User Panel
Posted: 7/23/2022 3:05:18 PM EDT
Do they take $ from manufacturers to review their products?
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Why do you ask? Do you not find value in his videos? YouTube certainly doesn't pay the mortgage for the ad revenue, if any. Takes time and money to film and edit videos plus with the costs of ammo, runs about 200-300 rds of ammo per video produced.
He has been asked about this in some recent videos and now he will post that it is a paid sponsorship at the beginning of the video with the little title card that YouTube installs. Honestly couldn't care if he got paid or not, I find a value and entertainment the reviews. Same for a few other quality YouTubers out there. |
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I don’t watch his (or most) videos
It’s important to know if you got paid /free suppressor/ free case of ammo etc to give positive reviews When’s the last time a big channel said “wow this was a let down”? It’s just basic integrity |
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Quoted: I don’t watch his (or most) videos It’s important to know if you got paid /free suppressor/ free case of ammo etc to give positive reviews When’s the last time a big channel said “wow this was a let down”? It’s just basic integrity View Quote Though to be fair, modern firearms and accessories are generally pretty well made at this point. Basically personal preference vice good/bad. To use dead air as an example: a nomad ti doesn’t belong on a belt fed anymore than a sandman k belongs on a gun you want to be as quiet as physically possible. Both are great suppressors if used in roles that play to their strengths. |
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A lot of reviewers have had a rule that if they don't like something they won't review it. That doesn't mean everything gets a positive review. Some of the others will say negative things if they feel they are warranted. There are different styles of reviews and reviewers.
NTP reviewing the Sig Cross and exposing the trigger issue comes to mind, but even in that review I think NTP was saying he really liked the Cross rifle. |
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Quoted: A lot of reviewers have had a rule that if they don't like something they won't review it. That doesn't mean everything gets a positive review. Some of the others will say negative things if they feel they are warranted. There are different styles of reviews and reviewers. NTP reviewing the Sig Cross and exposing the trigger issue comes to mind, but even in that review I think NTP was saying he really liked the Cross rifle. View Quote I wonder if your opinion would be different if he'd never reviewed any of GA's products |
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Quoted: I wonder if your opinion would be different if he'd never reviewed any of GA's products View Quote He never reviewed any of our products for a long time. I never said a negative thing about NFA review channel that I can remember. He had talked to us a few times over the years. It is obvious that with social media and Youtube banning firearms channels from being paid for the ads their content allows youtube to show (demonetizing) [which by the way is horrifically unfair and amounts to discrimination] that somethings got to give and reviewers have to obtain revenue streams whether those are patreon- sponsors they advertise in the videos, ammo sponsors, or other means of being compensated. They are professional video content producers. Video production costs ten plus thousand dollars in equipment, software subscriptions, and the videos take time with more than one person, so they probably have to pay a person to run a camera or edit video. His productions probably take several days of work. That is beyond a hobby at that point. The youtube channel owners and partners shouldn't be expected to eat ramen noodles and live in a tent. Our company internal media department is staffed by professional full time employees. Their talents are similar to those of the professional firearms media community. What the big tech companies want, is to kill the firearms industry. When they demonitize the channels or shadowban the pages from subscribers, what they are trying to do is stop people from thinking about firearms in order to assist in the total ban of firearms. There was a ton of free content before Youtube demonitized the firearms channels. If anyone has been around long enough to remember that, you can probably see how effective the big tech companies have been. There was formerly a lot more successful Youtube firearms channels. |
