Posted: 12/1/2013 10:24:04 AM EDT
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Hey Everyone,
Had kind of a strange experience at deerfield pistol. I moved to Wisconsin about 8 months ago, and this was my first time buying a pistol here. I wanted a new Glock and was tired of searching for deals, so I decided to just go there and snag one. Their price wasn't awful, but not great either and they had what I wanted in stock so I figured what the hell. So I fill out all the paperwork, and the guy goes to ring me up, and says "Ok, so just those two things today?" They charge a separate fee to run a background check! On the receipt, it said "Internal Firearms Transfer - $15.00". Never in my life have I ever bought a gun and been charged separately for the processing fees. That is supposed to be part of the retail price on the tag, in my book. Am I out of line here, or is this a bunch of hidden fee trickery bullshit? |
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I paid $15 Quoted:
I paid $15 Quoted:
I thought they reduced the fee to $10 back in May? If you paid $8, you'd have no bitch, IMO, because that's what the State now charges for a handgun background check, and it's only fair for the gun dealer to pass that on to you. Every gun dealer I've been to in Wisconsin has a poster or sign on the wall, explaining the 48hr procedure AND the fee for handgun sales. It's a govt imposed charge, not a money maker for the retailer. Business is business, and if he wasn't itemizing the $8 fee on your bill, it'd be added to the cost of the gun somewhere anyway. You're not getting away from it. But paying the extra $7 is bullshit. 
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The current fee charged by the WI DOJ is $10. It was $8, went up to $13 and now is down to $10. Anyone who was charging $15 was simply rounding up. Anyone who is still charging $15 is just being a capitalist...  Agreed. I'm not sure what the deal is with Deerfield. $15 is excessive, but they can set the fees at their business. Not including it in the cost of the gun, and adding after seems a little like a bait and switch to me. If I read the op correctly, it was only disclosed after the call was made, that he had to pay the fee. Now as far as I know once the call is made the fee to the state must be paid by the dealer. I have never had a buyer get declined, nor have I had one back out after the call is made, so I cannot be sure if the state waives the fee if a buyer backs out after the call is made. Which begs the question, are buyers told about the additional cost after the call on purpose? |
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Right, I wasn't told until after. I guess I would have just appreciated being told there was a fee being passed on to me before it was too late. I mean, I don't think I would have changed my mind, but it still would have been nice. When I buy something, I just expect to pay what is written on the price tag + applicable tax.
Lesson learned, no big deal. The end result is that the State of Wisconsin is $10 richer, the dealer swindled me out of $5 and a I have a new gun to shoot! We'll call it a win. Quoted:
Agreed. I'm not sure what the deal is with Deerfield. $15 is excessive, but they can set the fees at their business. Not including it in the cost of the gun, and adding after seems a little like a bait and switch to me. If I read the op correctly, it was only disclosed after the call was made, that he had to pay the fee. Now as far as I know once the call is made the fee to the state must be paid by the dealer. I have never had a buyer get declined, nor have I had one back out after the call is made, so I cannot be sure if the state waives the fee if a buyer backs out after the call is made. Which begs the question, are buyers told about the additional cost after the call on purpose? Quoted:
Quoted:
The current fee charged by the WI DOJ is $10. It was $8, went up to $13 and now is down to $10. Anyone who was charging $15 was simply rounding up. Anyone who is still charging $15 is just being a capitalist... Agreed. I'm not sure what the deal is with Deerfield. $15 is excessive, but they can set the fees at their business. Not including it in the cost of the gun, and adding after seems a little like a bait and switch to me. If I read the op correctly, it was only disclosed after the call was made, that he had to pay the fee. Now as far as I know once the call is made the fee to the state must be paid by the dealer. I have never had a buyer get declined, nor have I had one back out after the call is made, so I cannot be sure if the state waives the fee if a buyer backs out after the call is made. Which begs the question, are buyers told about the additional cost after the call on purpose? |
