Posted: 11/4/2007 10:50:32 PM EDT
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There is a provision in the law to repeal the FOID. We would need ~ 150,000 signatures ( 2% from each county) to put the issue on the ballot. Why hasn't ISRA or NRA taken this up? Are they afraid it won't pass? So what if it doesn't the first time or the first ten. Collect the signatures and get the question on the ballot every single election until it does. (430 ILCS 65/16) (from Ch. 38, par. 83‑16) Sec. 16. When 2% of the number of registered voters in the State desire to pass upon the question of whether the General Assembly should repeal this Act regulating the acquisition, possession and transfer of firearms and firearm ammunition, they shall, at least 78 days before a regular election to be held throughout the State, file in the office of the State Board of Elections, a petition directed to the Board in accordance with the general election law. The petition shall be composed of county petitions from each of the counties throughout the State and each county petition shall contain the signatures of at least 2% of the number of registered voters in the county. The petition shall request that the question "Should the General Assembly repeal the Act entitled 'An Act relating to the acquisition, possession and transfer of firearms and firearm ammunition, to provide a penalty for the violation thereof and to make an appropriation in connection therewith,' approved August 3, 1967, as amended?" be submitted to the voters of the State at the next ensuing State‑wide election at which such question may be acted upon. (Source: P.A. 81‑1489.) |
It will never ever ever happen in this life time or any other. The only thing you will see in IL is more nannying, more BS gun laws and more Volkswagen driving cross country skiing pink shirt wearing Liberals who want to save the children, drink the kool-aid and get on the train car. Eventually IL will become a complete welfare state drenched in socialism, high taxes, draconian gun control and social decay. The Wife and I will be gone in 5-7 years, I prefer to live with folks who encourage me, not with folks who vote for Hillary. Funny thing about IL, I was just running a job at 54th and Asland in the Ghetto where crack heads had burnt a building to the ground not once, but twice. It's an amazing neighborhood, every time I was down there the entire neighborhood had the day off work! They were all listening to rap music, drinking, just having a genral good time all day, every day. Maybe they all work the night shift, I don't know. I was always a little miffed because I didn't get to take as many days off work as they did. Oh and the beautiful manner in which they keep their neighborhood. I'm just glad no guns are allowed there, it's such a safe quaint little area. Bye Illinois. |
Hey now... I XCSki (at least used to when we got snow reliably), and the biathalon is still XCskiing and shooting...
Trust me. I like my current house, but given the choice, I'd be in WI. You might not have CCW there either, but at least you can have CIII goodness... just gotta wait for our Contract to get the appropriate changes in language... or to retire (13 more years) 
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ya same here though they just expanded our western boundry i can almost move to iowa lol it should be just show up to work on time....got 2 days to get there |
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Called and asked once. Was told that it was dangerous to put Second Amendment issues up for public vote - civil rights should not be determined by majority vote. Secondly, if it was on the ballot and the vote went badly it would be used to further destroy our rights. In essence, too risky. |
I agree. The same reason that SCOTUS taking on the 2A may be a very bad idea. |
| I say they should push it. I can't believe the negative replies. We have the worst gun laws in the country, because we have one of the biggest shitholes in the country running OUR state. It's so bad, we have counties voting (and passing) to declare their 2A rights as untouchable. I say push it. |
We don't have the worst gun laws in the country. Besides no CCW and the FOID act we have no restrictions. You need to do some research on state by state gun law. It is much, much worse out there. |
I hope you are trying to make a funny, because if not you need to recheck your research. IL is far from gun friendly. I wouldn't say we have the worst gun laws in the nation, but we are way up the list. To each his own, but being prohibited from carrying a firearm for self defense and being made to posses a note from your mommy at ISP to purchase a firearm or ammunition don't seem like minor details to me. |
Yeah, because we can own Title II stuff in this wonderful state, don't have to wait around several days to pick up a firearm that I've already paid for and passed the background checks for, don't have to worry about a duty to retreat when defending my life with a firearm, and definitely don't have to worry about continually-proposed legislation that would turn me into a felon nearly overnight because of cosmetic features on the firearms I own. Oh wait. None of the above is true. My bad.  ETA - Oh, and on the original subject; I've always thought that the repeal procedure for the FOID act is one of the most fucked up things I've read. According to that procedure, if one county has less than 2% in support, but every single other county in the state has 100% support, the repeal fails and the act stays in effect. |
