In an attempt to figure out my priming issues I have done all the polishing, chamfering and rounding mods I saw. My primer shuttle has never hung up or gotten jammed by powder. Turns out my issue was a shell plate that was .004" tighter than a new one. So some brass was not going all the way into the plate and the punch did not line up perfect. That is now fixed.

Once you get the press pawls dialed in it stays. The trick is to adjust the detent balls so the plate locks at each position but does not snap into position. The detent balls are adjustable. Again takes a little trial and error but once they are set you don't need to touch them again.

What I did to set the detent balls is as follows:
First I turn the shell plate upside down and use a punch to push them so they are not protruding.
Second I check the pawls to make sure the shell plate gets indexed perfectly. Without the balls  pulling the plate into position.
Once the pawls are dialed in I then lightly tap the detent balls down a little at a time.
I tap them down until I get the plate to lock in but not jump into position.
Sometimes you may have to remove the plate and push the balls up to start over.
Once done I remove the plate and put a dab of grease on each detent in the base plate. This makes it run smooth and acts as a damper.

I adjusted my 4 Ammo-plants and my buddies 650 on 23 May 2015. I have cleaned and lubed each of them every six months. At that time I also check the timing. To date, they are all still perfect.

I've had a LnL for about 6 years, and, like you, I like it but don't love it.  I'm thinking of moving to a 650, and would like to know what you decided about keeping one or the other.  Space and budget allowing, I would like to have both, but alas, that is not to be.

I am still trying to decide. It is not an easy decision. The Dillon is not the unbelievably awesome press that "just works great out of the box" as the fan boys will have you believe. Both presses have their strong points and weak points. I am trying to decide which one stays on my bench.

I have the space for two but I do not want two different brands.

Right now I am leaning toward the Dillon. The Swage-It is the reason. I am doing some more testing of the Swage-It's effectiveness at removing the military crimp. If it proves to work then the Dillon stays.

If the Swage-It does not work out for me then the Dillon goes bye bye. I prefer the Hornady for the ergonomics. The press is more open, you can see every station when seated or standing in a comfortable position. Caliber changes are much less expensive. Lastly storing caliber setups takes up less space.

One last thing that is irking me with the Dillon is the powder that collects on the shell plate. It gets into the shell plate grooves and causes issues. I have tried one last attempt at solving this. If it works great if not then regardless of the Swage-It I will dump the Dillon.

It was for me after transitioning from my first press, a 550.

If swaging is really that big of a deal for you then the 1050 might be a worthwhile investment.

Most people swage very infrequently, and unless you shoot a lot of lost brass games or process boatloads of brass, it isn't that huge of a consideration for the vast majority of people.

I believe the 650 to be superior to the LNL having used both but I don't believe either are bad presses at all. Either decision is going to serve you well for 99% of reloading tasks, but you are very focused on the swaging aspect. Might as well go for the tool that's really designed for it.

With all the aftermarket parts and tinkering shown for both of the presses to make you happy you're not far from 1050 territory anyway.

I agree, sell both the 650 and the LnL, get a 1050.

I use the Hornady pocket reamer chucked up in a small lathe. That seems to give such a nice bevel it makes reloading crimped pockets a joy. But I don't reload crimped brass by the five gallon bucket loads either. Plus it seems like my primer pockets stay a bit tighter that away. I asked my buddy who runs a 650 and he said once he quit swaging the powder trickle slowed down. He thinks it's due to the vibration. Now he uses the Hornady case prep tool with the pocket reamer. I would love to play with a 650 side by side my LNL. But don't have the space or disposable income.

I came very close to buying an LnL at one point, if I had spare time, I'd pick a used one up and try it out thanks to this excellent thread.

I did consider buying a 1050. It really is more than I want to spend plus caliber conversions are very expensive.

I am focused on swaging? For the purpose of this thread, yes.

This whole thing started because I was struggling to get the priming working correctly on the Hornady. Once I started this thread and had the two presses side by side I figured out, thanks to you guys, that my Hornady shall plate was a bit tight. I bought a new shell plate at Cabelas and my Hornady priming problem was solved.

So now the only thing left that the Dillon possibly can do that the Hornady can't is swage primer pockets on the same pass through the press as sizing and trimming. So now my energy is focused on seeing if this Swage-It tool really works well or it is so so. I have processed another 500 or so cases so my next step is to try and load them. if the primers seat nice then the Swage-It works.

The primer pocket does not have a chamfer at the edge like I get reaming with the Hornady reamer. I am concerned this may cause issues. My first tests indicate it is not a problem but running a few hundred rounds in a row will tell the tale.

You need to remember, you bought a used one that had been worked on, it wasn't new out of the box. I went from a LEE loadmaster to a XL 650 in .223, and it was as simple as assembling it and dumping in components and setting the powder drop. It was set for use with 55gr FMJ-BT, and had a sample cartridge that came with it.

The swage function on the S 1050 serves for more then just one function. You can swage on it, also buy a FF&B swage rod, it will then give the primer pocket just a little chamfer if you want, it will also help detect ringers, can help to not run a small pocket case when loading large pocket .45. When loading most anything, I will run with it set up to just run up in the pocket enough to detect any kind of blockage. It also has an adjustable primer system, by turning one set screw, you can make minor tweaks to the primer seating depth.

It is alittle more for caliber changes, but it can be done for way cheaper then people say. The conversion time takes a lot less then people often say it is.

