Posted: 4/14/2009 4:22:30 PM EDT
| I've never been very happy with my accuracy of my AR-15. Even when sighting it in at 25 yards I would not be able to regularly get a consistent grouping. I thought it was me and that I needed to get use the sights. We'll now I got a new gsg-5 with basically the same type of sights and I am dead on. Now I am thinking something is wrong rifle. Any suggestions? Could something be loose? |
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Do yourself a big favor and check the barrel nut and make sure its not loose. I brought a few of my ARs to range a couple times when it was loose as fuck and i didnt notice. Everytime i placed my hand on the handguard it would basically throw the barrel off everywhere. Im retarded for not noticing and idk how it loosened but it did. Must have not been tightened enough. MAKE SURE IT IS.
ETA: lol GT 12 seconds ahead of me |
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I think its the rifle, as some have stated above. I have two Bushmasters and at 100 yards a couple of years back tested ammo for accuracy:
Wolf Federal Am. Eagle Winchester White Box British Radway Lake City. Very little difference in my groups, and I had expected Wolf to be the least accurate. I recall WWB usually had the better five shot groups, but not by much. |
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Too many variables unknown to diagnose...
What kind of barrel? length? Sight system used (Irons, 1x red dot, magnified optics)? Have you had any rifle training? Are you flinching? Is the crown on your rifle in good condition? Shooting from a rest or offhand? Sling being used? Ammo selection can be an easy fix, but often it is not the only issue. |
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What is this "Crown" thing? Inspection Method for your Barrel Crown |
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Results:
Crown Test : I don't see or feel anything in the last 1 1/2 inches of the barrel. After inserting Qtip, none of the fibers seemed to have snaged on anything. Loose barrel Nut: after taking off hand gaurds, there appears to be something that looks like a bike sprocket where the barrel meets the upper. Using my hand ....nothing iseems to be loose. Do I need a special tool? |
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Results: Crown Test : I don't see or feel anything in the last 1 1/2 inches of the barrel. After inserting Qtip, none of the fibers seemed to have snaged on anything. Loose barrel Nut: after taking off hand gaurds, there appears to be something that looks like a bike sprocket where the barrel meets the upper. Using my hand ....nothing iseems to be loose. Do I need a special tool? Buy an AR wrench, it will suit your needs for everything AR |
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Results: Crown Test : I don't see or feel anything in the last 1 1/2 inches of the barrel. After inserting Qtip, none of the fibers seemed to have snaged on anything. Loose barrel Nut: after taking off hand gaurds, there appears to be something that looks like a bike sprocket where the barrel meets the upper. Using my hand ....nothing iseems to be loose. Do I need a special tool? How old is the rifle? What manufacturer? Since you have never taken the hand guards off before, I'm gonna assume its a factory assembled rifle and not a home build. That being the case, could you give us a run down on the specs as I asked before? Thanks. |
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Well I've got good news. I went to the range today to compare the accuracy of my two rifles side-by-side. The result is that there really isn't much difference. Maybe it was the shooter after all, and with all of the shooting i've been doing with my gsg-5 has helped my ar-15 accuracy.
At 100 yards I am shooting groups about the size of dinner plate from the bench with iron sights. However, I am still better with the gsg-5 where the groupings are the size of a salad plate. I am thinking the better results from the GSG-5 are due to less anticipation from the lower recoil and the fact that the trigger has a lighter and smoother pull. By the way, is this average shooting? I think it was still good to learn how to check the crown and barrel nut tourque thanks everyone for the help. The AR-15 is: Bushmaster xm-15 16 inch barrel 1/9 twist Federal XM193 Ammo |
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Are you sure its not you? I mean i have a home build AR with a 16 inch 1/9 twist DPMS barrel, standard DPMS parts kit trigger and im shooting 1 Inch groups, sometimes even less off a bench with shitty 55g Wolf ammo at 100 yards. Offhand is around 1-2 inch with the same ammo. This is with either the iron sights (Troy BUIS) and an Eotech 511.
To me it sounds like you are either flinching or jerking the gun as you pull the trigger and not squeezing it properly. I have the same problem with pistols if im not concentrating. |
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Well I've got good news. I went to the range today to compare the accuracy of my two rifles side-by-side. The result is that there really isn't much difference. Maybe it was the shooter after all, and with all of the shooting i've been doing with my gsg-5 has helped my ar-15 accuracy. At 100 yards I am shooting groups about the size of dinner plate from the bench with iron sights. However, I am still better with the gsg-5 where the groupings are the size of a salad plate. I am thinking the better results from the GSG-5 are due to less anticipation from the lower recoil and the fact that the trigger has a lighter and smoother pull. By the way, is this average shooting? I think it was still good to learn how to check the crown and barrel nut tourque thanks everyone for the help. The AR-15 is: Bushmaster xm-15 16 inch barrel 1/9 twist Federal XM193 Ammo With that rifle and ammo combination (and some practice ) you should be able to consistently shoot groups well under 6 inches from a benchrest. 