| I'll say it again, we have the worst gun laws in the country. 48 out of 50 states know what's right and fair to its law-abiding people as far as CCW. Not one other state REGISTERS it's gun owners like the FOID act does. The poor people of this state can't even look at a firearm over the counter without technically having been registered by FOID. For Christ's sakes, they even tried passing a high-cap law attached to a good Child sex preditor law. It's the "Oh, it's not so bad" mentallity that lets Shitholecago get away with it's anti-gun BS. |
You are correct, and Senator Brady introduced legislation this year to change that to 8% across the whole state, not in any particular county. It's SB 1229, and it has not gone anywhere, yet. |
Massachusetts has something similar, if not worse, no? |
I have read the law as 2% to force a vote. Am I missing something that states > 2% (which shouldn't be a problem in any county) to actually repeal? ETA: 2% of the registered voters in every county get the issue on the ballot and then 51% or more of the voters of the state vote to repeal and the deal is done. |
The worst gun laws in the country? To further add, there is a huge difference between sentiment and law. Although Illinois may be environmentally unfriendly to private gun ownership, the sentiment of people plays NO role when it comes to actual law, ask ANY Attorney. Never said Illinois is gun friendly. To the newer members here, you have no idea the ass ripping I have given this state and it's officials on this site over the years, hang in there long enough and you'll catch one of my rants. As far as the worst gun laws in the country? Far from it. Ranting on like a 20 year old idiot living in your parents basement when I state simple truth that IL is far from the worst gun laws in the country makes you sound like a Liberal that denies simple fact to advance their own emotional based angry and idiotic agenda. Anyone who thinks I of all people support the FOID act is a fool and does not know me. But after the most remedial amount of research, you will find that IL is far, far from the worst gun laws in the country, and you will feel stupid. I understand what it is like to be new to something and think you know everything. In time, if you are serious about being educated on firearm restrictions nationwide, you will learn IL gun laws are an infringement yes, but nowhere near what you will find in states like CA. NY, MA, CT, DC to name a few. If I am wrong, please educate me on how IL gun laws are worse than the states I mentioned and I will correct myself. Until then, happy studying boys. 
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Tomcat, there is a difference between defending a stink pile and stating truth. Just imagine if we were in a real theatre of political debate, where our rights depended on actual fact and we started spewing untrue emotionally based rhetoric. There would then be no difference between us and the gun control movement. |
That's just it Patriot, I'm stating truth and our 2A rights are the basis for my statement. Fact #1, Illinois denies it's law-abiding people the right to defend themselves in public. All the states you put forth do. This alone makes our state the worst for 2A. You tell me what rights I should be glad that Chicago hasn't stolen from me should I have to defend myself or family, from some POS who could care less if he kills us or not and I DON"T have a CCW. Fact # 2, Why does Illinois insist on FOID ? Only one other state does it and it's to control ownership. Together these two laws clearly put us in last place. And really, "Spewing untrue emotionally based rhetoric...". [edit] sp |
Just one example, just one Tomcat would be California. No CCW, absolutely no "assault weapons" all pre-ban California "assault weapons" to be registered with California DOD. No hi-cap mags and a bevy of low-cost pistols are banned for civilian purchase. Although we have no CCW and the FOID act, perhaps you can see how the laws in California are worse? The FOID act pre-dates most of us but it is rooted in racism as I and others have pointed out. The FOID act is a poll tax, meaning it is a tax on civil liberties which in itself is a violation of constitutional law. This is why there is no sales tax on newspapers, that would be taxing the First Amendment. Don't confuse what I am saying here and don't perceive me as one who is standing up for Illinois. Beyond gun rights, Illinois is in awful condition financially, corruption and wild incompetance runs amuck unchecked, the educational system is in the lower rung of the nation statistically and unemployment, especially south of I-80 is rampant. Welfare and programs like Medicaid are literally bankrupting the state. Labor Unions rule the nortern part of the state burrying us in tax debt and diverting funds that could be put to good use to conduct endless pork barrel road projects that