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"Shootable" MGs (Page 1 of 2)
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Posted: 3/29/2025 9:03:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: sleestakwhisperer][Edited]
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I'm mostly a "shooter." I have purchased some MGs and sold them because their "shootabilty" was poor. I had an FNC, one of the really cool NJ State Police paratroopers, NIB, but I sold it because it's literally unshootable due to the complete lack of spare parts. You can buy a $6000 FNC to use for spare parts. But that's not exactly optimal. I also had a NIB M16A2 with DOD stamps on it, I sold that because shooting it would kill the collector value. (Some guys say that they would shoot any NIB collectable, because "guns were made to be shot" and all that horsepucky. But they aren't the ones who are going to take the financial hit on it.) I had an M11/9 that I sold, but that was pre-Lage and it was just a nasty, jammy little turd of a gun that had horrible plastic magazines. On the other hand, I have three MGs that I constantly shoot without any worry at all: my M1A1 Thompson, my UZI and my M16 clone. They are absolutely 100% reliable. The parts supply is infinite and cheap, the mag supply is infinite and cheap, and the ammo supply is infinite and cheap(ish). I have probably 20,000 rounds through my UZI and 15,000 through my Thompson. I don't think it's possible to make the Thompson jam or wear out a part. What would be the list of guns that are shootable without any restrictions? And which ones aren't all that "shootable"? I personally would put guns like the M2 on the "not so great" list, because $250 for a belt of 50 cal ammo is kind of a buzz kill. I'm always looking at guns for sale on Sturm and so forth, I often wonder what the "shootability" is of guns is, like for example a Walther MPL. To start the list off: Ammo burners: 1. M16 family = A++ no explanation needed 2. UZI = A+ infinite parts, cheap ammo, reliable 3. MAC10 family = A+ lots of parts, Lage stuff 4. WWII Thompsons = A+ never jams, accurate, lots of parts, cheap(ish) ammo, cool history 5. Thompson West Hurley Clones if they have been fixed to run well. = A get one that runs, burn ammo Wall hanger list: 1. FNC = D Great gun, no parts. 2. Reising = C Kind of jammy, parts supply is not great, mags are expensive |
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Another point of interest would be the "number of pony tricks." One of the most common nuggets of criticism that you hear is people calling a gun "a one trick pony". Isn't it true that practically every MG is a one-trick pony? Or a better question is: which guns aren't a "one-trick pony?" Also, does it really matter? Personally, I couldn't care less. A grease gun is a one-trick-pony, but that isn't stopping them from selling for $30k. Or BARs from selling for $60k. How would the list look? 1. Of course, you have the AR/M16 platform, which is truly an erector set. The options are huge. Definitely a multi-trick pony. 2. You can get Lage uppers for the various MACs that either turn it into pretty good but blocky-looking UZI or a kind of a weird M16. 3. You can convert an UZI into 45 acp, if you don't mind paying $150 for a decent magazine that only holds 22 rounds. 4. There are various 22 kits available for some guns, but let's be honest, they generally run kind of crummy. There are 22 kits out there for MACs, UZI, Thompson, M16, any what else? My personal success rate with 22 kits has been zero point zero. I'll never waste another penny on that stuff. So personally, I don't regard this as being a "pony trick." 5. ??? what else is there? I use an original IMI plastic stock on my UZI because the folding stock works great, but pressing your face against a metal bar gets real old. I suppose that you could call the ability to change stocks and grips to be a "pony trick." |
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I really enjoy shooting my 1919 and it's always a crowd pleaser. The 22 kit is also pretty awesome. The down side is that it is a crew served mg, and bringing it, ammo, tripod, mounts, accessories, etc to and from the range by yourself kind of sucks. |
''Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid.''
