[ARCHIVED THREAD] - AR Build Party? (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 9/26/2014 4:40:45 PM EDT
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Hello folks!
My name's Daniel, and I have just purchased a 80% lower from Lockestone, and was wondering if anyone know anything about any build parties here in GA? I am located near McDonough/Locust Grove, so any help would be appreciated. I am building an AR-15 , with a Lockestone lower, LaRue upper, Daniel Defense lower parts, etc. I have owned a Core15 before, but sold it and decided to go high-end on this build. Looking forward to hearing inputs from you guys! 
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Quoted: I have not heard anything that would indicate Lockestone was a shitty lower. Their material seems to be good stuff from what I've seen, but I'm always open to comments/suggestions. |
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I have not heard anything that would indicate Lockestone was a shitty lower. Their material seems to be good stuff from what I've seen, but I'm always open to comments/suggestions. Have youe any idea how you are going to anodize it with a mil spec hard coat finish? Thats part of the quality you will get in a $50 Anderson lower. Without it your fcg holes will eventually wear. |
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I've been shopping around forever for lowers, and a lot of them have that bland " look " to them, but something about Lockestone's lower stood out to me, with their design. I can't believe you've been shopping around "forever" and can't find a complete lower to your liking. Is this project more about seeing if you can make a functioning rifle from a 80% lower and you just want a challenge? Because quality and 80% lower usually don't go in the same sentence. Eta I will add that a member recently did an 80% lower build, and it did turn out looking good. I don't know if he put a finish on it though. |
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Quoted: It doesn't seem to be much of a challenge. I've had several friends that say they built rifles from a 80% lower, and claim to shoot perfect. |
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Shoot perfect is a relative term. 80% lowers won't hold up to a lot of use. They aren't hardend and wear out under hard use. If your like most, build away, it'll outlast your kids kids. Quoted:
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It doesn't seem to be much of a challenge. I've had several friends that say they built rifles from a 80% lower, and claim to shoot perfect. Can you explain why it won't harden and wear out after hard use? I don't see what part of the lower receiver would wear out after use.....only thing that makes sense to wear out after use is ( barrel, springs, firing pin , and the likes ), but the lower receiver itself? I'm intrigued in hearing more. |
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I think theres a logical distrust of anybody that will pay a premium to DIY a 80% lower at a premium price to a off the shelf lower.
I'd take a PSA blem lower any day over a quality 80% lower If you just want to DIY something to say you've done it, Get a form 1 and start playing with cans. |
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Can you explain why it won't harden and wear out after hard use? I don't see what part of the lower receiver would wear out after use.....only thing that makes sense to wear out after use is ( barrel, springs, firing pin , and the likes ), but the lower receiver itself? I'm intrigued in hearing more. Quoted:
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It doesn't seem to be much of a challenge. I've had several friends that say they built rifles from a 80% lower, and claim to shoot perfect. Can you explain why it won't harden and wear out after hard use? I don't see what part of the lower receiver would wear out after use.....only thing that makes sense to wear out after use is ( barrel, springs, firing pin , and the likes ), but the lower receiver itself? I'm intrigued in hearing more. Anodizing, while a surface treatment, actually hardens the surface to keep the pins from wallowing in the aluminum the lower is made from. There are some of us here who shoot thousands of rounds a year, a few tens of thousands. An 80% lower left unanodized in a stress area like the fire control group will eventually wear out to the point it will become unsafe, and therefore pointless. Buy yourself an inexpensive billet lower or an Anderson for $39 from Primary Arms and you'll never have to worry about it. |
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HELLO, the outside has been anodized, not the part you are going to finish IE the most important part the FCG! Look at your 80% lower, notice anything odd? Like the fact that you don't have two off-set holes at 45 degree angle to each other where the hammer and trigger pins go. When you drill those, there will be NO anodizing much less hard anodizing. Aluminum is a soft metal which is why you can finish the lower in the first place. Your holes will be out of spec after the first 1000 rounds (if they were in spec in the first place)! Unless you are somebody like the MadMachinest that has access to proper tools and technology, you are not going to have a lower worth mating to anything high tech! If you buy and build an 80% lower, you might as well mate it with the cheapest upper you can build/buy. That's my opinion on the subject, YMMV! Oh yeah, Welcome to the forum! 
And sorry to dump on you right out of the gate, but 80% lowers are NOT a popular topic. |
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Thanks for the input guys. I may just look into getting a complete lower. It's safe to assume that one can send it to a custom anodizing company? I am looking to get a dark burnt orange lower. Bear with me, I'm fairly new to the whole concept of anodizing/cerakoating.
