AR-15 - 20" Ballistic Advantage Barrel: 77SMK and CFE223

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - AR-15 - 20" Ballistic Advantage Barrel: 77SMK and CFE223

Posted: 10/14/2020 11:21:14 AM EDT

I've got a bit of CFE223 because that's what I can find. I realize that the go to powder for the above setup is IMB 8028XBR, but that's about as none existent as other popular powders.

I've read so many threads, but very few actually call out the use of CFE223. I know it's been out a while and I also know that it's a bit slow. I'm seeing loads all over the place when I do see them. I'm wanting to do load up to take to the range and see how well they do, but I also want to make sure that I have a full range covered.

I'd rather not load everything from 23 all the way up to 26.2. Even at .3gr increments that's a fair amount of shooting.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

Posted: 10/14/2020 11:33:57 AM EDT

[#1]

Maybe a starting point..CFE223 & 77gr The link won’t save the table but it’s a place to start.

Posted: 10/14/2020 12:10:49 PM EDT

[#2]

Quote History

Quoted:
Maybe a starting point..CFE223 & 77gr The link won’t save the table but it’s a place to start.

View Quote

Started there and that's where my problem lies. A good number of accuracy loads are well above Hodgdon Reloading. Again, I'd rather not load 10 sets of loads to shoot.

Posted: 10/14/2020 12:14:18 PM EDT

[#3]

I'd do 24.5-26.0 in 0.5gr increments. If two in a row are decent, use the .2-.3 in between.

Ball powders tend to be more efficient on the warm end, so you might balance group size with velocity uniformity.

Posted: 10/14/2020 1:13:57 PM EDT

[#4]

CFE223 usually needs to be loaded hot to perform well. I would ladder from 24.0 to 24.6 in .2 and see where you get. Loading all the way to 26 seems like tempting fate given the published loads.

Posted: 10/14/2020 1:23:03 PM EDT

[#5]

AA 2520 is also a great 223/5.56mm Powder and it is available right now at Graf & Sons. I've found it to be neck and neck with IMR 8208 XBR for both velocity and accuracy with heavy 224 caliber bullets.

It's about $4.00 a lb cheaper to boot. My accuracy load with it is 25.0 grains with either the Sierra 77 grain SMK or Nosler 77 grain CC. It yields 2739 FPS from my 18" barrel, sub MOA groups.

With CFE223 25.0 grains yielded 2672 FPS with good accuracy.

Posted: 10/14/2020 2:24:09 PM EDT

[#6]

CFE223 will drive the heavies well, but as noted it's likely to be on the hot end and over book max.

There is no alternative to working up, even if it's a lot of work.

But it's not that much work. You don't need 10 rounds at each charge. 2 or 3 at each of the lower charges is fine. You're looking to confirm function and safety at the lower charges, not teasing out a subtle node.

Posted: 10/14/2020 6:23:32 PM EDT

[#7]

Quote History

Quoted:
AA 2520 is also a great 223/5.56mm Powder and it is available right now at Graf & Sons. I've found it to be neck and neck with IMR 8208 XBR for both velocity and accuracy with heavy 224 caliber bullets.

It's about $4.00 a lb cheaper to boot. My accuracy load with it is 25.0 grains with either the Sierra 77 grain SMK or Nosler 77 grain CC. It yields 2739 FPS from my 18" barrel, sub MOA groups.

With CFE223 25.0 grains yielded 2672 FPS with good accuracy.

View Quote

Go to Johnny's reloading where he discusses 2520. He also mentions his MK 262 series. He's done a lot of work with the 77 grain bullets.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldKykzuV8eU

Posted: 10/14/2020 7:40:29 PM EDT

[#8]

Another nod for AA2520.

Posted: 10/14/2020 8:34:14 PM EDT

[#9]

I'm trying to consolidate on powders and bullets.

I got 1k of the 77SMK on sale at MidwayUSA and I had read that the CFE223 kinda ran like Varget, but meters better. I did all my research after I bought the powder. Worst case, I load up enough to get me past this draught and if possible next year, I'll load up on IMR 8208XBR for 223 heavies. I'm running 50/53gr for 200 and shorter ranges which is 90% of my shooting. I have a preference for H322 for the lighter pills (have shot thousands with this combo).

Posted: 10/14/2020 9:03:07 PM EDT

[#10]

The good news is, CFE223 and 77 SMK are very easy to work with so you won't get anything too crazy even if you miss the node on your first try.

I would say use a chrono for a clue and just test the first five or ten and take a second guess from there before you load too many.

Use a hotter primer for cold weather.

Posted: 10/16/2020 3:23:10 PM EDT

[#11]

I like 8208XBR and a lot of people love Varget behind the 77 but I have seen good results with other powders including RL15, CFE223, and TAC.

Posted: 10/16/2020 10:41:25 PM EDT

[#12]

Tried CFE with 77's and it just didn't shoot as well as Varget or RL15.

You can push them faster with CFE.

Some of my CFE data with 77's, LC brass, Rem 7 1/2, 20"1:7

23.5gr- 2540avg
23.8gr - 2560avg
24 - 2611
24.2 - 2626
24.5 - 2672

Posted: 10/16/2020 11:01:58 PM EDT

[#13]

Benchmark for the win.

Posted: 10/16/2020 11:28:16 PM EDT

[#14]

I have a few rounds loaded from 23.8 to 26.2. I’ll take these to the range on Monday and try them out at 200. I’ll see what comes of these charges. If they don’t pan out, I’ll wait it out and find a powder when all this crap settles down.

Posted: 10/17/2020 4:00:51 AM EDT

[#15]

My node was 24.9gr shooting Nosler 77gr. 2,749fps avg out of a 20” barrel. 2.25” COL CCI 41 primer. LC brass

To build up, load 1 round at .3 increments until 24gr then move up.

Weird thing about CFE 223, it might show pressure at lower charges and then you move up they disappear.

As always, use caution.

From all of my digging, cfe 223 does better at max.

Posted: 10/17/2020 7:53:48 AM EDT

[#16]

Quote History

Quoted:
My node was 24.9gr shooting Nosler 77gr. 2,749fps avg out of a 20” barrel. 2.25” COL CCI 41 primer. LC brass

To build up, load 1 round at .3 increments until 24gr then move up.

Weird thing about CFE 223, it might show pressure at lower charges and then you move up they disappear.

As always, use caution.

From all of my digging, cfe 223 does better at max.

View Quote

This is what I’ve heard. I’m also expecting a node right around 25. I made 10 rounds at 25 to use as sighters. I have 5 rounds loaded at .3 increments with 25 being the midpoint. I’m gonna try and chrono but we’ll see how well that works. Can always chrono when I find a node.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - AR-15 - 20" Ballistic Advantage Barrel: 77SMK and CFE223

Armory » Reloading

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