Looking for something more distance and power-driven to round out my rifle collection, leaning towards 308.

Debating going with a battle rifle that can also serves a long distance purpose with a good scope (ATACR). I had a DD5 V3 that I regret selling so if I go this route it would be this gun.
Reason I sold it is because I looked at it as an all purpose tool and replacement to 556 for SHTF. At $1 per round it’s just too expensive and heavy in that regard. I have a couple 556s that arent going anywhere and if SHTF I’m grabbing one of those, BUT perhaps this DD5 can work under new expectations that it will be practiced with much more sparingly, serving as a nice distance rifle while being a plan B backup to a 556

OR

Do I scrap this battle rifle idea and go dedicated long range? My options here are

Tikka CTR: cheaper up front and can customize as I go

Tikka Tac A1: twice as expensive but all the leg work is done. Only downside is regretting skipping the customization as I get deeper down the rabbit hole of distance shooting.  

Full context I’m fairly new to distance shooting and my local range goes to 300. Not looking to get into competitions at the moment but maybe some day.

What do you guys think? Any context is helpful

I have tossed this around a bit myself.  I would build a bolt gun on a chassis that takes common magazines.  The size is what attracts me to the AR platform, the large frame is not in that realm.

The SFAR has thrown a wrinkle in that, but until they get all the bugs worked out I will keep my distance.  

I know there a dudes that drop binary triggers in large frames and more power to them.  I gonna slow press and work the handle.

If I could have only one (gas or bolt) I'd go with a gas gun.  I like my 16" .308 AR as it's compact "enough" for closer in work but can reach out to 1000 yards.  

Yup.

17S can shoot sub-MOA with 168gr FGMM (iffy with 175gr).

18” G2 SASS consistently does sub-MOA with 168gr OR 175gr FGMM. Swapped out the cheese grater, PRS stock and grip for lighter options. Works for both roles, now.

Yeahhhhh I think this is the way to go. Back to the DD5 I go, this was all I needed to see so thank you brother.  What mount are you using on your NF?

I just went through this thought process and went with the SFAR in 16".

However I will still build a precision bolt action down the road but stupid Colorado AWB pushed me to get the SFAR first.  

In my AO, you have to seek out a specific place to even be able to shoot beyond about 400 yards. I'm not talking about just shooting ranges. Just look around where you live,  where you hunt etc. Bring a range finder.  How often can you find yourself shooting at longer ranges? If you have many places where you can even see 5,6,700 yards plus,  then go ahead and go for the precision build.  Bolt gun or AR 10 doesn't matter.  You'll have a chance to use it.  But if you are maxed out at 300 or 400 yards, then you really don't need that much precision.  A battle rifle is adequate with something like an ACOG and you are really only taking advantage of the increased energy of 308.

Btw, if you go bolt gun,  I wouldn't be entertaining 308. A short action caliber in 6 6.5 or 7mm is going to have an accuracy advantage due largely to the modern and tighter sammi specs for the chamber. I think a 308 can get there but needs a custom barrel and chamber cut in order to do it, or just a high end gun that cuts it to their own specs.  And a quick search on ammo seek reveals that 6.5 CM is actually cheaper on average than 308, not to mention,  better quality compared to the cheapest 308 loads( ignoring steel case).

I have two 308 AR platforms. I bought a CTR for hunting. Purchased several guns since then.  The only one that is close for favorite is my Tikka super varmint in 6.5 prc. The CTR has a perfect balance and is very accurate.

BR.

If you're settled on .308, gas gun for sure. 6.5CM would probably be the better bet though if you're starting fresh.

