Posted: 12/7/2011 1:35:35 PM EDT
| I got into an arguement over the legal NJ mag cap limit. I said its 15rds, he said 10rds. Who`s right? |
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I got into an arguement over the legal NJ mag cap limit. I said its 15rds, he said 10rds. Who`s right? Tell him to look up 2C:39-1y, and get back to you. 2C:39-1y: "Large capacity ammunition magazine" means a box, drum, tube or other container which is capable of holding more than 15 rounds of ammunition to be fed continuously and directly therefrom into a semi-automatic firearm.
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If ya really want to confuse him, explain that 15 rounds in only for a semi auto....You can legally have a lever , bolt or pump action gun that holds more than 15 rounds in NJ.
This only applies if the mag does not also work in a semi auto version of the firearm... |
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Quoted: If ya really want to confuse him, explain that 15 rounds in only for a semi auto....You can legally have a lever , bolt or pump action gun that holds more than 15 rounds in NJ. This only applies if the mag does not also work in a semi auto version of the firearm... Ahhhhh!!! Stop!! Law is confusing! Law hurts brain!  |
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>>2C:39-1y: "Large capacity ammunition magazine" means a box, drum, tube or other container which is capable of holding more than 15 rounds of ammunition to be fed continuously and directly therefrom into a semi-automatic firearm.<<
If that's the way it's written, it's insane because it could be interpreted that mil-surp ammo cans fit that definition. |
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Quoted: >>2C:39-1y: "Large capacity ammunition magazine" means a box, drum, tube or other container which is capable of holding more than 15 rounds of ammunition to be fed continuously and directly therefrom into a semi-automatic firearm.<< If that's the way it's written, it's insane because it could be interpreted that mil-surp ammo cans fit that definition. Yes, if the ammo in the ammo can is on a chain and the chain segments exceed 15 rounds. Otherwise... it's a box, not a magazine. Also, whenever someone cites a title, chapter, and paragraph before quoted text... it is safe to assume that they copied it directly from the NJ Statutes, and that is indeed the way the law is written. 
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Sorry I used the word *if*, I didn't mean to hurt anyone's feelings. I'm not here to argue with anyone. People were already discussing it on this other thread, so I guess I'm not the only one that's dumb enough to think it might be misinterpreted.
http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php?/topic/23015-is-this-nj-legal/ The law quoted a box, and an ammo can *could* be interpreted as a box after all, the 2 are shaped very similarly, I'm not here to argue for or against the dumb ass laws that are in place in NJ nor dissect them like I think I'm an attorney, I was just a little surprised how it was worded because the way it could be interpreted was all. You guys are on me like the law is some cut and dry black and white area that nobody ever got fucked by. Sorry for joining your conversation. *for the record, I'm personally in agreement that the belt itself would be the piece in question on a belt-fed, but the way the law is written is worrisome* |
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The law quoted a box, and an ammo can *could* be interpreted as a box after all, the 2 are shaped very similarly,
They are similar in shape, I'll give you that. However, I just bought 1,000 rounds of .223.. and it came in <gasp> a box (or, according to Brian Regan, a boxen). Somehow, I don't think I'm going to jail over it. I was just a little surprised how it was worded because the way it could be interpreted was all.
Well, in this case, I think the wording is appropriate. There are several different types of magazines... the word "tube" is used to describe the magazine of something like a Marlin 60. The word "drum" is used to describe the magazine of something like a Thompson. And the word "box" has long been used to describe the magazines of things like the M-14, M-16, etc. Thinking that an ammo can could be considered a large-capacity magazine, just because it's the same geometric shape as an actual magazine, is like thinking you could be arrested for having a pile of ammo in a 55-gallon drum, because the law uses the word "drum" in it. |
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What if the ammo in the can is on stripper clips. You have ammo in a box on devices designed to feed directly into the magazine of a semi-automatic firearm. If magazine is construed to be part of the semiautomatic firearm...
Ahh... the laws of the great State of NJ, how many ways can we over-analyze them. 
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The way I read the NJ statute and the way it has been explained to me by several people who I believe to be knowledgeable, belt or chain feeding devices satisfy the NJ definition of a high-capacity magazine only if the belt or chain segments exceed 15 rounds.
However, IMHO, the drum is not worth the huge hassles you will get from everyone who sees it from range officers, to off-duty LEO, to nosey citizens. |
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<pic of some dude holding a PKM> Okay... now remove the belt, and tell me how well it feeds 
The previous poster was concerned that, because the definition of an LCM included the word "box", that an ammo can full of loose ammunition could fit said definition. BTW: I see you got your first Class 3 weapon. Congratulations. Nice house, too. 
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<pic of some dude holding a PKM> Okay... now remove the belt, and tell me how well it feeds
The previous poster was concerned that, because the definition of an LCM included the word "box", that an ammo can full of loose ammunition could fit said definition. BTW: I see you got your first Class 3 weapon. Congratulations. Nice house, too.
Thanks! Sucks, its in a shitty 'Hood. ADT wasn't cutting it, so I got a new alarm system. 
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In my opinion, the way they chose to write the law, an uneducated person could be convinced that the 2 are one in the same using the examples in the pics above.
My intent was never to make an argument that your door would be kicked in, I just found it interesting the way they chose to word it was all. I don't think it's that unreasonable to think that a jury or anyone else involved with any type of prosecution of any of these insane laws would be very well educated in the workings of firearms. As an example, the *president* of an area gun club informed a friend and I that "when you rapid fire one of those things, it becomes an illegal machine gun". We weren't doing mag dumps or anything stupid, it was just double taps that were all going into a 6" group. When we heard him say that, we packed up and left because in the event that a neighbor of the range called the police (as they advised us has happened before) if an uneducated patrol officer were to come, Who's he going to ask about advice, the people shooting, or the president of the gun club? It wasn't that unreasonable to think that the president would say "those guys are shooting an illegal machine gun" and my friends 100% legal semi auto RPD get confiscated and us get arrested for having an illegal machine gun, when the fact of the matter was, everything was 100% legal. My point is, all it takes is a little misinformation and ignorance to start the legal process, and once that starts, it can ruin many a man. |