Suppose I purchase a quality lower that has already been anodized, is it still possible for the anodizing company to anodize it the color I want, or would cerakote be the suggested route to do this? |
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Quoted:
Thanks for the input guys. I may just look into getting a complete lower. It's safe to assume that one can send it to a custom anodizing company? I am looking to get a dark burnt orange lower. Bear with me, I'm fairly new to the whole concept of anodizing/cerakoating. Suppose I purchase a quality lower that has already been anodized, is it still possible for the anodizing company to anodize it the color I want, or would cerakote be the suggested route to do this? Any color you want it. 
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When you say build party are you talking about one of those deals where you walk in, pays yer money, get it set up in a CNC and you push the button.....? If so....the reason you are being met with derision is that those are illegal. Home building is exactly that...home building.....while it is perfectly legal for an individualto build a firearm....all work must be done by the builder. You'd have to set the lower up in the mill....program the pocket, select the tools locate them in the mill software, generate your code and then machine the fire control pocket with no help. Then make the second set up to drill the pin holes locating form the datum point.
It is considered the height of trolldom to join a forum and make your first post about comitting a felony.......from a liability standpoint someone like me with multiple milling machines both manual and CNC my attorney would have a coronary if I let someone I don't know into my shop with lots of razor sharp spinning things.... 
What you ask is almost as frowned upon as asking about "full auto conversions'.....another way to earn a long term stay at the greybar resort. Join a builders forum like weaponsguild, makes some friends and you might be allowed to use a nother members mill once they know and trust you......or get a mini mill (you can do an 80% on some very small machines if you take your time.....get the jig that goes with your lower or download the Ray-Vin tutoral and get to buildin....and as far as annodizing if you mark it you can have a home build professionally annodized in type three hardcoat by many annodizeds who hold an FFL just for this reason. If you want to do it yourself, search Vader Spade online....he has posts and tutorials on home annodizing on several forums. |
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There's a lot of 80% hate around here. Is it cheaper to buy a stripped lower? Yes. Less work? Yes. Will an 80% eventually wear the pin holes without proper anodizing? Yes. Are your chances of screwing the lower up much higher? Yes. Should any of that matter to anyone but you? Nope.
Some folks are nervous about a guy that nobody knows asking for help finishing an 80% since you're supposed to do it yourself according to federal law. That's why the "build party" thing doesn't sit well. To address your anodizing questions, sure, you could send it to a professional anodizing place to have it done after you finish it, but the problem is that at that point it's a firearm so you'd have to ship it to an FFL and it would probably have to be marked with a serial number so they could log it in. If I were you (assuming you already bought that lower) I'd finish it and put it together with some KNS pins and call it a day. If you haven't purchased, just know that buying a stripped lower and having it coated whatever color you want would be the easiest way out. Post pics when your finished. Welcome, and good luck. ETA: beat by a few minutes. Typing on iPad mini sucks. |
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Thanks for the clarifications as to how the " build parties " are perceived by you guys. I was under the assumption that it was legal, as long as it was at one's place of residence. I am now looking into getting a stripped lower that's completed and having it anodized.
I am leaning towards getting a Spike's Tactical lower at this point. |
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When you say build party are you talking about one of those deals where you walk in, pays yer money, get it set up in a CNC and you push the button.....? If so....the reason you are being met with derision is that those are illegal. Home building is exactly that...home building.....while it is perfectly legal for an individualto build a firearm....all work must be done by the builder. You'd have to set the lower up in the mill....program the pocket, select the tools locate them in the mill software, generate your code and then machine the fire control pocket with no help. Then make the second set up to drill the pin holes locating form the datum point. It is considered the height of trolldom to join a forum and make your first post about comitting a felony.......from a liability standpoint someone like me with multiple milling machines both manual and CNC my attorney would have a coronary if I let someone I don't know into my shop with lots of razor sharp spinning things....
What you ask is almost as frowned upon as asking about "full auto conversions'.....another way to earn a long term stay at the greybar resort. Join a builders forum like weaponsguild, makes some friends and you might be allowed to use a nother members mill once they know and trust you......or get a mini mill (you can do an 80% on some very small machines if you take your time.....get the jig that goes with your lower or download the Ray-Vin tutoral and get to buildin....and as far as annodizing if you mark it you can have a home build professionally annodized in type three hardcoat by many annodizeds who hold an FFL just for this reason. If you want to do it yourself, search Vader Spade online....he has posts and tutorials on home annodizing on several forums. I think I'm going to copy this post M-M. I'm sure op isn't going to be the last "Can someone help me finish an 80% lower? " and I figure it'll save time to just paste it up in quotes in the next thread. 
