Posted: 6/27/2006 1:41:40 PM EDT
| anyone have experience with Model 1 Sales uppers? Am thinking about a varmint upper for my Colt ST. Any suggestions? |
|
I know my luck has been bad with them out of the 5 kits I helped my friends built, all were ordered within 2 years from each other. Customer support were rude when we called. 3 -broken bolts after less than 1000 rounds through each one.(Model 1 offered to replace) 1 sling mount flew off. 4 bent inoperable Bolt Catch 1 Scratch bore, tons of fte. we polished out with a bore brush and a drill. Is this enough to prove they are not high quality, or did we just get bad kits. |
I have an M4 A3 upper from M1S that shoots .5MOA at 300 yds, using 62 gr Wolf BTHPs. That's 2 1/2 inch groups at 300 yds.  No Shit.....thousands of rounds....no FTFs. I love mine! The only thing I have replaced is the ejector retaining pin which broke after several thousand rounds of steel case wolf. I'd take mine to war. YMMV |
Really? Well, I guess you've never bought or seen one with the unfinished pot metal gas block. I have. Doug Holland replaced one I had and made the comment "this gas block is pot metal" I've shot a couple of their uppers with only one having some issues, but, I stand by my statement. I didn't go into any other details except to say that I've seen this. Call bullshit all you want, and then look at the real negative comments. I was a euphemistic. |
Calling them like I see em. The gas blocks look like a kid cast them in shop class and painted them. I've seen this on only two, not all. Again, all I said was this and nothing else. Call bullshit all you want, I know what I, and others have seen. |
| COZ calls it the way he sees it. Agree or disagree with what he sees, but you cannot disagree with his frankness. In recent weeks he has started at least 2 threads I know of dealing with problems he has encountered with stuff he sells. Not many dealers do that. |
|
Why bother? Buy from a local gun show dealer that is going to be there next time in case you have a problem. The so-called discounters like M1 and M&A aren't THAT much cheaper than other dealers who price their products competitively. Any check of the problem boards will tell you who gets the most complaints. BTW I'm not a dealer nor do I play one on TV.... |
thanks Renegade, and I have been telling everyone that buys an Armalite lower, what they'll have to do to get the mag catch and bolt release installed. It works, but it does require a bit of work. Cheers all. |
|
I don't order from Model 1 because I don't want to pay sales tax but I HAVE ordered from M&A with no trouble. I don't know about all of their stuff but I have assembeled one each of their cheapest grade carbine and rifle kits with no issues, and my co-worker ordered a midlegnth upper from them with a railed gas block and it was assembled on a Rock River marked upper receiver. If you MUST save some money by cutting corners than I would suggest either place but be prepared to get what you pay for. I have not been burned yet but understand that others have and my day might come. Until then, my "cheapest" source is M&A. |
Ditto at Alpine/Ft Worth. Come and try it. |
I didn't look thathard, but I didn't find any obvious links betweent he two back inteh SC-Vader days other than the familial link.
Yeah, but you have to dela with the asshole that owns the place and thats reason enough not to grace their doors with your presence. The deals are not that good. There are too many other good businesses to give your money to than to deal with that shitbird who owns M&A parts. |
And don't EVER attempt to knock a man's cigar out of his mouth at a gun show.... 
|
| I have built 12 or more kits from Model 1 Sales with only 1 issue, a barrel would not zero with windage on the sight max out. They cheerfully replaced it with no ques. asked. I would not hesitate to do business with them again. Great guys in my book.h, |
|
I've built a few rifles and still have a couple built from Model 1 kits or assembled upper. They work, the only problem I have encountered is with the timing. Every Model 1 uppered rifle I have shot throws the empty cases forward. I have tried different rate springs, buffer weights, different carriers and carrier weights, bolts, and hydraulic buffers but have not been able to correct it. I have not tried any of their bull barreled or target barreled uppers though. About the only thing this will do is a very minor increase in wear unless you let you go too light on the buffer spring or let the spring wear out before replacing it. mm |
|
mm38- The ejection pattern of fired cases has very little to do with the bolt, carrier, carrier weight or action spring, as you seem to have found out by trial and error. Replace the ejector spring with a new one to alter the ejection pattern. As a HP competitor, I "tune" the ejector spring on my AR's by cutting coils off of the ejector spring to deliberately get it to eject less violently and pile the cases in a neat pile at one o'clock. It sounds like you have a shortened ejector spring, or one that has a different spring rate. A normal, stock ejector spring should put the cases at the normal five o'clock position. |
ok, I had always been told if the case were being thrown forward, then the speed of the action was too fast. I should have said that I had tried several different bolt assemblies instead just bolt. I should have mentioned that the felt recoil from the rifles seem a lot snappier and harder than with other ARs. mm |
|
Whoever told you that was wrong. In trying different carrier assemblies and carrier weights, it didn't change the ejection pattern did it? I think you were able to disprove what someone told you! In HP, we shorten the ejector spring to get it to eject forward for a couple of reasons- One, the cases don't get dented by the shell deflector hump. Two, it's considered polite behavior to not shower the competitor next to you with hot brass, particularly in the prone position. |
| I have built 3 post sample M16s from parts that they supplied and will never do it again. The trigger group parts were all out of spec and each had to be hand fitted. The gas blocks do look like crap and their carbine stocks were of a cheaper plastic and had mold flaws. On top of that all their stuff look like it had been used. Now this was 10 years ago and I have never even bothered to look at their stuff at guns shows aftr that so it might have changed. BTW their 45 parts are also out of spec crappy castings but could see that and knew not to buy those. (I did not buy the M16 parts either, the guy I assembled the guns for did) Their carbine stock buffer tubes where cheap knock offs and where not the correct depth so you could not even get the bolt far enough back to lock it with the bolt catch. |
Yes that was Model 1 sales 10 years ago. They have good stuff for the $ but you get what you pay for in this case. I have never seen anything from them that was messed up that they didn't get fixed ASAP on their dime. But I have gotten at least one thing out of every order with them that was either out of spec or missing parts. They have even given kewl free goodies on occasion. The guy on the end of the phone is a dick. Plain and simple but if you can get a hold of the lady that works there she is great. I would recommend and will probably be getting my next rifle kit from Del-Ton as their customer service is much better. As for M&A they can go F#$K themselves. No chrome lined barrels and they are all around a$$holes on the phone. I had a guy even tell me that they did not care what parts I was looking for as they sell for functionality and not appearance. Well guess what jackass I am going to buy from the dealer that gives a damn about what I want for my $$ I hope you read this you dumb sh!t as I spend quite a bit of $$ on this hobby none of which will ever go to your shop again. |
 I am so choked up over your report of poor customer service by M&A Parts personell! 
|
I do miss seeing that avatar |