Posted: 10/2/2011 6:24:16 AM EDT
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I was just wondering if the slide fire stock is legal in this state. I know that the hand crank or gattling gun is illegal in Mn. and Hawaii and they also come with a atf letter saying they are not machine gun parts.
Any help will be appreciated thanks. |
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I was just wondering if the slide fire stock is legal in this state. I know that the hand crank or gattling gun is illegal in Mn. and Hawaii and they also come with a atf letter saying they are not machine gun parts. Any help will be appreciated thanks. How are they illegal? Edit- I didn't see this part (d) "Trigger activator" means a removable manual or power driven trigger activating device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun. I looked on Cabelas website at the 10/22 gatling kit. Cannot ship to MN. I'm dumber than shit. |
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I was just wondering if the slide fire stock is legal in this state. I know that the hand crank or gattling gun is illegal in Mn. and Hawaii and they also come with a atf letter saying they are not machine gun parts. Any help will be appreciated thanks. How are they illegal? Edit- I didn't see this part (d) "Trigger activator" means a removable manual or power driven trigger activating device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun. I looked on Cabelas website at the 10/22 gatling kit. Cannot ship to MN. I'm dumber than shit. Yep, that same clause really bummed me out.  I was all geared up to buy one until I read the state laws carefully.
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(d) "Trigger activator" means a removable manual or power driven trigger activating device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun. the slide fire (last i checked) falls under this statue and is illegal in MN. the device allows you to pull the trigger at a "MG" type rate of fire. it used to be listed on slidefire's own websight which state it was illegal in (naming MN), but seems they have removed that info instead opting for the general "you figger it out" line. |
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"Trigger activator" means a removable manual or power driven trigger activating device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun."
the slidefire stock is a device designed so that when attached to the rifle it will allow the user to increase the rate that the trigger may be pulled to the rate of a full auto(machine gun) bump firing is legal, using a device that attaches to the weapon to facilitate bump firing ( simulating full auto) is not. just because someone is selling them dosnt mean they are legal to own. the toy is new, people will sell them until someone gets called on it, then they will get pulled, just like the crank activator. |
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What are the state statutes regarding that? statute for what? the state law makeing them illegal to own has already been posted. If you're referring to this: (d) "Trigger activator" means a removable manual or power driven trigger activating device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun.
This does not apply. The slide fire stock does not activate the trigger. Your finger activates the trigger. https://www.revisor.leg.state.mn.us/statutes/?year=1999&id=609.67 |
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What are the state statutes regarding that? statute for what? the state law makeing them illegal to own has already been posted. If you're referring to this: (d) "Trigger activator" means a removable manual or power driven trigger activating device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun.
This does not apply. The slide fire stock does not activate the trigger. Your finger activates the trigger. https://www.revisor.leg.state.mn.us/statutes/?year=1999&id=609.67 the law doesn't say that the device needs to touch the trigger to be illegal. it just needs to attach to the rifle and allow the trigger to be pulled at a greatly increased rate. the slidefire stock is a device SPACIFICY designed so that when attached to the rifle it will allow the user to increase the rate that the trigger may be pulled. I am not a layer (tho i keep them employed) but my training in legalize comes from a very good defence attorney |
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What are the state statutes regarding that? statute for what? the state law makeing them illegal to own has already been posted. If you're referring to this: (d) "Trigger activator" means a removable manual or power driven trigger activating device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun.
This does not apply. The slide fire stock does not activate the trigger. Your finger activates the trigger. https://www.revisor.leg.state.mn.us/statutes/?year=1999&id=609.67 If you want to test your theory, go right ahead. IMHO, the device and the statute are close enough that I'll pass on being the guy that wants to find out for sure. |
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why is this any different than what Bowers made and then went through?
why would anyone think that the same thing wont happen with this too. I have friends that 3 years later are still trying to get their damn bolt guns back after the whole lot of weapons the group had were confiscated because of the doubt surrounding one firearm. Fuck that. ya really think the ATF or anyone else is going to allow anything that "creates" more machineguns to survive? really? why? it makes NO SENSE... it's all fine and dandy until you have to defend yourself in court and you have your first 150 buck an hour initial meeting with you lawyer... |
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Since the ATF ruled that a shoelace is a machine gun part, I would not risk my dog over it.