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Right, I wasn't told until after. I guess I would have just appreciated being told there was a fee being passed on to me before it was too late. I mean, I don't think I would have changed my mind, but it still would have been nice. When I buy something, I just expect to pay what is written on the price tag + applicable tax. Quoted:
Right, I wasn't told until after. I guess I would have just appreciated being told there was a fee being passed on to me before it was too late. I mean, I don't think I would have changed my mind, but it still would have been nice. When I buy something, I just expect to pay what is written on the price tag + applicable tax. Welcome to Wisconsin. Most States use NICS but WI uses its DOJ for handguns. I have not encountered a single WI FFL who just "includes it in the price". Quoted:
Lesson learned, no big deal. The end result is that the State of Wisconsin is $10 richer, the dealer swindled me out of $5 and a I have a new gun to shoot! We'll call it a win. The DOJ is not "$10 richer". The fee covers administrative costs and that is it. Unlike the extra $5 the dealer charged you, it is not a revenue generator. That is how and why they were able to reduce the fee to $10 after first setting it at $13. |
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Welcome to Wisconsin. Most States use NICS but WI uses its DOJ for handguns. I have not encountered a single WI FFL who just "includes it in the price". This one, near Tomahawk, does. Only one I've seen. |
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Welcome to Wisconsin. Most States use NICS but WI uses its DOJ for handguns. I have not encountered a single WI FFL who just "includes it in the price". This one, near Tomahawk, does. Only one I've seen. I am 99% sure Shay Creek in Medford included it in the price because: A: I don't recall seeing it and B: I think I would have noticed it when I verified that I paid the agreed price plus tax. But since it was my first handgun purchase in WI I was not even thinking about it. FYI they are setting up to do Class III in 2014 and I found them to be very easy to do business with as well. If you are curious I bought the newest version of the Ruger 22/45 Lite, the one that is not the ugly ass gold anodized color. Xmas gift for the GF. I went in to get .22 ammo, didn't expect to see that gun sitting there. |
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Welcome to Wisconsin. Most States use NICS but WI uses its DOJ for handguns. I have not encountered a single WI FFL who just "includes it in the price". This one, near Tomahawk, does. Only one I've seen. Sorry IK you have encountered me. If you buy a gun from me. The fees are included in the price of the gun. If you buy a gun elsewhere and I transfer the gun, then the transfer fee has the DOJ check already included. |
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I almost kind of wish they’d just left the damn fee at $10. Quoted:
I almost kind of wish they’d just left the damn fee at $10. They did. The change back down to $8 was just an Urban Myth... 
. . 175.35 Waiting period for purchase of handguns.
(2i) The department shall charge a firearms dealer a $10 fee for each firearms restrictions record search that the firearms dealer requests under sub. (2) (c). The firearms dealer may collect the fee from the transferee. |
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Sorry IK you have encountered me.. I didn't state that I had never heard of this, I simply stated that I had not encountered one who did so.  Regardless, it is a fee which is reasonable and customary to pass on to the customer. All WI customers should expect to pay it. By not including it in the sticker price, dealers can price match more effectively if they so choose which is just one advantage I see in doing so.
By encountering I meant in my shopping from them for handguns. I believe that the only dealings I have personally had with you were possibly ammo at a RN shoot. |
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I didn't state that I had never heard of this, I simply stated that I had not encountered one who did so. Regardless, it is a fee which is reasonable and customary to pass on to the customer. All WI customers should expect to pay it. By not including it in the sticker price, dealers can price match more effectively if they so choose which is just one advantage I see in doing so.
By encountering I meant in my shopping from them for handguns. I believe that the only dealings I have personally had with you were possibly ammo at a RN shoot. Quoted:
Quoted:
Sorry IK you have encountered me.. I didn't state that I had never heard of this, I simply stated that I had not encountered one who did so. Regardless, it is a fee which is reasonable and customary to pass on to the customer. All WI customers should expect to pay it. By not including it in the sticker price, dealers can price match more effectively if they so choose which is just one advantage I see in doing so.
