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Posted: 1/7/2021 10:12:14 PM EDT
[#1]
I really think Leupold is trying to piss off its consumers. A LPVO with 1.5x on the low end and only 4x on the top end and $700 WTF. These guys have the secret ingredients to make a VERY lightweight, yet durable LPVO and daylight bright illumination technology combined with motion sensitive on/off to enhance battery life and they arent willing to unleash it and make tons of fucking money.
ETA: maybe they didn't make a bunch of sales out of the VX6 with the BDC reticle. Idk |
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Posted: 1/7/2021 10:28:39 PM EDT
[#2]
That is steep for a 1.5-4. The VX-5HD 1-5 is only a couple hundred more, and likely much more scope. Not sure where they are going with this one.
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Posted: 1/7/2021 11:17:15 PM EDT
[#3]
I love the VXF illuminated model that has VX3 glass. An extra $300 for a throw lever, illumination knob, and HD glass (in a 4X optic at least) just doesn't seem as good of a buy though.
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Posted: 1/7/2021 11:31:17 PM EDT
[#4]
I kinda hate myself for being interested in this, even though I know I won’t buy it.
Leupold hasn’t done anything exciting or innovative in the last decade but I guess it’s still quality stuff. At least the LPVO is pretty light at 13.1 ounces. 1.5-4x doesn’t make much sense in 2021 but their old VXR Patrols still go pretty quickly on the EE so who knows. |
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Posted: 1/7/2021 11:35:30 PM EDT
[#5]
The knob is an improvement over push button, IMO. Hopefully has an off between each position.
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Posted: 1/8/2021 1:32:00 AM EDT
[#6]
1.5x on the low end and 4x at the top?
Sounds like the VX-R Patrol that Leupolds been making for many years. |
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Posted: 1/8/2021 3:25:34 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I kinda hate myself for being interested in this, even though I know I won’t buy it. Leupold hasn’t done anything exciting or innovative in the last decade but I guess it’s still quality stuff. At least the LPVO is pretty light at 13.1 ounces. 1.5-4x doesn’t make much sense in 2021 but their old VXR Patrols still go pretty quickly on the EE so who knows. They're sleepers in the case of the VXR and VXFI. People see not true 1X, only 4X, and the basic reticles and write them off. On the other hand they're the lightest electronic LPVO you can get, they're red dot bright, they have better glass than many optics costing hundreds more, and they do it while only costing $100 more than the vastly inferior typical Chinese stuff. I've come to the conclusion of this importance order for LPVO's after having owned more than I can remember. Glass quality. Daylight illumination. Eye box. Weight. Reticle. Magnification. A loss of 2X is easily negated by better glass quality, and not true 1X is easily negated by a red dot bright reticle. |
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Posted: 1/8/2021 10:47:37 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They're sleepers in the case of the VXR and VXFI. People see not true 1X, only 4X, and the basic reticles and write them off. On the other hand they're the lightest electronic LPVO you can get, they're red dot bright, they have better glass than many optics costing hundreds more, and they do it while only costing $100 more than the vastly inferior typical Chinese stuff. I've come to the conclusion of this importance order for LPVO's after having owned more than I can remember. Glass quality. Daylight illumination. Eye box. Weight. Reticle. Magnification. A loss of 2X is easily negated by better glass quality, and not true 1X is easily negated by a red dot bright reticle. |
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Posted: 1/8/2021 10:58:23 AM EDT
[#9]
I will say though, looking at the rest of the lineup, the other scopes are more interesting.
A 16oz firedot tmr illuminated 4-12x with an offset red dot would be an interesting setup. That's lighter than almost any lpvo other than some trijicon stuff. And an 8-24x that weighs 20oz? I like that. Not a fan of sfp with high mag though. |
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Posted: 1/8/2021 11:11:31 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If it's not 1x I don't care about it being daylight bright. Different strokes, but I've done direct comparisons with my own times. I'm faster with a 1.5X with a red dot bright reticle than I am with a 1X without daylight bright illumination. My VXF was $400. The next daylight bright LPVO after that is a $650-$700 P4xi, which i would likely choose over this new Leupold. |
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Posted: 1/8/2021 11:27:09 AM EDT
[#11]
Have faith in Leupolds ability to screw it up.