take 6 times longer than they should. The Unions endorse the candidate and then of course the candidate once elected, pays back the union with BS projects. That's what you get in "Bill Dugan" Country. Places like McCormick Place have all but lost convention business due to the ridiculous labor union rules, like union scale earning Electricians plugging in extension cords or union Carpenters hauling your booth from your truck to the convention floor, or $85 for a case of beer. So, with that being said, I can gripe about Illinois as much as the next guy, but I wish it to be truth, not emotionally based rhetoric because I am personally angered by the "state of the State." We are all in this together Tomcat, well until I leave this place, then I won't be in it with you anymore. I see places like Illinois as a place where people are not friendly to the likes of you and I and I wish to spend my hard earned tax dollars on people who do. Illinois wasn't always this way. Chicago used to very much be a tough-guy kind of blue collar city, I'm not that old and it was that way when I was a kid. The meterosexual movement would not have been welcome and the outrageous Liberalism would have never been tolerated. Old Illinois people have died or moved on. We are now left with the rock-throwing anti-American Babyboomer crowd and their useless, IPOD equipped Generation Y offspring that doesn't know if they are boys or girls and have no idea about their heritage, their rights and what millions of people have given their lives for in conflicts world-wide. The goals of the public school system have been acheived and the anti-American leftist movement spearheaded by 1960's teenagers has taken hold in places like Illinois. To un-do the brainwashing, to restore our core values and step back in time will never happen. I respect your passion Tomcat, and agree with you in regards to your disdain for the system. But I have learned that citing emotionally based jargin only makes us look foolish. The public at large views us as backwood, pickup driving white trash, which I proudly take claim to being. In this day and age it is acceptable and encouraged to discriminate against white heterosexual men and Jewish people. All other groups are off limits. In this climate where it is acceptable to attack and persecute our own kind, we need to be on the ball and have our facts straight. Stating that IL has the worse gun laws in the nation almost compells the ghetto-dwelling House Reps to ink more anti-gun legislation. You may point out to them that we have accepted our draconian laws already in place and would accept more. Many of us have worked very, very hard to keep an assault weapon ban from passing and to say we have the worst laws in the country is to say we have failed, and we have put up one helluva fight. See Tomcat, Patriot can bitch about IL too. We all can. To quote Bob Marley: "Some say it's just a part of it, we've got to fufill the book." 
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| I hate and despise the FOID card! Down with FOID! And you guys are saying what the hell is an Alabama guy saying this here? Well, I spent the 1st 18yrs of my life in the Jo Daviess county (Hanover) and left when I went in the Army... needless to say that's been amost 20yrs ago. But still, it ticks me off that Illinois will sell non-resident shotgun tags for $200 a pop (add $55 for license and stamp) but a non-resident (in non-bordering states) has a snowball's chance in hell to buy some slugs over the counter... even .22 cal b/c of this damn card. I feel for you guys... every time I visit home I have to shake my head... but the Blackwater facility in Mt. Carrol is a big plus to me. Too many Chicago tree huggers buying up all the land there... and "Gaylena" is making things worse in what is (once was?) a piece of heaven. I'm too scared to bring my AR with me b/c I have to bring 500rds of ammo to shoot with it... try to explain that to an IL trooper... anyway, if anyway to sign it I would! I have Jo D. listed as my permanent home of record on my DD214... |
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Honestly guys - we're ALL on the same team here and debating whether we're in the 7th or 10th ring of gun-owner's hell is counterproductive to the cause. IL sucks - that we can all agree on - I would completely support a repeal of the FOID act but I think that the chances of getting CCW in IL is higher than repealing FOID. Yes, it's that bad. My only hope is that the Parker Vs. DC case before the supreme court will open the floodgates for gun rights throughout the nation. The problem with all the "States Rights" folks on the right is that it leaves people that are 'behind enemy lines" in IL, CA, MA, NY, HI, NJ, etc. with their rights restricted due to "majority rule" in their states. I really think that the constitution should apply consistantly across the nation and that the states should not be able to individually restrict free speech or gun rights for example. The only thing that IL has going for it is that we don't have a standard capacity mag ban or an AW ban throughout the state - just in Cook Co. All the other states listed above have mag bans, and "assault weapon" bans if I'm remembering their laws correctly. Good times... Mike |
