Posted: 10/10/2011 11:30:58 PM EDT
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Alright, I don't know what my problem is. I qualified in BRM about a year ago and i shot a 35/40 which was the time before this BRM but this time I shot a 25/40, I barely passed. I don't understand what's going on, but let me tell you what I found out today. I set up a target at 25 yards,
like they do in the Army for Zero and Grouping, with the 300 yard size target (My military brothers will know what I'm talking about) I shoot PERFECT groups almost butthole tight on all five of the targets dead center and I would say the biggest group was quarter sized, but I do this all the time without ever going off of the zero 300 yard target and always hit inside of it. I impressed my buddy with how well I grouped and zeroed. Well here's what I found out. I made a target to see what I'm doing basically took a turkey deep frying pan (Painted it black) and welded a holder for it. Sat it at 300 yards. I always shot high. My buddy who was spotting for me this time to see what my problem is saying said I hit 5ft+ above the target but always in the same spot. Now you can ask what have you done with your back BIAS. Absolutely nothing I don't even turn it one notch like the range NCO's make you do, or tell you to for BRM for the long range target. I had to compensate about 1/8" below the target and I NEVER missed. Can someone please explain or maybe help me on what my problems may be? The position I'm in is prone/supported. If you need to ask more questions about what I'm doing please ask and I'll answer it as best as I can. |
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Nose to charging handle. |
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Originally Posted By Madcap72:
Nose to charging handle. Yeah and I used to do that, but some guys from my unit went to a tactical rifle coarse, and they said never to do that because it's not comfortable and it's what beginners do. They said take your chin, and rest it on the stock and slide it down to your cheek is rested on the stock. I didn't go back to the nose to handle thing. I just tried this out today with the chin to stock slide down to cheek. I never had to redo my sights which was nice, and I was still grouping and zeroed in on the practice target with perfection. |
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So, just to clarify, you're shooting point of aim, point of impact on the 25 yard reduced size targets, and 5' high on full size 300 yard targets? What sort of sights, and what is the sight radius? |
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Originally Posted By Jinxsters: Shooting for accuracy is not tactical rifle shooting, and nose to charging handle gives you a guaranteed distance from your eye to the rear aperture.Originally Posted By Madcap72: Nose to charging handle. Yeah and I used to do that, but some guys from my unit went to a tactical rifle coarse, and they said never to do that because it's not comfortable and it's what beginners do. They said take your chin, and rest it on the stock and slide it down to your cheek is rested on the stock. I didn't go back to the nose to handle thing. I just tried this out today with the chin to stock slide down to cheek. I never had to redo my sights which was nice, and I was still grouping and zeroed in on the practice target with perfection. It might be what beginners do, but it's also what champions do as well.  |
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Originally Posted By Madcap72:
So, just to clarify, you're shooting point of aim, point of impact on the 25 yard reduced size targets, and 5' high on full size 300 yard targets? What sort of sights, and what is the sight radius? The sights are stock LMT iron sights. I apologize for my lack of knowledge but what do you mean on Radius? Are you talking about the back sight? |
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Originally Posted By Jinxsters: The length from the rear sight to the front sight, I.E. is it a M4 style rifle, or 20" barrel.Originally Posted By Madcap72: So, just to clarify, you're shooting point of aim, point of impact on the 25 yard reduced size targets, and 5' high on full size 300 yard targets? What sort of sights, and what is the sight radius? The sights are stock LMT iron sights. I apologize for my lack of knowledge but what do you mean on Radius? Are you talking about the back sight? I have a feeling that if your 25 yard zero is causing the round to be that high at 300 yards, there is a problem with the ratio between the rear sights adjustments for range, and their length to the front sight. |
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Originally Posted By Madcap72:
Originally Posted By Jinxsters:
The length from the rear sight to the front sight, I.E. is it a M4 style rifle, or 20" barrel.
Originally Posted By Madcap72:
So, just to clarify, you're shooting point of aim, point of impact on the 25 yard reduced size targets, and 5' high on full size 300 yard targets? What sort of sights, and what is the sight radius? The sights are stock LMT iron sights. I apologize for my lack of knowledge but what do you mean on Radius? Are you talking about the back sight? I have a feeling that if your 25 yard zero is causing the round to be that high at 300 yards, there is a problem with the ratio between the rear sights adjustments for range, and their length to the front sight. Edit: Trying to find a tape measure to give you the distance between the two. Trying to find a tape measure to give you the measurement distance. 16" barrel the rifle is a LMT CQB MRP The Rear Sight is all the way at the back the front sight is all the way up at the front of the rail. It's the way it came. |
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Hopefully someone will be along that knows more about it, but I don't think the military style of 25 yard zeroing works as well in the civilian world, since there is so much variation in sights, ammo and such. I would say re-zero it at 300 yards at the correct sight setting then go back to 25 and see where they have to go. |
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Originally Posted By Madcap72:
Hopefully someone will be along that knows more about it, but I don't think the military style of 25 yard zeroing works as well in the civilian world, since there is so much variation in sights, ammo and such. I would say re-zero it at 300 yards at the correct sight setting then go back to 25 and see where they have to go. I was thinking about that. I'm going to take in to account what you said and go back to nose to charging handle and see how that works. I just didn't have enough time today at the range before I had to go back and pick up my daughter. I appreciate the help you have given me though. |
“The Constitution shall never be construed... to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms.” Samuel Adams
| This thread might be dead, but Jinxsters the Marine Corps BZOs their rifles at 36 yards for the 300 yard line. I believe your 25 yard BZO is too close to account for the rise in the bullet. You would be shooting high at 36 yards therefore hitting high on the 300 yd line. |
| Thank you, just checked back into this and count this Gem. I been tweaking somethings around and I think I've figured out some things. I know the marines shoot as far as 500 yards. |
“The Constitution shall never be construed... to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms.” Samuel Adams
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Originally Posted By NH9:
This thread might be dead, but Jinxsters the Marine Corps BZOs their rifles at 36 yards for the 300 yard line. I believe your 25 yard BZO is too close to account for the rise in the bullet. You would be shooting high at 36 yards therefore hitting high on the 300 yd line. Agreed on 25 m being just too close for a good zero. Basically it gets you "on paper" at 100 m. Sight in 3" high at 100 and you should be about spot on at 300. |