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Quoted:
Thanks for the clarifications as to how the " build parties " are perceived by you guys. I was under the assumption that it was legal, as long as it was at one's place of residence. I am now looking into getting a stripped lower that's completed and having it anodized. I am leaning towards getting a Spike's Tactical lower at this point. AR15.com does spikes build parties too.
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| Hello and welcome to the htf. I am located in locust grove as well. I am willing to help you if you are willing to listen and do this he right way. My best advice to you no is go see jake at Quiet Riot Firearms in McDonough. Get a Aero Precision blemish lower for 59.99. Get your lower and we can start your build. And stay your butt out of American Heritage gun and range... |
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Thanks for the clarifications as to how the " build parties " are perceived by you guys. I was under the assumption that it was legal, as long as it was at one's place of residence. I am now looking into getting a stripped lower that's completed and having it anodized. I am leaning towards getting a Spike's Tactical lower at this point. If you buy a complete lower its going to be hard coat anodized on every part of it so you don't have to worry about that. There is nothing wrong with an 80% if you just want to do it yourself and understand that it will never lasts with use without having it anodized. Stop by and see Jake in Mcdonough, as forman2000 stated, Jake has lowers at a reasonable price and he can also order anything you want or transfer anything you buy online. http://www.quietriotfirearms.com/ There are a lot of us in the Mcdonough area, welcome to the forum. |
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Don't take it the wrong way newbie. We are a tight group of guys who genuinely want to help those who are asking questions. The problem is we get a lot of folks (especially lately for some reason) that want somebody to help them do something illegal or stupid, and that screams sting operation or entrapment to most of us. Normal folks typically don't ask 80% build or full auto conversion parts questions for their first post(s).
We have a reason to be suspicious. There have been multiple attempts by the ATF and other govt agencies to entrap people into exactly these kinds of situations. |
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Don't take it the wrong way newbie. We are a tight group of guys who genuinely want to help those who are asking questions. The problem is we get a lot of folks (especially lately for some reason) that want somebody to help them do something illegal or stupid, and that screams sting operation or entrapment to most of us. Normal folks typically don't ask 80% build or full auto conversion parts questions for their first post(s). We have a reason to be suspicious. There have been multiple attempts by the ATF and other govt agencies to entrap people into exactly these kinds of situations. So in other words, if op wants an AR, he should just use the one issued to him by .gov, lol. |
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No, just take the time to learn to do the work yourself. Once I get to know someone and can confirm they aren't an idiot, I'm happy to help them with projects. I regularly welcom Weaponsguild members into my shop, but I have seen their past builds and know their skill level. Hell, a couple I respect their ability enough I just show 'em a mill and walk away, but I have know that select few for years. It is legal for an in home build party, I have gone to a lot, and I usually don't build as I know of very few home shops better equipped than mine, I offer advice and instruction, but I make anyone I am helping do the actual work. I have shown how to do a setup then taken the part off the machine handed back to the owner and said your turn
If you are serious about Building rather than assembling join weapons guild, make some friends, read, and learn, but don't expect someone to just let you walk in and start running their equipment, they are extremely expensive and easy for a novice to crash. Eventually I hope to have several bench top mills and offer classes on finishing lower's, chambering barrels and various other skills to promote home building, but they will be structured classes over the course of several days if not multiple weekends, starting with the basics of how to run a mill or lathe without hurting yourself or the machine
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I think theres a logical distrust of anybody that will pay a premium to DIY a 80% lower at a premium price to a off the shelf lower. I'd take a PSA blem lower any day over a quality 80% lower If you just want to DIY something to say you've done it, Get a form 1 and start playing with cans. I agree with Rob on this topic. While an 80% lower would be a fun project a scratch built suppressor that works would be much more of an impressive accomplishment IMHO OP this kinda thread came up a couple of months back and ended well I think. So hang in there, hang around and get to know some folks
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I think I'm going to copy this post M-M. I'm sure op isn't going to be the last "Can someone help me finish an 80% lower? " and I figure it'll save time to just paste it up in quotes in the next thread.
