I will make a prayer request for you here so that you will be able to inform this lady of the church just how this law effects crime. No joke. God Bless.

If you don't stand for anything, you will fall for everything.

Good luck to you. Let us know how things turn out.

Let her have it.... first in a nice way... maybe with drawings explaining that there is absolutely no functional difference between pre- / post-ban "assault rifles" and that they have been making them since 94 and sell them like hotcakes... TO AMERICANS!!!

She is obviously grossly un- misinformed and needs to have a lesson in a subject she clearly has no grasp of aside from what the liberals have been spoon feeding her. Approach it calmly and in a collected informative tone and she might actually get the message.

If she replies trying to say the same shit after you have explained it to her, git r' done!!!

Please note, the Presbeterian church does not support the right of self defense.  Period.  they gave it up in the Seventies.  So there's not much point.  

But email side-by-side photos of pre- and postban rifles.  Point out the only visible difference, which would be the bayo lug (if you've chosen carefully).  Point out that there has been no reduction in bayoneting since 1994

History lesson:

The Methodist Church, and to an extent, the Presbyterians were taken over in the late 60's, early 70's by "conciencious objectors".  These were the young anti-war protesters who chose this path to avoid the Vietnam era draft.  These two churches opened their Semenaries to these guys, and soon, these inmates were running the asylum.

The Coalition to Ban Handguns (which is now the VPC), when it was started, was actually in the main headquarters building of the Methodist Church.  

(aside:  Coalition to Ban Handguns became National Coalition to Ban Handguns became Nation Coalition to Ban Gun Violence, in order to switch emphasis to "assault weapons", then became Violence Policy Center.)

The Methodists and Pres have a very close relationship with Moveon.org.  This has been researched, you can go to Moveon.org and look their supporters yourself.

Links below, I just copied this from a file I had, I removed other links and quotes that are no longer working.

www.hoboes.com/pub/Firearms/Books%20and%20News/Neal%20Knox/CIA-NCBH%20Connection

ewsgroups: alt.conspiracy,talk.politics.guns
From: [email protected] (Larry Cipriani)
Subject: Re: (SM) Nazi Propaganda and Gun Control (fwd)
Date: Tue, 3 Jan 1995 04:50:13 GMT

                       CIA-NCBH Connection?

                         By NEAL KNOX

       Washington, D.C. (Dec. 19) -- The curious connection between
President Nixon's CIA and the two leading anti-gun organizations,
reported in my new "Guns & Ammo" column, has caused an uneasy stir
among the CIA-hating hard left.

    Particularly in the Nixon years, the left was convinced that
the CIA was trying to take over the country.  In October 1973, when
President Nixon ordered the "Watergate" special prosecutor fired,
an almost hysterical acquaintance told me Nixon was ready to
mobilize the CIA and Army and declare himself dictator.

    Even if the President had such notions, and I never thought
he did, American citizens would not have tolerated an overthrow of
the Constitution, and were adequately armed to make such a coup
impossible -- which is exactly what the framers of the Bill of
Rights had in mind when they guaranteed the Second Amendment right
to keep and bear arms.  

   But just for the sake of discussion, if someone within the
White House or the CIA had given serious thought to a "bloodless
coup," and been thwarted by the existence of an armed populace,
would they perhaps have tried to do something about removing that
roadblock?

    However we might speculate upon that question, the fact is
that during the next few months both of the leading anti-gun
organizations were formed -- and a principle player in the
formation of both was one Edwin O. Welles, who had just "retired"
from the CIA.

    As noted in Handgun Control Inc. Chairman Nelson Shields'
book, ex-CIA agent Welles was the first chairman of the National
Council to Control Handguns (later renamed HCI).

    Further, according to Rev. Jack Corbett, who founded the
National Coalition to Ban Handguns under the auspices of the United
Methodist Church, Welles was a "guiding light" to NCBH -- an
ostensibly competing organization.

     During 1974 (the year both groups were formed) I had several
telephone conversations/debates with Dr. Corbett.  Once when he was
stymied by my recitation of facts that refuted his anti-gun
arguments, Corbett handed the phone to Welles -- to my utter
astonishment.

     What particularly puzzled me about that conversation is that
ex-CIA Agent Welles didn't seem the sort of zealot that would help
form not one but two anti-gun organizations.  Years later I
learned, through a mutual acquaintance, that at the time he started
HCI and helped form NCBH he owned two handguns (which he supposedly
buried in his back yard) and a Sharps-Borchardt rifle.

    What brought this puzzle to mind was a fundraiser for NCBH
hosted at his Georgetown home last September by the man President
Nixon appointed as CIA Director, William Colby.

    The "Liberals" love the NCBH about as much as they hate the
CIA, so the linkage of the two caused some puzzlement around
Washington.

  Colby told a "Washington Post" gossip columnist that he had been
"quietly working with NCBH for the past several years," and that
he had "learned  of the dangers of handguns during his years at the
CIA" -- from September 4, 1973 to January 30, 1976.

