Posted: 1/20/2013 10:27:54 AM EDT
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I know it's been very difficult to find Small Pistol Primers lately. I've tried all over the Louisville area and at Kentucky Gun Co. in Bardstown with no success. Even the majority of internet relailers have ceased taking Backorders. FYI, Sinclair International is still taking backorders. Good luck.
http://www.sinclairintl.com/ |
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I am having the same problem in western Ky, I need 2k more and I can load the rest of my 40 brass. I have 4k rounds of brass and 1500 primers. I figure ill be able to get them about mid summer once I've shot what I have. Then I'll just buy a sleeve and an 8lb keg of powder to load it all.
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Did you try the Reloaders Bench?
Its a good drive just over the state line in Tennessee. |
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What are you going to use these primers for and how many do you need? Well, never heard back so I guess you don't really need any. I and many others have used small rifle primers in pistols and had good results, but YMMV. And some local shops did have small rifle primers. |
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Hi
I'm newly back in Ky, from Mo, and am lucky to have several thousand WSPs and CCI SPs. I was at Kentucky Gun Co in Bardstown yesterday and they had cases and cases (hundreds of cases I'd estimate) of Winchester Small Rifle Primers. I cannot recommend substitution of reloading primers, but I know there are several existing loads online for 40 S&W with small rifle primers. Use at your own risk. I do. :) |
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I have used around two or three thousand small rifle primers in my 9mm loads. I started doing it because I have several 9mm carbines and they really hammer the primers. And, when primers were impossible to find back in 2008 I found some Remington 6-1/2 primers and thought they might work. Rifle primers are a little stiffer than pistol primers. I have read a lot of reports on the bench loader sites about this. Many people have used Sm. Rifle primers in pistol caliber ammo without issue. BUT, if you do so, you do it at your own risk. There are real risks as the rifle primers do contain a bit more priming material than do the pistol ones. I found that if I used the standard small rifle primers, forget the number but it might be the Remington 6-1/2 that I used. This is the primer they tell you NOT to use on .223 as it has too little priming material to properly ignite the powder load of a case that big. It was made for small volume centerfires like the .22 Hornet and other small cases. I have not used the 7-1/2 primers that they recommend for .223 and larger rounds.
If you research this you will find a lot of information. My rule was to never use the rifle primers with a "max" load or a powder that was known to be "sensitive" like Bullseye. I used quite a few of the Sm Rifle primers with medium loads of Unique and having done two or three thousand rounds I can only report that there were ZERO issues in either my hammer fired pistols or my 9mm carbines. YMMV, you assume all risks, not advising anyone that this is fool proof or even safe, don't try this at home, etc., etc. Side note: If you look at the amount of primer material in a cartridge it is very small compared to the amount of powder. So, one could think that the amount of primer material would not really impact the power of the round. On the surface that might seem obvious. BUT, and a bit but.....not to tell you long time reloaders anything you already know, but the possible issue one can run into is pressure spiking. If the primer is incorrect for the load it is possible that the extra burning of the primer can cause a more rapid pressure spike to build during ignition. As you know the burn rate of the powder increases with pressure. Its vital that we control the burn rate and rapid pressure build up in the firearm. If we were to set off too much powder too fast we could cause peak pressures to exceed what the casing and even the firearm were designed to withstand. Is this likely to happen? Let's just say its not common nor likely.....but you could be the first! 
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I have used around two or three thousand small rifle primers in my 9mm loads. I started doing it because I have several 9mm carbines and they really hammer the primers. And, when primers were impossible to find back in 2008 I found some Remington 6-1/2 primers and thought they might work. Rifle primers are a little stiffer than pistol primers. I have read a lot of reports on the bench loader sites about this. Many people have used Sm. Rifle primers in pistol caliber ammo without issue. BUT, if you do so, you do it at your own risk. There are real risks as the rifle primers do contain a bit more priming material than do the pistol ones. I found that if I used the standard small rifle primers, forget the number but it might be the Remington 6-1/2 that I used. This is the primer they tell you NOT to use on .223 as it has too little priming material to properly ignite the powder load of a case that big. It was made for small volume centerfires like the .22 Hornet and other small cases. I have not used the 7-1/2 primers that they recommend for .223 and larger rounds. If you research this you will find a lot of information. My rule was to never use the rifle primers with a "max" load or a powder that was known to be "sensitive" like Bullseye. I used quite a few of the Sm Rifle primers with medium loads of Unique and having done two or three thousand rounds I can only report that there were ZERO issues in either my hammer fired pistols or my 9mm carbines. YMMV, you assume all risks, not advising anyone that this is fool proof or even safe, don't try this at home, etc., etc. Side note: If you look at the amount of primer material in a cartridge it is very small compared to the amount of powder. So, one could think that the amount of primer material would not really impact the power of the round. On the surface that might seem obvious. BUT, and a bit but.....not to tell you long time reloaders anything you already know, but the possible issue one can run into is pressure spiking. If the primer is incorrect for the load it is possible that the extra burning of the primer can cause a more rapid pressure spike to build during ignition. As you know the burn rate of the powder increases with pressure. Its vital that we control the burn rate and rapid pressure build up in the firearm. If we were to set off too much powder too fast we could cause peak pressures to exceed what the casing and even the firearm were designed to withstand. Is this likely to happen? Let's just say its not common nor likely.....but you could be the first! Thanks 11G. What about small pistol magnum? I found myself with 2000 of these somehow. Guess I should wear the reading glasses when buying primers... I've seen some loads on cast boolits and handloads. com, but it was data w/ some velocity data. Not a lot of info. Know anything? Thanks, |
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I am loading these 40 S&W to run in my glock and Ruger SR40c. The powder I'm running is Winchester 231 @ 16.5 grains with a 180 grain round nose plinking bullet. Can I use small rifle primers without any issues? What's the true difference in the Small Pistol vs the Small Rifle?