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When you say build party are you talking about one of those deals where you walk in, pays yer money, get it set up in a CNC and you push the button.....? If so....the reason you are being met with derision is that those are illegal. Home building is exactly that...home building.....while it is perfectly legal for an individualto build a firearm....all work must be done by the builder. You'd have to set the lower up in the mill....program the pocket, select the tools locate them in the mill software, generate your code and then machine the fire control pocket with no help. Then make the second set up to drill the pin holes locating form the datum point. It is considered the height of trolldom to join a forum and make your first post about comitting a felony.......from a liability standpoint someone like me with multiple milling machines both manual and CNC my attorney would have a coronary if I let someone I don't know into my shop with lots of razor sharp spinning things....
What you ask is almost as frowned upon as asking about "full auto conversions'.....another way to earn a long term stay at the greybar resort. Join a builders forum like weaponsguild, makes some friends and you might be allowed to use a nother members mill once they know and trust you......or get a mini mill (you can do an 80% on some very small machines if you take your time.....get the jig that goes with your lower or download the Ray-Vin tutoral and get to buildin....and as far as annodizing if you mark it you can have a home build professionally annodized in type three hardcoat by many annodizeds who hold an FFL just for this reason. If you want to do it yourself, search Vader Spade online....he has posts and tutorials on home annodizing on several forums. I think I'm going to copy this post M-M. I'm sure op isn't going to be the last "Can someone help me finish an 80% lower? " and I figure it'll save time to just paste it up in quotes in the next thread.
Feel free, this does seem to be happening with increasing frequency. |
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I think I'm going to copy this post M-M. I'm sure op isn't going to be the last "Can someone help me finish an 80% lower? " and I figure it'll save time to just paste it up in quotes in the next thread.
Quoted:
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When you say build party are you talking about one of those deals where you walk in, pays yer money, get it set up in a CNC and you push the button.....? If so....the reason you are being met with derision is that those are illegal. Home building is exactly that...home building.....while it is perfectly legal for an individualto build a firearm....all work must be done by the builder. You'd have to set the lower up in the mill....program the pocket, select the tools locate them in the mill software, generate your code and then machine the fire control pocket with no help. Then make the second set up to drill the pin holes locating form the datum point. It is considered the height of trolldom to join a forum and make your first post about comitting a felony.......from a liability standpoint someone like me with multiple milling machines both manual and CNC my attorney would have a coronary if I let someone I don't know into my shop with lots of razor sharp spinning things....
What you ask is almost as frowned upon as asking about "full auto conversions'.....another way to earn a long term stay at the greybar resort. Join a builders forum like weaponsguild, makes some friends and you might be allowed to use a nother members mill once they know and trust you......or get a mini mill (you can do an 80% on some very small machines if you take your time.....get the jig that goes with your lower or download the Ray-Vin tutoral and get to buildin....and as far as annodizing if you mark it you can have a home build professionally annodized in type three hardcoat by many annodizeds who hold an FFL just for this reason. If you want to do it yourself, search Vader Spade online....he has posts and tutorials on home annodizing on several forums. I think I'm going to copy this post M-M. I'm sure op isn't going to be the last "Can someone help me finish an 80% lower? " and I figure it'll save time to just paste it up in quotes in the next thread.
just don't add 'edited by makeitflyfast"
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Thanks for the recommendation on Jake at Quiet Riot. I will definitely get in touch with him.
