Good job trying to keep the price down! LOL 2k....LOL yea, they will price it less then a SCAR and FS2000....right.

$2k is not a really valid price, if you look at it from a big picture perspective of other firearm costs across the market.

I hope their survey results don't cause them to curtail the production effort.

I know!  I actually said I wouldn't question the quality until it got down to $500.00.

To me, anything above 2500.00 and I will look at full auto ownership.  I'm a big FN can and hope they produce it, but im not the true market for this gun.

I understand your personal views on it, and you do certainly admit you are not their intended customer.  I just was pointing out that your personal views are not reflective, in my opinion, of the vast majority of gun purchasers out there nor the actual firearms market in the US right now.

I think most of the likely customers for this would be extremely happy if it came out at $4,000 or so.  Extremely happy, when compared to what other things (like the semi-auto BAR you mentioned) went up to in recent years.

What full auto would someone be jumping into at $2500 today?  I'm a Class 3 guy, and the $2500 entry days for decent Class 3 are long, long gone.  And anything belt-fed is an order of magnitude above that, unless you have a WayBack Machine.

I wanted a semi BAR this summer, tad over $4k, wifey intervened so the 249S ain't gonna happen no matter how much I "need" it.

Yes, I think you are correct..  I was thinking along the lines of a semi-auto BAR or a reising which I can jump into for less than 5K  (buddy deal).  But really, I pretty much met my max into a gun with a SA SCAR17.  

So I do realize that your idea of pricing is much more in line with reality.  And I really do hope it gets produced, even if I'm not the market.  I'm sure my results were outside the average and will have very little sway over the folks at FN.

I have bought a lot of FN guns over the years, I'm sure that is why I came up on the radar for their survey.

So why would you then as a FN purchaser try to sabitoge their efforts on the M249S?

As a FN owner (I've got got em all pretty much) and a number of C3 including a FNC, what you did was foolish and/or ignorant to the market.

Best case $4000 which is a pipe dream. $6K is more accurate.  I believe the US mil pays ~$4500 per so there is your baseline.

Based on what is on the market, which is no belt-fed factory semis, they can and should ask whatever they want over $4500 to recop design costs.

I would be interested at $5k. I have owned several belt feds and would rather have one at 5 than one at 10 and sell it for a couple of guns i will shoot more. Ymmv

I did a little rough math today on this.

According to this site: http://fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/land/m249.htm the military pays $4087 for each m249 saw. Being that this site was last modified in 1999, using an inflation calculator, the price in today's dollar would be $5846. Considering that the military generally pays quite a bit less than what civilians pay for the same item, our price will likely be a bit higher. For example, FN's contract for 120,000 M4A1 carbines came out to $642. Looking at what FN gets for a civilian model (FN15 Carbine), the price is about 50% higher at somewhere around $950. So in theory, I don't think the M249s will be any less than the $7k figure already mentioned. Including the price of R&D for developing the closed bolt mechanism for the gun, I think the price will be pretty substantial.

Yup, this is spot on.

I'm a buyer at 6.5k, so hopefully a msrp around 7-7.25K.

Keep in mind that mil purchases are almost never for just a stand-alone weapon.  There are all sorts of kits, accessories, etc that are "bundled", so the spec'd $ is never for just a weapon in a box, like we buy.

Didn't you think that the M249 was no longer in military service as of a week ago?

I don't have access to the system at this very moment, this might inspire me to shoot off a quick e-mail or make a quick phone call out of curiosity...  

With that being said, inflation is all well and good, but if that's an accurate 1999 figure, you're not factoring in the fifteen years of continuous conflict with contract negotiations and competitive bidding (Colt, for example, has/had a big chunk of spare barrel production) which could make the price fluctuate up or down... but probably a little bit down.  Moreover - the price that the government pays does not necessary relate directly to how much the weapon system costs to produce.  

The MINIMI is a pretty old design, and while there have been tweaks here and there, it's still pretty much the same old MINIMI used by not just the US military, but many, many more throughout the world.  

Like the AR15/M16/M4 - for all intents and purposes, the development costs have probably already long since paid for themselves - which is why you can find a basic AR15 dirt cheap these days.  You're really only paying for material and labor costs, the development's been done paid for.  The problem with belt fed machine guns (and I don't care what the military says... the MINIMI is a light machine gun, not an "automatic rifle," regardless of how you attempt to employ it) is that they're pretty hard to monetize on the civilian market.

The "wild card" here is how much FNH spent creating the closed bolt, semi-automatic function, as that's the development cost the consumer is going to be paying for.  I suspect, however, that for a concern as large and well established as FNH, it wasn't as difficult or expensive as it would be for say a small machine shop cobbling together parts kits.

At the same time, you've got to wonder "why" FN is coming out with the M249S right now...  




Something worth considering... basically no one wants the long barrel, fixed stock M249 these days.  FNH might be sitting on a pile of barrels and other parts that no one wants and trying to figure out what the hell to do with them.    

At the end of the day, the M249S is, quite possibly in many ways "like nothing we've ever seen before."  

The M249 is current production, long-serving, in widespread usage, and being marketed by the company that originated it.  I don't know that I can think of another situation/weapon system that is similar.  