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Posted: 1/8/2021 11:28:13 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If it's not 1x I don't care about it being daylight bright. If it’s not 1X or daylight bright I don’t care that it exists. |
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Posted: 1/8/2021 11:31:19 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Have faith in Leupolds ability to screw it up.  Ice cold |
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Posted: 1/8/2021 11:39:00 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ice cold At this point I can only assume that they have someone in the decision making process actively trying to sabotage the company from the inside. “We have a completely redesigned DeltaPoint we’re calling the Pro. Clear glass, big window, shock absorbing spring steel hood. Should be a winner.” “Cool... make sure the battery connection is only secured with tape.” “This new VX-R Patrol should be a hit... The weight, cost and glass quality combined with the Firedot should really make it a winner in its class.” “Excellent! Make certain to only offer it in reticles nobody wants.” ?? Don’t even get me started on the DPP Micro. |
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Posted: 1/8/2021 11:45:18 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They're sleepers in the case of the VXR and VXFI. People see not true 1X, only 4X, and the basic reticles and write them off. On the other hand they're the lightest electronic LPVO you can get, they're red dot bright, they have better glass than many optics costing hundreds more, and they do it while only costing $100 more than the vastly inferior typical Chinese stuff. I've come to the conclusion of this importance order for LPVO's after having owned more than I can remember. Glass quality. Daylight illumination. Eye box. Weight. Reticle. Magnification. A loss of 2X is easily negated by better glass quality, and not true 1X is easily negated by a red dot bright reticle. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I kinda hate myself for being interested in this, even though I know I won’t buy it. Leupold hasn’t done anything exciting or innovative in the last decade but I guess it’s still quality stuff. At least the LPVO is pretty light at 13.1 ounces. 1.5-4x doesn’t make much sense in 2021 but their old VXR Patrols still go pretty quickly on the EE so who knows. They're sleepers in the case of the VXR and VXFI. People see not true 1X, only 4X, and the basic reticles and write them off. On the other hand they're the lightest electronic LPVO you can get, they're red dot bright, they have better glass than many optics costing hundreds more, and they do it while only costing $100 more than the vastly inferior typical Chinese stuff. I've come to the conclusion of this importance order for LPVO's after having owned more than I can remember. Glass quality. Daylight illumination. Eye box. Weight. Reticle. Magnification. A loss of 2X is easily negated by better glass quality, and not true 1X is easily negated by a red dot bright reticle. This^ ...and in shopping glass for a bolt gun project the 8-24 looks like a steal w/ incl. features & it’s light as heck. I’ll definitely be looking @ these. |
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Posted: 1/8/2021 12:30:53 PM EDT
[#16]
After more reading, (they are visible on Optics Planet) looks like at least some have a zero stop too. That makes them a bit more interesting. I had one of the older Mark AR 1.5-4s and I sold it because I did not trust the uncapped turrets, which seemed more apt to get bumped off zero than other scopes. Otherwise it was good.
I agree leupold does have some things going... made in USA, good glass, good warranty, and LIGHT. Prices are good on their lower end lines, but way high on their high end lines I'd love it if they made one of these in 2.5-8x36 (like the old Mark 4 used on the MK12) but with updated illumination, good mil reticle (TMR?), capped/zero stop adjustments I'm curious to see leupolds marketing/announcement... "We've again revolutionized the tactical optics world" 
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Posted: 1/8/2021 8:56:35 PM EDT
[#17]
The VX-6 1-6x is one of the most underrated LPVOs in my opinion. Too bad they didn't just refine that line with nuclear bright daylight illumination and better reticle options.
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Posted: 1/8/2021 10:03:45 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The VX-6 1-6x is one of the most underrated LPVOs in my opinion. Too bad they didn't just refine that line with nuclear bright daylight illumination and better reticle options. |
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Posted: 1/8/2021 10:23:37 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The VX-6 1-6x is one of the most underrated LPVOs in my opinion. Too bad they didn't just refine that line with nuclear bright daylight illumination and better reticle options. That the Leupold MO, though... bring a product 90-95% of the way to greatness and then blow it. |
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Posted: 1/8/2021 10:53:45 PM EDT
[#20]
Reticle leaves a lot to be desired.
I feel like I say that a lot when it comes to Leupold |
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Posted: 1/8/2021 11:02:33 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That the Leupold MO, though... bring a product 90-95% of the way to greatness and then blow it. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: The VX-6 1-6x is one of the most underrated LPVOs in my opinion. Too bad they didn't just refine that line with nuclear bright daylight illumination and better reticle options. That the Leupold MO, though... bring a product 90-95% of the way to greatness and then blow it. Definitely. They have every component necessary to make a great optic, yet they insist on only including a random two-thirds of them on any given optic while inexplicably omitting the rest. |
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Posted: 1/9/2021 11:31:31 AM EDT
[#22]
i have 2 vx6 1-6 cmr scopes. they are fantastic. i wish they would build a 1-8 or 1-10
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Posted: 1/9/2021 11:08:53 PM EDT
[#23]
I love the new line up but the 1.5x.
