New DSA Arms FALs good to go? - Page 1

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - New DSA Arms FALs good to go?

Posted: 2/13/2018 5:03:54 PM EDT

I seem to remember that DSA rifles were a bit sketchy for while after the surplus parts started drying up and/or the QA/QC has slipped. Anyone know what I can expect out of DSA these days? Are they still using Badger barrels? How are the cast receivers?

Posted: 2/13/2018 8:51:54 PM EDT

[#1]

I don't know if this data point is recent enough, but I got my Para in the middle of 2016. It's been superb. In fact, I alternate carrying it to work with my Robinson XCR.

Posted: 2/16/2018 11:57:01 AM EDT

[#2]

I purchased a rifle from there custom shop in fall 2017. It was a 16", short gas system and has ran flawless for me. Not much of a record on it, but it has been great for a few hundred rounds. Fit and finish was quite nice as well.

Posted: 2/23/2018 5:15:42 PM EDT

[#3]

Their rifles aren't like they were back in the beginning but there's not many complaints about the newer ones from what I've seen. Their recent stripped receivers on the other hand are an abomination. Gunplumber has some videos and writing on the subject.

Posted: 2/23/2018 5:57:23 PM EDT

[#4]

They have serious QC issues, but are better about dealing with them on complete rifles, it would seem, but sometimes those issues persist in complete rifles that they ship out. Some parts are known to be of inferior quality, such as bolts, which according to Mark Graham are prone to cracking. They seem to no longer be that concerned with making key parts to the proper spec. You may end up with a rifle that functions excellently for the entire time that you own it, but that is far from guaranteed.

Posted: 2/23/2018 11:46:37 PM EDT

[#5]

Quote History

Quoted:
They have serious QC issues, but are better about dealing with them on complete rifles, it would seem, but sometimes those issues persist in complete rifles that they ship out. Some parts are known to be of inferior quality, such as bolts, which according to Mark Graham are prone to cracking. They seem to no longer be that concerned with making key parts to the proper spec. You may end up with a rifle that functions excellently for the entire time that you own it, but that is far from guaranteed.

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Good to know. That's sort of what I suspected. I guess if I want a reasonably priced and decent .308 its going to be a PTR then. Thanks!

Posted: 2/24/2018 12:15:25 AM EDT

[#6]

Quote History

Quoted:
Good to know. That's sort of what I suspected. I guess if I want a reasonably priced and decent .308 its going to be a PTR then. Thanks!

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Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
They have serious QC issues, but are better about dealing with them on complete rifles, it would seem, but sometimes those issues persist in complete rifles that they ship out. Some parts are known to be of inferior quality, such as bolts, which according to Mark Graham are prone to cracking. They seem to no longer be that concerned with making key parts to the proper spec. You may end up with a rifle that functions excellently for the entire time that you own it, but that is far from guaranteed.

Good to know. That's sort of what I suspected. I guess if I want a reasonably priced and decent .308 its going to be a PTR then. Thanks!

I would check the FAL Files Marketplace. You can potentially find some decent FALs for a good price. I suppose if you wanted new, though, your options are extremely limited with the FAL. DSA is really the only game in town as far as the U.S. goes.

DSA does seem to be pretty good about honouring their warranty, though, although it might take more than one time for them to get things right.

There is a nice Chilean IMBEL kit that's been refinished on the FAL Files right now. Buy that and a NOS IMBEL receiver to go with it and you basically have something fairly decent that shouldn't cost significantly more than the PTR if you're willing to borrow tools and do the build yourself. Shouldn't really cost much more than a DSA (aside from their cheapest model) if you were to send it out to be built.

I do like the FAL much more than the G-3. Much more ergonomic and comfortable, softer-shooting, usually a better trigger (not that the FAL is spectacular in this regard, but on average they tend to be better than the G-3 and can be made fairly crisp, even if they can't safely be made lighter than about 6 lbs. or so), easier to strip and clean (and work on), etc.

If you were to go the FAL route, I'd suggest sticking to OEM or Moses magazines, as DSA's have issues except for the 30-rounders and some of th eother aftermarket stuff, like the Korean mags, are junk. Don't try to buy Moses mags from Moses himself, though, unless you like people stealing your money.

Posted: 2/24/2018 8:57:38 AM EDT

[#7]

You'll pay more but be better off buying an older DSA built rifle with a DS serial number prefix which is when LMT made their receivers. Also look for a SAR-48 or a kit gun built by one of the good smiths. Gunplumber still has a few IMBEL kits left, buy one and a receiver and have him work his magic. There's some IMBEL receivers available and one DSA (DS) receiver for sale over in the marketplace on the FALFiles.

