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Posted: 1/24/2026 12:46:45 AM EDT
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EDIT: Brought up from my post below: Here's the TL;DR for those of you sad hams who deal primarily in knee-jerk opinions rather than careful consideration: Forget my opinion. Take a look at the cuts. Assuming you're familiar with other product offerings, and what SS cuts typically look like, would you pay $70 given MTD's description of the service and what I got back? If yes, then MTD is good-to-go for you. If no, or if you were going to assume that people who perform SS cuts do so in a way also compatible with similar mechanisms like ARC-FIREs, then MTD is not "the way". Either way, if you're reading this, you're now better informed. You're welcome. ---- Original material: Mid-Tier Defense's trigger cutting service is very expensive $70, but that includes all shipping (to/from) and testing of the entire FCG. It sounded legit, so I sent them my Geissele G2S. This is what I got back: Attached File Attached File That included "polishing". While it worked with a Hoffman SS, it would not at all work with an ARC-FIRE, which was effectively SAFE in all three positions. I emailed MTD, and they neglected to respond. I consulted folks on this forum on how to attempt to remedy the trigger. After some very slight attempts to correct and additional examination of contact and clearances, I have since determined that the amount of material MTD unnecessarily removed from the rear of the left side of the trigger made it impossible to achieve the proper radius for use with the ARC-FIRE. The trigger now fails to reset in FRT mode, which is the classic sign of removing too much metal. This is really frustrating because removing all that material wasn't even necessary to get it to function with any SS. They just took it off with what appears to be an angle grinder. This was a month ago. I've since written them four times. I've received zero non-automated responses, and none addressing any of my questions or concerns. You'll likely note in that conversation with folks here, I recognized (after the fact) that MTD does not technically advertise their trigger cutting service will work with the ARC-FIRE, only with the Hoffman SS, which it technically still does. Shame on me for not reading more carefully or asking up front. Even so, this was one of the ugliest, sloppiest metal modification jobs I have seen. No care was taken. I don't know what jig they were using, but the trigger didn't match up with any that I have ever seen. It's obvious to me they don't know what they're doing and have zero attention to detail or craftsmanship, despite their clever marketing. My recommendation is to avoid this vendor. They charge a premium for amateur, potentially destructive work, putting your hardware at risk, and are unavailable to discuss the matter. |
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Quoted: So its ugly but works as advertised? Is that the issue? "standard" super safety cuts are assumed to work with an ARC-Fire. If you're cutting people's triggers, it's probably a good idea to explain that you're doing something other than the industry standard. |
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Quoted: "standard" super safety cuts are assumed to work with an ARC-Fire. If you're cutting people's triggers, it's probably a good idea to explain that you're doing something other than the industry standard. Quoted: "standard" super safety cuts are assumed to work with an ARC-Fire. If you're cutting people's triggers, it's probably a good idea to explain that you're doing something other than the industry standard. This was my apparently mistaken understanding as well. Quoted: Just saying... seems pretty clear that the service is for Super Safeties. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/41568/SS_cut_geissele-3700363.jpg This is absolutely true, as I acknowledged in my original post. Quoted: Hah. It says Mid-Tier right in the name. Looks like they did a fine job for the price paid. Yours is a low bar. What do you do for a living? I can see what they might block you. What do you mean by "block"? This is a transaction, services-for-money, not some social media circle jerk. Were you demanding a new trigger and also telling them how to do it? No. I was asking for a conversation. We hadn't gotten to any exploration of remedies yet. No one from MTD has ever contacted me. The only thing I've ever received were automated emails about the placement of my order, its shipments, and then radio silence despite my attempts to ask some questions. I already acknowledged that I should have read more carefully. (Perhaps you should read more carefully also.) Here's the TL;DR for those of you who deal primarily in knee-jerk opinions rather than careful consideration: Forget my opinion. Take a look at the cuts. Assuming you're familiar with other product offerings, and what SS cuts typically look like, would you pay $70 given MTD's description of the service and what I got back? If yes, then MTD is good-to-go for you. If no, or if you were going to assume that people who perform SS cuts do so in a way also compatible with similar mechanisms like ARC-FIREs, then MTD is not "the way". Either way, if you're reading this, you're now better informed. You're welcome. For the rest of you, thanks for sharing your opinions about my opinions. You've helped make the internet what it is. |
