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Posted: 1/4/2020 12:28:28 PM EDT
[#1]
Are bullets hitting the flash suppressor? Does it change the zero with the flash suppressor off? Most FAL flash suppressors aren't timed.
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Posted: 1/4/2020 12:31:18 PM EDT
[#2]
No they are not hitting it.
If you click the link in have pics of how much it changes the impact at 25 yards. |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 2:39:04 PM EDT
[#3]
I have tweaked bent FAL barrels back in Iraq.
Got it to within a few clicks of mechanical zero. A laser boresight is a big help here. Don't be afraid to mess with it. Don't lean on it. Gentle pressure until you see what it takes... |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 2:48:09 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have tweaked bent FAL barrels back in Iraq. Got it to within a few clicks of mechanical zero. A laser boresight is a big help here. Don't be afraid to mess with it. Don't lean on it. Gentle pressure until you see what it takes... |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 4:00:40 PM EDT
[#5]
Ive repaired a bunch of FALs. Put the stripped receiver barrel combo in a vice. Lay a G.I. cleaning rod across the receiver flat. Put a G.I. cleaning rod through the gas block handguard bolt hole. Compare how the align.
Also what receiver are you using? If the barrel is shout out deformed etc it should be printing all over the place. I searched around heres a pic of what im explaining to do. |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 4:02:55 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ive repaired a bunch of FALs. Put the stripped receiver barrel combo in a vice. Lay a G.I. cleaning rod across the receiver flat. Put a G.I. cleaning rod through the gas block handguard bolt hole. Compare how the align. Also what receiver are you using? If the barrel is shout out deformed etc it should be printing all over the place. It is a dsa receiver I bought 10 years ago. |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 4:12:08 PM EDT
[#7]
DSA should be good to go. I worked on a repair job for a Hesse a friend bought at a gun show. The barrel hole was off center. Total nightmare but I got it to run.
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Posted: 1/4/2020 4:15:18 PM EDT
[#8]
Concentricity issue with the barrel, maybe? My buddy's FAL has a South African barrel cut down to 18" that has such an issue and does what you describe. It'll have to be replaced.
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Posted: 1/4/2020 4:37:04 PM EDT
[#9]
If you have the correct pin gauge you can send it down the barrel to see if it stops anywhere. If it does, your bore is bent.
Or you can dismount the barrel, spin it slowly in a fixture, and see visually if it's bent. It could be there's something not flat where it mates up with the receiver. If that's the case, maybe just fix the shoulder using a lathe and a washer. Worst case - rebarrel it. |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 4:39:56 PM EDT
[#10]
Is it a stock flash suppressor?
I had a 8mm mauser that I could never get a decent pattern out of. Recrown the barrel, cleanings etc and it just would not hit POA. It probably needed some oversize bullets hand loaded. It had decent rifling but I never slugged it. If a barrel is bent it will kick or show some over gassed issues. |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 4:44:09 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you have the correct pin gauge you can send it down the barrel to see if it stops anywhere. If it does, your bore is bent. Or you can dismount the barrel, spin it slowly in a fixture, and see visually if it's bent. It could be there's something not flat where it mates up with the receiver. If that's the case, maybe just fix the shoulder using a lathe and a washer. Worst case - rebarrel it. I may buy a pin gauge and try that. 308 sized? |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 4:46:22 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Is it a stock flash suppressor? I had a 8mm mauser that I could never get a decent pattern out of. Recrown the barrel, cleanings etc and it just would not hit POA. It probably needed some oversize bullets hand loaded. It had decent rifling but I never slugged it. If a barrel is bent it will kick or show some over gassed issues. |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 4:48:22 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Interesting about the washer idea. I know there is a very thin washer used to correct a slight overtime issue with the barrel. If you have a lathe though, you can set the barrel up however you want. |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 4:50:52 PM EDT
[#14]
Run a string from breech to muzzle and look thru the bore to see if it touches all the way down...rotate and check again..
remember you only need a few thousandths to throw you off... Here is one I bent back straight....shot fine groups afterwards with USGI M80 ball. 
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Posted: 1/4/2020 7:39:53 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yeah the washer could be made however thick it needs to be. Commonwealth (inch) FALs used washers to index the barrels, but metric FALs typically did not. If you have a lathe though, you can set the barrel up however you want. |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 7:40:38 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Run a string from breech to muzzle and look thru the bore to see if it touches all the way down...rotate and check again.. remember you only need a few thousandths to throw you off... Here is one I bent back straight....shot fine groups afterwards with USGI M80 ball. https://i.imgur.com/QqKYVUU.jpg |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 7:44:22 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yeah the washer could be made however thick it needs to be. Commonwealth (inch) FALs used washers to index the barrels, but metric FALs typically did not. If you have a lathe though, you can set the barrel up however you want. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Interesting about the washer idea. I know there is a very thin washer used to correct a slight overtime issue with the barrel. If you have a lathe though, you can set the barrel up however you want. |
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Posted: 1/4/2020 8:25:59 PM EDT
[#18]
From what I read on the fal files they were supposed to be timed because of the gas ports? This is mine when it is tightened down.
