Polytech M14S find....should I snag it? - Page 1

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Polytech M14S find....should I snag it?

Posted: 7/22/2018 6:10:03 PM EDT

Hi all,

I recently found a Polytech "side stamped" M14S with the faux flash hider/bayo lug ground down at a local gun shop. I looked it over and it seems to be in nice, originalcondition. What I thought was interesting was that the rear sight knobs were "WCE" marked, like the ones on my Garand, so unsure if that was put on by the previous owner or if they came from the factory in China like that. Needless to say, they want $899 for the rifle, one mag, and sling. I'm on the fence and would like to hear y'alls opinions since, minus some recent internet research, I'm pretty new to the M1A/M14 world.

Posted: 7/22/2018 7:16:17 PM EDT

[#1]

If I remember correctly they could be turned into serviceable rifles, and many did because it was economical to do so. I think the "problem" with them was some soft metal and bedding issues.

Posted: 7/22/2018 7:23:27 PM EDT

[#2]

I'd say it's a reasonable price. Polytechs have a hammer forged receiver that makes a good host (for a reputable shop that's done it before) to put a usgi bolt and barrel on. The M14S I once had didn't have a WCE marked sight so your guess as good as mine.

Posted: 7/22/2018 7:33:57 PM EDT

[#3]

Its a fair price. Usually you want to replace the bolt with a G.I. one for around $200 for just the bolt. I found a couple near me for $900 I passed on.
Its getting close to what you can buy a new Springfield for after the bolt and gun smithing if you factor all that in and then see how it shoots. I was afraid I would still need more work after that.

Posted: 7/23/2018 9:48:58 AM EDT

[#4]

I have one. Solid rifle. The bolt issue is grossly overblown. The WCE sights are original Chinese and will probably need to be replaced. Grafting a USGI flash-hider is doable though more expensive than you might think.

Price is fair. Not outstanding but reasonable in today's market. I bought mine about five years ago, almost new in the box, for $850. I consider it one of the better buys I've ever made.

Posted: 7/23/2018 1:27:25 PM EDT

[#5]

All rear sights on Chinese M14s are stamped ‘WCE’ from the factory, and many of them are shoddily-made. Plan on replacing them with USGI if they bother you or present tracking and adjustment issues.

Do some reading about ‘soft bolts’ in Chinese rifles before you sink money into a fix that most likely won’t be needed. Lots of BS out there about them, much of it from people who don’t like the thought of the Chinese building ‘America’s rifle’, and gunsmiths whom turned an issue with a few guns into an industry.

If you get it, swap the rear sights and muzzle device for one of your choosing, then blast away with it.

Several big advantages to the Chinese M14s are that the receivers and op-rods are forged steel, and that the bores and chambers are chrome-lined. Springfield hasn’t produced CL barrels in their M1As since they ran out of GI barrels in ‘04-05, their receivers have always been cast, and now so are their op-rods. Norinco-Polytech receiver dimensions are also GI-correct, so scope mounts and GI stocks will fit with minimal to no fitting. Read about issues people have with their M1As and getting those parts to fit correctly.

The front end parts are metric threads, but the flash suppressor threads are close enough that a GI or commercial part will go right on. You can’t use GI or American commercial gas system parts because the diameters are different, but you will never wear out those parts, anyway. When/if you shoot out the barrel, replace the barrel and gas system with USGI-spec parts and keep shooting.

Posted: 7/23/2018 1:39:19 PM EDT

[#6]

The stock is a throwaway or stash away for "collecting"

The Chinese Chu wood is SO soft (think like Balsa) that your Zero will shift all over the place.

Put it in a USGI Fiberglass stock and your accuracy will improve a LOT.

Posted: 7/23/2018 4:54:46 PM EDT

[#7]

Quote History

Quoted:
The stock is a throwaway or stash away for "collecting"

The Chinese Chu wood is SO soft (think like Balsa) that your Zero will shift all over the place.

Put it in a USGI Fiberglass stock and your accuracy will improve a LOT.

View Quote

Not all of them used Chu wood. Some of the later ones used what was described as Manchurian Walnut, which seems to hold up fine.