By encountering I meant in my shopping from them for handguns. I believe that the only dealings I have personally had with you were possibly ammo at a RN shoot. Fair enough. |
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I didn't state that I had never heard of this, I simply stated that I had not encountered one who did so. Regardless, it is a fee which is reasonable and customary to pass on to the customer. All WI customers should expect to pay it. By not including it in the sticker price, dealers can price match more effectively if they so choose which is just one advantage I see in doing so.
By encountering I meant in my shopping from them for handguns. I believe that the only dealings I have personally had with you were possibly ammo at a RN shoot. Quoted:
Quoted:
Sorry IK you have encountered me.. I didn't state that I had never heard of this, I simply stated that I had not encountered one who did so. Regardless, it is a fee which is reasonable and customary to pass on to the customer. All WI customers should expect to pay it. By not including it in the sticker price, dealers can price match more effectively if they so choose which is just one advantage I see in doing so.
By encountering I meant in my shopping from them for handguns. I believe that the only dealings I have personally had with you were possibly ammo at a RN shoot. 90% of handgun buyers I deal with know what the fee is and that they will be paying it. Anyone surprised by the fee is definitely in the minority. Makes it understandable that an FFL wouldn't always remember to mention it. Most dealers used to round up to $15 when it was $13 (I'm one). When it went down to $10 I changed my price to $10. I heard of a few dealers who said they didn't care if the state changed the fee they were leaving it at $10. I'd recommend finding a new dealer. |
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90% of handgun buyers I deal with know what the fee is and that they will be paying it. Anyone surprised by the fee is definitely in the minority. Makes it understandable that an FFL wouldn't always remember to mention it. Most dealers used to round up to $15 when it was $13 (I'm one). When it went down to $10 I changed my price to $10. I heard of a few dealers who said they didn't care if the state changed the fee they were leaving it at $10. I'd recommend finding a new dealer. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Sorry IK you have encountered me.. I didn't state that I had never heard of this, I simply stated that I had not encountered one who did so. Regardless, it is a fee which is reasonable and customary to pass on to the customer. All WI customers should expect to pay it. By not including it in the sticker price, dealers can price match more effectively if they so choose which is just one advantage I see in doing so.
By encountering I meant in my shopping from them for handguns. I believe that the only dealings I have personally had with you were possibly ammo at a RN shoot. 90% of handgun buyers I deal with know what the fee is and that they will be paying it. Anyone surprised by the fee is definitely in the minority. Makes it understandable that an FFL wouldn't always remember to mention it. Most dealers used to round up to $15 when it was $13 (I'm one). When it went down to $10 I changed my price to $10. I heard of a few dealers who said they didn't care if the state changed the fee they were leaving it at $10. I'd recommend finding a new dealer. Just curious... do you calculate the sales tax before or after adding the $10? IOW, is the background check fee subject to sales tax also? I've seen it done both ways. Don't know if I got away without paying tax on it, or if I was charged 5.5% (of the fee) too much.... not that the 55 cents really matters that much. I don't think it should be taxed. I don't pay sales tax on any other govt fees, such as a fishing/hunting license, license plates, concealed carry license, etc. |
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Most dealers used to round up to $15 when it was $13 (I'm one). When it went down to $10 I changed my price to $10. I heard of a few dealers who said they didn't care if the state changed the fee they were leaving it at $10.. My personal experience as a purchaser in NE WI has been different. When you say "leaving it at $10, that infers that they were charging more than the $8 State fee. I have never found a chain store which charged more than what the State charged them and I only know of one Green Bay local smaller FFL who consistently charges more. I would rather see FFLs put the extra $2 in the price listed on the tag instead of charging $2 labor above the price on the tag to sell me an in-stock handgun. As always, huzzah for free market capitalism and all that jazz. As an informed purchaser, I make a conscious decision to pay it with a smile when I wish to purchase a handgun from those FFLs who participate in this practice..