But that reticle is a bit busy. |
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Posted: 1/31/2021 12:08:00 PM EDT
[#24]
I've come back to this thread like 10 times now to look at these.
The p4xi is going for $800, and I really don't think it's an $800 optic. Add to it the VXFI (which I pretty much praise) turned out to just be an introductory special for the VXF line. So it looks like this is the new cheapest red dot bright LPVO? The closest competitors are the p4xi and Accupoint, neither of which have HD glass or the feature set of these. I may have to buy one for my 308 carbine. |
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Posted: 1/31/2021 1:18:57 PM EDT
[#25]
It's like they're trying to go out of business.
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Posted: 1/31/2021 1:30:15 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's like they're trying to go out of business. How so? Just curious where the big disconnect on this is. |
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Posted: 1/31/2021 2:10:27 PM EDT
[#27]
What a joke...
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Posted: 1/31/2021 2:24:32 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How so? Just curious where the big disconnect on this is. My personal issues are: 1.5-4x - is this a joke? Literally missed the mark (on both ends, some would argue) on their new 'Mark' LPVO. 3-9x - is ok. 4/6/8-whateverX - are all 2nd focal plane. |
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Posted: 1/31/2021 3:45:19 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My personal issues are: 1.5-4x - is this a joke? Literally missed the mark (on both ends, some would argue) on their new 'Mark' LPVO. 3-9x - is ok. 4/6/8-whateverX - are all 2nd focal plane. 1.5X with a red dot bright reticle is going to outperform 1X without it. I used to be give or take on daylight brightness until I timed myself on them side by side. 5 yards or 100, red dot brightness wins over true 1X. The only optics that compete in the same arena are the Vortex PST Gen II, Steiner P4xi, and Trijicon Accupoint. Of which most are more expensive, most are made in Asia, none use HD glass, none are as lightweight, most don't have zero stops, none have quick throw magnification, and none are as compact. It's not perfect, but it has a balance most people don't even know they need. |
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Posted: 1/31/2021 3:57:08 PM EDT
[#30]
1.5x? lol
Right up there with their "new" 30mm red dot with specs from 15 years ago |
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Posted: 1/31/2021 4:01:09 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've come back to this thread like 10 times now to look at these. The p4xi is going for $800, and I really don't think it's an $800 optic. Add to it the VXFI (which I pretty much praise) turned out to just be an introductory special for the VXF line. So it looks like this is the new cheapest red dot bright LPVO? The closest competitors are the p4xi and Accupoint, neither of which have HD glass or the feature set of these. I may have to buy one for my 308 carbine. What about the Zeiss conquest V4? I've been seeing these for less than $500 right now. There is also the Trijicon Credo line. |
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Posted: 1/31/2021 4:27:06 PM EDT
[#32]
I don't understand why the keep falling back on 1.5x magnification... They know how to do true 1x... They could be making bank on these. But what do I know
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Posted: 1/31/2021 9:54:58 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What about the Zeiss conquest V4? I've been seeing these for less than $500 right now. There is also the Trijicon Credo line. Neither are daylight bright, nor HD glass. If that doesn't matter to you, I haven't heard anything bad about the Zeiss and don't know anything about it first hand. I had a couple of Accupowers but end of the day they get outshined, especially with their new price as the Credo. It was good quality for $450. I'd feel like I got took if I paid the current $700 pricing for the 1-4. |
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Posted: 2/1/2021 5:34:49 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The VX-6 1-6x is one of the most underrated LPVOs in my opinion. Too bad they didn't just refine that line with nuclear bright daylight illumination and better reticle options. this... all day long. The VXR and VX6 are extremely underrated and their glass punches at price points way over what you can find them used and they are lightweight to boot. Not to mention their illuminated dot reticles are borderline nuclear bright. I have both and zero desire to upgrade either. I can’t believe they discontinue the VX-R patrol AND the VX-6. Those were the two Most affordable high-quality-light LPVOs on the market. So then they they introduce what appears to be a less sleek version of the VX-R at a higher price point with the same “Achilles Heel” (1.5x low end). They could have simply rebadged the VX-R, given it true 1x, offered a couple less ghey reticle options, added $50 to the price .... they would have owned the mid-tier 1-4x market with a clear robust lightweight $550 option. 