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The best deal in full auto for shooting full size rifle cartridges is a browning 1919/1917. Parts are cheaper and more plentiful than any other belt fed, and most importantly the registered part never wears out. MAJOR considerations. I bought a Group Industries BAR as my first MG, but only because my dad has a 1919 already and I wanted something I could carry by myself to take hog hunting. It’s definitely not just a “bullet hose” MG you’re going to shoot 10,000 rounds a year through, though. Next on the list if I can afford it: 1. WWII Thompson for the reasons you mentioned. 2. 1917a1 Browning 3. M2 Carbine |
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Originally Posted By the1919man: The best deal in full auto for shooting full size rifle cartridges is a browning 1919/1917. Parts are cheaper and more plentiful than any other belt fed, and most importantly the registered part never wears out. MAJOR considerations. Great points. And, username checks out… 
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| I agree the UZI, M-16, Thompson are my top favorites also. I'll also add in HK sear or trigger pack. The M-16 RDIAS and HK sear are the most flexible options out there. Get a bunch of roller locked hosts and go to town blasting away. The Sterling is another top favorite, love the easy loading of those roller mags. |
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I went through this as well. I had a M11/9, AC556, M16A1, Uzi, Sten, Thompson and then my HKMP5 Without a doubt my favorite was the M16A1 then the MP5 (not the SD) and next was the UZI. I loved the versatility of the M16, I was fortunate to have a presample factory HKMP5 and my Thompson was also a presample. If I had to do it all over again I would get another M16 for shoot ability |
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I have an M16, M10, and an AC556. I don't want to shoot the AC because parts are pretty much non-existent. It was my dad's, so there is an emotional bond with it, but it probably won't get shot much. I have thought about trading/selling it towards a full size Uzi, but never did anything. The M16 is hands down the most versatile and gets shot the most. |
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Among other MGs, the M11-380 that I have is multi-caliber capable. I have a couple .380 ACP standard configuration uppers - one houses a standard steel bolt and the other a tungsten slow fire bolt. Also included is a 9mm Suomi mag pattern upper. There is a 5.56x45 upper available that I have zero interest in ever acquiring. And as of now, the only upper that gets used is a Fleming .22LR (10/22 pattern mag) upper. MHO, YMMV, etc. |
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Im in the uzi ballpark…I own several different machine guns but the uzi is always my go to and I have enough spare parts to last a lifetime. Sten mk5 is also one that I rank pretty high…faster rof but is very smooth and reliable with good mags although they suck to load compared to uzi. Spare parts are readily available as well. Macs have a great aftermarket with parts and configurations that really make them prob the best option at the current time. My .380 max11a1 upper configuration is currently a favorite of my kids. Im currently on the hunt for a good sterling as shoot-ability is great and magazines are excellent although currently expensive. The BRP guns have great spare parts options and many configurations although I dont like the appearance of some options. The ones ive shot have been great. |
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Fleming SP1, Uzi, M11/9 and MK760. I have all the spare parts and none of the malfunctions. The M11/9 with a CF/W bolt, Practical Solutions mini Uzi folding stock and a YHM9 fits in my man purse and is a viable weapon for controllability and being able to hit what you put the substandard sights on, hands down. It has replaced the Uzi as my favorite carry subgun and range companion. |
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Originally Posted By macloud: I have an M16, M10, and an AC556. I don't want to shoot the AC because parts are pretty much non-existent. It was my dad's, so there is an emotional bond with it, but it probably won't get shot much. I have thought about trading/selling it towards a full size Uzi, but never did anything. The M16 is hands down the most versatile and gets shot the most. I'm going to leave my gun collection to my kids, and if they want to sell the whole thing, it wouldn't bother me. I plan on making a video of the entire contents of my "stuff" for insurance purposes, and as I'm doing it I'm going to call out the current value. Like "here is a box of 25 mint condition Thompson mags, they are worth $40 each in 2025." I would rather that they get something they actually want with the money, and I'd rather have my guns go to someone (like you) who would cherish them. There are probably a lot of really nice guns just sitting in closets because of sentimental value. There are also a lot guns that get taken to the local gun shop by widows and kids, who get paid $100 for a Garand by the "nice man" at the gun shop. A guy at work told me that when his father-in-law died, he took about 10 shotguns to the local gun shop and got like $400 for them all. I asked him what kind of guns they were, he said they all had two barrels and real fancy wood stocks, "really shiny and pretty looking." And the funny thing is that the guy is a real cheapskate, if we hit up a McDonalds, he'll get one of those $2 burgers. |
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I did mg shoots for 10 years. My 1919 ran with out any malfunctions 8mm or 308. Very reliable when setup correctly. I still have my first that has been probably the best overall. Texas Mac 10. I have many uppers everything from lage and older. I replaced internals just because, no problems and no wear to lower. Best investment ever, I paid $800 that includes 200 tax stamp new in box. 
