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MO, USA
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Posted: 1/23/2024 11:45:12 AM EDT
Hello! First post here and I’m sorry to start with a question. I did a search first…
I have a lower receiver purchased at a gun store. They did the NICs check and I assume they ran it as a “long gun” but not sure. It’s one of those “multi” marked lowers. What do I need to do to legally build a pistol on this receiver? I’m strictly talking about the legality of making a receiver into a pistol. Not talking about parts or accessories, just wether it’s legal to build a pistol on this receiver. Thanks for any help. |
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PA, USA
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Posted: 1/23/2024 11:51:54 AM EDT
[#1]
You can build it into a pistol. Whatever the gun store marked on the 4473 ultimately doesn't matter to you, lowers are supposed be marked "other" but that's their problem if they did it wrong not yours.
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Posted: 1/23/2024 11:52:53 AM EDT
[#2]
If the receiver the start out life as a stripped item. That is, it was never a rifle then you can build anything that you want out of it.
Remember if it starts out as a pistol, then you turn it into a rifle then you turn it back into a pistol or whatever else makes you happy you’re good but once a rifle always a rifle |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 1/23/2024 12:45:05 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 18B30: once a rifle always a rifle Commonly used phrase, but kind of misleading. If it starts as a rifle, it's always a rifle. I get what you were saying, just trying to clarify for the OP. |
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Posted: 1/23/2024 12:50:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: RenegadeX]
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 18B30: but once a rifle always a rifle Over 30 years ago SCOTUS said WRONG, yet it still gets repeated. |
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OK, USA
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Posted: 1/23/2024 12:53:48 PM EDT
[#5]
When the gun store wrongly entered it as a rifle it sealed that lower's fate.
It's on record as a rifle and it's your word against theirs and guess who the ATF is going with. Lowers are cheap now, start over and save the potential problems. Build a rifle or sell the lower. |
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Posted: 1/23/2024 12:57:45 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 18B30: If the receiver the start out life as a stripped item. That is, it was never a rifle then you can build anything that you want out of it. Remember if it starts out as a pistol, then you turn it into a rifle then you turn it back into a pistol or whatever else makes you happy you’re good but FIFY. 
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Posted: 1/23/2024 12:59:55 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By hotdog250j: When the gun store wrongly entered it as a rifle it sealed that lower's fate. It's on record as a rifle and it's your word against theirs and guess who the ATF is going with. Lowers are cheap now, start over and save the potential problems. Build a rifle or sell the lower. Show me a single case, just one, that shows the ATF charging someone for building a pistol on a lower receiver of any designation. At the end of the day we are quibbling over nothing. |
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Posted: 1/23/2024 1:01:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: RenegadeX]
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By hotdog250j: When the gun store wrongly entered it as a rifle it sealed that lower's fate. It's on record as a rifle and it's your word against theirs and guess who the ATF is going with. Lowers are cheap now, start over and save the potential problems. Build a rifle or sell the lower. No, incorrect entries are FFL problem and are fixable. If it came to it, a trace would show it left MFG as a lower, passed to distributor as lower, went to dealer as lower, receipt would show lower and typical lower price, and most dealers do not have 07 MFG license so it would not be on books as lower, etc. |
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FM, USA
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Posted: 1/23/2024 1:03:23 PM EDT
[#9]
Op if your concerned Anderson has their stealth lowers $34.
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Posted: 1/23/2024 1:03:27 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By -Obsessed-: Remember if it starts out as a pistol, then you turn it into a rifle then you turn it back into a pistol or whatever else makes you happy you’re good but once first a rifle always a rifle FIFY. Still not true. Rifles can become machine guns (legally not a rifle), shotguns, or DDs. |
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Posted: 1/23/2024 1:04:15 PM EDT
[#11]
If it is a stripped receiver that has never had a buttstock installed you can build it into anything you want.