Posted: 7/23/2018 5:23:47 PM EDT

[#8]

Quote History

Quoted:
If I remember correctly they could be turned into serviceable rifles, and many did because it was economical to do so. I think the "problem" with them was some soft metal and bedding issues.

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The big problem is the potential for bad heat treat on the bolt. Aside from that they're fine.

Posted: 7/23/2018 7:11:18 PM EDT

[#9]

Quote History

Quoted:
The big problem is the potential for bad heat treat on the bolt. Aside from that they're fine.

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Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
If I remember correctly they could be turned into serviceable rifles, and many did because it was economical to do so. I think the "problem" with them was some soft metal and bedding issues.

The big problem is the potential for bad heat treat on the bolt. Aside from that they're fine.

Early Norincos were the main culprit for soft bolts. It’s possible that early Polys did, too, but it’s a situation that’s been overblown to a large degree.

Posted: 7/24/2018 9:43:31 AM EDT

[#10]

Also keep in mind the Canadians have continued to import them. I haven't heard of any complaints.

Posted: 7/24/2018 10:29:58 AM EDT

[#11]

I paid $800 for mine two years or so ago. I would buy it.

Gun shoots fine and I use check mate mags.

The Chu wood stock looks like ass and feels fat in the wrist. Mine curiously had a selector cut out of it.

I just found a GI stock I had "lost" while moving so tonight I plan on swapping it over.

I bought headspace gauges when I bought it the rifle. No issue and other members already commented on the WCE sight parts.

Attached File

Mine is heal stamped. Well, it almost looks electropenciled.

Posted: 7/24/2018 6:33:46 PM EDT

[#12]

The story of WHY the Chinese made M-14 Clones with US Marked parts is interesting...

The Communist Chinese were wanting to help out there follow Asian Communist Revolutionaries in the Philippines...

So, they took Vietnam Captured US M-14s, made some minor adjustments for their arsenal system (metric on some threads) and then cranked out Clone M-14s and unmarked (Sterile) 7.62x51 ammo for "Foreign Aid" for the Communists Rebels that wouldn't be traced back to Red China like AK-47s & 7.62x39 ammo might...

Later, they made a Semi-Auto version for sales overseas, and while we no longer can import them, the Canadians still do...

Posted: 7/24/2018 8:04:24 PM EDT

[#13]

Yeah, but the Canadian versions are all cast now. We got the good forged ones.

Most of the heel-marked M14S rifles are electro-penciled, because they didn't have adequate heel stamping dies or roll marking equipment to mark a curved surface.
I've never seen a bolt failure on a Chinese rifle. They might fail a .308 NO-GO gauge, but most won't close on a 7.62 NATO Field gauge. If it's an issue, replace with a US bolt. No big deal.

Posted: 7/24/2018 8:33:32 PM EDT

[#14]

Quote History

Quoted:
The story of WHY the Chinese made M-14 Clones with US Marked parts is interesting...

The Communist Chinese were wanting to help out there follow Asian Communist Revolutionaries in the Philippines...

So, they took Vietnam Captured US M-14s, made some minor adjustments for their arsenal system (metric on some threads) and then cranked out Clone M-14s and unmarked (Sterile) 7.62x51 ammo for "Foreign Aid" for the Communists Rebels that wouldn't be traced back to Red China like AK-47s & 7.62x39 ammo might...

Later, they made a Semi-Auto version for sales overseas, and while we no longer can import them, the Canadians still do...

View Quote

Is that why my chu wood stock has a selector cut out of it?

Posted: 7/24/2018 8:45:51 PM EDT

[#15]

It's because it was (mostly) originally a select-fire MG, although later they ramped up production strictly for the (US civilian) export market. I think every Chinese receiver in the US (other than a few post samples marked M14 on the heel in really big letters) used new production semi-auto receivers, although initially they reused the rest of the select-fire parts. US customs prevented them from simply modifying the MG receivers. (Once a MG, always a MG).

If you look at the Polytechs, they all have modified parts (semi-auto only) whereas the Norinco rifle parts are closer to USGI spec (op rod, sear, connector lock).

Posted: 7/24/2018 9:56:00 PM EDT

[#16]

Quote History

Quoted:
It's because it was (mostly) originally a select-fire MG, although later they ramped up production strictly for the (US civilian) export market. I think every Chinese receiver in the US (other than a few post samples marked M14 on the heel in really big letters) used new production semi-auto receivers, although initially they reused the rest of the select-fire parts. US customs prevented them from simply modifying the MG receivers. (Once a MG, always a MG).