I was able to find an oldtimer at the gun range that GAVE 1k CCI SP primers!!!!!!! |
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I am loading these 40 S&W to run in my glock and Ruger SR40c. The powder I'm running is Winchester 231 @ 16.5 grains with a 180 grain round nose plinking bullet. Can I use small rifle primers without any issues? What's the true difference in the Small Pistol vs the Small Rifle? I was able to find an oldtimer at the gun range that GAVE 1k CCI SP primers!!!!!!! Hey I reload 40 w W231 and I think you'd better recheck your data. I've been using 4.2g under 180gr plated bullet and it shoots really soft. 16.5 sounds WAY too high. I don't even think 16.5 of W231 would fit in the case. Sorry to butt in, but it sounds dangerous. |
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I am loading these 40 S&W to run in my glock and Ruger SR40c. The powder I'm running is Winchester 231 @ 16.5 grains with a 180 grain round nose plinking bullet. Can I use small rifle primers without any issues? What's the true difference in the Small Pistol vs the Small Rifle? I was able to find an oldtimer at the gun range that GAVE 1k CCI SP primers!!!!!!! Hey I reload 40 w W231 and I think you'd better recheck your data. I've been using 4.2g under 180gr plated bullet and it shoots really soft. 16.5 sounds WAY too high. I don't even think 16.5 of W231 would fit in the case. Sorry to butt in, but it sounds dangerous. Got that right!! WAY TOO MUCH! As for primers, do some research. I have used a few thousand rifle primers in loads for 9mm but mostly those were shot in my 9mm rifles. I switched because my 9mm AR was hitting the primers pretty hard. (It was a rifle after all!). The rifle primers are a bit harder due to the nature of the harder blows from their striker mechanism and due to the normally higher pressures of rifles compared to pistols. Some could even argue that rifle primers might even be safer due to this stronger material. According to some sources there is some differences in how much material actually burns in the primer as most rifles have more powder in the case to ignite. I have never seen any trustworthy documentation to prove or disprove that statement however. It you look at a primer you will see that compared to the volume of powder in the case the amount of primer material is pretty darn small. But there is more to this story and it has to do with the physics of what goes on when the powder is actually ignited and the pressure starts to rise. This pressure rise curve changes the burn rate of the powder. In theory this could cause a too rapid pressure rise in the case. One could argue this over and over from either side but without detailed testing its all speculation. This is what I do know: Go to one of the mainline, respected reloader sites. You will find discussions of this and find that many have used rifle primers in their pistols without issue. I have also done this, for reasons stated. You will find that like myself, most will do this only with lighter loads as we long time reloaders are a cautious bunck. Besides, I see no reason to use heavy loads that could cause more wear on my firearm for loads that are plinking at 50 yards or less at the range. No component maker would stick their necks out in our world of lawyers looking for a fat liability case and say its OK to do this. I can just tell you that many do and do it without issue but do it with caution. I would not tell anyone that its OK to do, after all, its NOT an approved procedure. I am just repeating what has been done by many. Now, if you reload your pistol ammo with rifle primers and it explodes in your face....ITS YOUR FAULT. (That is my disclaimer). No reasonable person is going to tell you, sure, its OK, nothing bad will happen. That applies to any statement about reloading as there are so many variables and people screw up the little things all the time, sometimes with disastrous consequences. I have seen more than one new reloader damage their firearms at the range. Proceed with caution. |
| You have to watch rifle primers in pistol loaded especially light low pressure loads as it might not seal up all the way and can cause gas leaks and breach face erosion. I use the small rifle primers in my 9mm major loads as they are tougher and do not flatten near as much as small pisol primers will. For my regular pistol loads I use small pistol |
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It still sounds like a typo. I am running 8.5 grains of hs6 for my open gun and there isnt much space at all left in 9mm agree that I, too, hope it's a typo. The latest data from Richard Lee's "Modern Reloading, 2nd Edition" show's a 4.1gr starting load and 5.0 max load for 180gr XTP. I hope you haven't shot any of them, yet, and, if you have, I hope they're taking really good care of you wherever you landed in the hospital. Sorry, not to be flip, but it's WAAAAAYYYYYYY too much powder. |