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Posted: 1/5/2020 4:33:08 AM EDT
[#19]
i went through this with my south african barrel. took me a while to figure out. when it was perfectly timed the gas tube would be so off that it dragged the gas piston causing failures even with a wide open setting.
since this barrel is serial the same as my lower, i contacted a well known fal smith to see if he could straighten it. he told me he does not do them because in the past he has only gotten so so results doing so and that buying a new barrel was better. mine is all taken apart and i am looking for a good reasonably priced barrel. kinda hard to find used fal barrels these days. i might just get a DSA barrel when i decide to fix it. |
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Posted: 1/5/2020 7:53:03 AM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
From what I read on the fal files they were supposed to be timed because of the gas ports? This is mine when it is tightened down. https://i.imgur.com/jIthUyil.jpg be at 6 o'clock. |
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Posted: 1/5/2020 9:02:52 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
i went through this with my south african barrel. took me a while to figure out. when it was perfectly timed the gas tube would be so off that it dragged the gas piston causing failures even with a wide open setting. since this barrel is serial the same as my lower, i contacted a well known fal smith to see if he could straighten it. he told me he does not do them because in the past he has only gotten so so results doing so and that buying a new barrel was better. mine is all taken apart and i am looking for a good reasonably priced barrel. kinda hard to find used fal barrels these days. i might just get a DSA barrel when i decide to fix it. |
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Posted: 1/5/2020 9:04:16 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Correct. There is also a notch on the bottom for the bayonet to lock into. The notch is supposed to be at 6 o'clock. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
From what I read on the fal files they were supposed to be timed because of the gas ports? This is mine when it is tightened down. https://i.imgur.com/jIthUyil.jpg be at 6 o'clock. |
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Posted: 1/5/2020 1:57:34 PM EDT
[#23]
I looked up the pin gauge and Pacific sells one for 45$.
Do you think a smaller one will tell me anything? They sell ones on eBay for under 10$ that are approx 2.5" long. |
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Posted: 1/5/2020 5:40:31 PM EDT
[#24]
if you know anyone with a lathe they cold put it between centers and rotate and see if its bent. i would be kinda concerned about putting a pin gauge down the bore in case it got stuck
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Posted: 1/5/2020 6:52:19 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
if you know anyone with a lathe they cold put it between centers and rotate and see if its bent. i would be kinda concerned about putting a pin gauge down the bore in case it got stuck |
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Posted: 1/7/2020 3:48:59 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I looked up the pin gauge and Pacific sells one for 45$. Do you think a smaller one will tell me anything? They sell ones on eBay for under 10$ that are approx 2.5" long. -If it otherwise shoots good groups, it's not that the barrel is shot out. (A shot out barrel will shoot large groups, not have groups suddenly veer off to one side/another). -It might be if the barrel is somehow screwed in crooked (as another poster said, via the washer between the receiver/barrel). -At this point, I would do the pin test and use the right tool for the job...… You want to figure this out, right????? And I wouldn't worry about getting the pin stuck, besides, that the WHOLE point to the pin adventure...….. if the pin binds, you know the barrel is bent. Using a shorter pin may not "show" a subtle bend that that a longer pin will.... At this point, if you want to figure this out, use the right tool for the job. One last easy thing to look at: The crown of the muzzle isn't @#$% up somehow is it? I mean to be that far off, the nick/chip whatever would be very noticeable...……. |
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Posted: 1/7/2020 4:17:00 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Here's my 2%: -If it otherwise shoots good groups, it's not that the barrel is shot out. (A shot out barrel will shoot large groups, not have groups suddenly veer off to one side/another). -It might be if the barrel is somehow screwed in crooked (as another poster said, via the washer between the receiver/barrel). -At this point, I would do the pin test and use the right tool for the job...… You want to figure this out, right????? And I wouldn't worry about getting the pin stuck, besides, that the WHOLE point to the pin adventure...….. if the pin binds, you know the barrel is bent. Using a shorter pin may not "show" a subtle bend that that a longer pin will.... At this point, if you want to figure this out, use the right tool for the job. One last easy thing to look at: The crown of the muzzle isn't @#$% up somehow is it? I mean to be that far off, the nick/chip whatever would be very noticeable...……. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I looked up the pin gauge and Pacific sells one for 45$. Do you think a smaller one will tell me anything? They sell ones on eBay for under 10$ that are approx 2.5" long. -If it otherwise shoots good groups, it's not that the barrel is shot out. (A shot out barrel will shoot large groups, not have groups suddenly veer off to one side/another). -It might be if the barrel is somehow screwed in crooked (as another poster said, via the washer between the receiver/barrel). -At this point, I would do the pin test and use the right tool for the job...… You want to figure this out, right????? And I wouldn't worry about getting the pin stuck, besides, that the WHOLE point to the pin adventure...….. if the pin binds, you know the barrel is bent. Using a shorter pin may not "show" a subtle bend that that a longer pin will.... At this point, if you want to figure this out, use the right tool for the job. One last easy thing to look at: The crown of the muzzle isn't @#$% up somehow is it? I mean to be that far off, the nick/chip whatever would be very noticeable...……. I do want to figure it out, it's my mission now. Look at the link I posted. There are pics of the crown in there. The washer is very thin, if I remember right it's a peel washer for an ar barrel nut. Do you think that would be enough to throw off the shot? |
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Posted: 1/7/2020 4:35:50 PM EDT
[#28]
To go back to that pin gauge idea. I can buy a 2in long pin gauge that will fit down the barrel for under $10. I just don't know if that is long enough to tell me if there is a bend in the barrel. I found a longer one that is $50.