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HK MP5 is the finest 9mm submachinegun out there and lots of parts, accessories, etc. For 5.56, M16 with 20 inch barrel with rifle extension and rifle hydraulic buffer shoots at +/- 600 RPM. Very controllable, very little recoil, and slow rate of fire without being "choppy". For .22lr, CMMG upper on M16 with all the mods mentioned on the AR15.22 rimfire page. How to make your AR 22 run smoother RCA |
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Originally Posted By sleestakwhisperer: I'm going to leave my gun collection to my kids, and if they want to sell the whole thing, it wouldn't bother me. I plan on making a video of the entire contents of my "stuff" for insurance purposes, and as I'm doing it I'm going to call out the current value. Like "here is a box of 25 mint condition Thompson mags, they are worth $40 each in 2025." I would rather that they get something they actually want with the money, and I'd rather have my guns go to someone (like you) who would cherish them. There are probably a lot of really nice guns just sitting in closets because of sentimental value. There are also a lot guns that get taken to the local gun shop by widows and kids, who get paid $100 for a Garand by the "nice man" at the gun shop. A guy at work told me that when his father-in-law died, he took about 10 shotguns to the local gun shop and got like $400 for them all. I asked him what kind of guns they were, he said they all had two barrels and real fancy wood stocks, "really shiny and pretty looking." And the funny thing is that the guy is a real cheapskate, if we hit up a McDonalds, he'll get one of those $2 burgers. All excellent advice. I do feel very sorry for those completely non-gun knowledgeable widows, who often grew up in a "women don't shoot guns" environment, and feel exactly the opposite for the vultures who will take advantage of her, in any sort of way. But. I can't work up much sympathy for an adult man who may own and shoot, but is too lazy to do any searching of values. I one watched a well dressed, well known, and noticeably arrogant lawyer (Who drives his Mercedes to the only remaining full service gas station in the area, because "It isn't dignified for professionals to pump their own gas") walk into the local shop and demand he would not take "any less than $300"-for a decent condition First Gen 7-1/2" Colt SA a client had given him as a retainer. And, he got his money. |
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I don’t know if I would class the FNC as being un shootable due to lack of spare parts. With the new bolts that were recently made, pretty much every major part is available for the FNC with the exception of the bolt carrier. Sure, you may have to do some digging to find them, but most other parts are available. |
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Navgunner on Sturm and FNCtalk did a run of FNC bolts. He plans to make other critical parts. Fuatos on the same boards has the extractor components. Green mountain made barrels. Firing pins are available. The FNC is now a shootable firearm. I personally love shooting the fnc. It’s a great not-an-m16 alternative in 5.56. |
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The “must haves” in my opinion are an M16 and an HK sear. -Factory Colt M16. Keep this as a 5.56 or 300bo setup. -non-Colt RR m16 to set up as a beltfed with a FL MCR or the pending Lima-6. -HK sear or HK trigger box that accepts all factory parts. Or preferably both. -Lots of m16 uppers. -Lots of HK hosts: mp5-n, mp5k-n, MP5SD, 21e, 23e, etc. |
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I've always wanted an MP40  The Big Red One [Crazy or Sane?] |
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Originally Posted By H2K: For me the Sterling SMG is very shootable and accurate. The magazines are easy to load. The cyclic rate has a perfect rhythm to it and is music to my ears. https://a.l3n.co/i/AvSIRD.md.png The Sterling is a decent drivers gun. It has an ability to rest on the door and put some lead down accurately. |
Sisyphus had it easy.