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Quoted: Join date/post count This was me before I lost my login and couldn't recover it before having to create a new one. And before anyone else wanders even further astray to litter this thread with more off topic opinions and advice, I've already had the conversation with admins. This is the path I picked given the tradeoffs. I'll note for our home audience that my original join date precedes @Mike_Golf's, but thanks for playing! You keep being you, buddy. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. Who's a good boy? You are! Yes, you are! (Pats head, lovingly.) ?? And you're right: I don't post much, because my bar for lengthening the conversation and sucking up attention is to significantly advance either my or others' knowledge within the topic at hand. Do I always meet that bar? No. Do I make mistakes? Yes. But I try to avoid contributing to endless pages of opinion pageants. (Although, on second thought, maybe that means I don't belong on ARFCOM ... ??) |
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Quoted: I now know. Sorry it was at your expense. Quoted: I now know. Sorry it was at your expense. At least it saved somebody! I wish as designs would get cut G triggers stocked soon. I want an sdc or I'd even settle for an ssa. Me too. I even asked ASD if they would cut mine. They responded (yay!) and politely declined, which I respect. |
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Quoted: This was my apparently mistaken understanding as well. This is absolutely true, as I acknowledged in my original post. Yours is a low bar. What do you do for a living? What do you mean by "block"? This is a transaction, services-for-money, not some social media circle jerk. No. I was asking for a conversation. We hadn't gotten to any exploration of remedies yet. No one from MTD has ever contacted me. The only thing I've ever received were automated emails about the placement of my order, its shipments, and then radio silence despite my attempts to ask some questions. I already acknowledged that I should have read more carefully. (Perhaps you should read more carefully also.) Here's the TL;DR for those of you who deal primarily in knee-jerk opinions rather than careful consideration: Forget my opinion. Take a look at the cuts. Assuming you're familiar with other product offerings, and what SS cuts typically look like, would you pay $70 given MTD's description of the service and what I got back? If yes, then MTD is good-to-go for you. If no, or if you were going to assume that people who perform SS cuts do so in a way also compatible with similar mechanisms like ARC-FIREs, then MTD is not "the way". Either way, if you're reading this, you're now better informed. You're welcome. For the rest of you, thanks for sharing your opinions about my opinions. You've helped make the internet what it is. Quoted: Quoted: "standard" super safety cuts are assumed to work with an ARC-Fire. If you're cutting people's triggers, it's probably a good idea to explain that you're doing something other than the industry standard. This was my apparently mistaken understanding as well. Quoted: Just saying... seems pretty clear that the service is for Super Safeties. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/41568/SS_cut_geissele-3700363.jpg This is absolutely true, as I acknowledged in my original post. Quoted: Hah. It says Mid-Tier right in the name. Looks like they did a fine job for the price paid. Yours is a low bar. What do you do for a living? I can see what they might block you. What do you mean by "block"? This is a transaction, services-for-money, not some social media circle jerk. Were you demanding a new trigger and also telling them how to do it? No. I was asking for a conversation. We hadn't gotten to any exploration of remedies yet. No one from MTD has ever contacted me. The only thing I've ever received were automated emails about the placement of my order, its shipments, and then radio silence despite my attempts to ask some questions. I already acknowledged that I should have read more carefully. (Perhaps you should read more carefully also.) Here's the TL;DR for those of you who deal primarily in knee-jerk opinions rather than careful consideration: Forget my opinion. Take a look at the cuts. Assuming you're familiar with other product offerings, and what SS cuts typically look like, would you pay $70 given MTD's description of the service and what I got back? If yes, then MTD is good-to-go for you. If no, or if you were going to assume that people who perform SS cuts do so in a way also compatible with similar mechanisms like ARC-FIREs, then MTD is not "the way". Either way, if you're reading this, you're now better informed. You're welcome. For the rest of you, thanks for sharing your opinions about my opinions. You've helped make the internet what it is. Yeah. That’s unacceptable. If I wanted a hack job, I’d do it myself. |