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Posted: 2/1/2021 5:53:53 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: 1.5X with a red dot bright reticle is going to outperform 1X without it. I used to be give or take on daylight brightness until I timed myself on them side by side. 5 yards or 100, red dot brightness wins over true 1X. The only optics that compete in the same arena are the Vortex PST Gen II, Steiner P4xi, and Trijicon Accupoint. Of which most are more expensive, most are made in Asia, none use HD glass, none are as lightweight, most don't have zero stops, none have quick throw magnification, and none are as compact. It's not perfect, but it has a balance most people don't even know they need. But Leupolds don’t HAVE to be 1.5x to be nuclear bright. Get both. The firedot reticle vx-6 they used to offer had nuclear bright center dots AND true 1X... AND more zoom ratio. There is no reason they can’t do a 4x zoom with bright dot if they can make both a 3x ratio (VXR) and a 6x ratio (VX6). The misconception and demonization of “1.5x  ” is what keeps used VXRs cheap. If they were true 1-4x then the used VX-Rs would be $50-100 more expensive in the EE. Although Leupold would have discontinued them even sooner than they did because their market strategy is to avoid profit and innovation... of course innovation is acceptable if it’s to come up with a product that is extra not profitable (like re-releasing a discontinued product at a higher price with the same shortcomings).
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Posted: 2/1/2021 7:25:47 AM EDT
[#36]
Well, atleast it's light.
It's kinda got my interest if it's an inch shorter and an ounce lighter than a TR24. Seems like Leupold is always like 2 degrees off from center of with their product development lately. But I'll agree the 1.5x isn't a deal breaker in practical application. |
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Posted: 2/1/2021 7:28:21 AM EDT
[#37]
I have no idea why you guys bag on Leupold for Duplex reticles in low power SFP scopes. That is all you need in a SFP LPVO if you have a custom BDC elevation turret... and the turret works at any magnification, not just max.
Why more people did not buy VX5HD and VX6HD Firedot scopes I will never understand. A 1.5-4× Firedot scope like this or VXR? Would not use it if it was given to me for free. If Leupold make a 1-4× Firedot shorter and lighter than the VX5HD I might swap, but this VX3 is a joke. |
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Posted: 2/1/2021 8:15:27 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have no idea why you guys bag on Leupold for Duplex reticles in low power SFP scopes. That is all you need in a SFP LPVO if you have a custom BDC elevation turret... and the turret works at any magnification, not just max. Why more people did not buy VX5HD and VX6HD Firedot scopes I will never understand. The simple answer is that many people shooting on a timer - which is more than just 3gun guys - need holdovers on their reticle. Dialing is not practical or fast enough if you have to engage targets at 300, 400, and 500 in rapid succession. This isn't to say there is a valid time and place for dialing - of course there is - but having the holdovers on your reticle doesn't hurt you in that scenario, either. As for the Mark3HD, you are correct that the whole market has passed that by. No one is going to spend $700 on a 1.5-4x anymore unless they're purely buying it on the Leupold name. Doesn't matter what kind of glass is in there, doesn't matter how bright it is. I don't know what Leupold's marketing dept is thinking these days, but this thing is a huge dud. A version of this that was a true 1-4 with a good reticle and a price point at $400-$500 street MIGHT have been enough to get me to consider it. Maybe. |
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Posted: 2/1/2021 3:38:22 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I have no idea why you guys bag on Leupold for Duplex reticles in low power SFP scopes. That is all you need in a SFP LPVO if you have a custom BDC elevation turret... and the turret works at any magnification, not just max. Why more people did not buy VX5HD and VX6HD Firedot scopes I will never understand. A 1.5-4× Firedot scope like this or VXR? Would not use it if it was given to me for free. If Leupold make a 1-4× Firedot shorter and lighter than the VX5HD I might swap, but this VX3 is a joke. Someone didn't look at the specs, did they? |
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Posted: 2/1/2021 8:05:30 PM EDT
[#40]
The Mark 6 1-6 has been discontinued but nothing new to replace it’s quite disappointing
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Posted: 2/2/2021 1:52:39 AM EDT
[#41]
Mark 5 LPVO appears to be on the way.
