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Posted: 7/23/2018 8:12:29 PM EDT
I've submitted hundreds of form 4s and never have I had to submit with the persons DOB. Now there asking to have thier DOBs so they can determine if they can posses a suppressor. Well I know I dont have to submit their DOB, but might do so just to satisfy them.
Another thing is the second paragraph. Please see picture. Can some decipher what they are asking. Like I said I've submitted hundreds of form 4s and have always put "law Enforcement Official." Maybe someone with more experience can chime in and give me a few pointers.  Attached File |
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Posted: 7/23/2018 8:18:20 PM EDT
[#1]
I recommend stop sending the CLEO portion to the locals, send it to the state level CLEO. As for doing what they ask, you are under no legal obligation to do so.
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Posted: 7/23/2018 8:22:52 PM EDT
[#2]
Ok great thanks!! Dumb question, but who would the CLEO be of a state??
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Posted: 7/23/2018 8:34:38 PM EDT
[#3]
Seems like they want you to identify the CLEO as "County Sheriff rather than as "Law Enforcement Official." That strikes me as a reasonable request.
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Posted: 7/23/2018 8:37:30 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ok great thanks!! Dumb question, but who would the CLEO be of a state?? |
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Posted: 7/23/2018 8:37:38 PM EDT
[#5]
Yes if I continue to send to them, I will change the wording.
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Posted: 7/23/2018 8:44:51 PM EDT
[#6]
Just for my edification, the CLEO no longer has a "sign off" anymore on Form 4s, right? It's basically just a notification to them now?
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Posted: 7/23/2018 8:50:15 PM EDT
[#7]
Name/DOB is the standard way to run people through NCIC to check their background. Not unreasonable, and you will have that information on everyone on their 4473, which they already submit. Not overreaching.
They are asking you to title them appropriately, so "XYZ County Sheriff" |
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Posted: 7/23/2018 8:50:17 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Just for my edification, the CLEO no longer has a "sign off" anymore on Form 4s, right? It's basically just a notification to them now? |
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Posted: 7/23/2018 8:50:56 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Just for my edification, the CLEO no longer has a "sign off" anymore on Form 4s, right? It's basically just a notification to them now? |
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Posted: 7/23/2018 8:53:30 PM EDT
[#10]
Correct, since 41f all I have to do is submit paperwork to CLEO.
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Posted: 7/23/2018 9:00:05 PM EDT
[#11]
Father/son at the same residence. And if it's me, there's all sorts if potential fun - my son is the third, and we share a birthday.
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Posted: 7/23/2018 9:00:08 PM EDT
[#12]
I’m curious who they think is being delayed? Their own file clerk is the only one I cane think of. It certainly isn’t the processing of the form 4.
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Posted: 7/23/2018 9:03:22 PM EDT
[#13]
I would send them back a copy of the applicable part of 41f.
Your form 4 isn’t delayed haha. |
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Posted: 7/23/2018 9:18:28 PM EDT
[#14]
I would stop sending it to them, and instead submit to:
Travis Hampton, Superintendent
Oregon State Police 3565 Trelstad Avenue SE Salem, OR 97317 |
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Posted: 7/23/2018 9:32:47 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I recommend stop sending the CLEO portion to the locals, send it to the state level CLEO. As for doing what they ask, you are under no legal obligation to do so. Notify Chief of State Police, not the local yokel... |
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Posted: 7/23/2018 9:49:10 PM EDT
[#16]
We have had questions about the title/authority of the person who signed off on Form 4's (back when we had to do it) from NFA branch which no doubt delayed the transfer briefly.
As far as filing them, we don't file shit. Form 1, Form 4's, C&R, FFL applications, multiple handgun purchases etc...every one of those go straight to the shredder. If someone wants to know, they can ask the Feds, not us. We don't collect data on "citizens firearms" period. |
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Posted: 7/23/2018 9:58:53 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
We have had questions about the title/authority of the person who signed off on Form 4's (back when we had to do it) from NFA branch which no doubt delayed the transfer briefly. As far as filing them, we don't file shit. Form 1, Form 4's, C&R, FFL applications, multiple handgun purchases etc...every one of those go straight to the shredder. If someone wants to know, they can ask the Feds, not us. We don't collect data on "citizens firearms" period. Just clarifying. |
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Posted: 7/23/2018 10:00:43 PM EDT
[#18]
Yes, I am not an FFL, Command Staff at a Sheriff's Office....
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Posted: 7/23/2018 10:37:31 PM EDT
[#19]
I guess I’m confused. Do they still think they have to sign off on something or the processing of the form can be delayed?