I agree - FNH could look at the market and decide that it will bear another $7-8,000 semi-auto belt fed -- or they may decide that they can make more money selling hundreds of them at ~$4,000 or so than selling a couple dozen at $7-8,000.  

The fact that they sent out the survey seems to indicate to me that they're trying to figure out exactly that -- how many people would buy it at what price point, in which case, honestly, a $2,000 response does probably hurt those who want to see it released at a lower price point - because that's simply not going to happen - and it may push the decision makers to believe that there's not enough interest at the lower price point to justify a lower profit margin per unit.  

Regardless, unless there's some lottery winning or unknown inheritance receiving in the near future, I'm not in the market for an M249S - but I'm certainly curious to see what the MSRP will come out to be.

~Augee

I reached out to a buddy at FN last night, and asked to get the survey.  He said he'd get it to me, which is great- I am in the customer base for this one, and I'd love to at least have a little bit of input to their asked questions.

Can i get a survey? I am a customer in the 4-6k price point. Perhaps a group buy?

Another thought,  all those shrike owners, a fair number would upgrade to this and probably sell thier shrike. That is also a buyer group.

I would think.

Im in @3K, and thats a stretch. Above that not so much.

That's about what I'm comfortable spending as well. I'll have to sell a few guns to get it, but I've always wanted something like this. Prior to now, about the only moderately priced belt fed available was a 1919.

That's very true, I didn't take the fact that it is 16 years older into effect. The price we were paying in 1999 for an m4 carbine from colt is well over what we are paying fn for an m4a1 now. It does make a lot of sense that the minimi would go down in price as well

My interest would be in a 249s PARA in FDE and I'm hoping that is something they will release down the track.

I have two Shrikes....why would this make me sell them? They are on my M16 (one is for spare parts).

Apparently you would fall into the not camp. I would fall into the bought a shrike because i couldn't get a 249. I am also in a semi state so no fa for me.

$3k-$4k for me. 4.5-6.5 trigger? Yuck. I hope someone comes out with a feather light trigger so I can spam bullets downrange as fast as possible.

I also might buy in the $3,000-4,000 range.  Any higher than that, and it's lost my interest.

I'd be interested in a 240B like this but I couldn't care less about the 249.

Ohio Ordnance makes a semi auto M240B. Around $12K I believe.

FN Sales Rep, who I know from a previous job, told me they are finalizing the MSRP decision this week.  But sadly he also posted on Facebook "coming in 2016"...

I have one of those. Awesome beltfed.



 

Still, it's good news!

Yes indeed, it is movement towards the objective!  

Well please update us on whatever they decide the MSRP to be!

I will.

When I asked him if they'd be a limited access item, like only available through FN Stocking Dealers, he said no and that they'd be available through normal distributor channels for standard FFLs.

 
Nearly $2000 will get you the M4 or M16 collector series....


$1600 MAP, $1750 MSRP

My favorite fun shop sent me an email yesterday with the dealer cost price on the 249s, now I'm assuming the price was the "package" FN talked about (hard case, extra barrel etc) but it was way to rich for me so I'll pass at this stage.

Can you fill us in? If you don't want to say publicly would you pm it to me?
Thanks

Now their cost (dealer) came from one of the many distributors they deal with and "dealer cost" has been known to change from distributors to distributor. That being said if FNH does a 249s PARA for 2000 less than the price I was quoted I will reconsider.

And what did they quote your cost as? Interested parties need to know.

Ahh you can't just tease us and not give us the price quote!!

$2,000 more than what you were willing to pay... What were you willing to pay?
$3000?

While I haven't been told I can/can't state this distributor's "dealer cost" I didn't specifically ask, I will say this that the street price will be 7 to 7500K (or more at some dealers). I suspect that this will be the package, hard case, extra barrels etc.

do yo guys think these things should be free ? LOL i beleive the post sample machineguns cost that much

According to a FNH post on facebook, the official MSRP is $7999

My "guess" is about a tax stamp under 7k and hard to come by. Availability will drive the price.

cant knock FN for makin a buck .
i dont think thats a bad price.

In the grand scheme of things, if you want a 249 that is not a bad price. It just kinda sucks that instead of the MSRP going down a little bit to attract more buyers, it went up by a grand from the first msrp estimate from tfb. Now street price will be around $7000 to $7500.

Saw the price today, ain't going to happen for me too soon I can say that, but never say never.

I'm buying at 6500...

Don't forget, there are lots of rich people out there.
They will buy without thinking twice.
Unfortunately, I'm not one of them

can u get me one @ that price too?  -I got the 100s lined up!  

I'd think about it at 4.5...above that....I dunno.

I can get a shrike kit with a couple barrels and a lot of ammo for that price.  Im not saying it's the same thing, but if I want a relatively cheap beltfed in an affordable round, that would suffice for me.

A dealer just hit me up on one he is going to be selling for $7200. I was hoping it would be in the $5k range but I guess not. Anyways its still an ok deal for a factory built beltfed, these will only go up in value over time especially if FN stops making the semi so you never know. Still a chunk of change though.