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Posted: 1/23/2024 1:10:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: RenegadeX]
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By bgenlvtex: If it is a stripped receiver that has never had a buttstock installed you can build it into anything you want. Still not true. Stocks alone do not make it other than other. It remains other until it legally is made into something else. |
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Posted: 1/23/2024 2:05:16 PM EDT
[#13]
Originally Posted By Lollygagger: Hello! First post here and I’m sorry to start with a question. I did a search first… I have a lower receiver purchased at a gun store. They did the NICs check and I assume they ran it as a “long gun” but not sure. It’s one of those “multi” marked lowers. What do I need to do to legally build a pistol on this receiver? I’m strictly talking about the legality of making a receiver into a pistol. Not talking about parts or accessories, just wether it’s legal to build a pistol on this receiver. Thanks for any help. You should assume they ran it correctly and marked "other" and receiver on the 4473 and the NICS check as sale of "other" Build away. Guns shop's problem (if there ever is one but unlikely), not yours at this point. |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 1/23/2024 2:07:50 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By hotdog250j: When the gun store wrongly entered it as a rifle it sealed that lower's fate. It's on record as a rifle and it's your word against theirs and guess who the ATF is going with. Lowers are cheap now, start over and save the potential problems. Build a rifle or sell the lower. Not true at all. Also, OP said he "assumed" it was logged in as a rifle. Stripped lowers are not designated as either. |
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Posted: 1/23/2024 2:25:11 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RenegadeX: Still not true. Rifles can become machine guns (legally not a rifle), shotguns, or DDs. Actually yes it is true. If you turn it into a MG, DD, etc, you have to F1 or F2 it (depending on your SOT/FFL status, if any), which constitutes making a new firearm. They legally are not the same firearm. When you take a lower and built it into a rifle, or a pistol, etc it's legally the same firearm. |
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Posted: 1/23/2024 2:27:43 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RenegadeX: Still not true. Stocks alone do not make it other than other. It remains other until it legally is made into something else. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By RenegadeX: Originally Posted By bgenlvtex: If it is a stripped receiver that has never had a buttstock installed you can build it into anything you want. Still not true. Stocks alone do not make it other than other. It remains other until it legally is made into something else. Well, yeah until it is mated with an upper. |
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Posted: 1/23/2024 2:34:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: mancow]
[#17]
After all this I'm sure OP is perfectly clear on the topic now.
 Hey OP, nobody knows. |
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Posted: 1/23/2024 3:15:25 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By -Obsessed-: Actually yes it is true. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By -Obsessed-: Actually yes it is true. So when a 16" 556 upper is replaced with a 18" 12GA shotgun upper, it is still a rifle? No the rifle is now a shotgun. Originally Posted By -Obsessed-: If you turn it into a MG, DD, etc, you have to F1 or F2 it (depending on your SOT/FFL status, if any), which constitutes making a new firearm. They legally are not the same firearm. Exactly. A rifle is not always a rifle. It can become something else in this case it is MG/DD/etc. Thanks for making my point. |
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MO, USA
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Posted: 1/23/2024 4:19:23 PM EDT
[#19]
I see I should’ve mentioned that it is a stripped receiver. One of those Anderson’s that comes sealed in the clamshell packaging. I didn’t know they could call it in as “other”. I was only aware of the long gun and hand gun designations. So I assume they did it right. - My assumption that they called it in as a rifle was just my ignorance.
Thanks everyone for the replies. I assume the same logic applies for US-made AK receivers that were never assembled into anything or drilled? |
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Posted: 1/23/2024 4:59:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: bionicmonkey]
[#20]
buy an 80%. finish it. build into whatever you want. no paper trail to disagree with how you make it come out
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Posted: 1/23/2024 5:54:23 PM EDT
[#21]
If it is marked "multi" that should be proof enough that it was not a rifle, am I correct in that a rifle would have the caliber marked?