| It's disappointing to see members of this site raking people over the coals in the Reloading section of the Equipment Exchange. People selling 1,000 primers for $100 is outrageous. I have 5,000 primers on backorder for $100. I understand supply & demand at a brick and mortar store and e-stores, but here I expect honesty, integrity and dignity. |
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It's disappointing to see members of this site raking people over the coals in the Reloading section of the Equipment Exchange. People selling 1,000 primers for $100 is outrageous. I have 5,000 primers on backorder for $100. I understand supply & demand at a brick and mortar store and e-stores, but here I expect honesty, integrity and dignity. Well, there are many ways to look at that. A seller has every right to ask whatever they want for something. A buyer has every right to just say "NO". What is a fair price anyway? I could, from my college business teacher career give you the long worded explanation but suffice it to say the "right price" is the one where the seller and buyer agree on value. Word from SHOT from people in the know say that reloading supplies will be in high demand and short supply for six to nine months. Primers are being used for loaded ammo as the demand is just so high. SO....I have some primers (which I do) and someone wants them. I know that if I sell them there is a high probability that I may not be able to replace them for many months. What is it worth to me to let go of them without knowing when I can replenish them? You can have anything you want on order for any cheap price you can....BUT...where are they? When will you see them? I would not sell my primers for $20 a thousand...I would be FOOL for doing so as I have no current source to replace them and no definite date when they will become available nor a price when they do. I would not ask $100 per 1k either unless I was broke and hungry and really wanted to eat again. Others are profit takers. We have no control over them other than to just refuse to buy from them. |
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You have to watch rifle primers in pistol loaded especially light low pressure loads as it might not seal up all the way and can cause gas leaks and breach face erosion. I use the small rifle primers in my 9mm major loads as they are tougher and do not flatten near as much as small pisol primers will. For my regular pistol loads I use small pistol When I say I don't use these primers on heavy loads, I am talking about backing off 10% from the listed "max" load.....not making some super light low pressure load. Excessively light loads create a new set of problems. There is a lot of physics in reloading. I don't suggest the uninformed deviate from any approved practices, components or load data. You can create bad experiences for yourself in many ways. Reloading is not something that should be taken lightly. There are some very good web sites that have a lot of information. There are many publications that will help educate you. You really need to do your homework before entering into reloading. There are many little things that can become big problems. Many have used rifle primers in their pistol loads. But one must remember there are different rifle primers. A Remington 6-1/2 and 7-1/2 are both "small rifle" primers but have different characteristics. I have used the 6-1/2's in my 9mm rifles and pistols without any issues. BUT that is just in my firearms with my loads. The heavier 7-1/2 (or other brands) might not perform quite the same. Also, there is a slight difference in the diameter of the primers. Look here for a chart that gives actual measurements on various primers. Note the differences between manufactures. Of course thickness is one factor, hardness of the materials is yet another. Primer spec's BY THE WAY>>>>NEVER USE PISTOL PRIMERS IN YOUR RIFLE!! |
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Hey folks.
An FYI. Sportsman Whse in Lex gets ammo and primers every Sunday night for Monday stocking. They open at 1000 on Monday. Usually they don't run out of primers until around 1200-1300. I even found PMC bronze 45 ACP in 185gr hp for 22.99 last week. Pistol ammo is at cust svc desk. Hope this helps. |
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That is correct. The cups in pistol primers are way thinner, and if SP primers are used in rifle, a "pierced primer" will result, and it will at least ruin your firing pin, even after 1 firing. The FP tip will become eroded and rough, and subsequent firings will pierce the primer cup even if you use small rifle primers.
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You have to watch rifle primers in pistol loaded especially light low pressure loads as it might not seal up all the way and can cause gas leaks and breach face erosion. I use the small rifle primers in my 9mm major loads as they are tougher and do not flatten near as much as small pisol primers will. For my regular pistol loads I use small pistol . . . BY THE WAY>>>>NEVER USE PISTOL PRIMERS IN YOUR RIFLE!! So never use pistol primers in rifle ammo. |