Ya, probably.

My problem is I'm 25 yrs old so I am impatient and think I know everything.

Hi Newbe, just curious.  Was your order for ammo or for some other product?  There seems to be two different "divisions" of which the ammo group has been more responsive.  And, did you fax/email the order form and proof of age?  Without a copy of the order form and your dirvers license you may experience quite a delay while they try to match orders with authentication.  I am not their advocate, just sharing my experiences.  They have been absolutely reliable and quick for me when I followed the directions.  Dan

Yes the order was for ammo.  

I placed one order on Nov 2nd.  My credit card was billed Nov 3rd.  I saw the form I had to fill out on their website about five days later.  I printed it out, filled it out, and faxed it along with a copy of my drivers license.  I even got a verification that my fax was recieved!  

I was wondering if I was going to get one or two ammo shipments.  Evidently I'll be getting none.

What chaps my ass about this whole thing is that the company has no problem billing my credit card.  But can't return several attempts of mine to aquire an order status.  

Of course I'm watching my order.  I thought something was wrong when I did'nt recieve an order verification.  Something IS wrong:  I'm not getting my product.  If I not been so persistant in this situation, I would STILL be waiting for an ammo shipment from a company who has no intention of sending it to me.

I just don't understand why they got enough information from me to bill my credit card but not enough info to know to send me my product.  Did they're billing personal just say, "Well, is'nt that thoughtful.  This nice young man decided to contibute $189 to our company.  Bless his heart."  

I'm also wondering why they have not returned any of my attempts to contact them.  I know if I had five messages on my answering machine from someone I did not know, wanting to know where his product was,  I'd call him back if only to ask him what he is talking about.

I may be impatient but I think my questions in this matter are legit.

newbe,

         I'd say waiting 5 days to fax your statement threw your order out of whack!!,did you include your order number on there??...i wouldn't be surprised at all if it takes them a week to sort this out.......follow directions man!!

Hey guys,
Can anyone say for sure/100% that Botach is the same product as Q3131A?

If so this is a great deal!![:)]

RussB was going to do a velocity test at some point.

I can't wait!  We are so lucky to have guys like RuusB around to help out!

Well, I got off the "live help' with Botach about 5 min ago.  It took some prying but I got it all straightened out.  2400 rds are enroute.  It seems they have been since Nov 12.  Still not sure why I was told the 17th that I needed to fax my order in again.  Still not sure why it was like pulling teeth to get a response or a tracking # from the company.

Well...Since I posted so much bad shit about them I should probably mention that they DID handle the problem.  I should also mention that there was a good chance the first individual that I "chatted" with may not have been up to par on some things.

Maybe a Newbie???

I should change my name.

Sounds like good news!  Looks like thats our next order(If RuusBs test shows-same as Q3131A).
Congrats  Newbe!  

ps if you keep the name you may still get that "red carpet treatment"[:D]

Although I can't say for certain, I'm pretty sure it is.  At least it's close enough that the recieving end won't know the difference.

Are you refering to the load or the projectile when you ask, "same as?".

In short, Yes.  The Q3131A has been so good to me, 2000 rds very clean, and very very accurate for "mil spec" ammo.

Caveat Emptor on these Botach guys.  I have been buying from them since Jan.2001 and their customer service is awful.  Getting stuff is pure hit and miss with them. I only come back because of the prices.

This is the end.  I ordered and paid for this IMI on 11/01, they still have not shipped.  I have been buying ammo from them since 2001 so there is not any legitimate issue of having my ID on file.  They have had it since early 2001 including a copy of my driver license.

They won't return a call, they won't respond to email, the live person I finally spoke to said he would take care of it and get back to me but that was three days ago.

They were quick to cash the PayPal payment however!  At this point I have filed a formal PayPal compliant and I am just focused on getting my money back from PayPal.

My advice, grab this wholesale hunter deal while they have it:

http://www.wholesalehunter.com/AR15deals/ar15bargdes/Fed.htm

As to  Botach, you are taking a chance, no doubt about it.  This is the third big order problem with them this year and I am through.  The discounts just are not worth the headaches anymore.

You can try Widener's for primed and unprimed brass.  I think they still have some IMI components in stock.

There are some questions about the IMI being the equivalent of the Q3131A, I found this info posted by Readyman:



Link to his post:
[url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=16&t=174870[/url]

I'd still like to see the outcome of RussB's test because of the questionable velocity numbers of Q3131A.

[/quote] wyv3rn

I'd still like to see the outcome of RussB's test because of the questionable velocity numbers of Q3131A.[/quote]


Same here[:\]

Dudes,

these are not "questionable" numbers...they are what Readyman got from his [b]14.5"[/b] barrel carbine. I beleive the numbers to be accurate.

Different powders, from different length barrels, various lot numbers, with different manufacture dates, with twist rates thrown in for fun...heck, add ambient temperatures and altitude...well, you all get the picture!

When I get out of work, it's dark, and weekends are busy...it could be a while before I post the results of IMI vs. Q3131A (I just ordered another case of XM193, too!)

That's why I included the barrel length in the post, I believe it is the determining factor in the velocities reported, they were all a bit low.

if you want it the next day, pay the overnite charges from Fed-Ex and shut up about it.