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Posted: 2/8/2021 1:58:23 AM EDT
[#1]
What kind of pistol light? Something like a TLR7 does not change the pistol's bulk in my opinion.
Adding another light source with arguably no negatives seems like a win win. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 1:59:01 AM EDT
[#2]
Are you going to war?
Do you have your rifle with a light on it all the time? For me, a light on a pistol is used far more than a light on a rifle. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 2:01:37 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What kind of pistol light? Something like a TLR7 does not change the pistol's bulk in my opinion. Adding another light source with arguably no negatives seems like a win win. I have TLR-1's. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 2:03:19 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are you going to war? Do you have your rifle with a light on it all the time? For me, a light on a pistol is used far more than a light on a rifle. God willing, I will never point or fire a gun at a human being. I have a lot of pistols. In this case I'm thinking specifically of a pistol on a war belt, worn in conjunction with armor and a rifle. Not talking about a bedside pistol, or a concealed carry. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 2:04:23 AM EDT
[#5]
Good idea to have if you need to clear tight spaces or if your primary weapon fails.
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Posted: 2/8/2021 2:10:46 AM EDT
[#6]
Let me ask you this: If your primary weapon (rifle w/ light) is down and you've transitioned to your pistol, is the weapon light on your rifle any good at all to you in that situation?
You'll want a light on any weapon you're going to use IMHO. It's only useful on a weapon that you're actually using. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 2:24:20 AM EDT
[#7]
A follow up question. If a light is used, are night sights desirable?
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Posted: 2/8/2021 3:04:49 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A follow up question. If a light is used, are night sights desirable? For me, yes. Carry weapon and go to war weapon. Range toys i dont care. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 3:15:32 AM EDT
[#9]
Quoted: It seems to add expense, bulk, weight, and limits holster options. Should I keep a light on my pistol for a " " "Go to war" " " setup? |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 9:04:41 AM EDT
[#10]
All the same reasons to want a light on a rifle also apply for a pistol.
The need to know what you're pointing your gun at and to have as much information about what's going on before you aim and shoot doesn't change depending on what kind of weapon you're using. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 9:11:38 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A follow up question. If a light is used, are night sights desirable? Generally yes. Some people say they don't like it or don't need it, but your flashlight doesn't illuminate your sights, and if it's dark enough that you need to use a light then it's probably dark enough that you could use some help seeing your sights. This changes if you have a red dot, however. Everything I'm about to say is a matter of perspective and preference, so bear in mind that other more experienced people may have a different position on this than me, but I don't like when a pistol has both night sights and a red dot. I've found that it makes my sight picture feel cluttered. I didn't like having other glowing dots competing for my eye's attention with the dot that I actually want to aim with. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 9:25:06 AM EDT
[#12]
I don't typically CCW with a light on my gun because I'm not typically places that get dark. I have young kids and we're home by night more often than not. No longer in malls or movie theaters so the need to conceal and live my life beats the need to carry a big annoying light on a gun.
HOWEVER, if I'm in my war belt set up, it means shit is bad. I am likely wearing armor and carrying a rifle. Discretion/concealment is no longer the issue and I want every option at my disposal. So the war belt gun has a light. I also like options. If my pistol has a light, I have the option to use it or not. If I don't have the light, I'm really out of options about using it. I'm on the fence about night sights personally. The best I've seen is that they help you find the gun bedside at night. There are very few situations where you can see the glow of the sights AND your target is lit up enough to identify. This was a bigger deal when weapon lights were shitty but blasting something with 1k lumens in close seems to wash out sights and leave you with an outline. At least they do for me. So now I'm happy with almost any sight configuration, and personally like FO in more shooting situations so that's the default. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 9:27:17 AM EDT
[#13]
IBTP
All fighting guns should have a light, IMHO |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 9:31:53 AM EDT
[#14]
If it's on an overt rig like a war belt there's no reason not to have a light.
As far as night sights go I don't find them necessary but a lot of people like them. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 9:55:24 AM EDT
[#15]
Glock 19 w/TLR7
Bedside gun, CCW, go to war gun, competition gun  Attached FileHopefully soon it will be my security job gun |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 10:00:09 AM EDT
[#16]
It's dark.....a lot.
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Posted: 2/8/2021 10:04:36 AM EDT
[#17]
What are your thoughts on 'lumen' rating for the pistol light? Is there too much (i.e. 1000) in your opinon?
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Posted: 2/8/2021 10:38:07 AM EDT
[#18]
I have both.