From what I understand, they don’t need to conduct a review at all and even if they want to, that “review” isn’t going to have any effect on the ATF processing the Form 1/4, right? I guess I’m just not seeing what they think they’re accomplishing by doing anything with your notification other than filing it or shredding it. |
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Posted: 7/24/2018 12:13:47 AM EDT
[#20]
I think the Sheriff or one of his command staff could call the ATF and advise them of what is taking place. As in I am not providing the required info. I have no idea what the ATF would say to the Sheriff if they did call.
I've got a call into the ATF lady who does my compliance checks. I will see what she has to say. Thanks for all the help guys. |
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Posted: 7/24/2018 12:21:05 AM EDT
[#21]
The ATF would probably ask the sheriff's office how they could possibly know that, while also taking them school on how things work post-41F.
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Posted: 7/24/2018 1:09:06 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think the Sheriff or one of his command staff could call the ATF and advise them of what is taking place. As in I am not providing the required info. I have no idea what the ATF would say to the Sheriff if they did call. I've got a call into the ATF lady who does my compliance checks. I will see what she has to say. Thanks for all the help guys. |
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Posted: 7/24/2018 7:30:14 AM EDT
[#23]
As long as the forms are all filled out completely...i.e.........Form 4 and Responsible person questionnaire, then what could the CLEO complain about to the ATF? You are following the rules and complying with ATF regulations. I have my customers do the CLEO dropoff, I do not handle that portion. I print out all the forms, and fill out my appropriate info, then they are responsible for the Form 4 and RPQ and CLEO dropoff as well as mailing the forms to the ATF.
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Posted: 7/24/2018 7:44:23 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I recommend stop sending the CLEO portion to the locals, send it to the state level CLEO. As for doing what they ask, you are under no legal obligation to do so. |
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Posted: 7/24/2018 11:50:58 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I guess I’m confused. Do they still think they have to sign off on something or the processing of the form can be delayed? From what I understand, they don’t need to conduct a review at all and even if they want to, that “review” isn’t going to have any effect on the ATF processing the Form 1/4, right? I guess I’m just not seeing what they think they’re accomplishing by doing anything with your notification other than filing it or shredding it. If you continue submitting the notification to them, I can see titling them appropriately, but wouldn't provide any additional applicant info to them. Might be worth a phone call to clarify with them depending on your relationship and their attitude. |
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Posted: 7/24/2018 7:14:42 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Dumb question, but who would the CLEO be of a state?? |
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Posted: 7/24/2018 7:20:54 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Name/DOB is the standard way to run people through NCIC to check their background. Not unreasonable, and you will have that information on everyone on their 4473, which they already submit. Not overreaching. For the FFL, the best practice is to follow the law exactly. I myself have sent everything to TX/AG for decades. I would avoid confrontation on the issue and just start sending the forms to someone else. |
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Posted: 7/24/2018 7:22:27 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I’m curious who they think is being delayed? Their own file clerk is the only one I cane think of. It certainly isn’t the processing of the form 4. |
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Posted: 7/24/2018 9:16:52 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ok great thanks!! Dumb question, but who would the CLEO be of a state?? |
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Posted: 7/24/2018 9:17:23 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ok great thanks!! Dumb question, but who would the CLEO be of a state?? |
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Posted: 7/24/2018 9:58:37 PM EDT
[#31]
Oregon
Ellen F. Rosenblum
Attorney General Oregon Department of Justice 1162 Court ST NE Salem, OR 97301-4096 |
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Posted: 7/25/2018 5:19:53 AM EDT
[#32]
Oregon State Patrol maintains all of the records concerning guns in the state or OR, Just helped a friend of mine get an OR conviction expunged and the AG told us to send everything to the OSP.
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Posted: 7/25/2018 8:17:12 AM EDT
[#33]
It doesn't matter which CLEO you send them to.
It doesn't matter if they maintain the record or not. My sheriff throws them away. |
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Posted: 7/25/2018 10:56:28 AM EDT
[#34]
I would tell the sheriff to get bent.
Send it to the state attorney general next time. |
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Posted: 7/26/2018 2:02:00 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The information an FFL collects is specified by Federal Law, and is protected by Federal Law. FFLs are not permitted to give that out, except as specified by Federal Law. Asking an FFL to provide information not legally required, for a reason not authorized is, "unreasonable". The instructions on the form for CLEO is quite clear, CLEO should read them and follow them. For the FFL, the best practice is to follow the law exactly. I myself have sent everything to TX/AG for decades. I would avoid confrontation on the issue and just start sending the forms to someone else. |
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Posted: 7/26/2018 2:11:22 PM EDT
[#36]
.02. Unless the State has separate rules you need to follow..?
From the Federal POV. You complied with the law and made notifications as required. Ignore them and continue to comply with the Federal rules. Should the Local LEA send you another request or something more ominous..? The reply could be.. We are not asking permission. We are making notifications as per the Federal mandates. The information included is all that is required CFR..? Thank you. |
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