The ATF can do whatever they want. You have to lawyer up to get your rights and your guns back if they decide you are a criminal. How hard would it be for them to destroy any one of us in the court of public opinion? Especially since they would just have to report that the individual building machine guns in question had a "cache" of arms and over one thousand rounds of military grade ammunition!!!!! |
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But does MN law really say this is a trigger activator? I thought that was the original question. With the posting of the MN law here, I'd say the Slidefire is NOT banned in MN since it does not attach to the trigger.
Really, if you want one of these, buy it while you can. If you are worried about the legality, don't buy one. In general, if you go ask the gov't, "Please mother, may I?", you are going to be told no because it is easier and safer for the bureaucrats to say no and gather more power for themselves. Then someone will have to be a test case to get it proven legal. That's not going to be me. The ATF has already ruled, for now anyway, that federally it is not restricted. Once again, we're stuck with shitty MN laws in this nanny state and as a state and nation, we're too cowed to even question the state's authority in what is perhaps a grey area of law. Bitter Bastard |
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"Gatling" style kits are illegal in Minnesota....I would only assume that the Slidefire would be as well...and I assume things accurately at times. And you are the "bump fire master". Remember when we shoulder bump fired my G36 at Bills and took out that bank of lights? 
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"Gatling" style kits are illegal in Minnesota....I would only assume that the Slidefire would be as well...and I assume things accurately at times. And you are the "bump fire master". Remember when we shoulder bump fired my G36 at Bills and took out that bank of lights? hahahahaha I may or may not have been in an indoor range one time with an M1A and... its true, fire those too fast and youlll take down an airplane. or part of the ceiling 
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The Gatlin kits are not legal because of the crank which is considered a trigger activator. I have a neighbor who works for the BCA and is a gun nut as well.
He has a slide fire stock and so do I. They are fun as hell but ammo consumption has gone way up.... He checked into it and can't find where they would not be legal. Don't take that as a legal ruling though. He said that we should keep the ATF letter that comes with it and a dated sales receipt so that if a ruling comes down on the stock we could get them grandfathered in.. |
| I was out at Ahlmans in Morristown on Friday, and they only had one in stock. there was a guy out there at the same time as me buying 2 of them.....Must be nice! They have had them out there for a while now. I'll talk to them next time I'm out there, I know them pretty well, and I wouldn't think they would be selling them if they were illegal in MN. |
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Quoted: Quoted: The SlideFire Stocks come with a ATF Approval Letter ATF letter says its not a machine gun. MN law says its a trigger activator and illegal. being a trigger activator has nothing to do with it not being a machine gun. I haven't found anything that Minnesota Law claims it a trigger activator, care to share a source or a link? |
I bought the slide fire stock and I used it at the local range, it's pretty neat. Although, I'm having some difficulty with it. It'll only fire a two round burst and then on the third it punctures the primer sometimes. It could just be that I need more practice. I was told I could not go full auto with all the people around from the range officer, so it could be that I was too nervous about letting out too many rounds which is pretty easy to do. 