You do you. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 10:43:16 AM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: IBTP All fighting guns should have a light, IMHO This. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 10:54:29 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What are your thoughts on 'lumen' rating for the pistol light? Is there too much (i.e. 1000) in your opinon? Super bright lights in small rooms like a bathroom sucks but its great if outside. Gotta pick your poison. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 11:12:29 AM EDT
[#21]
Every single one of my sidearms has a light, from CCW only weapons to my go-to-war G17, as do 2/3 of my fighting rifles. My SCAR doesn't, but it's set up as a DMR (still might grab a Modlite OKW for it, because lightsaber).
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Posted: 2/8/2021 11:20:04 AM EDT
[#22]
Ok, let's run this down by the numbers.
1.) Should a fighting handgun have a light? Emphatically yes. And a fighting long guns should have a light. And you should still have a handheld light. Light is a tool, uses include PID, searching, enhanced situational awareness, and sometimes a non-lethal use of force or temporary distraction device. Have it always. 2.) Do I need night sights on a gun with a light? I believe so. There are places that you may not need to hit white light and expose yourself but are in darkness too dark to outline your sights. Its a niche scenario but a real one nonetheless. I run dots on all my primary fighting handguns which replaced nightsights utility for me. That said they still serve a purpose, they help me find the pistol quickly on the nightstand without light. 3.) Is there such a thing as "too bright" or "too much light"? Yes, if you don't know what your doing. Light is a tool which requires training to use effectively. I have been trained, I trained others. I use light professionally most patrol shifts because I work at night and most of my SWAT work is during hours of reduced or diminished light. So for me and mine, no... there's no such things as too bright or too much light. Give me all the lumens, shower me in candela. For the untrained person flashing a 1000 lumen tac light in your darked out bathroom with white walls....yeah, you're gonna have problems. If you want to use white light well there are plenty of tactical trainers focused on low light, I would highly recommend you avail yourself their services. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 11:28:38 AM EDT
[#23]
Thanks for all the responses. I just bought a Glock 41, and I want to make it my pistol to be used in conjunction with my armor, belt, and rifle. I'm generally in favor of pistol mounted lights, and I was trying to decide if I should set up my belt with a light accommodating holster or not.
I decided I will. I attached one of my spare lights to it, and ran through a few drills, and it doesn't hamper anything at all. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 12:30:19 PM EDT
[#24]
Oh, my bad, didn't see the OP already had what he needed above.
Good stuff. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 12:37:50 PM EDT
[#25]
My stupid reason is that the Safariland holsters I've got need the light for retention. Safariland makes non-light bearing models but buying their stuff is a bear lately and it won't provide much extra value to replace the existing holsters.
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Posted: 2/8/2021 3:16:09 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ok, let's run this down by the numbers. 1.) Should a fighting handgun have a light? Emphatically yes. And a fighting long guns should have a light. And you should still have a handheld light. Light is a tool, uses include PID, searching, enhanced situational awareness, and sometimes a non-lethal use of force or temporary distraction device. Have it always. 2.) Do I need night sights on a gun with a light? I believe so. There are places that you may not need to hit white light and expose yourself but are in darkness too dark to outline your sights. Its a niche scenario but a real one nonetheless. I run dots on all my primary fighting handguns which replaced nightsights utility for me. That said they still serve a purpose, they help me find the pistol quickly on the nightstand without light. 3.) Is there such a thing as "too bright" or "too much light"? Yes, if you don't know what your doing. Light is a tool which requires training to use effectively. I have been trained, I trained others. I use light professionally most patrol shifts because I work at night and most of my SWAT work is during hours of reduced or diminished light. So for me and mine, no... there's no such things as too bright or too much light. Give me all the lumens, shower me in candela. For the untrained person flashing a 1000 lumen tac light in your darked out bathroom with white walls....yeah, you're gonna have problems. If you want to use white light well there are plenty of tactical trainers focused on low light, I would highly recommend you avail yourself their services. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 3:20:36 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: HOWEVER, if I'm in my war belt set up, it means shit is bad. I am likely wearing armor and carrying a rifle. Discretion/concealment is no longer the issue and I want every option at my disposal. So the war belt gun has This right here. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 3:37:36 PM EDT
[#28]
Absolutely have a light on the handgun. The TLR-1 is cheap, reliable, and holsters are really common.