---------------------------------------------

www.hoboes.com/pub/Firearms/Essays/Peter%20Alan%20Kasler/Truth%20About%20Victim%20Disarmament

The Board of Church and Society of the United Methodist
Church founded, and still sponsors, the National Coalition to
Ban Handguns (now renamed the Coalition Against Gun
Violence). The Methodist Board of Church and Society teaches
that it is a woman's Christian duty to submit to rape rather
than to do anything that might imperil her rapist's life. In an
official publication, its editor rhetorically poses the question "Is
the Robber My Brother." He answers "yes"  for, though the
burglary victim or the "woman accosted in the park by a rapist
is [not] likely to consider the violator to be a neighbor whose
safety is of immediate concern***[c]riminals are members of the
larger community no less than are others. As such they are our
neighbors or, as Jesus put it, our brothers..." Brockway, "But the
Bible Doesn't Mention Pistols", May, 1977 ENGAGE-SOCIAL
ACTION FORUM. The language quoted is from pp. 39-40 of this
issue which has been published as a separate pamphlet by the  
Methodist Board of Church and Society under the title
HANDGUNS IN THE UNITED STATES.

--

Eckholm, "A Little Control, A Lot of Guns", N.Y. TIMES, Aug.
15, 1993, quoting Sarah Brady). Of course, the LOS ANGELES
TIMES agrees. Editorial, Oct. 22, 1993. So does the Coalition  
Against Gun Violence -- which also seeks the banning and
confiscation of all handguns. One CAGV member, the
Presbyterian Church USA, explains that it does not seek to ban
long guns for it deems that they will be used for sport.
Handguns, however, are to be banned because they are used for
self-defense. The Presbyterian "General Assembly has declared
in the context of handgun control that it is opposed to `the
killing of anyone, anywhere, for any reason.'" Testimony of
Presbyterian representative; 1985-6 Hearings on Legislation to
Modify the 1968 Gun Control Act, House Judiciary Committee,
Subcommittee on Crime; v. I at 128; emphasis added.

---------------------------------------------------------

www.shadeslanding.com/firearms/kates.speech.html

----------------------------------------------------------

My point with all of the above, this poison is intrinsic in these two churches, and is the reason I left the Methodists many years ago.  I am still religious, still a Christian, but those are not my kind of people.

The method I use to air my concerns with these folks is a simple one.  I remind them that these "gun control measures" were designed to reduce crime and such--by creating new laws.  Criminals, by their very nature are law breakers and prone to harming others.  Explain, in the most professional and non-emotional manner that she knows who you are and what kind of a person you are.  She should also know that guns have no magical or mystical power to make their owners do terrible things like shoot up schoolyards and other heinous crimes.  Explain that it is a bad person who does bad things and hopefully she will see the logic in that.  At the same time, remind her that the CDC's research has shown that the AWB has done nothing to reduce crime, morbidity and mortality.  Remind her that a 16 year old gang member who kills another teenage gang member with an illegally acquired and possessed gun is nothing more than a thug--not a "child".  Good luck and always be prepared for them to become irate and angry and never let yourself be drawn into a shouting, cursing, and loss of composure presentation.  Always maintain yourself and be the better person.  In closing, also do not hesitate to voice your own opinion if conversation like this arises and have your arguments ready.  Let us know how it goes.

Where the hell do these idiots get their information?  The AWB has kept NO weapons off the streets.  People seem to think that the AWB banned guns by name, NOT TRUE.  It banned features that made certain guns so called "Assault Weapons"  The way the media and others word these stupid letters, articles, etc , they are going to make people who don't have a clue about the AWB, guns or anything start freeking out because they are going to think that if the AWB sunsets all of these military "assault Weapons" are going to be on the streets.  What the hell?

Quoted: I would suggest a similar email sent to all the church members on the list stating your views.

Tell them that as soon as they get one jackboot on our guns, they start putting the other jackboot on speech and religion. Without us crazy gun folk they won't have anyone to protect them from the man. The religion bans have already started... what more of a wake-up call do they need. Would I be losing any sleep if they banned churches full of idiots like them... not on your life.

Respond with, "HAHA" on Monday.

Quoted: I would keep it simple, because 99% of these folks don't understand laws or their impact. The media has whipped her up into a frenzy, with visions of armagedon in the streets herIt is a media misconception that kids or adults can simply purchase an AK47.  They have been regulated and licenced a long time ago (and that law does not sunset). Despite what political groups tell you, statistics prove that semi auto rifles are not the weapon of choice by criminals.  And if the AWB law stays or goes it will have no effect on the total number on firearms in the wrong hands. That might sound non-confrontational enough to preserve peace at your house, and get your message across?

I agree with this, except I would add the url for awbansunset.com www.awbansunset.com/ and ask her to review this site for the real skinny on what the ban was really about.