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Quoted: He never reviewed any of our products for a long time. I never said a negative thing about NFA review channel that I can remember. He had talked to us a few times over the years. It is obvious that with social media and Youtube banning firearms channels from being paid for the ads their content allows youtube to show (demonetizing) [which by the way is horrifically unfair and amounts to discrimination] that somethings got to give and reviewers have to obtain revenue streams whether those are patreon- sponsors they advertise in the videos, ammo sponsors, or other means of being compensated. They are professional video content producers. Video production costs ten plus thousand dollars in equipment, software subscriptions, and the videos take time with more than one person, so they probably have to pay a person to run a camera or edit video. His productions probably take several days of work. That is beyond a hobby at that point. The youtube channel owners and partners shouldn't be expected to eat ramen noodles and live in a tent. Our company internal media department is staffed by professional full time employees. Their talents are similar to those of the professional firearms media community. What the big tech companies want, is to kill the firearms industry. When they demonitize the channels or shadowban the pages from subscribers, what they are trying to do is stop people from thinking about firearms in order to assist in the total ban of firearms. There was a ton of free content before Youtube demonitized the firearms channels. If anyone has been around long enough to remember that, you can probably see how effective the big tech companies have been. There was formerly a lot more successful Youtube firearms channels. View Quote Nobody was suggesting that YouTube firearms reviewers must live in poverty, and I think at this point everyone is well aware of their plight as well as our technological overlord's intentions as they apply to 2A. |
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Quoted: I don’t watch his (or most) videos It’s important to know if you got paid /free suppressor/ free case of ammo etc to give positive reviews When’s the last time a big channel said “wow this was a let down”? It’s just basic integrity View Quote Exactly. Many YouTube reviewers are paid shills to advertise products. (Or to be the sole buyer of imported firearms, positively review them, then offer them for sale at exorbitant prices) The end. |
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Quoted: Exactly. Many YouTube reviewers are paid shills to advertise products. (Or to be the sole buyer of imported firearms, positively review them, then offer them for sale at exorbitant prices) The end. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: I don’t watch his (or most) videos It’s important to know if you got paid /free suppressor/ free case of ammo etc to give positive reviews When’s the last time a big channel said “wow this was a let down”? It’s just basic integrity Exactly. Many YouTube reviewers are paid shills to advertise products. (Or to be the sole buyer of imported firearms, positively review them, then offer them for sale at exorbitant prices) The end. I understood that reference lol |
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Quoted: Exactly. Many YouTube reviewers are paid shills to advertise products. (Or to be the sole buyer of imported firearms, positively review them, then offer them for sale at exorbitant prices) The end. View Quote I think that's an unfair characterization of youtubers in the firearms industry segment. Obviously they can bow out behind the scenes without eviscerating products and keep their reputation as being nice people. That doesn't make them shills when they say a good thing about a good product. I'm sure they want to broadcast positivity, and avoid damaging relationships in their line of work. |
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Quoted: A lot of reviewers have had a rule that if they don't like something they won't review it. That doesn't mean everything gets a positive review. View Quote This is pretty standard for anything published in a magazine or "professional" outlet. Not just because some company is a potential advertiser, but that's going to have some influence, sure. Just for funsies, I've done some writing for magazines, blogs, etc.. The general rule of thumb is "if it's that bad, then send it back to the manufacturer with a private courtesy opinion of why it sucked, and give them the chance to make it right. "We'll review version II, if there's ever a fix" sort of note. But if that's their best/they don't care, then why publish a piece just about how bad something is?" Deafening silence is a comment and clue. ) Most reviewers cover items that they find interesting or like already. If something is intriguing, but in the end lets me down, I'm probably just going to drop the project, not go out of my way to slam someone's stuff. Especially if it's just personal preferences play a role. Now, if something's dangerous, it's fair game to BBQ. Ultimately, most authors and YouTubers probably are interested and enthusiastic about the gear they're reviewing, so you're going to see mostly positive reviews, unless they're going for clicks and likes for their edgy hit pieces. Whenever I hear someone in a gun shop say "I saw this great review on XXXX!", I'm like "Have you ever seen a BAD review?" Press-crickets on a product usually means no one wants it. But it should never surprise someone that reviews are done for money: it doesn't mean the author/vlogger is paid off to shill, it doesn't mean it's dishonest. It just means their channel is there to make the talking head guy or gal a popular star and get them money in their pocket. |
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This is definitely being asked because of the most recent review he released.