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Quoted: Of course. Quoted: Quoted: Did you use the additional "lever blocker" that is noted for the ARC-Fire kit for using it with Geissele triggers? Finish wise they really should be using a finer stone for that price, and throwing some cold blue on the parts for good measure. So yeah, pretty mickey-mouse with results, and disappointing for $70+ I also agree their not responding being poor business practice. Even if they're busy and a one man shop, a quick glance would let them see which emails are questions and which are problems they need to address sooner rather than later. Messed up work can be fixed, but it takes acknowledging the issue first in order to take the needed steps to fix it. |
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Quoted: This was my apparently mistaken understanding as well. This is absolutely true, as I acknowledged in my original post. Yours is a low bar. What do you do for a living? What do you mean by "block"? This is a transaction, services-for-money, not some social media circle jerk. No. I was asking for a conversation. We hadn't gotten to any exploration of remedies yet. No one from MTD has ever contacted me. The only thing I've ever received were automated emails about the placement of my order, its shipments, and then radio silence despite my attempts to ask some questions. I already acknowledged that I should have read more carefully. (Perhaps you should read more carefully also.) Here's the TL;DR for those of you who deal primarily in knee-jerk opinions rather than careful consideration: Forget my opinion. Take a look at the cuts. Assuming you're familiar with other product offerings, and what SS cuts typically look like, would you pay $70 given MTD's description of the service and what I got back? If yes, then MTD is good-to-go for you. If no, or if you were going to assume that people who perform SS cuts do so in a way also compatible with similar mechanisms like ARC-FIREs, then MTD is not "the way". Either way, if you're reading this, you're now better informed. You're welcome. For the rest of you, thanks for sharing your opinions about my opinions. You've helped make the internet what it is. TLDR |
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Quoted: TLDR Quoted: Quoted: This was my apparently mistaken understanding as well. This is absolutely true, as I acknowledged in my original post. Yours is a low bar. What do you do for a living? What do you mean by "block"? This is a transaction, services-for-money, not some social media circle jerk. No. I was asking for a conversation. We hadn't gotten to any exploration of remedies yet. No one from MTD has ever contacted me. The only thing I've ever received were automated emails about the placement of my order, its shipments, and then radio silence despite my attempts to ask some questions. I already acknowledged that I should have read more carefully. (Perhaps you should read more carefully also.) Here's the TL;DR for those of you who deal primarily in knee-jerk opinions rather than careful consideration: Forget my opinion. Take a look at the cuts. Assuming you're familiar with other product offerings, and what SS cuts typically look like, would you pay $70 given MTD's description of the service and what I got back? If yes, then MTD is good-to-go for you. If no, or if you were going to assume that people who perform SS cuts do so in a way also compatible with similar mechanisms like ARC-FIREs, then MTD is not "the way". Either way, if you're reading this, you're now better informed. You're welcome. For the rest of you, thanks for sharing your opinions about my opinions. You've helped make the internet what it is. TLDR Is there a particular reason you're behaving this way? |
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Just joined to make a comment. I ordered two Geissele SD3G SS kits from Mid-Tier Defense last year. Both triggers worked on AS Designs ARC fire with lever blocker. I got no issues there. I recently learned that AS Designs had a bad batch of ARC Fire triggers. Users are saying they were out of spec. I saw posts on Reddit. However. I completely agree that MTD is AWOL. I've ordered a pre cut SSAE-X trigger almost 3 weeks ago and MTD hasn't shipped the item or respond to any form of communication may it be by email, IG, Facebook or SMS. My mistake was not using a credit card for the transaction and I'm calling my bank tomorrow to see what options I have to get my money back. |