It really depends on what you plan on using the rifle for.  While the 6.5 is probably better at 1000 yds, are you really good enough to be able to effectively use it at that range? 308Win/7.62x51 would be more common and easily found.  The nice thing about the AR platform is the ability to easily change uppers for specific requirements. For long range you really want a longer barrel, something around 24".  The 168 gr 308 bullet is known for going subsonic at about 800 yds, and going subsonic is known to affect the bullet stability and accuracy.  That's why the 175 gr was developed and used. Going from a 24" barrel to a 16" barrel and one loses close to 200 fps(roughly 25fps per inch of barrel).  But that depends on the bullet and powder type.  Some lose less per inch.
However, the longer barrel is heavier, and a bit harder to manipulate.  Personally, I don't have much use for 16" barrels, but I do have a couple of 18" barreled guns.  They are much louder. One can easily make a spare upper with a different barrel length for different uses.
Essentially, if you plan on shooting at longer ranges, you really need a longer barrel.  In the 22" to 24" range.  For shorter ranges, a shorter barrel will work adequately.

https://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2015/06/308-win-barrel-cut-down-test-velocity-vs-barrel-length/#:~:text=The%20testers%20observed%3A%20“The%20Berger,standard%2024″%20barrel'.”

It's a Reptilia

Bolt for long range  AR10 for shorter range may work. Thinking long action like 338 in bolt and 458 in AR10. Just  my thoughts.

Well, darn…

Gonna have to look those up, now.

P.S.
Not sure why FN chose the slower twist rate for the 17S.

My 2 cents with both types

I have an MR762 and a Tikka tac a1 (20inch) both 308 the Tikka is getting a 6.5creed barrel with switch lug by WTO soon so i will have both 308 and 6.5CM on it.

IMO two totally different rifles and shooting style lots of info here from experts am only a newb.

I use the MR762 nominal 300yd to 600yd it struggles out at 1000yd (targets are small about 1.3MOA at the 1000yd range with 185gr FGMM Juggs) or maybe its me. What i like about the large frame AR is that it is a challenge and tests/exercises my fundamentals thoroughly. MR is a piston gun so more moving mass. DI is superior for precision / accuracy but I hate to clean and enjoy the large frame piston rifle challenge besides I like the HK MR762.    

The tac a1 is a tackdriver shoots better at 1000yd (308, sure the 6.5 will shine) and is a more forgiving beautiful well made rifle (some minor issues with it as with all things we make).

After I shoot the MR and hone in good precision (<1.4MOA 600yd - 15 to 20 rounds -, 10 and X's on an MR1 target - dont happen to often always a pesky nine creeps in LOL) and accuracy jumping on the tac a1 is like cake walk.

My Tikka tac a1 is easily a sub MOA rifle (again 15 to 20 rounds) at 600yd (308), at 1000yd with 185gr FGMM Juggs it rings steel continuously and misses when i screw up. If i shoot it often though it spoils me and I get sloppy so i go back to the MR to recharge my fundamentals.

Both types of rifles use high end glass MR S&B 5-20X, MR Steiner 3-15X (for AR tactical 300,500,600yd competitions) and tac a1 Kahles 5-25X, IMO good rifles deserve good glass but it is costly, I like Ramen noodles LMAO.

Guess my point is they are different animals why I got both.  Regards, PeterNNH

Well, I did the "Get Both". I picked up a Tikka T3 Light in 6.5 and a POF Prescott (Also 6.5). They each fit different purposes. I prefer the Tikka for hunting and the POF for more "run and gun" type stuff. Sadly havent made it out to do any long range comps with either as of yet as I've been too focused on NRL22 stuff. If I had to choose only one its be a tough call. Both are sub MOA out of the gate but the POF does start to open up a bit when it heats up. First 8 or 10 are right where you want'm, after that it's a solid "moa-ish" gun.

Of the two....I probably prefer the Prescott. Its an incredible rifle. In full loadout with ammo it's a smidge over 10 pounds. Its accurate as hell and has fast follow up shots. I much prefer the Tikka for walking the fields of course, but the POF is a more well rounded gun IMO. While we can wax all day on 308 vs 6.5, I choose 6.5 primarily for recoil reasons. Both are expensive to feed so it's not like I'm pulling the trigger like a retard on a drum set with either one so cost wasnt really a factor for me.

So my suggestion to you is check out POF rifles. The 308 is both lighter and shorter than the Prescott. Its in the same price range as DD gear and lighter weight. Ruger SFAR is a fantastic option if you are willing to potentially invest a bit of time working through any kinks you may have but its very doable and theres a good thread in this subforum which covers all the various possible issues.