Oh man.. where to begin... 1) Non-residents can just show their Driver's License and buy ammo, handle a gun, etc. no need for a FOID - the FOID only applies to the subjects of "Hizzonor" and the Governor 2) "Gaylena" - Honestly, I could care less what consenting adults do in the privacy of their own home. 3) Scared of transporting a legal firearm with (gasp) 500 rounds of ammo? Man up, dude - you're perfectly legal and there's nothing a state trooper can do to you if you're carrying 500,000 rounds of ammo and an AR in your trunk. 4) Good on you for thinking about getting training though - more folks should do it. Stay safe, Mike |
SPD: Noble cause. Yes, we as Guns Save Life considered taking this up. However, even ASSUMING you could get the signatures, do you really [??] think you're going to get neutral or favorable coverage in the media? And, SPD, unless you've got deep pockets like George Soros, I don't think you could afford to pay to get our message out to all the sheeples who live in IL. In fact, doing what you suggest would involve serious amounts of money and thousands and thousands of volunteer hours. And for what? Frankly, given the people IL residents have been electing, I think it's clear that the average person in IL is dumber than average. John |
Man up, or Lawyer Up? ILSP can do whatever they want, the law be damned. Daley and Blago can and will do whatever they want. And if you got caught with 500,000 rounds of ammo, ILSP will find a reason to arrest you. And Channel 2, 5, 7, 9 and 32 will all be there with their cameras to portray you as the next Tim McVeigh. Of course you can hire a lawyer and spend thousands if not tens of thousands to protect your constitutional right. That's cool. Mike, it's a different ballgame now and its a full court press now from the State, Chicago and the helpful Press. You're right that its legal to haul mega rounds and an AK, but the boys don't have to play by the rules anymore. |
Please show me a headline or a court case where someone was arrest for possession of large amounts of ammunition. Make sure that the person arrested was either a legal holder of a FOID card or a out of state resident that could LEGALLY own ammo in their own state. The director of the Illinois State Police might be a corrupt lap puppy of Daley and Blago, but to accuse all Illinois troopers of that kind of corruption or illegal behavior isn't going to get you very far around here. |
| I Believe now is a good time to try this FOID repeal thing. Like someone said earlier (it may have been me), there are a lot of counties in our state now passing County Resolutions to prohibit Shitcago Socialists from more "Home Rule" 2A infringements on down state. Looks like the pendulum could be on our side. |
Do you think that the average California Citizen is getting the right to carry? Have you applied for a permit to carry in San Francisco, LA or Orange County? Riverside? San Diego? Ventura? Marin? I lived in Northern California for a brief period of time in the early 1990's. Believe me when I say you simply will never be issued a permit to carry. Unless of course urban California has relaxed their anti gun perspective in the last 15 years. Somehow I would gander that things have only gotten worse. It's a shame as the vast majority of the state is rural or wilderness. California is one of the most beautiful places on earth, but it is held at political bay by San Francisco and LA. I went to one of the most spectacular gun shows I may have ever seen at Cal Expo in 1993. I'm not dancing around anything with you Sir, you are convinced that what you believe is absolute fact. How can I argue with that? Will dancing really cause your face to turn blue? Is that how the Blue Man Group got their start? |
Me being one of the most outspoken critics of law enforcement here must agree with Cody. I have never heard of anyone being arrested for 500 rounds of ammo in IL that had their FOID. I have also recently criticized ISP but to say every Trooper is a criminal is BS. Are many corrupt and puppets of the machine? Sure, but how many Troopers are there in the state? I would imagine most are not interested in making an illegal arrest for 500 rounds of ammo being carried by a sportsman. That's like taking the far left Liberal wacko side and saying that because one soldier raped a girl in Iraq that all American GI's are rapists. Man, the leftist brainwashing has spread further than I thought Let's lighten up friends, it's almost Christmas, ugh, ooops, I mean "Winter Holiday" I wouldn't want to offend any board members that work for the ACLU 
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patriot, I believe I said if you had 500K rounds. I'm sure if I was driving down 55 with even 100K rounds and an AR/AK and the Trooper decided to check the trunk, backup of 2 or 3 units would be there in a flash. What would ensue is anyone's guess but I believe they would look for the tiniest reason to arrest. They would be looking at me like a lunatic. I'm not saying the ISP Trooper is a crook, but I do believe constant Top Level pressure and brainwashing will produce more and more anti-gun cops that will look to find anyway to make life hell on the lawful owner. Not by planting or making up anything though. That's just my belief. In Chicago, as more new recruits come aboard and new training offered (new age PC BS), they will be molded into little followers of what the King and Duke want. |
