Posted: 3/17/2011 5:04:32 PM EDT
|
I've been depriming .223 brass, first with a full length sizing die, and then with a general decapping die. Both dies are Lee brand. Anyway, the depriming rod has a rod with a smaller "pin" set into a cavity. This pin keeps being pulled out, stuck in the flash hole. Is this germane to Lee brand? Or does all brands of deprimers operate similarly? I'm sure it is cheaper to manufacture these in two pieces and press them together.
Brian |
|
My LEE full length sizing dies have given very good service. If the decapping pin is seperating from the punch, I suspect your brass has smaller than normal flash holes. What brass are you using? The only time I have broken the pin on a LEE die is when a piece of berdan brass got mixed in.
If the entire stem is pulling out of the die body, tighten the stem a little more. You will need a 1/2" and 3/4" end wrenches. |
| Whoa, time out! Ok, do I understand that you have been using a full size resizing die to resize the brass and deprime the shell. Then you are running the resized and deprimed shell through a general deprimer? There is no benefit to do this. The general deprimer is to deprme a shell and then use a neck only sizer. This is for people who have a tight chamber and do not need to bump back the shoulder. Also some will do this if their brass has a staked or crimped primer. Seeing how you are reloading. I would assume that you have a caliber and can measure the dia of the decapping pin on both dies. So, is there a difference in the dia of the two pins on the different dies? I would quit using the general decapper till you have figured out why the pin keeps getting pulled. An enlarged primer hole could change the burn characteristics of the powder. Primer holes are critical in the diameter of the hole. |
|
I agree that it is probably undersized flash holes, IMG brass is notorious for being undersize. My solution was to upgrade my old RCBS stem to the new type where the size button threads on, and the pin had a large head under the button. deprimes, and swages the flash holes at the same time.
Max-Paul if the flash hole is so critical, why does winchester say to use standard primers in the win clean brass with the huge flash hole? |
|
Quoted:
Whoa, time out! Ok, do I understand that you have been using a full size resizing die to resize the brass and deprime the shell. Then you are running the resized and deprimed shell through a general deprimer? There is no benefit to do this. The general deprimer is to deprme a shell and then use a neck only sizer. This is for people who have a tight chamber and do not need to bump back the shoulder. Also some will do this if their brass has a staked or crimped primer. Seeing how you are reloading. I would assume that you have a caliber and can measure the dia of the decapping pin on both dies. So, is there a difference in the dia of the two pins on the different dies? I would quit using the general decapper till you have figured out why the pin keeps getting pulled. An enlarged primer hole could change the burn characteristics of the powder. Primer holes are critical in the diameter of the hole. +1 I use Lee Reloading EQ, the sizing decapper die is all you need. Be caseful to resize the brass ALL the way to the case holder for an AR. You don't want to stick a case! Been there, done that! YUCK! 
|
Sorry if I wasn't clear (It was clear in my mind ).
Quoted:
Whoa, time out! Ok, do I understand that you have been using a full size resizing die to resize the brass and deprime the shell. Then you are running the resized and deprimed shell through a general deprimer? I'm not using both simultaneously. I used the sizer die until the pin pulled out, and then used the decapper die until the same thing happened. The rod/stem is securely held in the die, it is the "pin" that is pressed into the bottom of this rod/stem that is pulled out. The actual part that pushes the primer out by pushing through the flash hole. It is not Berdan primed, but is mixed head stamp, with a lot of military. I'm not sure about the first time, but the one that put me out of business tonight was IMG. So that makes sense if they are notorious for smaller flash holes. Now what is the solution? Do other brands of dies operate differently. I'm not opposed to trying a different brand as I have over 1000 cases to process. Brian |
|
There is some brass out there with undersized flashholes. These will hold the decapping pin and it will pull out (as you have found out. If this gets too annoying then I would suggest decapping with a dedicated decapper (RCBS is good, the pin is captive) then resizing using your Lee dies (remove the decapping pin but leave the expander in) Yeah, it is an extra step but it solves the problem.