I have both a 16" Rock River Elite Operator and a Ruger RPR.  The Rock River is a spectacular rifle with a geat stock trigger and exceptional barrel (1.5moa).  In retrospect I probably could have gone with more generic AR-10 pattern for more interchangeable parts and accessories options. But the Rock River does use FAL mags so thats a plus.   


Yea, calibers like 6.5 Creedmoor are going to get you to a thousand yards+ but you're spending or reloading at a very expensive cost per round .   If you're settled on .308 and don't want to go down the rabbit hole of customizing up at potentially great expense I'd take a serious look at the RPR.  1st day out I was printing Cloverleafs at a hundred yards with commercial Match ammo. I put a Timney in it but, honestly, the stock trigger is wonderful.  The only thing you'll have to replace is the awful stock it comes with. The Magpul PRS Light butt stock is perfect and doesn't add much weight.  Other than that it's great out of the box. Might want to put a fancy knurled bolt handle but I find the one included is fine for me.

Match ammo for a 6.5creed is no more expensive than .308. In some cases, it’s cheaper.

IMO, unless you have a stockpile of .308 ammo or are planning on a SBR build, a 6.5creed is a better option if there’s any chance you’ll shoot beyond 600yds.

All my precision rifles are semi-autos. I don't need .3 MOA. .55-.65 is more than enough. Not having to break position (until the mag runs out) and having faster follow-up shots are more important for me. .308's a great general purpose cartridge, but something like 6.5 Creedmoor is a better long range performer. Cost per round is pretty close. I have both.

And because of that you missed the heart shot and had to settle for a lung shot. Not a margin of error I would accept. Not at all. Sloppy. Sloppy.



All jokes aside, I hate carrying an AR style rifle in the field. Not sure why but a bolt gun just carries on the back better and sets in the truck better (In my opinion)

I’ve had large frame ARs but always sell them. They are clunky and you have to be perfect with your fundamentals especially follow through. Eventually I settled on a 16” precision AR in 5.56 and a 20” 6.5 bolt action. There’s always 22 or 6mm ARC if you want more from a small frame.

BATTLE RIFLE

Different tools for different jobs.  Mostly.

And while an properly configured AR10 can do just about everything a Bolt Gun can, the reverse is not true.

After that type of failure, seppuku is the only reasonable option.

True marksmen would accept no lesser punishment.

I think you'll get more use out of the gas gun.

If you're thinking of SHTF scenarios, then a 308 gas gun is a powerful tool to have if your plan is to remain in place and defend your territory.



While I love my 6.5 Creedmoor bolt gun for general purpose hunting and bench shooting, I absolutely love my 16" 308 AR-10. It's a bit heavy, weighing in at over 12 pounds with suppressor and optic, but this isn't the rifle I"m grabbing if I had to move my family to a safer location. It's the rifle I'm pointing out the window or setting up in an ambush position.

Other than the SHTF stuff, my AR-10 is simply very satisfying to shoot. I love 308.

Questions like these are where the LMT MWS shines. I love them enough I built out a second one. Mine is an original quad rail MWS…bought a 16” LW CL barrel and an MLOK upper for maximum weight savings. Tossed the ACOG/RMR on that. Then started building out the original upper into a DMR. Just waiting on the buffer tube kit and B5 Precision Stock to arrive this week. Already have an optic picked out. I have 20” .308 and 6.5CM barrels for it. While I went overboard, you can easily pick up a 16” MLOK MWS, buy a 20” barrel for it, and have two optics in QD mounts (each zeroed to their respective barrel) and cover all the bases you’ve brought up.

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After doing a caliber consolidation, I was left with 9mm pistols, (4) 5.56 and (1) 6.5CM gas guns. The 6.5CM is dedicated towards longer range, not really battle-rifle oriented with a 22" heavy barrel, heavier scope, etc. Was looking for a .30 cal rifle for hunting or just something heavier caliber in case the 6.5CM went down. Was considering some bolt action rifles like the RPR, MPR, Cross. Bounced an idea off the wife and got the reply of "eh I'd really prefer it be a semi-auto." Had a 16" .308 barrel on the shelf, so here we go with another Aero M5 build. I've already shot this barrel out to 600 yards or so, which is a distance that doesn't present itself often in this area. Plan on topping it with another GLX 2.5-10 for a handy 500yd capable rifle.

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