Posted: 6/1/2015 8:16:57 PM EDT
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Wonder if this would pass muster in CT?
http://ar15spur.com/index.html |
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(II) Any grip of the weapon, including a pistol grip, a thumbhole stock, or any other stock, the use of which would allow an individual to grip the weapon, resulting in any finger on the trigger hand in addition to the trigger finger being directly below any portion of the action of the weapon when firing;
Been too long since I read this POS law. Forgot about the wording of the pistol grip section! 
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(II) Any grip of the weapon, including a pistol grip, a thumbhole stock, or any other stock, the use of which would allow an individual to grip the weapon, resulting in any finger on the trigger hand in addition to the trigger finger being directly below any portion of the action of the weapon when firing; Been too long since I read this POS law. Forgot about the wording of the pistol grip section! The feature list doesn't matter. ITS ON AN AR15 LOWER. it's banned by name. |
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The feature list doesn't matter. ITS ON AN AR15 LOWER. it's banned by name. Quoted:
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(II) Any grip of the weapon, including a pistol grip, a thumbhole stock, or any other stock, the use of which would allow an individual to grip the weapon, resulting in any finger on the trigger hand in addition to the trigger finger being directly below any portion of the action of the weapon when firing; Been too long since I read this POS law. Forgot about the wording of the pistol grip section! The feature list doesn't matter. ITS ON AN AR15 LOWER. it's banned by name. So then how were we buying lowers which were stamped .22? |
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(II) Any grip of the weapon, including a pistol grip, a thumbhole stock, or any other stock, the use of which would allow an individual to grip the weapon, resulting in any finger on the trigger hand in addition to the trigger finger being directly below any portion of the action of the weapon when firing; Been too long since I read this POS law. Forgot about the wording of the pistol grip section! This! Even the Komifornia & NY legal work around don't work in CT because of this wording of the CT law. The charging handle, buffer, & spring are part of the "action" on an AR15... |
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The feature list doesn't matter. ITS ON AN AR15 LOWER. it's banned by name. Quoted:
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(II) Any grip of the weapon, including a pistol grip, a thumbhole stock, or any other stock, the use of which would allow an individual to grip the weapon, resulting in any finger on the trigger hand in addition to the trigger finger being directly below any portion of the action of the weapon when firing; Been too long since I read this POS law. Forgot about the wording of the pistol grip section! The feature list doesn't matter. ITS ON AN AR15 LOWER. it's banned by name. That is not quite true. What is banned by name is semiautomatic centerfire AR-15 rifle manufactured post 9/13/94. There are a variety of ways to get around this banned by name language. One is to create a non semiautomatic rifle, another is to create a rimfire rifle, another is to change the lower so it is no longer a copy or duplicate or has the same capabilities as an AR-15 lower. There are several options available for someone who doesn't want to spend the money on a preban and still get an AR-15 style firearm. Those options include a pump action AR, the Ares SCR, or a fixed magazine lower like the CGAR15FM from Comgraf. |
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That is not quite true. What is banned by name is semiautomatic centerfire AR-15 rifle manufactured post 9/13/94. There are a variety of ways to get around this banned by name language. One is to create a non semiautomatic rifle, another is to create a rimfire rifle, another is to change the lower so it is no longer a copy or duplicate or has the same capabilities as an AR-15 lower. There are several options available for someone who doesn't want to spend the money on a preban and still get an AR-15 style firearm. Those options include a pump action AR, the Ares SCR, or a fixed magazine lower like the CGAR15FM from Comgraf. Quoted:
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(II) Any grip of the weapon, including a pistol grip, a thumbhole stock, or any other stock, the use of which would allow an individual to grip the weapon, resulting in any finger on the trigger hand in addition to the trigger finger being directly below any portion of the action of the weapon when firing; Been too long since I read this POS law. Forgot about the wording of the pistol grip section! The feature list doesn't matter. ITS ON AN AR15 LOWER. it's banned by name. That is not quite true. What is banned by name is semiautomatic centerfire AR-15 rifle manufactured post 9/13/94. There are a variety of ways to get around this banned by name language. One is to create a non semiautomatic rifle, another is to create a rimfire rifle, another is to change the lower so it is no longer a copy or duplicate or has the same capabilities as an AR-15 lower. There are several options available for someone who doesn't want to spend the money on a preban and still get an AR-15 style firearm. Those options include a pump action AR, the Ares SCR, or a fixed magazine lower like the CGAR15FM from Comgraf. Speaking of Comgraf, has anyone actually seen any of their products? The website says their stuff is on GB, but I have never been able to find it. |
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Speaking of Comgraf, has anyone actually seen any of their products? The website says their stuff is on GB, but I have never been able to find it. If your interested in one of their products contact them through their website. Don't know exactly how both the AR lower and the fixed magazine kit are being sold through Gunbroker, was only told that they would be when I talked to them a few months ago about their fixed magazine kit. I was able to test out one of their AR-15 fixed magazine kits and it worked very well both with the 10 round magazine CongrafLLC included with the kit they sent me as well as with my own 5 round magazine. |