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Results: Crown Test : I don't see or feel anything in the last 1 1/2 inches of the barrel. After inserting Qtip, none of the fibers seemed to have snaged on anything. Loose barrel Nut: after taking off hand gaurds, there appears to be something that looks like a bike sprocket where the barrel meets the upper. Using my hand ....nothing iseems to be loose. Do I need a special tool? You can't tell if the nut's loose with the gas tube in place. Drift out the roll pin in the front sight block. Pull the gas tube back and out through the receiver. |
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If the trigger is really heavy (stock AR-15 triggers are far from great) that can make grouping harder...but shouldn't be impossible. You can always do a 15 minute trigger job...google it. It really does wonders to an AR15 stock trigger. I liked it so much I sold my RRA 2 stage trigger and have done the 15 minute trigger job in all my AR's. And 2-stage triggers are meant for rifle ranges, cmp matches, basically ideal situations. I wouldn't trust my life to a 2-stage trigger if the shtf. Just my $0.02. RRA 2stagers are nice for sure, make sure you install some kns anti rotation pins installed. I've seen 2 RRA-2 stage triggers have pins walk out at 2 different Appleseeds. One was on my rifle 
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If the trigger is really heavy (stock AR-15 triggers are far from great) that can make grouping harder...but shouldn't be impossible. You can always do a 15 minute trigger job...google it. It really does wonders to an AR15 stock trigger. I liked it so much I sold my RRA 2 stage trigger and have done the 15 minute trigger job in all my AR's. And 2-stage triggers are meant for rifle ranges, cmp matches, basically ideal situations. I wouldn't trust my life to a 2-stage trigger if the shtf. Just my $0.02. RRA 2stagers are nice for sure, make sure you install some kns anti rotation pins installed. I've seen 2 RRA-2 stage triggers have pins walk out at 2 different Appleseeds. One was on my rifle
while this might be fine for someone with plenty of firearms experience... the OP stated he's never even had his AR apart, didn't know what the crown of the barrel was, etc. etc. etc. is a homemade trigger job really the answer to accuracy? |
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If the trigger is really heavy (stock AR-15 triggers are far from great) that can make grouping harder...but shouldn't be impossible. You can always do a 15 minute trigger job...google it. It really does wonders to an AR15 stock trigger. I liked it so much I sold my RRA 2 stage trigger and have done the 15 minute trigger job in all my AR's. And 2-stage triggers are meant for rifle ranges, cmp matches, basically ideal situations. I wouldn't trust my life to a 2-stage trigger if the shtf. Just my $0.02. RRA 2stagers are nice for sure, make sure you install some kns anti rotation pins installed. I've seen 2 RRA-2 stage triggers have pins walk out at 2 different Appleseeds. One was on my rifle
while this might be fine for someone with plenty of firearms experience... the OP stated he's never even had his AR apart, didn't know what the crown of the barrel was, etc. etc. etc. is a homemade trigger job really the answer to accuracy? People only learn from reading about something then trying it out. We all have to start somewhere. 15 minute trigger jobs are not rocketscience, hell its basically shortening a spring, bending another and uses a little lapping compound. And yes, a crappy 17lb trigger can really degrade the accuracy potential. The OP even mentioned he liked his GSG5 trigger much more than his AR trigger. |
| You can check for barrel loosness with the following test. Break the rifke down into the receiver gorups. Grasp the front sight base with one hand, and the upper receiver with the other. Now try and twist the barrel off in both directions. If the barrel is loose, you will get some movement. The gas tube has to come out to actually tighten the barrel, but you'll know if something is loose. |
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i don't think the homemade trigger job is a good idea.. however, for 40 bucks, he can send it to bill springfield.i plan on it next paycheck $40 is about $40 to much for something that you can easily do yourself. I'd personally rather use that $40 for ammo, mags or components (when they can be found  ).
The real benefit of trying doing something like this is that you get a better mechanical knowledge of your rifle (how it operates). The 15 minute trigger jobs I did on all of my AR15's, that I own now,helped shrink my bench groups from 1.5" down to just over 1" with my 20" Colt HBAR varmint rig with 55gr V-max handloads shooting 10 shot groups. I can shoot 3 shot groups sub MOA all day long  with that rig on a stable platform like a truck hood, bench, prone, etc. They work so well I sold my RRA 2 stage trigger. The OP's rifle should be able to shoot just as well provided all the necessary elements are in place: good ammo, good mechanically sound rifle, good nut behind the butt, etc.
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