT do isn't seen as proper conduct by "the gub'ermint" by most people.

Retrospectively, the warning signs are always clearer............................. Of course once someone has gone "postal" there's a whole bunch of people coming out of the woodwork telling stories about what they "saw", who also didn't report anything PRIOR to the "postal" incident.

Putting the police in a position to be responsible for what any person they investigate MAY do, is a sure way to get the police to over-react to every person they contact.

The Police were called to an incident involving Hamilton shortly before he went nuts were he pulled a gun on his neighbour over a parking dispute, he told her if she did not move her car he would 'blow your fucking head off'… curiously the Police did not take any action against him.

Likewise, the Firearms Officer and a Sergeant reported to the Asst Chief PoPo they though he was a danger, he overrulled them. This is the same Asst Chief PoPo who promptly reseigned after the 'inqiuiry' and moved to Australia on a very good pension... no disciplinary action was taken against him.

ANdy

Posted: 3/14/2006 6:52:32 AM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

As an aside - did it ever...cross your minds that perhaps this shooting was a reichstag fire of sorts?

I'm starting to learn that you have a real love for conspiracy theories don't you?

There is a lot wrong upstairs with thedoctors308, conspiracy theories being only the beginning.

Quit trolling me boyo, unless you have a good reason.
If you do have one, I expect to come back to a pit thread.

Posted: 3/14/2006 9:30:35 AM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

As an aside - did it ever...cross your minds that perhaps this shooting was a reichstag fire of sorts?

I'm starting to learn that you have a real love for conspiracy theories don't you?

There is a lot wrong upstairs with thedoctors308, conspiracy theories being only the beginning.

Quit trolling me boyo, unless you have a good reason.
If you do have one, I expect to come back to a pit thread.

Nice edit.

Posted: 3/14/2006 10:03:46 AM EDT

[#24]

If this kook brandished a weapon and threatened to use it over something as assinine as a parking spot he was guilty of a violent crime and should have been locked up. There would have been nothing resembling prior restraint or preemption about it.

I don't believe in ever taking someone's guns away. Only locking the criminals in a cage where they can't access their guns!

Posted: 3/14/2006 10:11:36 AM EDT

[#25]

If I was you guys I would riot and over throw the goverment.

Posted: 3/14/2006 10:14:05 AM EDT

[#26]

Australia went through pretty much the exact same scenario. Guy goes off his rocker in Port Arthur, kills a bunch of folks, the gov't steps in and says"We'll make you safe"....

* Australian politicians are on the spot and at a loss to explain how no improvement in safety has been observed after such monumental effort and expense was successfully expended in "ridding society of guns." their response has been to " wait longer".

http://www.sonic.net/tfoot/gun-politics/ausygns.htm

Posted: 3/14/2006 2:37:41 PM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
Ding! Ding! We have a winner!!!!

It was NOTHING to do with safety it was EVERYTHING to do with an election due that year and the need to show the sheeple that the Goobermint was there to 'protect them'… and the sheep fell for it.

In other words from some British non-pro-gunner:

"I don’t like guns. To me, double-bore pistol-shooting lives up to its name. But, little though I cared for the rights of shooters and much though I sympathised with the victims of Dunblane, the evidence now points me to an obvious conclusion: that an outright ban on handguns was a pathetic gesture that has disrupted peaceful sports but done absolutely nothing to make any of us safer."

www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,6-2084371,00.html

Posted: 3/14/2006 2:59:34 PM EDT

[#28]

Quoted:
If I was you guys I would riot and over throw the goverment.

Ill buy ya a plane ticket over there.

Posted: 3/14/2006 3:31:11 PM EDT

[#29]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
You didn't lose them, you gave them up.
You could have fought back - you would have most likely died, but is that not preferable to living as slaves?
Now your government puts cameras on your street corners, and you are forced to use clubs to defend your homes and lives.
Your example has galvanized many of us here in the states.

OK 'Mr Big' go buy yourself a full auto machine gun, ring the Feds and tell them you have a 'right under the Constitution' to own it' and come and take it from your cold dead hands……

I'll be waiting to see the report on FOX NEWS (Yes, I do get FOX over here)…

But I expect it will be a long (make that never) time before you do that… Talk is cheap when you don't have to put your life where you internet mouth is.

Uh, WE CAN go buy ourselves full-autos. We just can't get any NEW ones.

Uh reading comrehension is vital… did I say a REGISTERED NFA one? Nope… I said go and buy one THEN tell the Feds you have it and they can come and try take it off you………

Same with a rifle or shotgun, I can take a hacksaw and saw the end off my rifle and make it 12" long without problem, go into your basement and hacksaw the end off yours, then ring the Feds and say 'you have the right' and see what happens…

In matters of Military Defense issues worldwide, you are the unassailable. Sort of our own Arfcom Janes, however, your attempting to argue that your remaining gun freedom is in any way comparable to ours is ludicrous and pitiful.

It's like when our Kalifornia inmates proudly show off their "registered preban" rifles, only sadder.

Also, a small matter of semantics perhaps, but a good many of the guns that you "lost" were ours. I respectfully request their return if you can foresee no further need of them.

No Brit bashing here, only profound sadness.

Posted: 3/14/2006 4:44:09 PM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:
Quoted:
You gun owners should not have bent over while supplying the vaseline. People need to understand the gobberment rules by fear, picking off somebody and making a big scene. If people unite and say no, the gobberment can do nothing. The key is to unite and stick together.

For instance if the people of Kalifornia owning "assault weapons" had told the state to go screw itself and all stuck together, the state would not have thrown hundreds of thoudands owners in jail and the law would have gone away. Same for New York, etc. There is strength in numbers.

There was only 57,000 of us…

ETA;

57,000 handgun owners.
150,000 rifle owners.
650,000 shotgun owners.

The gun banners got up a petition with 1,000,000 signatures…… we lost.

Wow! I had no idea that there were so few gun owners in England. I learn something every day.

Bob

Posted: 3/14/2006 4:57:15 PM EDT

[#31]

Quoted:
Quoted:
On a serious note, did you guy get to keep them (grandfathered) or did you have to turn them in?

All turned in and melted down into manhole covers except for the Glocks, SIG's and Hi-Powers that were kept by the Police for their use…

Quite sad. I would have rather melted them down myself then give them to the very people that will enforce the stupid bans. My glock is mine, if you don't want me to have it, then I'll destroy it myself.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - 10 years ago today we lost our handguns… (Page 2 of 2)

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