Or you could try to come up with a smaller diameter decapping pin. Good luck! |
|
If it's the Lee decapping pin that is being pulled from the stem, there is something wrong with the set. The pin should not be pulled out no matter how tight the flash hole.
I've accidentally decapped a berdan primed piece of brass and the Lee punched right through. Didn't even notice other than it was pretty stiff. I just blamed it on a primer crimp but it was actually berdan primed!
|
|
Quoted:
I agree that it is probably undersized flash holes, IMG brass is notorious for being undersize. My solution was to upgrade my old RCBS stem to the new type where the size button threads on, and the pin had a large head under the button. deprimes, and swages the flash holes at the same time. Max-Paul if the flash hole is so critical, why does winchester say to use standard primers in the win clean brass with the huge flash hole? CIB, I am getting to be an old man and memory is not as good as it was in the past. I do a lot of reading and hopefully I am not confusing things. I am going to try to find the source and post it. But seems to me, I remember reading something about the size if flash holes being important. I dont remember if it was allowing to much fire from the primer setting off a larger flame front thus raising the pressure in the case. Or if it had to do with back pressure blowing the primer out of the case. But I am fairly sure there is a significance to the size of the hole. Anyone else seen something about this in a book? Edit: Well I went and used my friend google to search out any info about "Flash Hole Size". And there seems to be a 50/50 about this subject. And to add to the mix, we have the smokeless powder people and black powder people add their comments. I have concluded that the enlarging the flash hole on cartridges for black powder such as the gov. 45.70 is a good thing. As for the smokeless powder cartridge. Well one guy thinks that one of his cases had an enlarged flash hole and that caused a blown primer. Then a few other do not think it has anything to do with blown primer. All I know is that I shall not ever on purpose enlarge the flash hole past .082". I am no engineer, but I am aware that the pressure pulse is very short in duration. And even though the volume of the primer chamber is very small. Something in the back of my head says that the pressure pulse is restricted somewhat by the size of the flash hole. Seems that most of my reloading knowledge came from the Speer reloading manual and the "ABC's of reloading". I would almost bet you this is where I heard something about flash hole size in the past. |
|
Max, I should clarify the Win-Clean stuff that I have seen have all been pistol calibers. I don't know if they ever made them in rifle cals where the pressures would be significantly higher. I came into a bunch of the .45 brass, and when I saw the flash hole I taken aback by the size of the flash hole, that's when I contacted Winchester, and the tech told me it was fine to use standard primers in them. I don't even know if they are still making the stuff or not?
At any rate the OP will probably be stuffing American made primers back in the IMG brass, so he should be alright enlarging it to our standard. I've never had any problems with the batch of IMG I have. Wish I could buy some more of those 2,100 rd. cases of it for $90.00! |
|
OK, I solved my problem, BUT! I created another. I bought a RCBS decapping die and no longer have the problem of the decapping pins pulling out. The model I bought has "headed" pins, that don't allow them to pull out. The new problem is breaking the pins. I bought a pkg of 5, in addition to the one it came with, and tonight I went thru all of them. Is there a secret to getting them centered? I just need to get thru about another hundred or so. I really like this style of rod/stem over Lee, just need to figure this out.
Brian |
|
Jeez, dude your hard on shit are'nt you? LOL! I remember breaking/bending a few, but I don't think I went through that many. I think your answer may be just to slow down while your working the handle, and maybe lube the pin a bit every 2-3 cases. PIA I know, but you should'nt have any problems the second time through.
|
|
Thanx for all the replies. I FINALLY finished depriming all of the brass, and cleaned and sized most of it before I got tired and quit for the night. I finally got the hang of using the RCBS decapper. You're right, the secret was to go slower and feel the pin go through the flash hole. If you don't feel it, raise the handle and try again. Also, if it felt too hard after reaching the primer, just pull the case and throw away. The problem headstamp was IMG.
I have an idea for the perfect decapper. You take Lee's idea for a "sliding" rod/stem, so that it gives when it reaches too much resistance. And add the replaceable pin idea the RCBS has. Especially with the "headed" pins that prevent being pulled out. Who wants to bank roll this idea?!? 
Brian |