Posted: 2/24/2018 9:12:42 AM EDT

[#8]

Good advice here about the new DSA FAL rifles. You're spot on in considering a new PTR-91 instead...

Posted: 2/25/2018 4:49:12 PM EDT

[#9]

I looked around for an older used DSA with the LMT made receiver and am very satisfied.

Posted: 2/25/2018 5:55:33 PM EDT

[#10]

I have a DSA Para and I’ve had no trouble with mine. Don’t shoot them down. They will stand by their weapons.

Posted: 3/12/2018 3:47:20 PM EDT

[#11]

I've been bitten by the FAL bug recently, and have been researching DSA SA58 rifles as well... Appears ~$1800 would be the going rate for a para 16-18" model.

At the same time i've also been calculating costs to have Arizona Response Systems build a FAL from an Imbel parts kits (they have plenty at ARS), and possibly DSA/other Receiver... I think cost wise they would be similar, and I hear ARS does fantastic work on Fal's...

Posted: 3/19/2018 3:56:42 PM EDT

[#12]

I think DSA gets a ton of shit they dont deserve

They've always bent over backwards to help me

Posted: 3/19/2018 6:36:57 PM EDT

[#13]

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Quoted:
I think DSA gets a ton of shit they dont deserve

They've always bent over backwards to help me

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Their CS, for me, has been phenomenal. The problem is this: a lot of the issues folks have with them shouldn't be issues in the first place, and those could be rectified by a far more rigorous QA/QC system. That would lessen CS's load and make the customers happier (they have legitimate gripes). In my case, on an R1 receiver, the locking shoulder dog leg was too short. A thorough check would have caught that before it left the factory.

Posted: 3/20/2018 11:28:45 AM EDT

[#14]

Quote History

Quoted:
Good to know. That's sort of what I suspected. I guess if I want a reasonably priced and decent .308 its going to be a PTR then. Thanks!

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
They have serious QC issues, but are better about dealing with them on complete rifles, it would seem, but sometimes those issues persist in complete rifles that they ship out. Some parts are known to be of inferior quality, such as bolts, which according to Mark Graham are prone to cracking. They seem to no longer be that concerned with making key parts to the proper spec. You may end up with a rifle that functions excellently for the entire time that you own it, but that is far from guaranteed.

Good to know. That's sort of what I suspected. I guess if I want a reasonably priced and decent .308 its going to be a PTR then. Thanks!

Or just find a real FN FAL on Gunbroker. I've owned 3 FN FAL's over the last 28 years and all of them worked reliably. I owned one brand new DSA FAL and it had issues chambering rounds reliably. I also had many issues with DSA made FAL magazines. I got rid of my DSA FAL and never bought any more of their products. I wish I had kept my FN FAL's. I ended up with a PTR 91 just out of interest in an HK 91 type of rifle. My PTR 91 is as accurate as my old HK 91 and yet it has a shorter 16" barrel and has a lot less recoil than my old HK 91. That said, If I was going to buy an older .308 rifle, I'd be looking for a Galil AR or ARM. I had a Galil AR .308 (sold my HK 91 for an FN FAL Paratrooper model and then sold that for a Galil AR) and it was a better rifle than either the FN FAL or HK 91. It was a lot more accurate, reliable, simpler to disassemble/clean, and had a lot less recoil that either of the other two. In fact, I'd be tempted to check out one of the new Galil ACE .308 rifles. If the ACE is anything like the original Galil AR or ARM, it would be a fantastic battle rifle and would be much better than an FN FAL, HK 91, or PTR 91. An original Galil AR or ARM would cost about $3,000 while an ACE costs about $2,400.

A picture of my Galil AR before I sold it to a friend. I loved those heavy duty 25rd steel .308 magazines.

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Posted: 5/24/2018 10:18:28 PM EDT

[#15]

Is DSA the only option for a new FAL? Are parts kits all dried up for any other manufacturer? With how popular the FAL is around the world, I’m kinda shocked our option is $1700+.

Posted: 5/25/2018 9:39:20 PM EDT

[#16]

Makes me sad man

Posted: 6/4/2018 12:21:01 PM EDT

[#17]

OP, I'm in the same boat as you. I hear so many bad things about DSA.

Every time I see threads like this about trouble with .308 semis and folks recommending the PTR 91s, FALs, the Galil etc I realize how FNH could utterly kill this market if they brought the price down on the SCAR 17. All the features are there, reliability is superb, and it's lighter than nearly all of them.