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Quoted: This is definitely being asked because of the most recent review he released. View Quote This? Attached File |
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Nope…I guess it was the email I got today from Griffin Armament saying to check out their and NFAreviews YouTube videos that got me confused.
Attached File |
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Quoted: Nope…I guess it was the email I got today from Griffin Armament saying to check out their and NFAreviews YouTube videos that got me confused. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/289111/C8F5F187-925A-4F59-9F55-441122681BC3_jpe-2463542.JPG View Quote Ahh The plot thickens |
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Quoted: Quoted: Nope…I guess it was the email I got today from Griffin Armament saying to check out their and NFAreviews YouTube videos that got me confused. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/289111/C8F5F187-925A-4F59-9F55-441122681BC3_jpe-2463542.JPG Ahh The plot thickens Idk… lost me at Griffin. But I don’t watch YouTube reviews much anyway. |
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Quoted: I think that's an unfair characterization of youtubers in the firearms industry segment. Obviously they can bow out behind the scenes without eviscerating products and keep their reputation as being nice people. That doesn't make them shills when they say a good thing about a good product. I'm sure they want to broadcast positivity, and avoid damaging relationships in their line of work. View Quote I don’t trust someone’s opinion unless they’ve got skin in the game. These T&E videos are all products that they are given for free - of course they are going to say it’s super awesome so they can keep getting cans to review or else their channel dies. There’s a huge conflict of interest to be impartial. It’s not that reviewers don’t shit on their products - it’s that they aren’t even neutral. “This can is awesome! I love it! The mount is solid and POI shift is repeatable!!” In reality, it should be more like “This is just another 5.56mm can. It’s loud. Lock up is solid but so are all cans since 2010’s 51T. Most of you won’t shoot enough to erode the blast baffle so it doesn’t matter what it’s made of.” It’s like Top Gear reviewing the Porsche GT3. Looked great on the show, but I’d hate to be one of the people who woke up to their $143k car burning down in the garage. |
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Why is it surprising that we newsletter a review of our new product to our customers who have signed up to our email list?
Or that we newsletter media content on our products to our customers on our newsletter? Every company does that. Nobody looks at a cgs video, dead air, or oss, or a rex, or rugged video on NFA review channel and posts anything about that. Quoted: Lock up is solid but so are all cans since 2010’s 51T. View Quote I get your point that there are a few good mounts on the market like Surefire for example. Most of the emphasis for better mounts were probably inspired by the customer feedback on the AAC mounts. The m4-2000 is a great can on an average to poor mount. Thats too bad as a great can should have a great mount. |
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I enjoy alot of the you tube content for what it is, cheap entertainment. Its not the only data point to rely on but it is a data point you can certainly use in your overall equation to determine if a potential purchase is worth it or not.
I love how some of those guys now will only buy and or recommend something that Jay has done through his pew science project. Especially on Reddit there are a few there that will definitely make it known that if Jay hasn't touched it they are not interested. Again I view his work as just another data point that I also find entertaining. Should Jay provide those services for free? I wouldn't. Neither would I post up Youtube content in a professional sense like NFA Review, Sage Dynamics, Alabama Arsenal etc............ without some way to re coup some of the costs. Adam definitely produces professional content. For anyone who hasn't done video work it can be very taxing. What you see in a 30 min video probably has been whittled down from multiple hours of raw video and then the multiple hours of time it takes editing that raw video. It can be a full time job if you let it be one. |
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I used to attempt to do suppressor reviews/comparisons, until I got a phone call from one of the manufacturers telling me they would end our relationship if I kept doing that. Sucks, but understandable.
