That whole MiM thread got me all worked up now.  Several forum posters have expressed that they replaced the "critical" parts with higher quality steel parts.  Not sure what to say?  I'm on the fence.

Here's what I'm looking for: a no frills reliable 1911A1 (series 70) pistol that will be used for target shooting, and may be used for personal defense/local gun club competitions.  I'm not rich and although an Ed Brown 1911 looks mighty sweet, who has $3000 bucks to burn?  Not me, which brings me to the Mil-Spec 1911-A1 from Springfield Armory...

QUOTE:  "Springfield's Mil-Spec pistol is a faithful recreation of John Browning's classic 1911-A1. If you are looking for traditional features and quality in a no-nonsense package, the parkerized Mil-Spec is for you."

I actually like the stainless version myself [PB9151LP] and if the MSRP is $724 I'll wager a bet my local gun shop has it for mid 600's or better.  But if that thing is loaded with MiM parts, can I look forward to a broken piece after a few hundred rounds?  Is the whole MiM thing fact or fiction?  If it's a fact, what should I replace right away.  Does this mil-spec edition have the firing pin block mechanism?

I'd like to think the FBI and other contractors choose Springfield Armory for a good reason.  The whole MIM thing could be internet lore but I'd rather be informed.

Thank you for your time.

As much as I do NOT like Springfield Armory, there are a couple plusses with SA....if your frame and slide are marked F.I.B. , it means they were Forged In Brazil at the famed Imbel Company.  Imbel's forgings are really damn good and very damn tough.  LOL...a couple have been a bit too hard and have cracked but by and large the FIBs are absolutely a top notch base for building a good "business gun".

There is a list around here that shows exactly what parts are MIM in each companies guns...I am sure someone will post it.

In my experience, MIM is a very viable manufacturing method for stable parts that are NOT impacting one against the other.  At my factory in AZ, we use MIM parts for many applications such as Super High Pressure gas nozzles.  It's a HELL of a lot easier to MIM these parts than to have them machined and they are for a one time use.  They're a perfect blend of economy and strength.

That being said, I absolutely abhore the use of MIM in things like sears and hammers. In fact, I depise the use of MIM or castings in firearms in general.   If a part in the MIM process is handled incorrectly in any way and microscopic flaws are induced in that process then you are going to have a catastrophic failure of that high stress part at some point.  The same can be said about a forging, however the chances are IMMENSELY smaller. In fact, the inherantly tough, layered grain layer structure of a forged component makes catastrophic failure due to microscopic flaws a much smaller probability.

Still, if MIM ( or even a casting ) is done absolutely right and done by a highly reputable firm, the chances of a MIM part failing are small.  BUT HERE IS THE RUB:  most folks using MIM and castings are trying to get by on the cheap.  In these cases, they are not specifying the highest of Control Standards from their vendors.  In fact, with the exception of major companies like Colt or Smith and Wesson or Ruger, they do ONLY what needs to be done to "get by".

AND...when Springfield, Kimber or whoever is advertising that they build "THE GUN" for X, Y or Z Alphabet Soup Agency, I can gurantee you that when you buy a model that looks just like it....YOU ARE NOT GETTING THE SAME GUN AND YOU NEVER WILL!!! ( Hobbs excepted, the lucky bastard.... )  Kimber is NOT going to be able to build you an MEU Gun and sell it to you for 900 bucks, they spend a shitload of time and effort and they use VERY specific parts on those guns and build them to a VERY specific set of dimensions and tolerances.  These are SMALL PRODUCTION RUNS and they are like night and day compared to the guns you buy at Bob's Shop O' Firearms.  There is no economically feasible way that they can build them to sell for a competative price.  It's a hell of a lot easier to have YoBo or Ned Chrstiansan build you what you need....andyou'll most likely get better results.

If you like the Springfield Loaded models, get one. Enjoy it. I have a parked one, and carry it daily. It shoots well, and has givn me no trouble, other than an issue with the sights.

I am concerned about the MIM durability as well, but I don't lose sleep over it. I'm on a budget, and as I'm able to, I'll replace the parts that need it: safety, slide stop, hammer, etc.

