What's the consensus on a Lage uppered M11/9 vs a full size RR Uzi for a transferable sub gun?

I know the Uzis are going to run a few $k more than the M11/9s, but I'm looking for thoughts on value, shootability etc.

The M11/9s upraised with Lage uppers seem like really nice setups, but at $8500+ $800 or so for the Lage upper, and Uzis selling for $13-14k, it's temping not to spend the extra money and go with an Uzi.

How does the Uzi compare to the upgraded M11/9s?

Mini Uzis are at the top of my list for subguns, but I don't see the additional money that they are going for worth it.

I've never owned an Uzi but I am an M11 owner.

The aftermarket support and choices for the M11 is amazing. A 5.56 AR style upper is in the works too that will take STANAG mags too. You can't go wrong with an M11.

That being said, the Uzi is great gun with great history and a certain cool factor that an M11 just doesn't have. Do your research though, there are different variations and conversions out there as I understand it.

I prefer the M11 (Lage equipped) to the Uzi. I know you'll hear people declare their love for the Uzi but I just don't like the full sized ones. Personally I find them clunky and uncomfortable to shoot but I do enjoy the mini Uzi, weird huh.

The M11 Lage setup is almost, repeat almost, as smooth as the MP5. It's amazing how the Lage MAX-11 upper transforms the M11. On the other hand the MAC10 with a Lage upper was meh.

Unless you’ve always had a thing for Uzis, I think a Lage M11 is an easy call for the reasons above.

That said, the classic MG advice still applies: buy what you really want, and buy it yesterday.

UZI is the better weapon no question, price not being a concern. However UZI's have gone way up in price and the MAC's are still affordable for most. Toss on a Lage upper and you have a poor mans UZI. Great for a beginner looking to get into the full-auto game. Have to start somewhere. Or if you can find a Sterling SMG I would get those, great gun also, but probably closer to UZI prices, maybe a little cheaper though. But I'm a big UZI fan as well. The Mini UZI is a fun buzz gun, but the rate of fire is very high. Like a stock MAC-10 or M11/9 before the Lage upper.

A registered receiver uzi can be converted between 22, 9mm and 45 semi easy. The m11/9 will be 9mm and 22lr for the most part. The uzi is "cooler" but personally I'd go for the m11/9.

Their has been a lot more work modernizing the m11 guns. You have the lage uppers and the coffee freak heavy bolts and a bunch of good stock options. A side charging conventional upper(or lage upper) gives you in my mind better optics mounting options although I do know you have a few for the uzi that should be good. I will say uzi mags are generally cheaper.

The lage 5.56 upper will be expensive but looks interesting. I personally have a m-10 and if he manages to make them for it I'll prob pick on up just to have even though I have a m16(and soon a hk33k).

Overall I think the macs are some of the best options for machineguns if you want a shooter. Parts are available at a reasonable price, you have multiple companies that have been working on upgrades, and they are still on the low end price wise. When price doesn't matter as much the m16/hk sear is still the best options.

Excellent responses so far. I love the UZI. It is iconic. Spare parts are (for now) widely available, as are mags. The full-size UZI becomes very smooth with the addition of a longer buffer to increase ROF. Barrel changes are stupid simple. And the UZI suppresses exceptionally well. If you want an iconic firearm with historic significance, the UZI is for you.

With Lage’s excellent uppers, the MACs have come into a class all their own as shooters. If you are looking for a versatile entry SMG, the Lage equipped M11/9 is simply unbeatable. They are smooth shooting, controllable, with easy optic mounting, and they suppress well. As smooth as an mp5, I don’t agree with that though they are smooth.

You can literally pick up a Lage equipped m11/9 and a second MAC for the price of a full-size Uzi. I would buy two MACs. Keep one as a hedge against future rises in MG prices; you can trade or sell the second to fund your next MG. I believe MACs have one of highest potential rate of increase in value as compared to other MGs because they are still affordable. As 5.56 uppers and other innovations come to market, they will climb in price at a faster rate.

I would never trade my UZI for two MACs, but if I were starting today I would likely buy a Lage equipped MAC and apply the savings towards another MG.