Posted: 6/7/2018 5:02:35 PM EDT

[#18]

Just order a DSArms sa58 there customer service was great. You hear all these stories about DSArms FALs having issues and some are probably true but I’ve been reading over at the falfiles and the few companies that are making FALs all have their own set of issues. At least DSArms will make it %100 correct for you if they mess it up. Imbel kits are easy to find as are recievers if you look around you can build your self a FAL for well under what some of these companies charge if you know/figure out what your doing.

Posted: 6/12/2018 4:10:47 PM EDT

[#19]

I have one of their complete rifles... and I've bought a bunch of other parts from them to modify my other FAL's.

I've never had a single issue.

Posted: 6/21/2018 7:27:07 PM EDT

[#20]

Same here. 100% buy with confidence.

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Quoted:
I have one of their complete rifles... and I've bought a bunch of other parts from them to modify my other FAL's.

I've never had a single issue.

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Posted: 7/23/2018 5:39:40 PM EDT

[#21]

I currently have 3 DSA FALs and they all function flawlessly with surplus and DSA 20 and 30 round mags. And I say that as a previous owner of 2 original FN FALs.

If I was to do it over I would settle on the 25 round DSA mags because of weight and length considerations.

YMMV
The MULE

Posted: 8/1/2018 8:20:36 AM EDT

[#22]

We ship quite a few DSA FAL rifles and pistols out each month and rarely encounter issues . Just like Colt , Glock , Ruger etc there will be a bad apple that gets out every once in a while .If we did have a problem DS Customer service took care of the problem.

Posted: 8/1/2018 9:04:08 AM EDT

[#23]

Quote History

Quoted:
I've been bitten by the FAL bug recently, and have been researching DSA SA58 rifles as well... Appears ~$1800 would be the going rate for a para 16-18" model.

At the same time i've also been calculating costs to have Arizona Response Systems build a FAL from an Imbel parts kits (they have plenty at ARS), and possibly DSA/other Receiver... I think cost wise they would be similar, and I hear ARS does fantastic work on Fal's...

View Quote

I had a Arizona Response Systems FAL some years back, great rifle.

Posted: 9/18/2018 7:37:16 PM EDT

[#24]

Sad to hear about their troubles, back in the day DSA Maas the best option for a TAL. I bought a a DSA SA58 in 2001, the fit, finish and performance have been second to none. But man, .308 out of a 16” rarely with a brake is painful for me, I haven’t taken that gun out in over ten years.

I also picked up 2 sealed cases of FN 20 round magazines at the time. Those too have been flawless.

Posted: 9/22/2018 8:01:53 PM EDT

[#25]

Got my new 16" Para carbine in on Thursday evening. Tried, with an emphasis on tried to test fire it and adjust the gas regulator on Friday morning.

The rifle brand new out of the box would not strip the top round off of a fully loaded 20 round magazine. I thought it could be a bad magazine, but it did the same
thing with every other magazine I tried until I had tried 8 or 10 of them with the same result. The rifle has several issues, most notably this one. I believe the cause of
this is the feed ramps are not as large or as polished as they are in my SAR48 or my Imbel receiver kit build. The feed ramps look extremely rough.

I also do not think the para top cover is correct since it does not hold the bolt and carrier together as one unit as it should. The gas regulator also turns way too easily
which makes me think the spring underneath is too weak or out of spec. I also experienced several malfunctions when I tried to fire this rifle. Several failures to go into
battery completely, several failures to eject, and the not stripping a round off the top of the magazine. All in all about 15 malfunctions in 40 rounds.

Totally unacceptable for a rifle that costs almost $2000.00

The good news is, DSA sent me a call tag and a return authorization to send it back. So, a rifle that I waited 7 weeks to get has to go back for quality control related
issues that should have been corrected BEFORE it left the factory. No telling how long this will take, and if it will be any better when it comes back.

So the waiting game starts yet again.

Posted: 9/23/2018 4:41:34 AM EDT

[#26]

Yeah, not unusual. It's unfortunate. There is simply no quality manufacturer of complete FALs or receivers with products available in the U.S. anymore.

On the FAL Files, someone was doing a review of a DSA FAL and when they went to shoot it got stoppages every couple of rounds or so.

Posted: 9/25/2018 1:24:49 PM EDT

[#27]

I wanted a 16" fal and being that the market is super limited I took the chance on a dsa. It's currently sitting at my dealer waiting for me to drive over and pick it up.I'm hoping I get lucky and don't have to deal with any issues that other people are seeing.