If you look at the Polytechs, they all have modified parts (semi-auto only) whereas the Norinco rifle parts are closer to USGI spec (op rod, sear, connector lock).

View Quote

Thanks, I’ll take mine apart and take pics and start another thread. Sorry for the hijack, OP!!

Posted: 7/24/2018 10:45:09 PM EDT

[#17]

A USGI stock will let the Chinese connector lock walk out. Connector lock doesn't stick out like the US part.

Posted: 7/24/2018 10:48:36 PM EDT

[#18]

It depends on which Chinese connector lock you have. The Norinco ones are generally USGI length, while the Polytech ones are flush. They'll swap with a US pin though (maybe with a little fitting). That's what I did to all of mine.

Posted: 7/24/2018 10:53:21 PM EDT

[#19]

Please note best I can recall the Chinese were decent but all screws are metric and differ from USA gun screws threads etc. I’ve had norinco sks rifles an ak and a Mac 90. Every on performed flawlessly. You could not force them to malfunction . But I’m in agreement that the chu wood is ultra soft. It dents easily. What I did was to replace all with fiberglass.
Chinese steel has been known to be softer but all my Chinese weapons had no issue with steel

Posted: 7/24/2018 10:53:35 PM EDT

[#20]

Quote History

Quoted:
It depends on which Chinese connector lock you have. The Norinco ones are generally USGI length, while the Polytech ones are flush. They'll swap with a US pin though (maybe with a little fitting). That's what I did to all of mine.

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I stuck a Sparrowhawk dummy selector kit w/ connector arm in my birch stock, and it holds the connector lock in place. It looks pretty bad-ass, too.

Posted: 7/24/2018 10:55:48 PM EDT

[#21]

Quote History

Quoted:
Please note best I can recall the Chinese were decent but all screws are metric and differ from USA gun screws threads etc. I’ve had norinco sks rifles an ak and a Mac 90. Every on performed flawlessly. You could not force them to malfunction . But I’m in agreement that the chu wood is ultra soft. It dents easily. What I did was to replace all with fiberglass.
Chinese steel has been known to be softer but all my Chinese weapons had no issue with steel

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The Chinese knew a thing or two about hardening steel in their firearms. Ask a gunsmith about doing custom work on a Norinco 1911 or forged receiver AK. “Forged in the fires of Hades” is how a gunsmith I know described them.

Posted: 7/24/2018 10:56:48 PM EDT

[#22]

For 800 I’d buy it aren’t USA m14s about $200

Posted: 7/24/2018 11:05:48 PM EDT

[#23]

Quote History

Quoted:
For 800 I’d buy it aren’t USA m14s about $200

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Posted: 7/24/2018 11:25:04 PM EDT

[#24]

Quote History

Quoted:
Is that why my chu wood stock has a selector cut out of it?

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
The story of WHY the Chinese made M-14 Clones with US Marked parts is interesting...

The Communist Chinese were wanting to help out there follow Asian Communist Revolutionaries in the Philippines...

So, they took Vietnam Captured US M-14s, made some minor adjustments for their arsenal system (metric on some threads) and then cranked out Clone M-14s and unmarked (Sterile) 7.62x51 ammo for "Foreign Aid" for the Communists Rebels that wouldn't be traced back to Red China like AK-47s & 7.62x39 ammo might...

Later, they made a Semi-Auto version for sales overseas, and while we no longer can import them, the Canadians still do...

Is that why my chu wood stock has a selector cut out of it?

Yes, They were originally made Select Fire (thus the connector link at the receiver and cut out in the stock)

When the unissued guns were to be imported to the USA, the Chinese had to replace the receivers (once a Machine Gun always a Machine Gun Per BATFE)

Posted: 7/24/2018 11:33:55 PM EDT

[#25]

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Quoted:
I have one. Solid rifle. The bolt issue is grossly overblown. .

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Isn't the bolt issue mostly rooted in people using .308 headspage gauges instead of 7.62?