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I had an FNC but was afraid to shoot it be cause of the lack of parts. Also had a 1919m37 but again. Lack of parts and were 3x what standard 1919 parts were. Of course the M-11, M-16, HK and uzi guns top the list for surplus parts and for accessories. My #1 accessory would def be the 22lr conversion kit for my RR M16. It’s dedicated to that receiver and runs like a raped ape. I couldn’t tell you how many 10s of thousands of rounds are through it. I also have a DIAS and use it in everything else. (Regular/pistol caliber uppers, belt fed uppers) |
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Some guns that I own (PPSH-41, MP-40, M2 50cal, Swedish K, Stemple 76/45, AK-47, Vickers and Maxims) are so dependable I won't need spare parts. Plus with many parts kits available, I can find what I need. Even the Mp-40, I can locate repro and original parts for. The ones you need to worry about parts for are probably out of your price range. These guns get snatched up by collectors, not shooters, for top $. -Stg-43/44, johnson 1941's |
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Originally Posted By M-203: Some guns that I own (PPSH-41, MP-40, M2 50cal, Swedish K, Stemple 76/45, AK-47, Vickers and Maxims) are so dependable I won't need spare parts. Plus with many parts kits available, I can find what I need. Even the Mp-40, I can locate repro and original parts for. The ones you need to worry about parts for are probably out of your price range. These guns get snatched up by collectors, not shooters, for top $. -Stg-43/44, johnson 1941's I came to post the Swedish k and SW-76. Both very shootable and anything that tends to wear (though they’re both very reliable) tends to have replacements available. |
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Originally Posted By cms81586: SOT and post samples are the way to go. No concerns of a KB destroying a $40k transferable M16 lower. Poverty pony goes in the trash and another converted. Not everyone wants to run an SOT. I’ve got a wife, young kids, busy career, etc… I barely make it to the range a few times a year. No way I would have time to run a gun shop. Not to mention I don’t want to be opening advertising my home as place that sell and had guns. There is a reason why demand for transferable MGs is high. The alternative is just a hassle. |
"I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery". - Thomas Jefferson
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Originally Posted By Spartikis: Not everyone wants to run an SOT. I’ve got a wife, young kids, busy career, etc… I barely make it to the range a few times a year. No way I would have time to run a gun shop. Not to mention I don’t want to be opening advertising my home as place that sell and had guns. There is a reason why demand for transferable MGs is high. The alternative is just a hassle. I would agree that FFL with a SOT isn't for everyone. However you don't need to own a gun shop to have a license. Nor do you have to have people come to your house.. you can sell online. Main requirements are that it is a business and not a way to just get a gun collection. Also zoning for businesses where you plan to have your license. Nevertheless it didn't sound like this is what the OP was wanting. He wants to get MGs to have fun and be able to transfer to the kids. |
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None of my MGs are safe queens. I also keep spares for all my guns and will not buy a MG if I can't get a parts kit squirreled away. I have a Japanese Type 99 LMG, I bought 2 parts kits before I bought a transferable gun. My Swedish Kg m/37 BAR is probably the hardest and rarest to find parts for but I have spares for the entire gun and 6 spare barrels. Stoner 63a, the most expensive spares to get but I have what I need for it as well. I have shot it enough to smooth bore one barrel but got another one to replace it and used the original parts from the worn out barrel and reverse engineered it and had a new barrel made. In over 80K rounds I have only broken an extractor and a "c" clip on the gun. ZB26 complete spare parts kit plus 5 barrels. All my SMGs, spare parts kits for each. The value of the MG does not stop me from shooting them. Parts will break but planning ahead takes care of that. Almost all MGs were designed for military use and most of the older ones have support kits for them (aka gunners kits) and the spares in them usually tell you what you need to stock to keep your gun running. |
If God didn't want them sheared, he would not have made them sheep.