Both are great subguns and parts are plentiful for both. If you want a shooter to customize to your liking then M11/9 would be the better choice. The CFW bolt should not be overlooked either, it's another game changer to the m11/9 world.

Uzi's parts and mags are super cheap and affordable. You can get mags for $10 and parts kits for $150. They are very robust and should last you lifetime and then some. I think it's worth noting that there are several different transferable Uzi's on the market and I think it's worth a extra thousand or two to get a Vector or IMI.

A M11/9 with Lage upper and other goodies will run you roughly 9.5K and a good Uzi will run you 14-15k. It's closer to 5k difference between the two setups. It's a tough choice between the two. It's true afrfcom fashion the only real answer is get both.

Where are you located in SC.  I might can arrange an opportunity for you to shoot them both, then you can decide.  I personally prefer the Lage/M-11.  I'm supprised Clicker didn't try to set you up .

FYI, I'm in the low country, but occasionally move around throughout the state

I live in Spartanburg, but get down to the coast quite a bit to Edisto.  I'd love to try out both options.  I can bring ammo...

ETA: I can bring my transferable FNC as well, its the only MG I currently own.

Dang HarperJt I didn't want to be too forward. I'm in if you're game, good excuse to bring out the 10mm. Might be possible to shoot at the pond as it's not too far from Edisto.

The M11 is probably more practical with the aftermarket support, but I'd have a hard time turning down a full sized Uzi.

I own both & since someone mentioned the Sterling, I own one of those also.

It all depends upon what you plan to do with the gun.

The UZI has a lot of "cool factor" but not much shootability.  It is a clunky handling gun.  I am glad to read that I am not the only one that thinks this.  Most can't or don't look past the cool factor & go on about how great it is.  The UZI is reliable & has lots of cheap & available parts.  But it does not handle as well as it looks.

The M11/9  can be made into a great shooter.  If you want to actually shoot at targets in bursts or shoot in some type of competition.  You will not go wrong with the MAC.  If you like to tinker, again, get the MAC.  I have a heavy bolt, handmade fiberglass stock & an optic on mine.  In stock form I was ready to sell after I shot it for the first time.  Now it one of my favorites.

But if you want a real smooth shooting, absolutely enjoyable SMG, the Sterling cannot be beat.  But it is what it is.  There is not much you can do to one as far as modifications go.  Just shoot it & enjoy it.

Are you going to just do mag dumps into a dirt berm?  Get the cheapest gun you can find.  As long as it is automatic & it works, you will be happy regardless of the type.

Are you looking for a lot of cool factor for your friends to admire?  Get the UZI.

The MAC is probably the best bet for you.

As mentioned by others, it comes down to what you want to do with it and how much you want to spend. I debated for a long time between the Uzi and the Sterling. As noted, the Sterling is so much smoother. I ended up getting the Uzi, and have been happy with it.

For competitions, I go back and forth between the Uzi and the M11/9. I bought the M11 back in the day for subgun matches, and immediately did the TASK slowfire conversion to it. Later came the various Lage uppers. I've done well with any of the setups.

There are the rifle-caliber uppers out there now, and the Lage upper on the horizon. I find it somewhat ironic in that I always wanted an M16, but would likely shoot it in 9mm 95% of the time.



As for being able to customize the Uzi, besides the standard open bolt 9mm, I have setups in .22, .357 Sig, .40S&W, .45 ACP, and closed bolt 9mm. But I shoot it almost exclusively in 9mm open bolt.

If you want to run suppressed, the Uzi seems quieter to me with any can used. Also, the M11 tends to blow a lot of gas in the face when running suppressed, where I've never had an issue with the Uzi in this regard.

If I had neither and was shopping for one, I would buy the M11/9 with Lage upper(s). The two feel pretty similar. The TASK setup is smoother, but it seems I'm constantly having to tinker with that one to keep it running right.

I occasionally consider selling the Uzi and Reising and buying a converted AR15 instead. And then I usually remind myself to be happy with what I already have.

Let Clicker or myself know the next time you're going to Edisto and maybe we can make something happen.

Hope to see you soon,
Jeff

Sounds good. My family has a house down there so I get there quite a bit this time of year. I'll shoot you a PM a few weeks ahead of when I know I'll be down there next.