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Tomcat, you are simply smarter than I am, you got me. We have the worst gun laws in the country, perhaps the world. Obviously someone as small minded as myself could never give you an answer. I'll think about it really hard (thanks for giving me that opportunity) and I'll try to come up with something. Oh, here we go I thought about it....We don't have the worst gun laws in the country, far from it. To say we do, is foolish. I made NO claim that we should be "happy" for the rights we can actually enjoy in this state, I only made the claim that we don't have the worst gun laws in the country, and we don't. We have no CCW and we have the FOID. Those are the TWO infringements we have to deal with, TWO that's right after one and right before three. Perhaps we can compare our TWO infringements with the other states. I almost wish we could combine this conversation with the HTF's of Massachussettes, California, Hawaii, New York and Jersey to name a few. Perhaps the residents of those states could give us a few examples of what it's like to have more that TWO infringements on gun rights. The point here is that we have a much better chance of getting CCW than we do repealing the FOID. The FOID will NEVER, let me repeat NEVER EVER go away. No matter how angry you are at life in general, no matter how much reasoning, begging, pleading or stealing we do it simply ain't going nowhere. If it is a matter of principle you need to fight for, fight on. ISRA doesn't touch the FOID issue because the FOID is viewed by many as a license to own a gun, which in sorts it is. People who have grown up being brainwashed by public school teachers shudder at the idea of "unlicensed gunowners" running the streets with bayonet lugs. Try and convince the soccer moms, the Jesse Jackson types and the neutered men of Illinois that the FOID should be abolished. You will be pissing into the wind my friend. There is no absolutist answer. This is more a cultural issue than people like to think and this country has been split right down the middle. Even Conservative "Culture Warriors" like Bill O'Reilly can't understand why his neighbor needs an AK47 in his house. No one told you to be happy to accept the FOID. No one told you to be happy for the rights you can enjoy. What I said to you, and I will say it again. We don't have the worst gunlaws in the country, far from it. If you can't or won't realize that, then we may as well throw in the towel right now, lay down and drink the kool-aid. We live in a state that does not want us. We are beyond the minority here and we have done a good job, a great job repelling bogus anti-gun legislation. Of which, I have never known you to be involved in. I'm not saying you don't fight the good fight, I am sure you do. But many of us have been writing letters, making calls, going to Springfield and spreading the word. I have seen you complain to us that have been fighting this battle for years shit all over our success and progress by saying we have the worst gun laws in the Country. You should write a letter to Todd Vandermyde and tell him that, see what he has to retort to your claims. There is no man in this state that keeps me from protecting my loved ones. If someone keeps you from protecting your loved ones, you should re-evaluate your defense plan. I don't go into Chicago unless I absolutely have to, so the biggest threat I face is perhaps a 350 lb 50 year old man in a Mini Cooper. I'm not afraid. Keep up the good fight brother! I asked you one question to and you never answered it....does dancing around really make your face blue? So you know, this argument we are having is the EXACT reason ISRA will NEVER let the average gun owner speak in Springfield before committee or congress, they are angry and misinformed all too often. That's my last word in this exchange, I will give you the lastword. I am sure you will take it. |
You make it seem as if anyone can go get a CCW permit in their home state. So people in Los Angeles, NYC, New Jersey, MA, and other parts of the country just run down ot the police station and pick up their permits? What about many may issue states such as Iowa and Alabama? New York? California? Hawaii? In some ways IL is much better. If we had CCW it would be ok. But your trying to make an argument while fudging some of the facts in your favor. I agree with you in spirit but your not being completely honest either. IL is not so bad. I believe in Michigan all of the hand guns are registered through "safety inspections" done at the local police station. I believe in Missouri they need to get a handgun permit so they can purchase a handgun. New Jersey is similar. You need a permit to go buy a handgun. One permit per handgun. And the permits expire. So, yeah IL is not so bad, when it comes to permits required to purchase a gun. Ours is relatively cheap and expires after so many years as opposed to more expensive and expires after so many days. I would like to get rid of the FOID but it wont happen. I would love to see a carry law passed here. It would be great. THat is my biggest problem with IL is that I am not able to carry. But I also understand that many people are trapped in other parts of the country are denied the right to carry as well even though they live in a state that issues permits. |