As far as lumens go, more is brighter and isn’t bad. That said I’m rocking a 300 lumen TLR-1 as issued and it works fine, especially indoors. Outside 300 lumens seems a little weak beyond 25 yards. I do have a 500 lumen X300U and it works so well I don’t see the need to buy one of the 1000 lumen versions. I generally do not have a light mounted on my off duty Glock 19 when carrying it. If I did want a light for concealed carry I’d go with the TLR7. I did notice something cool with the TRex Ragnarok for the Glock/X300 combo. With the A version of the X300 you can stow it in the holster and when you insert the Glock the light attaches. The Ragnarok firmly holds the light and it’s not falling out. Obviously you’d want to remove it from the holster to verify attachment but it’s a good way to have it ready without getting lost in the bag. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 3:42:03 PM EDT
[#29]
I have lights on most of my handguns except:
1911 .357 revolver P365xl, only because I'm still deciding... |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 4:24:09 PM EDT
[#30]
In my experience, night sights on pistols are very useful, especially if the Trit "night sight" vials are emplaced into suitable light-colored dots on the front and rear sights.
I would not expect even brand-new, bright, night sights to be visible to the user after the first shot, although large sight "dots" might be so-- and that is their value, especially the front sight. That said, night sights are valuable for covert use, at least. If considering Trit night sights, please know that they naturally deteriorate over time. Buy from longstanding mfr that will re-hab such sights, presumably at far less cost than buying a new set. FWIW, there are many techniques employing suitable hand-held tactical flash lights that can be used either in conjunction with Night sights, or in lieu of such lights. On second shot, such flashlights just might be more useful than pistol-mounted trit Night sights. I'm no expert, btw. But I have listened to advice from experts. YMMV. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 5:32:42 PM EDT
[#31]
Use a light.
Regarding night sights: Use you are not using NV, get them. If you are using NV with a dot, plain sights. |
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Posted: 2/8/2021 6:08:49 PM EDT
[#32]
Remember... you're weapon is pointed at everything you are illuminating.
Watch for any nd's if any loved ones appear within sight. |
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Posted: 2/9/2021 5:17:42 AM EDT
[#33]
Quoted: It seems to add expense, bulk, weight, and limits holster options. Should I keep a light on my pistol for a " " "Go to war" " " setup? Weights alone is a reason to have a WML if its an Overt (ie not stuffed in your pants) gun. The WML is essentially a 4.5oz Frame Weight that doubles as a flashlight. Frame Weights are used in open competition as they've effective at minimizing muzzle rise / lowering perceived recoil. https://forums.brianenos.com/topic/259808-toni-frame-weights/ Recoil Reduction of WML:  RECOIL REDUCTION - Streamlight TLR-1HL vs. Streamlight TLR-7A - And comparing the two popular WMLs |
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Posted: 2/9/2021 7:19:54 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Remember... you're weapon is pointed at everything you are illuminating. Watch for any nd's if any loved ones appear within sight. Something I don't see mentioned here often is the potential legal ramifications of using your weapon light as a flashlight. In Michigan if you point a gun at someone who you're not already legally allowed to shoot you can (and likely will) be charged with felonious assault. There's also "aiming without malice." There are plenty of scenarios (99% of them, in fact) where you might be investigating a "bump in the night" and determine it's not a threat justifying fatal force. Probably a good idea to have a light handy that's NOT attached to a gun for those scenarios. |
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Posted: 2/9/2021 7:25:20 AM EDT
[#35]
People that think you have to point the light at something to ID it have never tried a real light.
I bump mine on at the ground or ceiling and I can see the whole room. |
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Posted: 2/9/2021 8:10:29 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: People that think you have to point the light at something to ID it have never tried a real light. I bump mine on at the ground or ceiling and I can see the whole room.  |
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Posted: 2/9/2021 8:15:16 AM EDT
[#37]
It’s dark a lot.
Bad guys like doing things in the dark. Gunfights in the dark suck. I want all the lumens, mixed lighting conditions can make weak lights useless. No reason not to have night sights or a weapon light. Everyone makes holsters for them, even inside the waste band. It doesn’t replace a handheld light for stuff you don’t need to point a gun at. |
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Posted: 2/9/2021 10:28:26 AM EDT
[#38]
Most of the time, you don't get to choose the scenario when it comes for you.
Therefore, lights go on everything. Even the "range toys".  Attached File |
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Posted: 2/9/2021 10:51:51 AM EDT
[#39]
I run a M17 w/RMR and X300V and a M18 w/RMR and X300U. I'm running both in Safariland 6390RDS holsters and I do carry both AIWB (though not at the same time.)