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Originally Posted By Ryo: I would agree that FFL with a SOT isn't for everyone. However you don't need to own a gun shop to have a license. Nor do you have to have people come to your house.. you can sell online. Main requirements are that it is a business and not a way to just get a gun collection. Also zoning for businesses where you plan to have your license. Nevertheless it didn't sound like this is what the OP was wanting. He wants to get MGs to have fun and be able to transfer to the kids. Originally Posted By Ryo: Originally Posted By Spartikis: Not everyone wants to run an SOT. I’ve got a wife, young kids, busy career, etc… I barely make it to the range a few times a year. No way I would have time to run a gun shop. Not to mention I don’t want to be opening advertising my home as place that sell and had guns. There is a reason why demand for transferable MGs is high. The alternative is just a hassle. I would agree that FFL with a SOT isn't for everyone. However you don't need to own a gun shop to have a license. Nor do you have to have people come to your house.. you can sell online. Main requirements are that it is a business and not a way to just get a gun collection. Also zoning for businesses where you plan to have your license. Nevertheless it didn't sound like this is what the OP was wanting. He wants to get MGs to have fun and be able to transfer to the kids. The city where I live will not issue a business license in areas that are zoned residential, as is the case of my home, period. In another similar situation (different city - same restrictive zoning regs), a dealer I once used for an online gun purchase leases a business zoned office for after normal work hour firearms sales and transfers, but the only way it is financially feasible is he also uses the office to sell insurance policies, which a second side business in addition to his day job. MHO, YMMV, etc. |
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I’m order of least worried to most worried about shooting them due to parts availability, fun, easy to deal with etc Sten - cheap parts everywhere and cheap ammo M16 - parts are everywhere and lots of options Madsen M50 - liked it much more than I thought I would and parts are out there but do need a barrel MAC11A1 - really only because Lage exists PPsH 41 - only in 9mm as the 7.62 ammo is expensive S&W 76 - really like this gun but parts can be tricky Beretta 38/42 - parts and mags are available and ammo is reasonable Pearl UC9 - everything about it is custom other than Uzi mags, worried about breaking something and no spares without making them 1919 - parts are available and lots of conversions but sucks dragging all that shit out to the range Valmet M78 - very limited spares and worth the most Type 99 Paratrooper - haven’t gotten it yet but kind of terrifies me, mags and parts aren’t available but it was converted to 308 so there’s that at least Haven't gotten it yet but 303 is expensive but at least parts are available Lewis Gun Friend has a Thompson that’s a reweld and while it’s not pretty that bastard just runs, sure it’s heavy and all but it’s a Thompson Another friend has a dealer sample VZ61 and my god is it fun to shoot! Don’t even care that 32 ACP is expensive when I shoot it |
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Originally Posted By jimmybcool: Well thinking of selling mine. Wondering the best way to do it. I know I can contact NFA dealers and it's done quickly. But at what discount? Subguns.com was my go to and it's gone. So where do people find interested real buyers of class iii now? Posting on sturmgewehr will probably get you the best deal. As the seller there is usually minimal risk as they are the one sending the money. I would recommend making and account now and making some posts so you have an account with a little history. Brand new accounts tend to not be as trusted. Always talk with the buyer on the phone, facetime is even better. Or just call up Frank or Reuben and they will give you 80% of market value and its hassle free. |
"I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery". - Thomas Jefferson
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Originally Posted By Spartikis: Posting on sturmgewehr will probably get you the best deal. As the seller there is usually minimal risk as they are the one sending the money. I would recommend making and account now and making some posts so you have an account with a little history. Brand new accounts tend to not be as trusted. Always talk with the buyer on the phone, facetime is even better. Or just call up Frank or Reuben and they will give you 80% of market value and its hassle free. Thanks. Yeah I forgot Sturmgewehr. Been a member for 20 years but not real active. I spoke with Reuben (dealernfa) about them and was mystified by his reactions. He asked me my lowest price. Well hell that's not a smart way for me to do business now is it? I mean I mentioned what he is selling them for and countered with a price about 10% off expecting a counter etc. Normal negotiation. He explains he has expenses and profit expectation etc and once against asked my LOWEST price. Hey male a counter offer dude. He is asking me to negotiate against myself. Never did get any offer from him and I think MP5s (purchased from him) and SP1 conversions are popular guns. Do not know who you mean by Frank. Please fill that in for me. I confess I am lazy and travel and doing business selling to one of those guys for a reasonable discount works for me. |