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Posted: 1/7/2020 6:22:14 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
@TGH456E I do want to figure it out, it's my mission now. Look at the link I posted. There are pics of the crown in there. The washer is very thin, if I remember right it's a peel washer for an ar barrel nut. Do you think that would be enough to throw off the shot? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I looked up the pin gauge and Pacific sells one for 45$. Do you think a smaller one will tell me anything? They sell ones on eBay for under 10$ that are approx 2.5" long. -If it otherwise shoots good groups, it's not that the barrel is shot out. (A shot out barrel will shoot large groups, not have groups suddenly veer off to one side/another). -It might be if the barrel is somehow screwed in crooked (as another poster said, via the washer between the receiver/barrel). -At this point, I would do the pin test and use the right tool for the job...… You want to figure this out, right????? And I wouldn't worry about getting the pin stuck, besides, that the WHOLE point to the pin adventure...….. if the pin binds, you know the barrel is bent. Using a shorter pin may not "show" a subtle bend that that a longer pin will.... At this point, if you want to figure this out, use the right tool for the job. One last easy thing to look at: The crown of the muzzle isn't @#$% up somehow is it? I mean to be that far off, the nick/chip whatever would be very noticeable...……. I do want to figure it out, it's my mission now. Look at the link I posted. There are pics of the crown in there. The washer is very thin, if I remember right it's a peel washer for an ar barrel nut. Do you think that would be enough to throw off the shot? As others have pointed out, it's not the presence of the washer, but if it's some-how off set or raised on one side, so the barrel is then set crooked. |
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Posted: 1/7/2020 6:24:09 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
To go back to that pin gauge idea. I can buy a 2in long pin gauge that will fit down the barrel for under $10. I just don't know if that is long enough to tell me if there is a bend in the barrel. I found a longer one that is $50. |
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Posted: 1/7/2020 9:55:12 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well, looking at the pictures of your crown, It doesn't seem buggered. As others have pointed out, it's not the presence of the washer, but if it's some-how off set or raised on one side, so the barrel is then set crooked. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I looked up the pin gauge and Pacific sells one for 45$. Do you think a smaller one will tell me anything? They sell ones on eBay for under 10$ that are approx 2.5" long. -If it otherwise shoots good groups, it's not that the barrel is shot out. (A shot out barrel will shoot large groups, not have groups suddenly veer off to one side/another). -It might be if the barrel is somehow screwed in crooked (as another poster said, via the washer between the receiver/barrel). -At this point, I would do the pin test and use the right tool for the job...… You want to figure this out, right????? And I wouldn't worry about getting the pin stuck, besides, that the WHOLE point to the pin adventure...….. if the pin binds, you know the barrel is bent. Using a shorter pin may not "show" a subtle bend that that a longer pin will.... At this point, if you want to figure this out, use the right tool for the job. One last easy thing to look at: The crown of the muzzle isn't @#$% up somehow is it? I mean to be that far off, the nick/chip whatever would be very noticeable...……. I do want to figure it out, it's my mission now. Look at the link I posted. There are pics of the crown in there. The washer is very thin, if I remember right it's a peel washer for an ar barrel nut. Do you think that would be enough to throw off the shot? As others have pointed out, it's not the presence of the washer, but if it's some-how off set or raised on one side, so the barrel is then set crooked. |
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Posted: 1/8/2020 7:58:14 AM EDT
[#32]
My 2%, at this point, is to check the barrel straightness and then the shim...... FWIW.
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Posted: 1/8/2020 11:28:59 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ive repaired a bunch of FALs. Put the stripped receiver barrel combo in a vice. Lay a G.I. cleaning rod across the receiver flat. Put a G.I. cleaning rod through the gas block handguard bolt hole. Compare how the align. Also what receiver are you using? If the barrel is shout out deformed etc it should be printing all over the place. I searched around heres a pic of what im explaining to do. https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse2.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.0t85dt2tyUV94QrCWUZfogHaFj%26pid%3DApi&f=1 I think mine might be slightly off that I just built. Going to try this to confirm |
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