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Posted: 2/9/2021 12:10:07 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Remember... you're weapon is pointed at everything you are illuminating. Watch for any nd's if any loved ones appear within sight. Quote HistoryQuoted: Remember... you're weapon is pointed at everything you are illuminating. Watch for any nd's if any loved ones appear within sight. No, it's not. If you have a WML made after 2006 it's probably bright enough to creat enough "splash" to illuminate a dark space without actively pointing your weapon at it. Quoted: People that think you have to point the light at something to ID it have never tried a real light. I bump mine on at the ground or ceiling and I can see the whole room. ^This I have a WML on all my pistols. Have also had to train using the Harries technique, Rogers technique, and (cringe) the FBI technique. That shit sucks. WML FTW |
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Posted: 2/9/2021 12:55:26 PM EDT
[#41]
You should always be able to identify your target. IMO a light on any home defense gun is a must regardless if it’s your primary or secondary.
With that said I do not carry a light on my CCW, it’s a trade off and the price you pay to be able to comfortably carry a pistol under clothing. A light and comfortable pistol without a light you always carry is better than a decked out full sized pistol with lights and lasers that you never wear because it’s to big and heavy. |
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Posted: 2/10/2021 8:01:24 AM EDT
[#42]
"What's the thought on a pistol mounted light, while you already have a rifle light and a flashlight?"
Pistol mounted light, yes. Now let's discuss why you only have 1 flashlight. I like to carry 2. Flashlights get used a lot and batteries get drained. Very likely it'll go dead. I carry a stream light pen light in my shirt pocket and a surefire in my front pocket. |
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Posted: 2/10/2021 9:44:42 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: "What's the thought on a pistol mounted light, while you already have a rifle light and a flashlight?" Pistol mounted light, yes. Now let's discuss why you only have 1 flashlight. I like to carry 2. Flashlights get used a lot and batteries get drained. Very likely it'll go dead. I carry a stream light pen light in my shirt pocket and a surefire in my front pocket. This, especially if you're in law enforcement, the military, or any other profession requiring weapons. I always carry a primary, a backup in my pack, and a set of spare batteries. |
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Posted: 2/10/2021 2:34:15 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No, it's not. If you have a WML made after 2006 it's probably bright enough to creat enough "splash" to illuminate a dark space without actively pointing your weapon at it. ^This I have a WML on all my pistols. Have also had to train using the Harries technique, Rogers technique, and (cringe) the FBI technique. That shit sucks. WML FTW Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Remember... you're weapon is pointed at everything you are illuminating. Watch for any nd's if any loved ones appear within sight. No, it's not. If you have a WML made after 2006 it's probably bright enough to creat enough "splash" to illuminate a dark space without actively pointing your weapon at it. Quoted: People that think you have to point the light at something to ID it have never tried a real light. I bump mine on at the ground or ceiling and I can see the whole room. ^This I have a WML on all my pistols. Have also had to train using the Harries technique, Rogers technique, and (cringe) the FBI technique. That shit sucks. WML FTW Carrying an appropriate hand-held back-up light, and training with it, is wise. Personally, and having nothing outside my stoutly-doored bedroom worth the risk of my life, I will hunker down, and await the arrival of the cops, who will (hopefully) be constantly on the cell phone. I'm not getting killed for a TV or something pointless like that Other folks, with different arrangements, such as kid's bedrooms, will differ, naturally. If that plan fails to be practicable, then go to Plan B. |
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Posted: 2/10/2021 3:01:21 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Something I don't see mentioned here often is the potential legal ramifications of using your weapon light as a flashlight. In Michigan if you point a gun at someone who you're not already legally allowed to shoot you can (and likely will) be charged with felonious assault. There's also "aiming without malice." There are plenty of scenarios (99% of them, in fact) where you might be investigating a "bump in the night" and determine it's not a threat justifying fatal force. Probably a good idea to have a light handy that's NOT attached to a gun for those scenarios. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Remember... you're weapon is pointed at everything you are illuminating. Watch for any nd's if any loved ones appear within sight. Something I don't see mentioned here often is the potential legal ramifications of using your weapon light as a flashlight. In Michigan if you point a gun at someone who you're not already legally allowed to shoot you can (and likely will) be charged with felonious assault. There's also "aiming without malice." There are plenty of scenarios (99% of them, in fact) where you might be investigating a "bump in the night" and determine it's not a threat justifying fatal force. Probably a good idea to have a light handy that's NOT attached to a gun for those scenarios. Some States require the "victim" to make a reasonable attempt to "retreat" or avoid confrontation, while other States have "Castle Doctrine" laws for intrusions into dwellings, or perhaps similar laws when out in public. It is absolutely essential that the firearms user fully understand the Laws under which they live. Such Laws vary widely, from State-to-State. |