Posted: 7/24/2018 11:42:52 PM EDT

[#26]

It's mostly rooted in gunsmiths offering bolt replacement services, and devout Springfield Armory or Smith Enterprise fans, but there were a few examples of Chinese bolts that were too soft. Hardly enough to warrant a bad reputation. Different has done extensive research & testing on the subject.

Posted: 7/25/2018 9:00:12 PM EDT

[#27]

Forget propaganda. For pravda you to me listen.

Chinese M14 short bolt having. Space of head much too bigly. Stripped bolt on 7.62 Nato field guage closing.

So me capitalist bolt TRW fitting. Amerikanski bolts much longer and headspace now shorter. Now stripped bolt not closing on .308 go nowhere guage.

Also rifle fascist sights of Beretta having. Chinese rear sights not good. No zero holding.

Pictures for you seeing.

Rifle now perfect. Is quality just as good as fascist rifle Beretta M1. Shoots accurately just as good.

Posted: 7/26/2018 6:16:37 PM EDT

[#28]

Well, ended up snagging the 'ol Polytech. I went ahead and swapped out the rear sight assembly for all USGI parts (mostly HRA) and I have a USGI flash hider ready to go on it soon. Overall pretty excited about it! And it looks good next to my Danish M1 Garand and '73 Colt SP1

Posted: 7/26/2018 6:37:56 PM EDT

[#29]

Check your IMs, please.

Posted: 7/26/2018 9:45:07 PM EDT

[#30]

Looks like it might already have a GI stock on it too

Posted: 7/27/2018 4:53:27 AM EDT

[#31]

Quote History

Quoted:
Looks like it might already have a GI stock on it too

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Nope, that’s a Chinese stock. Look at the squared-off features and lack of selector slot, a clear indicator of origin.

Posted: 7/29/2018 12:31:16 AM EDT

[#32]

I bought mine new in 1994, never had any issues.

As stated, the bolt issue was vastly overblown, limited to some early rifles.

the rear Mine consistently shoots 2 moa with handloads, irons, and old tired eyes.

one rifle I will never part with.

Posted: 7/29/2018 7:01:00 PM EDT

[#33]

I paid $900 for mine last year and was happy to get it for that price as it fills hole in my collection. This state banned M1A's and rifles like it that the parts are interchangeable, dumb, but it's run by libtards. with the metric threaded gas components it's considered "not a copycat rifle" as all the parts don't interchange.Mine came with a walnut GI stock and flash hider/bayonet lug.

Posted: 8/9/2018 7:16:02 PM EDT

[#34]

You will enjoy shooting it. The bolt issue warrants a quick check and shoot away

Posted: 9/3/2018 7:43:02 PM EDT

[#35]

Quote History

Quoted:
I bought mine new in 1994, never had any issues.

As stated, the bolt issue was vastly overblown, limited to some early rifles.

the rear Mine consistently shoots 2 moa with handloads, irons, and old tired eyes.

one rifle I will never part with.

View Quote

I had one of the early rifles, bought it when they first came out. 2nd magazine in, it went full auto. Called Fulton's Armory and talked to Clint McKee, who filled me in on what was good and bad with the rifle.

Sent it in and had a new bolt, op rod and trigger group replaced with US parts.

Ran like a champ and like a idiot I sold it.

Posted: 9/3/2018 7:50:04 PM EDT

[#36]

Well, the connector lock walked out of mine last weekend, but I glued pieces of popsicle stick into the stock and it’s holding for now.

Posted: 9/21/2018 8:41:59 PM EDT

[#37]

Quote History

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Well, ended up snagging the 'ol Polytech. I went ahead and swapped out the rear sight assembly for all USGI parts (mostly HRA) and I have a USGI flash hider ready to go on it soon. Overall pretty excited about it! And it looks good next to my Danish M1 Garand and '73 Colt SP1

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p38/XTRM1NATR/IMG_20180726_165852196_zpscimlur0o.jpg

http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p38/XTRM1NATR/IMG_20180726_170009218_zpssgjfft9o.jpg

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Very nice. The M1 especially so; I love an M1 with honest wear but was well cared for like yours.

A quality M14-type rifle that was assembled properly is a joy to own and shoot. I suspect the Polytech is a keeper.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Polytech M14S find....should I snag it?

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