2 years ago I applied for 2 suppressors as an individual, each application requiring 2 finger print cards and 2 photos.

I go into my lgs with my newly acquired trust ready to apply for some more and he tells me I need 4 photos for each suppressor! He told me where each one was going but i wasn’t listening cause I was pissed I had to buy more. This man has been wrong before, is he sending my pic off to somewhere it isn’t needed or is he correct?

You only need one picture per stamp man.

Download ATF E-Form 4 (5320.4) Revised September 2017 and read the instructions. Specifically, 2.d.(5). Then, download ATF E-Form 5320.23 Revised May 2016 and read the instructions. Specifically, items 1 & 9.

ETA: damnit @FMKeith
something about a horse and water

1 passport photo, two finger print cards, per suppressor.

For a Trust, yes, one photo, two cards.
The OP may be getting mixed information about an individual vs. a Trust application.

But, 4 photos? No way.

Yup...I just print out a cellphone picture and then tape the edges to the form1/form 4

They are never the exact size of a passport photo and often protrude off the edges. It doesn’t cover any info and I’ve never had a denial the five times I’ve done it.

I took a picture of myself with my cellphone against a plain colored wall, cropped it and printed it out on paper, then taped the pictures to my Form 4s.  Has worked on my last three cans

I just got my SBR stamp and the other photos were for the sheriffs dept.  You no longer have to get the sheriff's approval but you have to send them the information.

Wow I feel stupid, thanks guys. Appreciate it

Thank you so much for the info on the app. However, I have 6 individual stamps and I have only ever attached a single photo the the ATF copy of the form. Never been an issue so far.

My SOT prints those three forms. CLEO gets signature only and sent out. The other two get signatures and the ATF copy gets picture. The ATF Copy 2 - To Be Returned gets just signatures. Like I said. That is what I have done on 6 forms. I have 3 back with no problems and 3 more in processing.

Well my lgs is persistent on it being 4 photos and won't take no for an answer. It was hard enough just talking to him without him interrupting me and telling me I'm wrong so I guess I'll just print out some more so he's happy.

I only submit two fingerprint cards, regardless of how many form 4's.  Three stamps came back this way (2 cards total) so I submitted a large "batch" this way as well.  Hoping it works again.

Edit to add; One photo per application/can.

Thanks for asking this.....I've always put a pic on each of the copies that go to the ATF.......since the late 1980's.........

Good idea. He said he need the pictures for atf copy 1, atf copy 2, Cleo, and trust paperwork. “Wherever a space for a picture asked for, I place one”

It definitely used to require two passport photos for the Form 4. Now even passports just require one photo so I’m not surprised to here people saying it only takes one photo.

The guy probably misspoke because he was thinking two photos for each suppressor.

He definitely did NOT miss speak. I’ve asked him twice now, and he’s demanding 4 photos per suppressor (20 pictures total..)

Like Waylon said I should just send em in myself I guess. I guarantee he’ll  probably refuse and tell me, he needs to send them in. I’ll let you guys know tomorrow.

Pretty much what BW said. Bring a blank Form 4 and RPQ and walk him through each of the sections.

"See, here on the back of ATF Copy it says "Complete Only When Transferee is An Individual""
"See, here on the back of ATF Copy 2 it says "Complete Only When Transferee is An Individual""
"See, here on the back of CLEO Copy it says "Complete Only When Transferee is An Individual" and the place where a photo goes is grayed out"

Try your best to lead the horse using baby steps...

and good luck!

Wow OP.  Is he the only FFL in your immediate area setup for NFA purchases? I realize your already stuck with dealing with this guy but sounds like it's time to find a new one for any future NFA purchases.  Good luck getting this guy to realize you don't need all those extra photos.

This.
When I was a dealer 10 years ago, I snapped cellphone pics against a white wall and inserted them onto the PDF myself before printing. Never had a form rejected.

So this is how it went down, mind you the whole conversation he is progressively getting louder and more angry while I was talking in a calm voice not trying to cause a scene.

Me- did you happen to finish my paperwork yet? (He said he’d have it done by last Friday)

Mr. M - no, do you have my photos?

Me- about that, there a bunch of people online telling me that I only need one.

Mr M - No no no, I need 4 photos. That’s what they ask for and that’s what they get.

Me - if you read the instructions, it says you only need one. Can I get them and mail them myself?

Mr M - No you can’t, Mr. C has to sign off on them. Here! (scrambles to get paperwork)(throws papers on counter) see this box here, here, and here, all want pictures.

[slamming his finger down on each box]

Mr M - we’ll you know I’ll just have him sign them so you can just take them but we’ve never had one rejected so far.

(I turn papers over to see instructions but there weren’t any)

Me - do you have the instructions?

Mr M - (gets angrier)

Me - (I have my phone ready and start to read this off)

Attached File


Mr M - (silence) ........ well you know I have a lot of things going on and this is how I was taught. How about i call Mr C to make sure. Why is this even a big deal to you?

Me - on principal, I don’t want to send my pictures off to someone who doesn’t need them, and the hassle of getting more.

[at this point I’m walking away cause he said he’d call and find out and nothing more I could do and plenty of other customers were eating popcorn]

I get to work and 5 mins later, I see that he’s calling my phone. I answered and he just wanted my DL info. I told him I wasn’t trying to make him angry. He said it’s fine, he just has lots of thing going on and just wanted to wait for the answer from above.

In other news, I’m super happy I got my boat running after not knowing what the issue was for a month. (fail safe was engaged)

He just called again and was really sorry about the whole thing and said I (you guys) were right and legal but they can request photos if they please. He just likes to send them just in case. He said he’s busy tomorrow and I can finish everything up Friday.

I've done this for all of my transfers with only one exception where I let the dealer handle everything.

I'll also say that I've only had 1 problem with the 16 transfers I've done.  I'll let people guess as to which transfer had the problem, and it's not a trick question.