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Posted: 2/10/2021 3:23:32 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Personally, and having nothing outside my stoutly-doored bedroom worth the risk of my life, I will hunker down, and await the arrival of the cops, who will (hopefully) be constantly on the cell phone. I'm not getting killed for a TV or something pointless like that Other folks, with different arrangements, such as kid's bedrooms, will differ, naturally. If that plan fails to be practicable, then go to Plan B. My kid's bedrooms are across the landing at the top of the stairs from mine. Everything outside my bedroom door is worth defending at any and all costs. Once I figure out they are behind me it's a free fire zone in front of me. |
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Posted: 2/10/2021 3:38:08 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My kid's bedrooms are across the landing at the top of the stairs from mine. Everything outside my bedroom door is worth defending at any and all costs. Once I figure out they are behind me it's a free fire zone in front of me. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Personally, and having nothing outside my stoutly-doored bedroom worth the risk of my life, I will hunker down, and await the arrival of the cops, who will (hopefully) be constantly on the cell phone. I'm not getting killed for a TV or something pointless like that Other folks, with different arrangements, such as kid's bedrooms, will differ, naturally. If that plan fails to be practicable, then go to Plan B. My kid's bedrooms are across the landing at the top of the stairs from mine. Everything outside my bedroom door is worth defending at any and all costs. Once I figure out they are behind me it's a free fire zone in front of me. Not for nothing, but just looking at entrance to upper stairway, to 2nd floor, where bedrooms are located, I notice a door on lower entrance to stars could be installed. Might have to consider that. Having said that, I ask you whether your wife/kids are better off having a possibly dead husband/father going downstairs and taking on some TV-stealing burglar, assuming you can take a good, defensible position at top of stairs at little risk to yourself, or them. Not sure you meant so, just asking the question, for clarification. Possible some miscommunication here. No offense intended! |
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Posted: 2/10/2021 3:41:34 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My kid's bedrooms are across the landing at the top of the stairs from mine. Everything outside my bedroom door is worth defending at any and all costs. Once I figure out they are behind me it's a free fire zone in front of me. Yup. Consider the staircase a choke point, ensure loved ones are behind you, and just defend the choke point. I'll go downstairs and do fancy tactical bullshit if someone I care about is still down there. Otherwise I'm not exposing myself to any additional risk and leaving loved ones unguarded to save my TV. |
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Posted: 2/10/2021 3:51:27 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yup. Consider the staircase a choke point, ensure loved ones are behind you, and just defend the choke point. I'll go downstairs and do fancy tactical bullshit if someone I care about is still down there. Otherwise I'm not exposing myself to any additional risk and leaving loved ones unguarded to save my TV. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: My kid's bedrooms are across the landing at the top of the stairs from mine. Everything outside my bedroom door is worth defending at any and all costs. Once I figure out they are behind me it's a free fire zone in front of me. Yup. Consider the staircase a choke point, ensure loved ones are behind you, and just defend the choke point. I'll go downstairs and do fancy tactical bullshit if someone I care about is still down there. Otherwise I'm not exposing myself to any additional risk and leaving loved ones unguarded to save my TV. I "get" that some folks consider invasion of their homes as an "Actionable" event, and personal insult. Might not be the best way to play it, is all I'm saying. |
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Posted: 2/10/2021 4:16:14 PM EDT
[#50]
Quoted: Not for nothing, but just looking at entrance to upper stairway, to 2nd floor, where bedrooms are located, I notice a door on lower entrance to stars could be installed. Might have to consider that. not really an option at my house Having said that, I ask you whether your wife/kids are better off having a possibly dead husband/father going downstairs and taking on some TV-stealing burglar, assuming you can take a good, defensible position at top of stairs at little risk to yourself, or them. Not sure you meant so, just asking the question, for clarification. Possible some miscommunication here. No offense intended! I never said I was going hunting. I can post up prone at the top of the stairs and see my whole front yard, most of my front entrances and windows, and decorative mirrors help me see some of the back, too. Kids and wife behind (and in a tile tub) means they are protected. Anything that is in front is fair game until the cops come. Quoted: Yup. Consider the staircase a choke point, ensure loved ones are behind you, and just defend the choke point. I'll go downstairs and do fancy tactical bullshit if someone I care about is still down there. Otherwise I'm not exposing myself to any additional risk and leaving loved ones unguarded to save my TV. exactly the second part. I have insurance that will buy me nicer shit than I have now. No reason to get into a fight if I can help it. they don't have to be better than me, just lucky once. I can go small with a rifle and keep a stairway pretty open. |
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