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Quoted: I enjoy alot of the you tube content for what it is, cheap entertainment. Its not the only data point to rely on but it is a data point you can certainly use in your overall equation to determine if a potential purchase is worth it or not. I love how some of those guys now will only buy and or recommend something that Jay has done through his pew science project. Especially on Reddit there are a few there that will definitely make it known that if Jay hasn't touched it they are not interested. Again I view his work as just another data point that I also find entertaining. Should Jay provide those services for free? I wouldn't. Neither would I post up Youtube content in a professional sense like NFA Review, Sage Dynamics, Alabama Arsenal etc............ without some way to re coup some of the costs. Adam definitely produces professional content. For anyone who hasn't done video work it can be very taxing. What you see in a 30 min video probably has been whittled down from multiple hours of raw video and then the multiple hours of time it takes editing that raw video. It can be a full time job if you let it be one. View Quote This. For people just getting into the suppressor game like I was, Pew Science was great. Because it at least gave you SOMETHING. And Jay stays pretty damn neutral in it all. The viewer just needs to watch for any bias and actually listen to others who are critical to the reviewer. Take in all the information and be open minded. I think so many people don't like "reviews" because a product they already purchased may get a critical review, and it's a tough pill to swallow sometimes |
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Quoted: This. For people just getting into the suppressor game like I was, Pew Science was great. Because it at least gave you SOMETHING. And Jay stays pretty damn neutral in it all. View Quote Why are folks saying it is a conflict of interest for some, but it is not for others? I think these guys should be paid for their work. Who would want to work for free? |
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Quoted: I enjoy alot of the you tube content for what it is, cheap entertainment. Its not the only data point to rely on but it is a data point you can certainly use in your overall equation to determine if a potential purchase is worth it or not. I love how some of those guys now will only buy and or recommend something that Jay has done through his pew science project. Especially on Reddit there are a few there that will definitely make it known that if Jay hasn't touched it they are not interested. Again I view his work as just another data point that I also find entertaining. Should Jay provide those services for free? I wouldn't. Neither would I post up Youtube content in a professional sense like NFA Review, Sage Dynamics, Alabama Arsenal etc............ without some way to re coup some of the costs. Adam definitely produces professional content. For anyone who hasn't done video work it can be very taxing. What you see in a 30 min video probably has been whittled down from multiple hours of raw video and then the multiple hours of time it takes editing that raw video. It can be a full time job if you let it be one. View Quote Anyone who has owned or shot enough silencers can find value in products that aren’t on reviewer’s radar or for uses that don’t overlap with a particular, narrow use or test case. Not everyone’s utility, concerns, or sensitivity is the same. Some of my favorite or most useful suppressors aren’t the quietest, or strongest, or easiest to clean, or popular, big sellers, or the latest. It’s hard for many layman to grasp but in any non-unicorn design where figures of merit are in conflict and in need of balancing or trading off, local (observed in isolation) optima don’t optimize a total system. Understanding the user is the intangible ingredient where satisfaction is best met and content creators necessarily want to appeal to the broadest audience so they avoid characterizations that would provide actual useful focus to some, and bias to others. Tech forums should provide useful two way discourse if meaningful questions are explored. However, most often the potential in-depth conversations get drowned out by the emotional sway of diversion towards consensus. It’s all entertaining and a good way to keep abreast of trends and offerings. But the signal to noise ratio is pretty poor on all of them lest they be judged for actually being discerning and making balanced judgements and conclusions. |
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Quoted: Isn't Jay paid for his reviews too? Why are folks saying it is a conflict of interest for some, but it is not for others? I think these guys should be paid for their work. Who would want to work for free? View Quote Who has a problem with them getting paid? Folks should just not listen to anything they say. Mr Guns and Gear “reviewed” a Surefire Vampire light and didn’t even test it with NV. I mean how can you do a “review” of something and ignore 50% of the functionality? It’s best to just buy the cans you want to try out. If they don’t work well they can go to the bottom of the safe with all the 18T and 51T and aluminum baffled 22 cans of yesteryear. |
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Quoted: Isn't Jay paid for his reviews too? Why are folks saying it is a conflict of interest for some, but it is not for others? I think these guys should be paid for their work. Who would want to work for free? View Quote You essentially pay for a bit more content. It's essentially a thank you/donation. Which, given the info and reviews he does, is more than worth it. I would draw the line at taking money from manufacturers to do a review. Which he does not. His money comes from viewers. I can see where bias would come in if Dead Air, OSS, etc went to Jay and said "could you review this new can for us? Here's $10k to do so." Even then, any bias would become evident and he'd lose credibility fast. He's doing it right. Don't recommend/push cans. Let the reviews speak for themselves. And don't take money from the manufacturers yoy are reviewing. |
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I think it's important to know if a company is sending something with the understanding "hey you give us a good review" that's bull. If your product can't stand a little bit of honest shake down you deserve it. Build something better. Watch the "military arms channel" and PSA AKV review, it's a hot mess, and MAC ends up giving them a lonudry list of things to fix... Gave it an honest shake down. And guess what,? They fix it and it works great!