I look forward to it!

Many have posted what I think as far as what do you want from the Uzi or M11/NINE, so I won't repeat what others have said.  I think this has been eluded to in several posts but I wish to clarify.  It is my understanding that there is around 5,000 Uzis in the NFA Registry.  There are over 17,000 M11/NINE RRs in the Registry.  Personally I think the MAC style series of RR has reached critical mass of market value to make innovations possible to be financially viable.  When a M11/NINE had a market value was $2,500 no one would pay $3,000 for a rifle caliber conversion.  They would save a couple thousand more and buy an off brand RR M16.

Now with a MAC style RR going for $6,500 to $7,500 for the basic gun and a off brand M16 at $18,000 or $19,000 makes spending $3,000 on a rifle caliber conversion viable.  I can see that with a $3,000 price tag, I would think that would bring other possible products to this market.  With the Uzi at $12,000 or $14,000 and only 5,000 possible buyers, that would make innovation for the Uzi more limited.

Scott

Are you sure only 5,000 Uzi's?

There were 3,318 vector Uzi's alone, per small arms review article.

Well, I may be a little different than some, but I sold a couple of my SWD M11, as I almost never shot them.  I kept a couple Uzi's.  Personally I really enjoy the Uzi.

Don't care about centerfire Lage conversions as I've got M16's or sears.

Now I bought stuff back in the 80 & 90's when stuff was dirt cheap, compared to now.   If I had to buy my collection now?  Well I wouldn't have nearly as much.

Back to OP, I prefer the Uzi.

What's the consensus on a Lage uppered M11/9 vs a full size RR Uzi for a transferable sub gun?
Both are good and enjoyable. Can't go wrong with either for 9mm

I know the Uzis are going to run a few $k more than the M11/9s, but I'm looking for thoughts on value, shootability etc.
For value and shootability, I think the Lage upper M11/9 wins because it is cheaper and more options on accessories.

The M11/9s upraised with Lage uppers seem like really nice setups, but at $8500+ $800 or so for the Lage upper, and Uzis selling for $13-14k, it's temping not to spend the extra money and go with an Uzi.
Did you mean to say not spend the extra money and go with the Lage upper M11/9?

How does the Uzi compare to the upgraded M11/9s?
The Uzi mags are easy to load (double stack) cheap and plentiful.
Easy barrel change and clean up.
Suppresses well.
Heavier gun absorbs recoil well. Can feel a little choppy because of heavy bolt. Wood stock feels better than metal stock for Uzi. Metal stock looks cooler.
Registered Receiver Uzi can shoot 45acp. The M11 can't presently (Unless Mr. Lage creates a 45acp upper for the M11 to take GG mags like the Suomi drum).
The Uzi has military history behind it.

Mini Uzis are at the top of my list for subguns, but I don't see the additional money that they are going for worth it.
Mini Uzis cost more and the rate of fire is higher than the full sized Uzi. Plus you better love the metal stock on the Mini Uzi.

That is just a # I have heard but it sounds about right to me.  Yes, Vector was responsible for a lot of the transferable Uzis, but I know of no other big volume manufacturer of transferable Uzis.  Yes there were some SOTs and some Form 1s were done, but no big quantities.  Also the style of receiver makes conversions easier to do.  The "lower receiver style" of the M11/NINE receiver would make conversions for that style of receiver much easier to do.

Certainly if you have a M16 and/or a HK sear, you have a top quality subgun conversion available.  So the options that a MAC style RR wouldn't be that important.  But I think for someone new to machineguns, especially on a budget, a MAC style RR would tend to have more appeal.  YMMV.

Scott

I understand the number of transferable Uzis to be in 8,000+ range, including the registered bolts and a handful of registered sears.  The approximately 4,000 Group Industries assembled plus Vector assembled GI units are about half of the total.  As converting a semi Uzi to a machine gun involved little more than removing the bolt blocking bar in the eyes of the BATF, a lot of semis were converted, some more "complete to full auto spec" than others when first done.  Off the top of my head, I thought JA Ciener and Hard Times Armory both did quite a few Uzi conversions.

MHO, YMMV, etc.