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The SlideFire Stocks come with a ATF Approval Letter ATF letter says its not a machine gun. MN law says its a trigger activator and illegal. being a trigger activator has nothing to do with it not being a machine gun. I haven't found anything that Minnesota Law claims it a trigger activator, care to share a source or a link? as I said on the first page; 609.67 Sub1 (d) ""Trigger activator" means a removable manual or power driven trigger activating device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun." if you were to describe the slide fire to someone.....that's pretty much an exact definition of the product. "The Slide fire is a device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun." |
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The SlideFire Stocks come with a ATF Approval Letter ATF letter says its not a machine gun. MN law says its a trigger activator and illegal. being a trigger activator has nothing to do with it not being a machine gun. I haven't found anything that Minnesota Law claims it a trigger activator, care to share a source or a link? as I said on the first page; 609.67 Sub1 (d) ""Trigger activator" means a removable manual or power driven trigger activating device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun." if you were to describe the slide fire to someone.....that's pretty much an exact definition of the product. "The Slide fire is a device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun." AHA! But it is not a trigger activating device, is it? No where does it attach to, or interface with, the trigger. At the time that law was written all that was available of that nature was the Hellfire and the gatling-style crank, both of which do indeed activate the trigger. The Slidefire may serve a similar purpose but the way I read the law, it is not covered. What was just said on the other thread, something to the effect we are our own worst enemies? Yeah, here's another example. |
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The SlideFire Stocks come with a ATF Approval Letter ATF letter says its not a machine gun. MN law says its a trigger activator and illegal. being a trigger activator has nothing to do with it not being a machine gun. I haven't found anything that Minnesota Law claims it a trigger activator, care to share a source or a link? as I said on the first page; 609.67 Sub1 (d) ""Trigger activator" means a removable manual or power driven trigger activating device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun." if you were to describe the slide fire to someone.....that's pretty much an exact definition of the product. "The Slide fire is a device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun." AHA! But it is not a trigger activating device, is it? No where does it attach to, or interface with, the trigger. At the time that law was written all that was available of that nature was the Hellfire and the gatling-style crank, both of which do indeed activate the trigger. The Slidefire may serve a similar purpose but the way I read the law, it is not covered. What was just said on the other thread, something to the effect we are our own worst enemies? Yeah, here's another example. please point to the law that says the device needs to touch the trigger...because that wording is not in the law discribing a trigger activator. ""Trigger activator" means a removable manual or power driven trigger activating device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun." as you can see....A trigger activator is defined as something that attaches to the FIREARM that allows the trigger to be PULLED quickly. nowhere does it say that the device in question needs to TOUCH the trigger. now does it? and in ref to the other thread, this is differant, this law spacificly pertains the to the device that is illegal, and is exactly discribed. the backwards way that the "firearm that can accept a suppressor" is not exactly defined to mean AR rifles. in fact it would be arguable that simply having threads on the rifle is not "equipped" (a) not the sole, nor designed purpose of the threads and (b) because most suppressors utilize an adaptor to attach the actual device to the threads. |
!!!OMG!!!  !!!Grey Area Is Grey!!! If you think it's illegal - don't buy it. If you think it's legal - buy it. If you don't want to be a legal test case - don't use it... ...Wait for some other guy to take the legal initiative or fall prey to a zealous prosecutor. Simple as that.  I think they're a pretty decent device, and it's interesting that it doesn't directly interface with the trigger. The main legal debate here is what is the definition of the word "Activate" in relation to the trigger... |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: The SlideFire Stocks come with a ATF Approval Letter ATF letter says its not a machine gun. MN law says its a trigger activator and illegal. being a trigger activator has nothing to do with it not being a machine gun. I haven't found anything that Minnesota Law claims it a trigger activator, care to share a source or a link? as I said on the first page; 609.67 Sub1 (d) ""Trigger activator" means a removable manual or power driven trigger activating device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun." if you were to describe the slide fire to someone.....that's pretty much an exact definition of the product. "The Slide fire is a device constructed and designed so that, when attached to a firearm, the rate at which the trigger may be pulled increases and the rate of fire of the firearm increases to that of a machine gun." Read it real careful, there is nothing in there that says it illegal like you claim. Just your interputation of the law. If you don't want one don't buy one and leave the rest for lawyers to sort out, they have a understanding of the verbage  and with that this thread is done  |