Posted: 9/25/2018 1:25:29 PM EDT

[#28]

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I wanted a 16" fal and being that the market is super limited I took the chance on a dsa. It's currently sitting at my dealer waiting for me to drive over and pick it up.I'm hoping I get lucky and don't have to deal with any issues that other people are seeing.

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I've never had any issues with DSA products. I'm sure you'll be fine.

Posted: 9/28/2018 1:44:24 AM EDT

[#29]

Got an SA58 straight from DSA in 2012. After about 100 rounds of South African surplus the MIM ejector snapped. The MIM ejector and ejector block consisted of one piece molded piece.

DSA offered to ship the rifle back for repair, instead I ordered from them a correct ejector block and spare ejectors. After fitting and installation, been running like a champ.

After that I kicked myself for selling off my legit military parts gun.

Posted: 10/14/2018 9:38:44 PM EDT

[#30]

All of the DSA FALs I use to own had forged receivers. I recently saw they now offer cast. I don't want to start an argument about forged vs cast, but I wouldn't own a cast FAL (including a FNH made gun).

SAR-48 is the FAL to have.

Posted: 10/19/2018 7:26:16 PM EDT

[#31]

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but I wouldn't own a cast FAL

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Forged vs. cast for an FAL receiver is a non-issue.

I really hope they can get their shit together, because I have everything needed for an R1 build except the receivers.

Posted: 10/25/2018 7:18:21 AM EDT

[#32]

Reviews do seem to be all over the place.

I am looking at a Voyager after getting rid of a PTR-91. Didnt like the ergonomics and especially the charging handle

I haven't quite decided to pull the trigger on it....

Posted: 10/25/2018 12:32:08 PM EDT

[#33]

Quote History

Quoted:
Reviews do seem to be all over the place.

I am looking at a Voyager after getting rid of a PTR-91. Didnt like the ergonomics and especially the charging handle

I haven't quite decided to pull the trigger on it....

View Quote

----------------------

I have an H&K-G3k and like it a lot, it's accurate as hell, but it does handle like a club.

I absolutely love the pointability of my 13-inch DSA - OSW Para. It is so handy and balanced that it points like an M1 Carbine. Accuracy is acceptable even with surplus ball ammo.

None of my DSA's give me any problems, but they are all at least 10 years old so I can't speak for recently manufacturied guns.

I'm an admitted DSA fan, but I say "go for it"!

YMMV
The MULE

Posted: 11/5/2018 10:50:57 AM EDT

[#34]

I am sure if you google enough you can find people who encountered issues with anything. You never know until you test it yourself.

Posted: 2/2/2019 12:30:35 AM EDT

[#35]

Just picked up a new (to me) SA58. Appears to have been unfired, and I've yet to get it out to the range.

All the fit seems to be in good shape, and after a little lubrication and dry firing, the trigger is fair. I think it's going to be a winner!

I will say that it's needed a lot of dehorning. There was a bunch of flash to file down - and I'm still finding more. The receiver has at least a couple of sharp corners in places where thumbs can find. The standard-slot screw holding on the buttstock had a bit of sharp metal poking up - between that and flash around the U-shape recess was carving up my thumb just in dry fire.

Not to succumb to sour grapes, I've been using it as an excuse to get 'er apart and learn how the system works, and do a little cleanup with a file and sandpaper.

Haven't gotten to the internals yet or any metal except the screw.. and not sure how to get the stock off or if the spring housing is under tension, yet. But I'll get there.

Posted: 2/2/2019 6:11:20 AM EDT

[#36]

If it's a fixed-stock rifle you'll need the buttstock wrench or improvise an alternative (the wrenches are cheap, though). That spring is under a lot of tension. I used to use a bunch of bubble wrap to catch the spring and plug (it'll slap you in the face otherwise) and a long screwdriver. Then I would unscrew it most of the way with the screwdriver and then use a .22 cleaning rod to hold everything down while I finished unscrewing it by hand. Using the proper tool is the best method by far.

Posted: 2/2/2019 8:47:08 PM EDT

[#37]

Quote History

Quoted:
If it's a fixed-stock rifle you'll need the buttstock wrench or improvise an alternative (the wrenches are cheap, though). That spring is under a lot of tension. I used to use a bunch of bubble wrap to catch the spring and plug (it'll slap you in the face otherwise) and a long screwdriver. Then I would unscrew it most of the way with the screwdriver and then use a .22 cleaning rod to hold everything down while I finished unscrewing it by hand. Using the proper tool is the best method by far.

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Thanks Big!

I'll look up a how-to and see if I can find the correct tools set to go with it. Improvising tools is rarely worth the effort & lost parts!

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - New DSA Arms FALs good to go?

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