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MN, USA
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Posted: 1/23/2024 6:57:20 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By motoguzzi: If it is marked "multi" that should be proof enough that it was not a rifle, am I correct in that a rifle would have the caliber marked? Not all. And, even pistols come in rifle caliber. |
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Posted: 1/23/2024 8:58:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: JoeBud]
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By s4s4u: Not all. And, even pistols come in rifle caliber. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By s4s4u: Not all. And, even pistols come in rifle caliber. And, even rifles come in pistol calibers. :) Originally Posted By motoguzzi: If it is marked "multi" that should be proof enough that it was not a rifle, am I correct in that a rifle would have the caliber marked? The only caliber marking that matters is on the barrel. In the AR world the caliber designation on the receiver is irrelevant. That’s why the “multi” designation came to be. |
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Posted: 1/23/2024 9:21:27 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Lollygagger: So I assume they did it right. - My assumption that they called it in as a rifle was just my ignorance. Don't be so sure. I had to dump my previous FFL for reporting my stripped lowers as "long guns". I didn't know any better at that point in time. |
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Posted: 1/24/2024 12:12:51 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By s4s4u: Not all. And, even pistols come in rifle caliber. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By s4s4u: Originally Posted By motoguzzi: If it is marked "multi" that should be proof enough that it was not a rifle, am I correct in that a rifle would have the caliber marked? Not all. And, even pistols come in rifle caliber. A rifle would need to have the caliber marked on it somewhere. A rifle receiver does not need to have the caliber marked. |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 1/24/2024 1:22:13 AM EDT
[Last Edit: s4s4u]
[#26]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: A rifle would need to have the caliber marked on it somewhere. A rifle receiver does not need to have the caliber marked. I guess that might depend on who built the rifle. I have many rifles with no caliber markings on them. |
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Posted: 1/24/2024 1:38:31 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By TGWLDR: Don't be so sure. I had to dump my previous FFL for reporting my stripped lowers as "long guns". I didn't know any better at that point in time. This. I built a SBR on a stripped receiver simply because the shop ran it as a rifle and I was too naive at the time to know any better. It was pre-AR pistol times and I thought they were all rifle receivers. |
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Posted: 1/24/2024 10:56:46 AM EDT
[#28]
If your plan was legal on Jan 20, 2021, it is legal today.
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Posted: 1/24/2024 1:42:52 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By s4s4u: I guess that might depend on who built the rifle. I have many rifles with no caliber markings on them. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By s4s4u: Originally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: A rifle would need to have the caliber marked on it somewhere. A rifle receiver does not need to have the caliber marked. I guess that might depend on who built the rifle. I have many rifles with no caliber markings on them. I’m speaking from a legal standpoint. That’s one of the requirements of a completed firearm. Obviously there are tons of incorrectly built and/or illegal firearms out there. Always have been. |
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Posted: 1/24/2024 4:32:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: JoeBud]
[#30]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: I’m speaking from a legal standpoint. That’s one of the requirements of a completed firearm. Obviously there are tons of incorrectly built and/or illegal firearms out there. Always have been. From what I understand, a "completed" firearm is required at the time of manufacture and/or import. A receiver sold as an incomplete firearm is not required to have a caliber mark if the caliber is unknown at that time. |
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MN, USA
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Posted: 1/24/2024 6:04:00 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: I’m speaking from a legal standpoint. That’s one of the requirements of a completed firearm. Obviously there are tons of incorrectly built and/or illegal firearms out there. Always have been. Guess I'm still not following. I know of no requirement for me to inscribe the caliber on the lower receiver of a rifle that I have built. In fact I have several lowers that share time with uppers of different chamberings. Or, are you just referring to factory manufactured firearms? |
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Posted: 1/24/2024 6:26:02 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 18B30: If the receiver the start out life as a stripped item. That is, it was never a rifle then you can build anything that you want out of it. Remember if it starts out as a pistol, then you turn it into a rifle then you turn it back into a pistol or whatever else makes you happy you’re good but once a rifle always a rifle  |
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Posted: 1/24/2024 8:08:55 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By s4s4u: Guess I'm still not following. I know of no requirement for me to inscribe the caliber on the lower receiver of a rifle that I have built. In fact I have several lowers that share time with uppers of different chamberings. Or, are you just referring to factory manufactured firearms? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By s4s4u: Originally Posted By ALASKANFIRE: I’m speaking from a legal standpoint. That’s one of the requirements of a completed firearm. Obviously there are tons of incorrectly built and/or illegal firearms out there. Always have been. Guess I'm still not following. I know of no requirement for me to inscribe the caliber on the lower receiver of a rifle that I have built. In fact I have several lowers that share time with uppers of different chamberings. Or, are you just referring to factory manufactured firearms? Caliber can be marked on the barrel as well. I’m not aware of a law to force that on home builds. Manufacturers have to mark it. I think it’s required on barrels being commercially as well. Been a long time since I’ve read the codes on that stuff. |
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