Posted: 3/12/2007 5:46:05 PM EDT
| Toady I was at applebees in Dale City and had my glock on open on my belt. I was confronted by someone who was sitting at the bar, he came over to my table and asked if I was a Police Officer. When I said no he went off about how I could get into so much trouble for having it because of the bar and proceeded to run at the mouth. I tried to civily explain to him the laws in the Commonwealth but he then walked away and back to the bar. Do you guys that open carry keep a copy of the laws with you? Just figured I would share. Does anyone know the code section number in case I ever run into this again. Thanks. |
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Virginia Open Carry Forum I don't keep a copy of VA laws on my person. I know the VA law when it comes to open carry. Sounds like he had one too many. I would have ignored him when he went back to the bar. Was his name Clodfelter?  |
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WIlliams- here's whatt you're looking for, in regards to carrying in an ABC-liscensed establishment: § 18.2-308 J3. No person shall carry a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia; however, nothing herein shall prohibit any sworn law-enforcement officer from carrying a concealed handgun on the premises of such restaurant or club or any owner or event sponsor or his employees from carrying a concealed handgun while on duty at such restaurant or club if such person has a concealed handgun permit. Remember, open carry, per se, is not really described by statute, so our rights must be inferred by what is NOT stated in the statutes. You were in the right, my friend. Don't let them rattle your cage! |
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if he wasnt an employee of the restaurant, I would have politely told him to leave you alone, or that you would ask the manager to ask him to leave I dont keep the laws with me....as i said on the other forum, I dont think it would do much good... the people that have made up their minds to be asshats arent going to listen to you even if you roll out the entirety of the VA Supreme Court....I firmly believe in scenarios like this attempting to "educate" the dumbass just escalates him... I disengage, and move about my business.... the fact that I am the size of an NFL offensive lineman usually helps with this.... 
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I agree with Tiny. |
What is that supposed to be, did you type something and then change your mind or are you tagging it? I have seen you do this on several postings. Insight please? TOPIC related.....I have had it happen to me before and I just let them know that there is nothing wrong with what I am doing and they usually take my word. Never had an incident from it either. -TS |
| Yea, I didn't let it bother me. Just I have never had anyone make a scene and then talk to others about it. My concern being that people who really didn't care or were completely ignorant on the issue may have been told the wrong thing and believe I was in the wrong. Usually people just tell me its against the law and go about their business not all the questions about being police officer and all, I wanted to tell him my occupation was none of his concern, but didn't want any confusion that I was a police officer. |
I decided that what I said might have made me appear to be an asshole, so I deleted it. I suppose I need to think before I type. |
When asked if I am a LEO, I usually say "No, I'm just a guy".
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I had an experience at Starbucks a few weeks ago where a middle-aged lady in line right behind me leaned forward and whispered loudly " I certainly hope you're a police officer," motioning to the .45 carried on my hip. Without a moment's thought ( and it was morning, hadn't had any caffeine yet) I responded: "  No, Ma'am. In keeping with the rights afforded me by the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America, and in full compliance with all applicable state laws and statutes, I am a legally, lawfully armed citizen."The jaw-drop on her part was priceless, and the gasping noise she made was funnier that hell. She took a step back, and clammed up. I got my coffee and went on my merry way. |
| Just out of curiosity, when i CCW i place my xd 45 in the back of my jeans on my rear so it is covered by my shirt, and just leave it in the truck when i go into a place like applebees. Just out of curiosity, can i just keep the gun where it is and just not cover it with my shirt? or do i need to actually put it on the side of my hip with the belt holster? |
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there is some debate about that... I know one member had a Fairfax County Cop tell him that an IWB holster, even though exposed, was still concealed, and still wasnt good enough for "open carry" in a restaurant... The standard, I believe, is that it is openly visible....I dont really have this issue, because when I carry its generally with an OWB holster, so i just tuck my shirt behind it... Where I have recently found it REALLY sucks is since I have been a stay at home dad...I am gym shorts most of the time and so for "carry" i generally keep my weapon in my "tacticool" diaper bag....(which is an old drop bag I have...not some flowery thing, but it gets the job done)...the problem is I am totally screwed when I go to a restaurant then....because there really is no way to open carry a gun in a diaper bag...it made me really think about women and their purses too which really pissed me off about the restaurant rule.... As an aside, I was watching a thing by Penn and Teller called "Why Gun Control is Bullshit" and they had the story of a Texas State Legislator...a woman...whose parents were killed a while back when she was with them, IN A RESTAURANT, and a lunatic crashed his truck into the restaurant and then got out and methodically shot and killed 22 people....including her mother execution style as she cradled her father... What pissed her off is she had a gun in the car, but because of Texas' restaurant rule could not bring it into the restaurant with her....She said her greatest regret was not ignoring that stupid damn law so that she could have returned fire....she has since become a legislator, the law is gone, and she carries everywhere.... My point is...I think the diaper bag, and all its contents, are going with me regardless....chances of some manager wanting to look past the diapers, cream, and rattles is likely slim anyway....and if I need the weapon I will deal with the repercussions....its worth it to me to know I can protect my children...and for women who read this who carry with a purse I would expect they would do the same damn thing until this idiotic law is gone... |
| Trio your facts are a little off but pretty close. That was Killeen TX on 16OCT91 and Texas did not have a concealed carry law at the time. The lady of who you speak was instrumental in getting the law changed to allow concealed carry down there. The restauraunt was Luby's which did not serve booze anyhow. |
yeah, I didnt know why she couldnt have the gun in the restaurant, only that she couldnt, and that she did have one in the car.... having seen her speak, she is much more composed than I think i could be....if I left my weapon in my car and something happened to (in my case my kids) I think I would be a shell of a man... |
That was me that it happened to. FCPD said that IWB's are considered concealed as all it would take is a simple blousing of the shirt to conceal it. He said the best way to be compliant is an OWB. Even shoulder holsters are potentially considered concealed. I have had mixed responses to that about 50/50. Just imagine the worst case scenario.....a cop decides to charge you with a concealed weapon in an ABC restaurant. Your word against his. If its IWB all he has to say was that he barely saw it and the shirt was bloused covering a majority of the firearm. He declared it concealed. If it is OWB then there is no room for argument and he said she said doesn't exist. You can provide the holster and demonstrate to the convening authority and the case would be dismissed at that point(if it ever made it to court). A majority of the firearm must be visible. Since that incident I now open carry on my hip with my shirt/jacket tucked behind the pistol. No problem since, one cop even said he always preferred the CZ75 however the department wouldn't allow them to use them, said he liked the holster as well, got his food and paid no attention to me the remainder of my visit. -TS |
| Makes you wonder why he didn't charge you if he thought you were breaking the law. Then again Officer Hyland during the Tonys incident thought I was breaking the law then too, by carrying in a restuarant period. That said, when I open carry I use an OWB holster, just to be on the safe side. |
You do know that LEGALLY if you are in a restaurant that serves alcohol(ABC restaurant) you have to carry it open carry and you can't drink alcohol while armed. I am assuming that you know this and that your comment was a failed joke.  -TS |
Actually the code reads:
To me this does not restrict a person who does not hold a permit from open carrying while intoxicated, as screwed up as that sounds. And if "such handgun" refers back to a "concealed handgun", the same holds true for permit holders open carrying. Drinking, but not to the point of intoxication also seems to be permitted. Beyond that, its incredibly irresponsible to carry a handgun, concealed or otherwise, during or after consumption of any amount of alcohol. Hopefully there is another piece of code that I'm not aware of. If not, some legislation should be introduced next year to make it plainly illegal to publicly carry while intoxicated. |