After a little bit of research/shopping, I am finally set on getting a Black Rain lower/upper, with a DD LPK. Haven't decided on which BCG I would like to get for it yet, but I am looking for a 16" Stainless steel 1:8 barrel. Any suggestions as to which barrel provides top notch accuracy/quality? I've heard about Wylde, but any criticism is welcome here. Thanks |
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Quoted: Thanks for the recommendation on Jake at Quiet Riot. I will definitely get in touch with him. After a little bit of research/shopping, I am finally set on getting a Black Rain lower/upper, with a DD LPK. Haven't decided on which BCG I would like to get for it yet, but I am looking for a 16" Stainless steel 1:8 barrel. Any suggestions as to which barrel provides top notch accuracy/quality? I've heard about Wylde, but any criticism is welcome here. Thanks |
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Thanks for the recommendation on Jake at Quiet Riot. I will definitely get in touch with him. After a little bit of research/shopping, I am finally set on getting a Black Rain lower/upper, with a DD LPK. Haven't decided on which BCG I would like to get for it yet, but I am looking for a 16" Stainless steel 1:8 barrel. Any suggestions as to which barrel provides top notch accuracy/quality? I've heard about Wylde, but any criticism is welcome here. Thanks Damn you bounce around fast... lol... knew a girl like that once.. |
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Damn you bounce around fast... lol... knew a girl like that once.. Quoted:
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Thanks for the recommendation on Jake at Quiet Riot. I will definitely get in touch with him. After a little bit of research/shopping, I am finally set on getting a Black Rain lower/upper, with a DD LPK. Haven't decided on which BCG I would like to get for it yet, but I am looking for a 16" Stainless steel 1:8 barrel. Any suggestions as to which barrel provides top notch accuracy/quality? I've heard about Wylde, but any criticism is welcome here. Thanks Damn you bounce around fast... lol... knew a girl like that once.. Maybe he planned to order one then saw the wait times. |
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Maybe he planned to order one then saw the wait times. ^ This. I called them, and they said they don't have an exact ETA on when they will be back in stock and ready to ship. The Black Rain upper looks pretty solid. Can anyone on here vouch for Black Rain's quality, other than the rave reviews I have read online about them? |
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Thanks for the recommendation on Jake at Quiet Riot. I will definitely get in touch with him. After a little bit of research/shopping, I am finally set on getting a Black Rain lower/upper, with a DD LPK. Haven't decided on which BCG I would like to get for it yet, but I am looking for a 16" Stainless steel 1:8 barrel. Any suggestions as to which barrel provides top notch accuracy/quality? I've heard about Wylde, but any criticism is welcome here. Thanks What kind of sights are going to go with? Irons alone or an optic with BUIS? What's your budget for all of this anyways? |
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Feel free, this does seem to be happening with increasing frequency. Quoted:
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When you say build party are you talking about one of those deals where you walk in, pays yer money, get it set up in a CNC and you push the button.....? If so....the reason you are being met with derision is that those are illegal. Home building is exactly that...home building.....while it is perfectly legal for an individualto build a firearm....all work must be done by the builder. You'd have to set the lower up in the mill....program the pocket, select the tools locate them in the mill software, generate your code and then machine the fire control pocket with no help. Then make the second set up to drill the pin holes locating form the datum point. It is considered the height of trolldom to join a forum and make your first post about comitting a felony.......from a liability standpoint someone like me with multiple milling machines both manual and CNC my attorney would have a coronary if I let someone I don't know into my shop with lots of razor sharp spinning things....
What you ask is almost as frowned upon as asking about "full auto conversions'.....another way to earn a long term stay at the greybar resort. Join a builders forum like weaponsguild, makes some friends and you might be allowed to use a nother members mill once they know and trust you......or get a mini mill (you can do an 80% on some very small machines if you take your time.....get the jig that goes with your lower or download the Ray-Vin tutoral and get to buildin....and as far as annodizing if you mark it you can have a home build professionally annodized in type three hardcoat by many annodizeds who hold an FFL just for this reason. If you want to do it yourself, search Vader Spade online....he has posts and tutorials on home annodizing on several forums. I think I'm going to copy this post M-M. I'm sure op isn't going to be the last "Can someone help me finish an 80% lower? " and I figure it'll save time to just paste it up in quotes in the next thread.
Feel free, this does seem to be happening with increasing frequency. I think part of it MM is that AR prices are falling and a bunch of the 80% crowd see their market going away when we can get striped lowers between $39 to $59. There are being advertised on ever AR and Weapons Forum around, probably trying to unload them before they are caught with a ton of them. My shooting buddy in Sugar Hill bought one and after looking at it we discovered it was actually from one of the big lower manufactures and there was an outside defect so they must have unloaded them to somebody selling 80% lowers which is another reason I don't trust 80% lowers. |
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Are you sure this 80% lower thing isn't to have a lower that's "off the books"? Cause if it is, it's not worth it. Who needs an 80% lower to have an AR that is legally completely off the books?????? Any AR I buy on the secondary used market is purchased without a 4473 and is completely legal and totally off the books in regards to its new owner. And again as you said, why go to that much trouble with an 80% just to be off the books when you can buy a rifle legally off the books. Which is just one more reason 80% Lowers make no sense to me. They could be defective even before one starts finishing it. One can mess it up badly while finishing it. If not properly anodized afterwards it will not last. It costs more then a high quality completely finished striped lower. And on and on. |
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MOD, please disregard my last post. I apologize for being a dumbwit and not reading the forum rules in regards to the sale. Also read the rules for the EE (Equipment Exchange) and if its legal to be sold, just about anything can be sold over their if its legal, not on the do not post list, and in the right subcategory. The EE keeps the HTF from being a place invaded by people just trying to sell other people stuff. And the EE works, I have found several items I was looking for over their. |