Posted: 10/20/2021 8:59:52 PM EDT
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Like the topic says are your goals realistic? For the vast majority of us on this sight I would imagine the list in order should be something like this: fitness; combatives; pistol; medical; rifle. IMO, most of us here get caught up in the latest training fad, like CQB or vehicle tactics, when our time could be better spent on something we are more likely to encounter on a day to day basis as a civilian. |
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Yes. I call it my "threat bell curve". Do I train for work and lifestyle possibilities like carjackings or getting accosted in a parking garage late at night represented in the meaty part of the (bell) curve or do I train for a one in a billion (outlier) Red Dawn / Zombie Apocalypse scenario? Fitness should be an ongoing affair but the rest of it in no particular order based on class availability. |
Best Regards,
TonyF
Training Forum Moderator
"... there's trained and untrained" (Denzel Washington -- Man on Fire)
TonyF
Training Forum Moderator
"... there's trained and untrained" (Denzel Washington -- Man on Fire)
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From a purely firearms point of view, most of us (non-law enforcement or non- mil) are at most, going to use a handgun. So, IMHO, being able to draw and fire (accurately) in a reasonable time frame should be be one's top priority. After that, being able to reload and remedy malfunctions should be mastered. Over all, fitness (so one does not drop dead from cardiac arrest) and first aid are more likely to be needed than using deadly force. Sadly, a lot of folks neglect those areas. |
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I think handgun training ought to be the priority for non-MIL, including LEO, because it’s our primary and frequently only weapon, and because it’s simply harder to use well than a long gun. The biggest training gap I see is very close quarters or entangled fighting. Frankly, unless you are planning to be attacked by an IPSC cardboard target at 10 yards, this is something to plan for. Desired learning objectives: when NOT to draw the handgun, how to avoid having it ripped away/stolen, how to create time and space to draw (most people have around a 2 second draw…that’s a long time in a grappling fight), how to draw and shoot from retention, etc. The reality is that an aggressor might close in on you rapidly but still not meet criteria for lethal self defense until they get to contact distance where they then attack. The above paragraph is also directed at me, I have shot from retention at a class but need close quarters combatives/contested draw training. Unfortunately this is always an advanced training course that (rightly) shouldn’t be taught to complete novices, so you have to find a good trainer and knock out the prerequisites. It’s also not “sexy” like carbine training, it’s not an excuse to buy cool guy gear, and it’s not a skill you can demonstrate at the next 3 gun match. But I think it matters. That being said, don’t knock long gun courses either, I think they are also important. |
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Agree fitness is #1 I'd say medical is #2. Chances of needing at least first aid are HIGH. I'm alive because of CPR. AED, knowing what to do about bleeding, and handling shock are also pretty important. Stateside, Pistol would be #3. It's the firearm most likely to be used and can give you the key element of surprise. Yeah, it's that important. Rifle is critical to freedom and what you SHOULD reach for first in a shooting situation. Combatives can be combined with fitness and teach you fighting spirit. Which one is most important to you is probably dependent on your situation. While fighting in the context of home defense or CCW is high on the list, vehicles are also part of our every day life. Crime is common in parking lots. I'd say knowing vehicle fighting is also high on the priority list. Think BLM riots last year. Knowing how to "take down" a building with a CQB team is I think low on the list. Firstly because you need a well trained team to do it (I've done it alone FoF, it ain't easy or for the faint of heart), and secondly because you're feeding your well trained team into a potential wood chipper if you do it for real. The rule is, not to besiege walled cities if it can possibly be avoided. |
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Originally Posted By InvertedDeparture: ... The biggest training gap I see is very close quarters or entangled fighting. Frankly, unless you are planning to be attacked by an IPSC cardboard target at 10 yards, this is something to plan for. Desired learning objectives: when NOT to draw the handgun, how to avoid having it ripped away/stolen, how to create time and space to draw (most people have around a 2 second draw…that’s a long time in a grappling fight), how to draw and shoot from retention, etc. The reality is that an aggressor might close in on you rapidly but still not meet criteria for lethal self defense until they get to contact distance where they then attack. The above paragraph is also directed at me, I have shot from retention at a class but need close quarters combatives/contested draw training. Unfortunately this is always an advanced training course that (rightly) shouldn’t be taught to complete novices, so you have to find a good trainer and knock out the prerequisites. It’s also not “sexy” like carbine training, it’s not an excuse to buy cool guy gear, and it’s not a skill you can demonstrate at the next 3 gun match. But I think it matters. That being said, don’t knock long gun courses either, I think they are also important. I've seen statistics that around 2% of defensive encounters occur at contact distances... but ~50% of the FATALITIES occur at contact distances. Contact distance shooting is certainly a subject that requires and deserves specialized training. Craig Douglas and Kelly McCann have some outstanding training on the subject. I've had a lot of instructors/events not want to conduct even basic retention shooting as there are risks to retention live fire. I absolutely dedicate intermediate and advanced training to the subject. I believe airsoft and FoF are essential in order to conduct the training adequately and safety. Proper performance with airsoft leads to safe performance with live fire. And getting the required number of retention fire repetitions with airsoft is so much cheaper! |
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Originally Posted By R_S: I've seen statistics that around 2% of defensive encounters occur at contact distances... but ~50% of the FATALITIES occur at contact distances. Contact distance shooting is certainly a subject that requires and deserves specialized training. Craig Douglas and Kelly McCann have some outstanding training on the subject. I've had a lot of instructors/events not want to conduct even basic retention shooting as there are risks to retention live fire. I absolutely dedicate intermediate and advanced training to the subject. I believe airsoft and FoF are essential in order to conduct the training adequately and safety. Proper performance with airsoft leads to safe performance with live fire. And getting the required number of retention fire repetitions with airsoft is so much cheaper! This is currently where a lot of my training is focused. A lot of clinch work and working with elbows, head butts, knife deployment, all the way to firearm deployment. The problem with this training is my body is no longer as young as my mind thinks we are. 
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Physical fitness and being familiar with going hands on with someone should (my opinion) be a part of the training if your goals are being prepared for a physical combative encounter. Age and injury aside those that can should. Even sporatic trips to the local boxing/thai gym and an exposure to wrestling/Brazilian JiuJitsu would go farther than most martial arts of today. It'll build a solid foundation for most any other combatives. Footwork, body mechanics, stamina, gauging range, timing and reaction (I will caution any length of time in hard striking combatives are hard on the hands, even if wrapping properly.) If only alittle training will help those realize your own physical limitations and dispel/affirm any preconceived notions you may have had about your capabilities prior. How long is your reach? Do you know how, when and can you sprawl? Are you aware enough to keep your chin tucked? Can you carry your own weight? Don't get me wrong, im not saying everyone needs to be an mma fighter, super assassin type nonsense. But get some experience in it, its fun, a good work out, and usually a good group of guys. Last thing anyone would want is being exposed to that situation for the first time in dire circumstances. |
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