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If your interested in one of their products contact them through their website. Don't know exactly how both the AR lower and the fixed magazine kit are being sold through Gunbroker, was only told that they would be when I talked to them a few months ago about their fixed magazine kit. I was able to test out one of their AR-15 fixed magazine kits and it worked very well both with the 10 round magazine CongrafLLC included with the kit they sent me as well as with my own 5 round magazine. Quoted:
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Speaking of Comgraf, has anyone actually seen any of their products? The website says their stuff is on GB, but I have never been able to find it. If your interested in one of their products contact them through their website. Don't know exactly how both the AR lower and the fixed magazine kit are being sold through Gunbroker, was only told that they would be when I talked to them a few months ago about their fixed magazine kit. I was able to test out one of their AR-15 fixed magazine kits and it worked very well both with the 10 round magazine CongrafLLC included with the kit they sent me as well as with my own 5 round magazine. ComGraf just posted an update over on CTGT about the availability of both their CGAR15-FM lower receiver and their FMK-1 kit. Cross posting this info here for anyone who's interested. I just listed a stripped CGAR15-FM lower receiver on GunBroker.com. It comes with an ASC stainless steel 10-round magazine and the bolt catch, both installed. All other LPK parts must be supplied by the buyer. It's listed at $235. I know some will think that's a bit high given the availability of so many regular stripped lowers these days for $50-80 -- for people who can buy them legally. Unfortunately, when these parts are made in small volumes, they tend to be expensive. One alternative that will be available shortly, except for those owning specifically named banned ARs, is my FMK-1 kit which will allow you to convert a standard AR lower receiver into a fixed magazine version. Parts will be listed on GunBroker as soon as I get them back from black oxide treatment. Purchase price for a kit will be $39.95. That includes the retention fitting, a screw and a shortened magazine catch. Installation tools will also be available separately. See www.ctlegalars.com for details. |
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Sure but the key is what ffl would transfer that. Anyways maybe preban prices will come down a tad Why wouldn't an FFL transfer it (the lower from ComGraf)? It appears it would be similar to transferring any other "AR-15" lower or rifle that gets around the stupid banned by name language, like that from Ares or rimfire AR's. <shrugs> Edit to add: According to this link there are at least two CT FFL's who will transfer the lower. |
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ComGraf just posted an update over on CTGT about the availability of both their CGAR15-FM lower receiver and their FMK-1 kit. Cross posting this info here for anyone who's interested. Quoted:
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Speaking of Comgraf, has anyone actually seen any of their products? The website says their stuff is on GB, but I have never been able to find it. If your interested in one of their products contact them through their website. Don't know exactly how both the AR lower and the fixed magazine kit are being sold through Gunbroker, was only told that they would be when I talked to them a few months ago about their fixed magazine kit. I was able to test out one of their AR-15 fixed magazine kits and it worked very well both with the 10 round magazine CongrafLLC included with the kit they sent me as well as with my own 5 round magazine. ComGraf just posted an update over on CTGT about the availability of both their CGAR15-FM lower receiver and their FMK-1 kit. Cross posting this info here for anyone who's interested. I just listed a stripped CGAR15-FM lower receiver on GunBroker.com. It comes with an ASC stainless steel 10-round magazine and the bolt catch, both installed. All other LPK parts must be supplied by the buyer. It's listed at $235. I know some will think that's a bit high given the availability of so many regular stripped lowers these days for $50-80 -- for people who can buy them legally. Unfortunately, when these parts are made in small volumes, they tend to be expensive. One alternative that will be available shortly, except for those owning specifically named banned ARs, is my FMK-1 kit which will allow you to convert a standard AR lower receiver into a fixed magazine version. Parts will be listed on GunBroker as soon as I get them back from black oxide treatment. Purchase price for a kit will be $39.95. That includes the retention fitting, a screw and a shortened magazine catch. Installation tools will also be available separately. See www.ctlegalars.com for details. OK, so I can see how this lower could be a viable alternative for a CT legal centerfire AR. I remember the some concept being used years ago for a CA legal rifle, but that lower was modified to allow for the magazine loading spoon to be used to speed load with M16 stripper clips. But how would the mag catch kit be used on a post ban AR to get around the mechanically identical section of the law? Sure, you could install the new mag catch on any new $50 receiver, but it is exactly the same as any banned receiver. At least his purpose-built lowers have not been machined for a standard mag catch, so they should be OK in CT. And let's say you did figure a way to legally use the mag catch kit on a standard lower. The you couldn't own another AR, because the mag catch parts could be used to convert the fixed mag lower! |