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The ten dollar fee is the current charge that the state levees on handgun transfers only. It is ten dollars, not eight or fifteen.
The reason that it should be broken out as a separate item is that it is not a taxable item. If rolled into the cost of the gun, you would be charged sales tax on a state fee, which technically, while small, is incorrect. |
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Just curious... do you calculate the sales tax before or after adding the $10? IOW, is the background check fee subject to sales tax also? I've seen it done both ways. Don't know if I got away without paying tax on it, or if I was charged 5.5% (of the fee) too much.... not that the 55 cents really matters that much. I don't think it should be taxed. I don't pay sales tax on any other govt fees, such as a fishing/hunting license, license plates, concealed carry license, etc. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I didn't state that I had never heard of this, I simply stated that I had not encountered one who did so. Regardless, it is a fee which is reasonable and customary to pass on to the customer. All WI customers should expect to pay it. By not including it in the sticker price, dealers can price match more effectively if they so choose which is just one advantage I see in doing so.
By encountering I meant in my shopping from them for handguns. I believe that the only dealings I have personally had with you were possibly ammo at a RN shoot. 90% of handgun buyers I deal with know what the fee is and that they will be paying it. Anyone surprised by the fee is definitely in the minority. Makes it understandable that an FFL wouldn't always remember to mention it. Most dealers used to round up to $15 when it was $13 (I'm one). When it went down to $10 I changed my price to $10. I heard of a few dealers who said they didn't care if the state changed the fee they were leaving it at $10. I'd recommend finding a new dealer. Just curious... do you calculate the sales tax before or after adding the $10? IOW, is the background check fee subject to sales tax also? I've seen it done both ways. Don't know if I got away without paying tax on it, or if I was charged 5.5% (of the fee) too much.... not that the 55 cents really matters that much. I don't think it should be taxed. I don't pay sales tax on any other govt fees, such as a fishing/hunting license, license plates, concealed carry license, etc. I have it set up in my system to be nontaxed. If I'm wrong, I'm sure the state will spank me. |
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My personal experience as a purchaser in NE WI has been different. When you say "leaving it at $10, that infers that they were charging more than the $8 State fee. I have never found a chain store which charged more than what the State charged them and I only know of one Green Bay local smaller FFL who consistently charges more. I would rather see FFLs put the extra $2 in the price listed on the tag instead of charging $2 labor above the price on the tag to sell me an in-stock handgun. As always, huzzah for free market capitalism and all that jazz. As an informed purchaser, I make a conscious decision to pay it with a smile when I wish to purchase a handgun from those FFLs who participate in this practice.. Quoted:
Quoted:
Most dealers used to round up to $15 when it was $13 (I'm one). When it went down to $10 I changed my price to $10. I heard of a few dealers who said they didn't care if the state changed the fee they were leaving it at $10.. My personal experience as a purchaser in NE WI has been different. When you say "leaving it at $10, that infers that they were charging more than the $8 State fee. I have never found a chain store which charged more than what the State charged them and I only know of one Green Bay local smaller FFL who consistently charges more. I would rather see FFLs put the extra $2 in the price listed on the tag instead of charging $2 labor above the price on the tag to sell me an in-stock handgun. As always, huzzah for free market capitalism and all that jazz. As an informed purchaser, I make a conscious decision to pay it with a smile when I wish to purchase a handgun from those FFLs who participate in this practice.. Sorry I typoed. The $8 fee was before my time. I didn't get my FFL til 2010 and by then the state fee was $13. I rounded to $15 because i have OCD about round numbers. What I meant was when it went down to $10 I heard of at least a couple dealers who said they were leaving their fee at $13 or $15, whichever it was they were charging. I dropped mine to $10 to match the state fee. |