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Quoted: Just joined to make a comment. Quoted: Just joined to make a comment. Welcome! I ordered two Geissele SD3G SS kits from Mid-Tier Defense last year. Both triggers worked on AS Designs ARC fire with lever blocker. I got no issues there. Do you still have them? Do the cuts look similar to what they did on mine? I recently learned that AS Designs had a bad batch of ARC Fire triggers. Users are saying they were out of spec. I saw posts on Reddit. Interesting. Do you have a link? Was it this? My ARC-FIRE was ordered recently directly from ASD and seems to function check fine with the cut G2S I also bought from them. However, I haven't tried it yet, nor did I try to install it with the trigger shoe that came with it. However. I completely agree that MTD is AWOL. I've ordered a pre cut SSAE-X trigger almost 3 weeks ago and MTD hasn't shipped the item or respond to any form of communication may it be by email, IG, Facebook or SMS. My mistake was not using a credit card for the transaction and I'm calling my bank tomorrow to see what options I have to get my money back. Fingers crossed for you, man. If I hear anything from them, I'll post here. |
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Yup I still have them and the cuts are similar. I wish I can invite you to a zoom call! I think I can replicate your issue with G$ and ARC Fire. I think your lever is binding at the back meaning the top of the lever is pointed towards the buffer weight. All my uppers are shaved. I separated my lower. While on safe, I pulled the lever back towards the buffer weight. Then I switched to semi and pulled the trigger. Trigger did nothing and hammer didn't fall. It's like it's stuck in safe. I then switched to arc mode while the lever is still angled to the back, pulled the trigger, same thing. But you've probably did all the troubleshooting. Do you know anyone with an arc fire you can test on your G$? |
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If its safe in all 3 positions the issue is the ARC-Fire, not the trigger UNLESS the right side isn't cut low enough and its hitting whatever is on an arc-fire on that side. All of the Geisselle triggers I've seen advertised had the right side cut follow the curve on the trigger. I would suggest trying it with a Super Safety , at the very least it should work in plain jane semi and you can figure out if the arc-fire works right |
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Quoted: If its safe in all 3 positions the issue is the ARC-Fire, not the trigger UNLESS the right side isn't cut low enough and its hitting whatever is on an arc-fire on that side. All of the Geisselle triggers I've seen advertised had the right side cut follow the curve on the trigger. I would suggest trying it with a Super Safety , at the very least it should work in plain jane semi and you can figure out if the arc-fire works right Apologies for not including the rest of the details that seemed more relevant to my subsequent troubleshooting rather than my experience with MDT. I did try to remove a very small amount of material, and went directly from SAFE-SAFE-SAFE to SAFE-SEMI-NORESET. I can pass an upper-off, lower-only function check with the ARC-FIRE, but cannot get the thing to reset the hammer in a fully assembled function check, which suggests too much material was removed from the rear (vertically) to accomplish a sufficiently small radius for proper function with the ARC-FIRE. The trigger still works great with a Hoffman SS (which appears to be more forgiving with respect to tolerances). I have 100-200 rounds across multiple calibers/uppers with zero malfunctions on the SS. But I'm afraid the trigger was DOA for an ARC-FIRE. |
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Quoted: Do you have any calipers? Can you measure these two points? https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/99571/IMG_9782-3701684.jpg https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/99571/IMG_9787-3701706.jpg As modified https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/99571/IMG_9788-3701707.jpg https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/99571/IMG_9783-3701685.jpg Attached File Attached File Note that the radius is larger, and the vertical angle is different than the stock trigger because MTD removed material with what appears to be an angle grinder (see original post). Your trigger looks closer to a 90 degree angle between the bottom and rear wall. That's how mine was, too. Now, mine is more like 80-85 degrees. I can't figure out why they would do this. It's not necessary, even for SS function. That height (0.290") is at a point untouched by me (other than some blueing and some very minor polishing, not shaving). |
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Dang man. They really didn’t do a good job on that. It’s all about rounding that point. They came too far back for sure. Everyone needs to see how yours runs back toward the front of the trigger and a correct one is much more vertical.  Can you weld? Lay some material on top and then rework it? |
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Quoted: Is there a particular reason you're behaving this way? Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: ... Here's the TL;DR ... ... TLDR Is there a particular reason you're behaving this way? SHS (sad ham syndrome)? 