I don't know enough about NFA REVIEW CHANNEL to know if they are open or closed with information like this. I watch the channels that have full disclosure. Like Grand thumb and the like. |
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Quoted: Isn't Jay paid for his reviews too? Why are folks saying it is a conflict of interest for some, but it is not for others? I think these guys should be paid for their work. Who would want to work for free? View Quote I agree no one will work for free, but your words mean less to me if you are a paid employee of XYZ company if your spouting the praise of XYZ products. Just tell me your relationship and say what you will. Its not that your getting paid , it's if your taking it under the table and acting like your not. As far as the NFA REVIEW CHANNEL, i have not watched enough of Jays videos to know much, I do know they are interesting and valuable. |
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Quoted: I used to attempt to do suppressor reviews/comparisons, until I got a phone call from one of the manufacturers telling me they would end our relationship if I kept doing that. Sucks, but understandable. View Quote That’s interesting to read. Maybe that was what happened to the awesome Suppressed Nation comparison videos. Seemed like not long after they got an upgraded sound meter, the reviews stopped, which doesn’t make much sense given the expense of a meter. Always suspected it was because the results didn’t fit the sales narrative pushed by one large manufacturer in particular. |
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Quoted: That’s interesting to read. Maybe that was what happened to the awesome Suppressed Nation comparison videos. Seemed like not long after they got an upgraded sound meter, the reviews stopped, which doesn’t make much sense given the expense of a meter. Always suspected it was because the results didn’t fit the sales narrative pushed by one large manufacturer in particular. View Quote Which is quite sad as I enjoyed their content. |
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He’s done plenty to make nfa and specifically suppressor ownership more widely known and is one of the first places to hear about releases of new products in a somewhat more esoteric corner of the industry.
Sounds like cheap criticism to me to suggest he’s a shill. |
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I don’t think he affords a ram trx on his firefighter salary.
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Quoted: Isn't Jay paid for his reviews too? Why are folks saying it is a conflict of interest for some, but it is not for others? View Quote For me, the difference between Pew Science and YT reviewers is Jay/PS conducts objective, standardized testing. Pew Science is a test lab, not a YouTube channel (it doesn’t have one). His entire testing methodology is published on pewscience.com, and IMO isn’t vulnerable to much bias, if at all. He doesn’t give subjective opinions in his “reviews” because they’re simply presentations of the results taken and analyzed by PewSoft, the custom software he designed for this endeavor. Some of the reviews done by Pew Science are contracted (i.e. he was paid by a company to conduct specific tests, and the hiring company decides whether they want the test(s) publicized), and every review of that ilk has a note right at the beginning letting the reader know. And like with YouTubers, I think people doing work should be paid. The problems arise when a YouTuber receives a threat from a manufacturer along the lines of “say anything negative and we’re not going to work with you again.” With Pew Science, I just don’t believe Jay cares if that’s a company’s demeanor. We already know there are several silencer companies who are antagonistic or even outright hostile to him because now each of them can’t all claim with a straight face that their designs are simultaneously the “quietest, lightest, heaviest duty, lowest back pressure” cans ever made. There are also plenty of Pew Science reviews that are not contracted and are instead paid with Pew Science member funds. Edit - someone above said Pew Science is only member/donation funded. That is incorrect. He offers paid professional testing services to silencer manufacturers. |
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Really, it doesn't matter.