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Gunbroker link for the lower:
CT Legal AR-15 Lower Receiver AR15 http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=487832489 Quoted:
OK, so I can see how this lower could be a viable alternative for a CT legal centerfire AR. I remember the some concept being used years ago for a CA legal rifle, but that lower was modified to allow for the magazine loading spoon to be used to speed load with M16 stripper clips. But how would the mag catch kit be used on a post ban AR to get around the mechanically identical section of the law? Sure, you could install the new mag catch on any new $50 receiver, but it is exactly the same as any banned receiver. At least his purpose-built lowers have not been machined for a standard mag catch, so they should be OK in CT. And let's say you did figure a way to legally use the mag catch kit on a standard lower. The you couldn't own another AR, because the mag catch parts could be used to convert the fixed mag lower! While I don't quite understand the exact reasoning on how the use of the fixed magazine kit circumvents the banned by name language of the post 4/4/13 law, in some brief discussions I've had with Comgraf it appears they have gotten some sort of understanding from their lawyers or possibly from the state that supposedly one can use such a fixed magazine kit on a non registered post ban AR-15 that one currently owns to circumvent the ban. It was recommended to dispose (or remove from your possession) the AR-15 magazine catch after removing it to install the new fix magazine hardware to avoid having a "part" to make an AW. Don't think we know with the way the parts language is written if having another AR means that one has the parts to turn the fixed magazine AR back into a functioning detachable magazine AR. Don't know if there is any case law on the subject that says one way or the other on that particular issue. From the Comgraf FAQ: "Both our model CGAR15FM lower receiver and a standard receiver converted using our MRK-1 conversion kit fix the magazine such that disassembly of the receiver is needed to remove and replace it. While this is certainly more restrictive than approaches like the "Bullet Button" used in CA or the ARMagLock sold elsewhere, it ensures this firearm fully complies with CT law." "Why shouldn't I just buy one of the pre-bans instead? If this is your first purchase of an AR-platform rifle and you can find exactly what you want in the pre-bans being made available to buyers in CT, this could actually be a better choice, primarily because they do not introduce any complications in the loading of standard magazines. If, on the other hand, you already own an AR that falls under the restrictions of CT's assault weapons ban, you may want to consider either (1) purchasing a complete CGAR15FM Lower Receiver and mounting your existing upper receiver and barrel assembly to it or (2) making a simple mod to your existing receiver with the FMK-1 kit to convert it to a fixed magazine rifle. Either combination is legal to own and use in CT or NY the same way any other long gun can be used, so long as you do not modify the CGAR15FM lower receiver and use either product only with a 10 round magazine. Similarly, if you choose to start with our lower receiver and customize it with your choice of the many triggers, barrels, hand guards, stocks, etc. available as after-market products to make a legal AR-platform rifle that is truly your own, the overall cost of ownership will end up being far lower than if you started with a pre-ban. Talk to us or one of these dealers for more information." |
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SBHAVEN
Man, there is an awful lot of grey area there with the mag locks. While i am pretty sure it is unlikely, i would hope he has something in writing, with the state of CT letterhead, to go with them! While ungainly, This system does work, and would help avoid the transportation restrictions of an AW. You could get lots for range time on the plaform, and leave you full function AR for home defence. I would prefer if the front and rear takedown pin holes were beefed up, as they were never designed to be opened every 10 rounds. And a stripper clip guide would help for reloading. I also might be tempted to come up with a quick release floorplate, to help with unloading and clearing jams. The pricetag for the receiver doesnt seem horrible for the small number of receivers being made. It is just thr price drop due to the recent glut of AR receivers that makes it seem high. |
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Why wouldn't an FFL transfer it (the lower from ComGraf)? It appears it would be similar to transferring any other "AR-15" lower or rifle that gets around the stupid banned by name language, like that from Ares or rimfire AR's. <shrugs> Edit to add: According to this link there are at least two CT FFL's who will transfer the lower. Quoted:
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Sure but the key is what ffl would transfer that. Anyways maybe preban prices will come down a tad Why wouldn't an FFL transfer it (the lower from ComGraf)? It appears it would be similar to transferring any other "AR-15" lower or rifle that gets around the stupid banned by name language, like that from Ares or rimfire AR's. <shrugs> Edit to add: According to this link there are at least two CT FFL's who will transfer the lower. Well that's good to know. Glad it's getting done. I know more than 1 ffl that won't do it. But who gives a shit. As long as someone is doing it its gtg. |
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Speaking of Comgraf, has anyone actually seen any of their products? The website says their stuff is on GB, but I have never been able to find it. Quoted:
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(II) Any grip of the weapon, including a pistol grip, a thumbhole stock, or any other stock, the use of which would allow an individual to grip the weapon, resulting in any finger on the trigger hand in addition to the trigger finger being directly below any portion of the action of the weapon when firing; Been too long since I read this POS law. Forgot about the wording of the pistol grip section! The feature list doesn't matter. ITS ON AN AR15 LOWER. it's banned by name. That is not quite true. What is banned by name is semiautomatic centerfire AR-15 rifle manufactured post 9/13/94. There are a variety of ways to get around this banned by name language. One is to create a non semiautomatic rifle, another is to create a rimfire rifle, another is to change the lower so it is no longer a copy or duplicate or has the same capabilities as an AR-15 lower. There are several options available for someone who doesn't want to spend the money on a preban and still get an AR-15 style firearm. Those options include a pump action AR, the Ares SCR, or a fixed magazine lower like the CGAR15FM from Comgraf. Speaking of Comgraf, has anyone actually seen any of their products? The website says their stuff is on GB, but I have never been able to find it. Here it is http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=487832489 |
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Man, there is an awful lot of grey area there with the mag locks. While i am pretty sure it is unlikely, i would hope he has something in writing, with the state of CT letterhead, to go with them! While ungainly, This system does work, and would help avoid the transportation restrictions of an AW. You could get lots for range time on the plaform, and leave you full function AR for home defence. I would prefer if the front and rear takedown pin holes were beefed up, as they were never designed to be opened every 10 rounds. And a stripper clip guide would help for reloading. I also might be tempted to come up with a quick release floorplate, to help with unloading and clearing jams. The pricetag for the receiver doesnt seem horrible for the small number of receivers being made. It is just thr price drop due to the recent glut of AR receivers that makes it seem high. Yes there is a lot of gray area, all due to the way the stupid unconstitutional law is written and the fact that DESPP generally doesn't offer up public opinions to clarify these gray areas. Its a good thing in that those with illegal AR's may have a way to turn an illegal firearm into a legal firearm to avoid potentially being arrested for possessing that illegal AW and that there is another option available for those who want an AR platform. Beefing up the take down holes is potentially a lower/receiver design issue. In my use of the fixed magazine kit with a five round magazine I didn't seem to see any issue since I was only pulling the rear pin. Didn't notice any damage or the like with the rear takedown pin hole or with the pin itself on the lower. Trying to pull the take down pin out without removing the buffer tube/stock assembly was another story. 
The Comgraf products are another option for those in NY and possibly other ban states as well since the SAFE Act isn't as restrictive as our laws are. It is not clear however under NY law what constitutes fixed magazine so its not clear if someone from CT could use a fixed magazine on their AR and legally take that AR into NY. I posted a thread to the NYHTF about a CT resident using such a fixed magazine device on their AR and brining that AR into their state. There isn't a real clear answer if its legal or not. The law seems to indicate it would be legal but without NY clarifying their laws its a gray area. |
As far as the states are concerned, grey areas are good. They allow for more restriction than the original law might have intended!
My concern with the takedown pins are that the holes aren't designed with that much "traffic" in mind (sliding in and out), and there is not much metal holding the takedown pin in place. I guess as a civilian novelty firearm, it would be fine, as opposed to a real military firearm. |
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Too bad they are hooked up with Rick Milo at Valley Arms. I supposed I could find another dealer in the area.Rick can suck a dick. He's an ignorant, self righteous, prick. He's an old friend of my dad's too, and I still won't go near his wallet raping shit hole |
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As far as the states are concerned, grey areas are good. They allow for more restriction than the original law might have intended!
My concern with the takedown pins are that the holes aren't designed with that much "traffic" in mind (sliding in and out), and there is not much metal holding the takedown pin in place. I guess as a civilian novelty firearm, it would be fine, as opposed to a real military firearm. Gray area can be bad in that someone could end up the test case is law enforcement or others decide to press the use that either product isn't CT legal. Under prolonged use I can see the possibility of repeated take down pin removal or use possibly causing issues if someone was shooting 10's of thousands of rounds a year through their rifle equipped in such a fashion. For those folks they're better off with a preban. But for someone who is the occasional range warrior a few times a year and wants to get into the AR platform for the first time or who didn't register their AW prior to 1/1/13 and wants to try and make the gun CT legal they shouldn't have a problem. Where they'll have a problem (as I did ) was trying to remove the rear takedown pin without any special tools to install a pin with a ring on it to make pulling out the rear take down pin easier. Marked up my receiver slightly at the take down hole. 
If the magazine kit is also NY legal then it also offers the option for CT residents to use it on their rifles (with a 10 round or less magazine) and take those rifles into NY where otherwise they couldn't because of the NY SAFE Act. The magazine kit (which I believe will sell for around $40) presents a trade off. How its loaded versus gaining all the evil features back like pistol grip, folding stock, flash hider, bayonet lug and grenade launcher on a firearm that if one currently possessed it would be illegal if not a preban or already registered. |