Mine has been reliable and tough. Don't let these things get too you too much.

Quoted: If you like the Springfield Loaded models, get one. Enjoy it. I have a parked one, and carry it daily. It shoots well, and has givn me no trouble, other than an issue with the sights. I am concerned about the MIM durability as well, but I don't lose sleep over it. I'm on a budget, and as I'm able to, I'll replace the parts that need it: safety, slide stop, hammer, etc. Mine has been reliable and tough. Don't let these things get too you too much. hr

like said above buy it and enjoy it, i have a kimber eclipse2 with that darn scwartz safety, and ic chalk full of "MIM" parts and after Roughly 5300rds thru it the damn thing won't break

On my milspec the sear has been toast from almost day one!  Go to half-cock and the pull the trigger and the hammer will fall.

not all hammer 1/2 cock notches are designed to hold the hammer. Some are only designed to catch the hammer in the event of the hammer falling from full cock with out pulling the trigger.

Quoted: On my milspec the sear has been toast from almost day one!  Go to half-cock and the pull the trigger and the hammer will fall.

Yup, it's not the sear's fault, but the lack of a captive half cock notch.  If anything, the sear might be damaged from pulling the trigger at half cock.  There is absolutely no reason to do this.  Anyway, the only real problem with SA's sear is that it's very soft.

TheMocoMan, I assume that you read the tacked MIM thread above.   Since I started that, let me share what I thought was the main point.  It's hard to separate internet lore, as you put it, from reality.  I think that there is a genuine problem with MI parts, but I also think it's highly overstated.  This is just my opnion.  I see a lot of 1911s, from the ones that go through my friend's gunsmithing shop, to the ones that I work on.  I rarely see parts breakages, barstock, cast, or MIM.

When I do see parts breakages with MIM, it's almost always a Kimber.  Except for firing pin stops, I haven't seen a Springfield part break in years (I saw two broken hammers about 7 or 8 years ago).  I see broken Kimber parts a couple times a year.  I've had Kimber parts break on my own guns.  For me, MIM parts breakage is not an issue on Springfields.  Though it's actually common for Springers to crack firing pin stops, with routine inspection, you'll notice the crack long before the part actually breaks.

I replace certain parts as a matter of routine on my personal guns.  Most of the parts have more to do with having a long lasting trigger job and a better quality extractor.  You should be able to get a Mil-Spec for well under $600, and well under $500 for the WWII model.  They are very serviceable guns.  If you decide to replace parts later, then you can do it in small, affordable increments.

One final thought:  when it comes to premature or suspicious MIM parts breakages, even on the internet, you rarely see one from a Springfield.  It seems to be Kimber almost all the time, at least from what I see.   Bottom line, don't sweat it.

Just get a Norinco 1911A1.

Quoted: "don't buy a Beretta, the slide will crack because it happened to the Navy Seals back in 1985"

*snicker*  hehe

Man I swear, the Navy Seals get all the "gun store glory".  It's just not right.  *EVERY* damn time I'm on the local gun shop looking around there is always ONE of these dudes talkin' straight out of his @$$.

Somebody braught up the Barret .50 Cal and a guy started to tell of a story.  His relative was on the Seal 6 team and was taking out the bad guys with the Barret .50 Cal at 1000 meters.  Said it "took out the whole wall" and so on and so forth.  My brain is just screaming out "ahhh shut the f** up!  LIAR! relative on the Seal 6 team my foot!"  The problem is you can't really dispute the power of a 50, but I can dispute that EVERYONE at the local shop knows somebody who is or was a Navy Seal.

ugg.  So here's my beef.  How come nobody ever knows anyone from 1st SFOD-D or 160th SOAR?

How old was this cop?

:: drool ::

look at how that beauty added the beaver tail and 5" barrel.  Taking it's style directly from the 1911 but built by Sig in P226 fashion in a .40 cal.  shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit.  SOLD!

Quoted: Quoted: How old was this cop? Mid-50s.  In other words, old enough to have been in Nam and old enough to know better than to tell fish stories to a true AR15 nut.

And maybe so old that he actually believes his own stories :)