ILya |
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Posted: 2/2/2021 7:46:47 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Mark 5 LPVO appears to be on the way. If they can keep it at 14oz like the VX-5HD, and put in a usable FireDot reticle with drops, I think it would be quite popular as long as the pricing is in line with Tango6 and Razor lines. |
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Posted: 2/2/2021 10:14:36 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Mark 6 1-6 has been discontinued but nothing new to replace it’s quite disappointing For the life of me I dont know why they discontinued that scope. |
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Posted: 2/2/2021 10:19:30 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: For the life of me I dont know why they discontinued that scope. I didn't know it was discontinued -- it's my favorite LPVO
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Posted: 2/2/2021 11:30:56 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: At this point I can only assume that they have someone in the decision making process actively trying to sabotage the company from the inside. “We have a completely redesigned DeltaPoint we’re calling the Pro. Clear glass, big window, shock absorbing spring steel hood. Should be a winner.” Don't look at Aaron Cowan's drop test in the DP Pro LOL |
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Posted: 2/2/2021 12:17:13 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Mark 5 LPVO appears to be on the way. ILya Last year they said stays tune for 2021 shot show. Now the show is cancelled but they didn’t include into this 2021 release, so I guess they are coming out this year. |
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Posted: 2/2/2021 1:31:00 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The VX-6 1-6x is one of the most underrated LPVOs in my opinion. Too bad they didn't just refine that line with nuclear bright daylight illumination and better reticle options. Agree, but I do like the firedot G BDC reticle......could be a little brighter but it's still visible in daylight bright conditions. I have a VX6-HD and my main complaint isn't the reticle, it's the push knob. It's a clunky system and I'd rather have a turn knob with off positions between illumination. Leupold clearly doesn't pay attention to the tactical scope market and what the majority of buyers want, but this isn't a new revelation. A 1.5x LPVO would NEVER be a consideration for me, regardless of price/quality. |
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Posted: 2/2/2021 1:47:28 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I really think Leupold is trying to piss off its consumers. A LPVO with 1.5x on the low end and only 4x on the top end and $700 WTF. These guys have the secret ingredients to make a VERY lightweight, yet durable LPVO and daylight bright illumination technology combined with motion sensitive on/off to enhance battery life and they arent willing to unleash it and make tons of fucking money. ETA: maybe they didn't make a bunch of sales out of the VX6 with the BDC reticle. Idk If they made the VR-X firedot SPR with a true 1X, I would have them on at least 4 of my rifles. Maybe more. Edit: so we have any Leupold reps on this site? |
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Posted: 2/2/2021 2:49:55 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This. If they made the VR-X firedot SPR with a true 1X, I would have them on at least 4 of my rifles. Maybe more. Edit: so we have any Leupold reps on this site? Same. I have a few VX-6 1-6x scopes and I would buy more from them in 1-4x, 1-6x, 1-8x, etc. if they would just make the damn things with on the bottom. I don’t understand what the disconnect is for Leupold. I could even deal with the “clunky” adjustment button setup if they would just give us the nuclear brightness and additional reticle options. The adjust button isn’t that terrible, but it definitely could be better. Once I realized you can change adjustment direction from “high” to “low” by holding the button down for 2-3 seconds that made it a little less clunky for me personally. It should still just be a turn-dial knob either way though obviously. |
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Posted: 2/4/2021 1:17:50 AM EDT
[#50]
I’m in for two and let me tell you, I am an optics snob. The biggest problem I have with variables on carbines and SBRs is weight and balance of the gun! I have bought and sold the following LPVOs for reasons I’ll explain:
1) Schmidt Bender 1-8 Short Dot CC. Sold it due to weight and footprint. This scope was major bucks too! But the glass is unrivaled. The locking turrets and the illumination are spectacular! Just too big and heavy. I’ll probably buy another one some day - LOL! 2) Swarovski Z8i. Weight was pretty good. Footprint not so much. I probably should have kept this scope. Honestly, the aesthetics bothered me. The rear illumination ehhh. 3) Kahles K16i. I bought two of these with different reticles. Man they were nice. But the illumination was so-so and the parts of the reticle that absorb the illumination when not illuminated had a faded out gray look that bothered me. That and I’m not a 1 MOA big center dot guy. 4) NF NX8. Sooooo sooo close. Footprint, weight, illumination. This is by far the sexiest of the LPVOs. I had two of these at one time. Two gripes - the FFP center dot on 8x is ginormous!!! And I didn’t care for the exposed elevation turret. It’s so dumb that only LEOs can get capped turrets. A 1-6 FFP or SFP would be better. 5) Vortex Razor Gen III. 10x is too much for this envelope. And yes, weight. It’s too heavy. Just like it’s little brother the Razor 1-6. Just too much weight for a carbine or SBR. 6) Schmidt Bender 1-4 Short Dot. Glass and illumination is amazing! Too heavy. And the hash marks in the reticles were terrible. I’m excited to try the Mark 3 HD. Super light weight and daylight bright illumination with good glass and for the price - why not? I don’t care about 4x on the high end or 1.5 on the bottom. I’ve run 8 and 4x in field carbine courses and they perform the same out to 300 yards on torso sized targets. I don’t need special reticles for this either. If the Mark 3 HD doesn’t work out - screw it!!! I’m going with the decade old TR24!!!! I’m out! |
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