No, it is not the press for everybody, but don't ever pull the handle on one, cause you will want one from then on.

It has been a while since I had time to spend at the reloading bench. I finally had time this weekend to perform my last tests of both presses.

I can't stop the powder spilling with the Dillon powder measure with .223 and H335 powder. I have the indexing smooth as silk with no snapping and I even have tried the "No Spill" devices from Reloading Innovations. My problem is the powder measure spills some every case. I even went extremely slow and hung at the top of the stroke just to make sure. Still get a few granules of powder each time. It adds up to a mess after 100 rounds. I have the low mass ball, softer spring and shell plate bearing, no change.

The Swage-It primer pocket swager works about 95-98%. I did 500 rounds with it and had primer seating issues 2-5 times per 100. To me this is unacceptable. When I was reaming them I had 100% success.

I have made my decision. I am keeping the Hornady and the Dillon is going away.

In my journey I learned a few valuable things. One is that Dillon is no where near the perfection that the fan boys will have you believe. Second is that both red and blue have their quirks, strengths and weaknesses. Pick which press will work for you.

The Dillon's priming system is annoying. You have to advance the primer feed disk 6 or 7 times so that a case and primer will show up together. Not a deal breaker but really annoying. If you need to remove a case the unused primer gets sent down a ramp and unless you have modified the "ski jump" or bought a properly made one the primer will end up on the floor or bench somewhere. I am amazed at how Dillon does not fix this.

The powder measure is not nearly as nice as the Hornady. The Dillon needs a wrench to adjust it and to empty powder you have to take it apart. And what is with the rube goldberg rod thing?

Getting the shell plate center bolt tensioned just right is not hard but it takes some finesse to get it just right. I am sure with more experience I could get it set right faster.

When standing or sitting in front of the press you can't see the first two stations. Again not a deal breaker but I do like to see my cases. This is my last chance to catch any cases with an issue.

I have to say setting the Dillon up is no easier or harder than the Hornady. Dillon the shell plate tension is what takes a little practice and a feel for. On the Hornady it is the shell plate indexing that takes a bit of practice to get set.

As for caliber changes I don't think either press is faster than the other. Dillon you swap the whole head. On Hornady you twist in each item into the press. Both take seconds.

Priming system changes are faster on the Hornady. Just a few minutes longer for the Dillon.

None of this stuff is a deal breaker. I had three things that the Dillon did not do for me.

1. The Dillon powder measure spills powder. I was able to get a consistent charge.
2. Caliber conversions are much more money.
3. Swage-It device was not 100%.

The biggest con with the Hornady is you have to spend some time learning ho the press works so you can adjust it for indexing and case feeding.

Buy what floats your boat but my experience has been eye opening and am glad I did not sell my Hornady to fund a Dillon.

I have the Hornady Swager for .223 on order. I can't wait to test that. If it works I might buy a second press used if I can ding a deal.

Glad you made your decision based on your findings. You can now move on to just making ammo and concentrating on keeping the Hornady up and running, especially now that you have solved your shell plate issue.

For me, I have no issues with the Dillon Power Measure leaking, although we are using different powders. I find mine to be decent performers with most powders, and my only complaint is that there is not a powder shut off function, otherwise, they are fine.

I don't swage on my press, so no comments there.

Congratulations on getting through all of this, it was a long journey for you.

I don't understand the powder leakages.  I can't say I've ever seen that on my 650.

@edgephoto, I really appreciate everything you’ve written here, thank you.

I am glad we didn't get into a Blue vs. Red argument. My journey was long only because I did not have time to spend on it often.

In the end I determined both presses have their strong points and weak points. It is more a case of pick whatever you feel will do the job. Then learn how to work around the quirks and weak points.

This turned out to be like deciding if Ford or Chevy is better.

The guy who bought the Dillon came tonight and he saw the Hornady and asked why I am selling the Dillon. I explained my reasoning and findings. I know he will be happy with that press. it is in great condition and I gave him lots of "upgrades" and extra stuff.

If you were determined to recoup costs, and you believed them to be similar in function, it was wise to sell the dillon. It clearly did not take very long to sell it.

Strange. I owned a LNL.  I still own a 650xl after a decade.  It seemed like the LNL would always get out of adjustment.  I was always tinkering witb something.  Especially the case feeding operation.  Oh and the ejection wire.  I couldnt even use the last station on the LNL because i had to modify ejection wires for each caliber and they often made use of the last station not possible.  I was also never happy with their powder through expanders so I used a die for expansion.

I dont have an issue with the powder measure spilling powder with any caliber. The only powder spilled is from letting the shellplate snap when it turns but there are ways around it or fixes.  I've never had any issue with the shell plates in any way.

Maybe if you had bought the dillon new and unmodified it would have been different.  Maybe not.  With my Dillon I can get through with say a 5k batch of 9mm without having to tinker with anything.  With the Hornady I would have taking the priming system apart several times to clean it/mess with it, had to tinker with the case feeding (several areas of this system), perhaps needed a new case retaining spring, etc, etc.

Dillon is not perfect.  From my experience of 2 years reloading with a LNL and 10 years with a 650 I would says the LNL vs 650 is like a Sigma vs a Glock and if you throw Lee in it is the Hi-Point.

You will love it, I know I do mine. I've got a thread in here somewhere on a simple mod that really lets this thing shine.

I  Can't find it but search youtube, several good vids out there.