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You make it seem as if anyone can go get a CCW permit in their home state. So people in Los Angeles, NYC, New Jersey, MA, and other parts of the country just run down ot the police station and pick up their permits? What about many may issue states such as Iowa and Alabama? New York? California? Hawaii? Where in my comments did I say it was or should be easy to get a permit ? |
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speaking from a striclty political standpoint... how will repealing this generate money??  ive been around long enough to know that this will not, could not, ever happen. i believe when the toll booths stop collecting $$ and hell starts to freeze and pigs are flying... we will be free to own full auto' SBR with a suppressor.  where do i sign? |
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Hello, I am a Missourian trolling the neighboring state's fourm. As an outsider looking in I think Illinois falls somewhere in the middle as far as draconian gun laws are concerned. You guys have to possess a FOID card, don't have CCW, have waiting periods on long guns and handguns, and you are not allowed to have a loaded gun in your vehicle. It could be much worse. In Missouri up until August 28, 2007 we had to go to our county Sheriff and pay him $10 and ask permission to purchase a handgun. He had seven days to issue the permit. Some departments issued them while you waited, while others took the entire week. The permits had to be applied for and picked up in person requiring two trips to the sheriff's office in most jurisdictions. We finally got fed up with this holdover jim crow era law and repealed it with support from both sides of the aisle. Rural reps voted for repeal because it was a pro-gun measure. Urban reps voted for repeal as a symbol of getting rid of racist legislation. I would have traded our permit system for Illinois' FOID card and waiting period any time for purchasing handguns. I am glad this law is gone and I feel if you could sell it to Chicago as a racist law it may get enough votes for repeal. My biggest beef with Illinois gun laws is the cased gun law. I hate having to lock my guns up in a case to transport them. Here in rural Missouri everyone has a loaded rifle in their truck seat at all times. You even still see gun racks! I live about five miles from the ONSR national park which allows hunting, but requires guns to be cased while being transported. I avoid it at all costs because I hate to lock my guns up. But I could live in IL if I had to, there is no assalt weapons ban, no permit to purchase, private transactions are legal, and there are no limits on how many rounds your mags can hold. I am not advocating accepting these laws, on the contrary fight to repeal them, but believe me it could be much worse. |
Man, I tried to purchase some HMR17 (HMR17!!!) Ammo from that store on the 4 corners outside Lena... and they wouldn't sell to me as I didn't have a FOID card... I even tried to tell him I'm from AL, but still... same with Dick's sporting goods in Rockford. To tell the truth, I have brought my AR up with a can of ammo... no prob... I just don't like the idea of having to explain it to a trooper. I'll be bringing my AR10 up this Christmas for some 'yote hunting. |
| I am inviting everyone to move donw to TEXAS. I live in Illinois for the first 18 years of my life. Enjoyed it very much. Joined the army and after 7 years got out and stayed in Texas. A shall issue CCW and no mandatory wait periods on firearms rocks. I love being able to go into a stor give them my Drivers License fill out the ATF form and pay them, wait like 10 minutes and walt out with my purchase in hand. Also now in texas you dont need a CCW to carry in your home or vehicle or RV or whathave you. Look up the TX gun laws they rock. Oh and another + class 3 hing Plus its hella cheaper donw here in San Antonio. My house is only 90k and its 2x as big as my fathers house in NW subs(bloomingdale) and his house also costs like 2x as much as mine:) Once again I invite everone to come on down. The weathers great:) Plus Mexico is only 2hrs south. |
Fred just had an Appleseed shoot in Texas. Not one Texan showed up. Texas unfortunately will be part of Mexico in 20 years if we don't make some serious changes. Beautiful state. "I don't ride bulls but I have known some men driving pickup trucks trusting God and luck and I live to love Texas women." -Hank Jr.
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I think that guys "behind the lines" in restrictive states like IL, NY, NJ, MA, etc. value their firearms rights more than those that live in "free' states like Texas. It's easy to take it for granted and not value something like an appleseed shoot if your gun rights are as secure as they are in Texas. Of course, there could have been a lack of promotion too... Mike |