Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
BCM
User Panel

Site Notices
Posted: 1/11/2023 6:53:03 AM EDT
Say an enterprising individual had parts for, and could fabricate a Mk19, or an M242 Bushmaster. Does machine gun trump DD like machine gun trumps SBR?  or is DD exempt from rate of fire? There isn't anything listed in the ATF definitions in regards to rate of fire.

What about as a Type 10? I'm assuming it would be another form 2, but would a m242 still be a DD?

A man with armor needs to know these things.
Link Posted: 1/11/2023 8:27:23 AM EDT
[#1]
Machine gun trumps DD.
Link Posted: 1/11/2023 9:56:41 AM EDT
[#2]
I figured that was the case,  but can't seem to find the law that states such.
Link Posted: 1/11/2023 9:56:55 AM EDT
[Last Edit: User55645] [#3]
26 U.S.C. § 5845(b)
Machinegun:
Any weapon which shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be readily restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger

Destructive device:
(2) any type of weapon by whatever name known which will...


Ergo, any weapon which fires automatically is a machinegun.
(or whatever the AFT feels like calling it, on that particular day)
Link Posted: 1/11/2023 10:06:38 AM EDT
[#4]
So a meat popsicle that fires automatically...not a machine gun.
Got it.
Link Posted: 1/11/2023 10:27:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: trapsh00ter99] [#5]
What about a DD volley gun? One stamp?

40mm volley gun tested by the Naval Ordnance Laboratory in Vietnam in October 1969


Edit: with steel barrels, could probably use HV MK19 ammo....hmmm
Link Posted: 1/12/2023 5:10:11 PM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By trapsh00ter99:
What about a DD volley gun? One stamp?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kO5OI0c7mpA

Edit: with steel barrels, could probably use HV MK19 ammo....hmmm
View Quote



My fliegerfaust Is a volley fire DD so that would probably be legal as well
Link Posted: 6/17/2023 7:21:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Homeinvader] [#7]
Old post, I know.

But in the world of Destructive Devices, “Machine Gun” co-exists, it does not override anything.

There are plenty of DDs that fire automatically, like any 20mm auto cannon or a MK19 grenade launcher, and these are categorized as “MG/DD” for purposes of the NFA.

MG/DD is the only type of dual-category in the NFA and should not be confused with 2-stamp guns like an MP5 SD or a registered trigger pack/SBR host gun, which are technically two NFA guns that might transfer together.

While you can Form 1 a DD, you cannot Form 1 a MG/DD. You can Form 1 a 20mm Oerlikon as a DD, for example, but you’d need to take steps to make it semi-auto or manually operated.
Link Posted: 6/18/2023 12:24:30 AM EDT
[#8]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Homeinvader:
Old post, I know.

But in the world of Destructive Devices, “Machine Gun” co-exists, it does not override anything.

There are plenty of DDs that fire automatically, like any 20mm auto cannon or a MK19 grenade launcher, and these are categorized as “MG/DD” for purposes of the NFA.

MG/DD is the only type of dual-category in the NFA and should not be confused with 2-stamp guns like an MP5 SD or a registered trigger pack/SBR host gun, which are technically two NFA guns that might transfer together.

While you can Form 1 a DD, you cannot Form 1 a MG/DD. You can Form 1 a 20mm Oerlikon as a DD, for example, but you’d need to take steps to make it semi-auto or manually operated.
View Quote


While this was the case back in the day, nowadays a transfer of any of these MG/DDs will have the paperwork just show DD. There is no bore size restriction for MG, so any full auto DD is actually just a MG, with no need for the DD classification, same reason you dont have MG/SBRs. The DD registration for these guns was just done by people that didn't know any better during the 68 amnesty up til 86. There
Link Posted: 6/18/2023 2:05:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Homeinvader] [#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By SGT-Fish:


While this was the case back in the day, nowadays a transfer of any of these MG/DDs will have the paperwork just show DD. There is no bore size restriction for MG, so any full auto DD is actually just a MG, with no need for the DD classification, same reason you dont have MG/SBRs. The DD registration for these guns was just done by people that didn't know any better during the 68 amnesty up til 86. There
View Quote


It was only until 95-97or so that you needed a Type 9 or 10 FFL to do any DD transfer. MG/DD meant you had to use a DD-level FFL, which were hard to come by due to cost. A standard Type 1 SOT was not enough. The shotgun reclassifications of ‘94 brought this roadblock to the attention of ATF and they relaxed the requirement.  You’ll still see MG/DD on transfer paperwork and in the registry, though they can now be transferred through a Type 1 SOT “infrequently”.

MG and SBR (conjugating to “rifle”) are mutually exclusive by definition, one cannot be the other. MG and DD are not, a single firearm can be both at the same, hence the dual classification. If MG/DDs were to noticeably in popularity, you could expect a return to DD-level licensing requirements.
Link Posted: 6/19/2023 1:14:19 PM EDT
[#10]
Ok, so who is going to make the MK19 upper for my M16 lower?
Link Posted: 6/19/2023 1:53:09 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By red89notch:
Ok, so who is going to make the MK19 upper for my M16 lower?
View Quote

If there's no bore restriction that sounds like a great idea
Link Posted: 6/20/2023 2:02:01 AM EDT
[#12]
Close Join Our Mail List to Stay Up To Date! Win a FREE Membership!

Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!

You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.


By signing up you agree to our User Agreement. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win.
Top Top