If you are waiting for some reviewer on Youtube or in a magazine, or even Pew Science, to tell you it's OK to buy something, then whether they are getting paid or not for the review isn't the problem. Their opinion isn't important. It's just a personal opinion, and may not agree with yours if you were there using the product. I often disagree with reviewer's opinions on certain aspects of products. That doesn't make me right and them wrong or vice versa. We just have different wants, needs, and perspective. It's the details they are revealing in the review that are worth watching. You get to see the product up close. They show you what's in the box. Maybe they use aftermarket attachments. Maybe they meter a suppressor. After you watch a bunch of videos (or read reviews), you get a handle on whether the reviewer is genuine or not, especially after watching some of their reviews on products you already own. How they are paid is irrelevant. Either they are giving us an honest demonstration of a product or they are not. |
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Quoted: Edit - someone above said Pew Science is only member/donation funded. That is incorrect. He offers paid professional testing services to silencer manufacturers. View Quote Opinions are worthless, because they might not reflect your needs, wants and experience. Only facts are important. The only real question is, are the facts being obfuscated or manipulated? The only way to verify that is compare multiple sources. |
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Quoted: Their opinion isn't important. It's just a personal opinion ... Either they are giving us an honest demonstration of a product or they are not. View Quote For YouTubers, I wholeheartedly agree. But Pew Science doesn't give opinions. Those are test results. And that's why I, and many others, are glad to have Jay doing what he's doing. YouTubers are absolutely capable of giving their honest opinion, but money complicates that. My personal opinion is that Jay's results don't have the same vulnerability. If they did, I'd think that by now some people would have come out to dispute his test results saying their hearing experience doesn't match. I have yet to see that. |
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Quoted: Which is quite sad as I enjoyed their content. View Quote Come to think of it, a similar thing may have happened with Silencer Shop. They got a BK Pulse and did a small flurry of metering videos about a year ago, and then the metering videos seemingly stopped. Wonder if that’s also why the Otter_dump IG account of the 4.5” full auto testing suddenly went private midway through a delayed unveil of the test results. |
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Quoted: For YouTubers, I wholeheartedly agree. But Pew Science doesn't give opinions. Those are test results. And that's why I, and many others, are glad to have Jay doing what he's doing. YouTubers are absolutely capable of giving their honest opinion, but money complicates that. My personal opinion is that Jay's results don't have the same vulnerability. If they did, I'd think that by now some people would have come out to dispute his test results saying their hearing experience doesn't match. I have yet to see that. View Quote But Jay actually does give his "PEW Science Subjective Opinion" at the summation of the reviews. Though it is more of an analysis of the data and his experience with handling the suppressor, mount, end caps, etc. |
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I think, at this stage in the suppressor game, manufacturers need to just come together, hash out what they want to see/how they want suppressors tested, and make it known that someone like Jay at Pew Science the gold standard of reviewing/testing.