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Quoted: Dang man. They really didn’t do a good job on that. It’s all about rounding that point. They came too far back for sure. Everyone needs to see how yours runs back toward the front of the trigger and a correct one is much more vertical. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/99571/Image-3702502.jpg Can you weld? Lay some material on top and then rework it? Sadly, that's beyond my current skill set. Maybe a great opportunity to learn. At the moment, however, I lack the time (and likely the funds, but I don't even know what equipment I'd need). |
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Quoted: Sadly, that's beyond my current skill set. Maybe a great opportunity to learn. At the moment, however, I lack the time (and likely the funds, but I don't even know what equipment I'd need). Where would you start? Would you agree with this assessment? Any experience with stuff like this? |
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Quoted: Just joined to make a comment. I ordered two Geissele SD3G SS kits from Mid-Tier Defense last year. Both triggers worked on AS Designs ARC fire with lever blocker. I got no issues there. I recently learned that AS Designs had a bad batch of ARC Fire triggers. Users are saying they were out of spec. I saw posts on Reddit. However. I completely agree that MTD is AWOL. I've ordered a pre cut SSAE-X trigger almost 3 weeks ago and MTD hasn't shipped the item or respond to any form of communication may it be by email, IG, Facebook or SMS. My mistake was not using a credit card for the transaction and I'm calling my bank tomorrow to see what options I have to get my money back. @DuoMaxwell Do you know if the bad triggers were G$ or mil triggers? |
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I honestly haven't installed the milspec triggers that came with the Arc Fire kit so I don’t know. Sorry. I installed my precut G$ triggers from the get go and I have zero issues so far. Only thing I did was shave my upper to prevent possible binding. Just to follow up on my original post, my order of precut G$ trigger from Mid-Tier Defense. The person in charge just responded back. They are backed up due to Geissele shipment being delayed possibly due to shot show. |
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Quoted: ... Just to follow up on my original post, my order of precut G$ trigger from Mid-Tier Defense has officially reached two days shy of four weeks without them shipping it. I called and emaild at least three times a week and I haven't gotten any response. Funny thing is, I keep receiving updated email promotion from them with varying email subject and content. I believe they just keep taking orders from preople at this point but they aren't fulfilling them. When I called my bank, they mentioned that I wasn't the first to complain about the company (MTD) and they have logged the complaints and flagged them is fraud. Buyer beware. That sounds really frustrating. I hope you're able to come to some resolution. There has been no response to any of my inquires, yet, either, so I started a dispute through my CC issuer. If that leads to any insight as to whether and how anyone at MTD responds, I'll let you know. I know you can't pursue the same remedy, but it would at least be nice to know whether there's anyone coherent on the other end. Anybody near Tampa want to swing by 7402 N 56th St Ste 355 and see what's happening there?  Map. (Kidding. Don't do that.) I don't know how accurate this is, but it's interesting.
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@lugnutwrench2 I would have just filed a dispute on my CC after the last unanswered attempt. Common misconception is that the FCBA only covers unauthorized or undelivered goods & services, but you can also dispute the quality of the service, and frankly, if done through one of the big networks like Visa or Mastercard, they won't delve into too great of detail once they get your side of the story to the effect of inadequate service, especially for < $100 transactions... If you feel morally or ethically repulsed by the idea, I'd respond by pointing to your clear frustration over Mid-Tier Def's mid-tier shit of a job...you're clearly (and rightfully so) vexed by their handiwork, so take it up with the card issuers...oh and silver lining, any card dispute will be sure to get a merchant's attention through email replies these days, since they can't quite ghost a freeze on funds within their payment processor. EDIT: Your last post indicates you started a dispute, so good on you. 👍 |
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I joined the forum solely to echo my similar disappointing experience so far. In my case I ordered a pre-cut Geissele trigger from them because AS designs was out of stock at the time. I installed it with the ARC fire and lever. Doesn’t work, won’t release the hammer on semi. My emails were ignored for about 10days until I left a negative review - then I heard from them immediately. They basically said it’s not listed as compatible with the lever super safeties like the ARC-fire, but some people have gotten it to work. I asked if I can return it for a refund because that’s not clear on their page, and I’m not going to tinker with it myself. I sent the request for a refund around noon on Friday. If I get a response this week and can return it I would consider that fair customer service. I recommended they update the website to make it clear too. Slow but understandable for a small company. Will update if I get a response… or not. |
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I think in the future, I'm going to pay myself $70 for something a little easier on the eyes (and more functional): Attached File |
| FYI, my chargeback was successful after sending pictures of measurements from the botched trigger alongside measurement specs I lifted from @HKH's post. (Don't worry, @HKH, I just submitted the measurements, not the source.) These guys never bothered responding to anything. |
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