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Originally Posted By jimmybcool: Do not know who you mean by Frank. Please fill that in for me. I confess I am lazy and travel and doing business selling to one of those guys for a reasonable discount works for me. Frank is Frank Goepfert at Midwest Tactical. They also run gunspot.com. |
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Originally Posted By jimmybcool: Well thinking of selling mine. Wondering the best way to do it. I know I can contact NFA dealers and it's done quickly. But at what discount? Subguns.com was my go to and it's gone. So where do people find interested real buyers of class iii now? Snugbus.com is the new subguns. Unfortunately it's not near the traffic or knowledge base that subguns once was. Still don't like that Frank Goepfert ruined it. Best bet is sell on Sturm. Mario at POHF also buys and sells a lot. |
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Thanks guys. I have a problem. Even though I never shoot any longer every time I start to make an ad I get second thoughts. At least now I have ideas. BTW anyone familiar with Robert Brown in Peoria AZ? He has an ad on Sturmgewehr for a lot of NFA MGs. Guessing he also buys or maybe works as go between for a consignment. |
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Originally Posted By cherenkov: I think OP nailed the top contenders. I love my M2 carbine and have essentially spare parts for it now, Many spare parts New Old Stock from Surplus and barrels. Good parts and many mags. I agree with OP also, but will add the M3 Greasegun. A great shooter and suppresses well. I like the M2 Carbine, but the ammo cost puts me off. |
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Originally Posted By jimmybcool: Thanks guys. I have a problem. Even though I never shoot any longer every time I start to make an ad I get second thoughts. At least now I have ideas. BTW anyone familiar with Robert Brown in Peoria AZ? He has an ad on Sturmgewehr for a lot of NFA MGs. Guessing he also buys or maybe works as go between for a consignment. I am not familiar with Robert Brown, but I have dealt with Thomas Stewart in Peoria, AZ and would not hesitate to do so again. He is 'Tonetiup' on Sturm. |
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Originally Posted By J2X: I am not familiar with Robert Brown, but I have dealt with Thomas Stewart in Peoria, AZ and would not hesitate to do so again. He is 'Tonetiup' on Sturm. Originally Posted By J2X: Originally Posted By jimmybcool: Thanks guys. I have a problem. Even though I never shoot any longer every time I start to make an ad I get second thoughts. At least now I have ideas. BTW anyone familiar with Robert Brown in Peoria AZ? He has an ad on Sturmgewehr for a lot of NFA MGs. Guessing he also buys or maybe works as go between for a consignment. I am not familiar with Robert Brown, but I have dealt with Thomas Stewart in Peoria, AZ and would not hesitate to do so again. He is 'Tonetiup' on Sturm. Robert is a great guy — and a Thompson expert. |
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I had a great experience with Tom Stewart on a transaction last year. Goepfort may be a decent guy but his employees are total used car salesmen and I’ll never do business with Midwest Tactical again. I tried to buy a gun from them that was made completely out of spec, as it turned out after an in-person examination. I even tried to get it fixed by a third party, and said third party wouldn’t touch it. After I backed out of the sale, they re-listed it not disclosing any of the deficiencies I pointed out to them. Basically the equivalent of trying to sell a muscle car with a cracked block and not disclosing it to the potential buyer. After that, I saw that Tom had what I was looking for, and it was exactly as he said it would be. That’s the kind of guy I like to do business with, especially in such a high value transaction. Not like we’re talking police trade in pistols here. |
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Originally Posted By jimmybcool: Been so long I can not remember my password on Sturmgewehr. And their password recovery system is slooooowwwww. As in not really working. But I'll get it back again and contact those guys or list them directly. Thanks Maybe I missed it, but what are you trying to sell? |
"Shootable" MGs (Page 1 of 2)
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