Every manufacturer throw out what they want to see and don't want to see in testing criteria. That way, when all is said and done, no whining when a suppressor doesn't rate well. Or when a company complains about how it was tested, 99% of other companies can call B.S. |
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Quoted: I think, at this stage in the suppressor game, manufacturers need to just come together, hash out what they want to see/how they want suppressors tested, and make it known that someone like Jay at Pew Science the gold standard of reviewing/testing. Every manufacturer throw out what they want to see and don't want to see in testing criteria. That way, when all is said and done, no whining when a suppressor doesn't rate well. Or when a company complains about how it was tested, 99% of other companies can call B.S. View Quote That would be nice but I don't see it ever happening. It would probably go over about as well as dealers posting comparisons. I've enjoyed watching NFA Review videos for quite a whole, mostly just for entertainment. A lot of work goes into those and I'm sure he does just fine off of them, as he should since they are advertisements of sorts. |
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Quoted: Why is it surprising that we newsletter a review of our new product to our customers who have signed up to our email list? View Quote Because this is ARFCOM and everything is either offensive, a conspiracy or unscrupulous unless maybe if you're talking about the pet brand of the month (which you guy are certainly not! ) I mean really, why would a person who puts in countless hours and money into producing quality online reviews actually make any money from that effort? They should do it out of the kindness of the hearts to help the online community right? And if they are making money then obviously nothing they say can be trusted, even the things they show you in living HD color are probably faked or staged. Trust no one. Question everything!!! |
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Quoted: I think, at this stage in the suppressor game, manufacturers need to just come together, hash out what they want to see/how they want suppressors tested, and make it known that someone like Jay at Pew Science the gold standard of reviewing/testing. Every manufacturer throw out what they want to see and don't want to see in testing criteria. That way, when all is said and done, no whining when a suppressor doesn't rate well. Or when a company complains about how it was tested, 99% of other companies can call B.S. View Quote I've been able to be present in person or online at several sort of all hands industry meetings on sound testing. The purpose is generally that someone has an idea of how the product should be tested and wants everyone else to adopt their method. Our adoption of the unchanging muzzle reference position was promoted by a Nato sound testing standards meeting at SHOT show in like 2014. Silencer Co had funded a University of Florida scientific research project through the ASA conducted by acoustic scientists who argued for the unchanging muzzle ref pos. When we bought our Pulse system I thought about how we wanted to test moving forward and we adopted B&K's proposed headband for the ear mics, albeit re-arranged on tac 6S ear protectors, because the B&K headband looks really lame. We are using the B&K microphone mounts provided in the Pulse kit for firearms measurement. The University of Florida scientists had made a convincing argument for the unchanged reference position. So we adopted that. Few people agree to the standards proposed in the meetings, and relatively little happens. People mentioned Pew specifically in the most recent meetings and the industry reservation has been as such, the std isn't published so it essentially doesn't publicly exist, and the equipment is also publicly unknown. That makes it harder than any argument to accept because the conditions being accepted aren't known. Generally speaking, intelligent people won't accept anything that isn't completely specified and understood, as well as experienced, and agreed with. Those are a lot of conditions, and that's probably why the consensus has never been reached in any of these meetings. I didn't speak in the meeting, because I see the inevitable impasse of these types of meetings- so I was there to listen to the opinions of other passionate people in the suppressor and metrology industries. My personal opinion is that the industry doesn't need a new standard, because the existing methods are capable of telling people what they need to know in the most easily consumable way possible. Nothing is perfect. People are unlikely to agree. I'm a little interested in the AHAAH, but I have only the time that life affords me to look into it. |
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Literally the only guntuber I don't take with a huge grain of salt is hoplopheil. I agree with his gear philosophy and he has no problem shitting all over bad gear.
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Quoted: Literally the only guntuber I don't take with a huge grain of salt is hoplopheil. I agree with his gear philosophy and he has no problem shitting all over bad gear. View Quote I would rather watch a turtle take a shit than watch Hop do another boring ass, no personality and no excitement review or interview. Dude has no business being in front of a camera. |
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Quoted: People mentioned Pew specifically in the most recent meetings and the industry reservation has been as such, the std isn't published so it essentially doesn't publicly exist, and the equipment is also publicly unknown. That makes it harder than any argument to accept because the conditions being accepted aren't known. View Quote I’m not an engineer or an audiologist, but I feel like the way Jay has laid out the Silencer Sound Standard is already pretty transparent. What would you need to see to feel comfortable accepting it? More peer review and acceptance by people with the credentials to make them experts in the field? Thus far, has there has been a challenge or dispute from a neutral third party? Btw, I saw Griffin became the most recent corporate member of Pew Science. Are you guys going to contract any testing? Would love to see it. |
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A test standard is replicable by competent practitioners in a field by following a complete published test method with reference/calibration benchmarks, acceptable equipment, data analysis procedures, sources of error and deviation, etc. There’s an ASTM Style Guide that gives an accepted framework for what professional test standards entail. Viewed operationally an adopted standard would have multiple practitioners with agreement in approach and results. Right now it appears the most energetic practitioners are largely siloed and not unified. That’s usually rectified by big money.
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