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AR15.COM
1/27/2009 2:22:29 PM EDT
Totally off the wall question, but was talking to a friend who is a Lieutenant with a local PD. We were talking about CCW and he thought (possibly mis-informed) that one could start a private investigation company (simple LLC) and go through the certs and whatnot and end up being able to carry legally. I haven't looked into it, just wondering if anyone has thought of it (probably a long time ago)

Just thought I'd bring it up. Might start some discussion. ARFCOM HOMETOWNWI PI LLC?
1/27/2009 2:32:39 PM EDT
[#1]
Quoted:
Totally off the wall question, but was talking to a friend who is a Lieutenant with a local PD. We were talking about CCW and he thought (possibly mis-informed) that one could start a private investigation company (simple LLC) and go through the certs and whatnot and end up being able to carry legally. I haven't looked into it, just wondering if anyone has thought of it (probably a long time ago)

Just thought I'd bring it up. Might start some discussion. ARFCOM HOMETOWNWI PI LLC?


I don't think PI's can CCW.
1/27/2009 4:05:42 PM EDT
[#2]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Totally off the wall question, but was talking to a friend who is a Lieutenant with a local PD. We were talking about CCW and he thought (possibly mis-informed) that one could start a private investigation company (simple LLC) and go through the certs and whatnot and end up being able to carry legally. I haven't looked into it, just wondering if anyone has thought of it (probably a long time ago)

Just thought I'd bring it up. Might start some discussion. ARFCOM HOMETOWNWI PI LLC?


I don't think PI's can CCW.


RL 34.01 General conditions relating to carrying a
firearm. (1) No owner or employee of an agency may carry on,
about or near their person any firearm unless all of the following
apply:
(a) The circumstances or conditions of the owner’s or employee’s
assignment as a private security person give rise to a substantial
need for being armed.
(am) The agency requires the owner or employee to carry a
firearm when acting as a private security person.
(b) The client and the agency agree in writing that the agency
will assign armed security personnel to the client.
(c) The agency has received a permit from the department pursuant
to s. RL 34.015.
(d) The owner or employee is not prohibited from possessing
a firearm under s. 941.29, Stats., or any federal law.
(e) Subject to ss. 111.321, 111.322 and 111.335, Stats., the
owner or employee has not been convicted of a misdemeanor.
(f) The owner or employee is in uniform.
(fm) The owner or employee is on duty.
(g) The owner or employee complies with all federal or state
laws or local ordinances when carrying a firearm.
(h) The owner or employee does not hold a temperately private
security permit issued under s. 440.26 (5r), Stats.
(i) The agency has obtained a comprehensive general liability
policy pursuant to s. RL 31.034.
(2) Except as provided in sub. (4), an owner or employee of
any agency may not carry on, about or near the person any concealed
firearm at a time when he or she is on duty.
(3) Except as provided in sub. (4), a private detective, while
in uniform and on duty as a private security person, may only carry
on, about or near his or her person a firearm when all the conditions
in sub. (1) are satisfied. This subsection does not prohibit a
private detective from having on, about or near his or her person
a firearm which the private detective obtained and is holding as
evidence in an investigation.
(4) A person who is a peace officer, as defined in s. 939.22
(22), Stats., may carry on, about or near his or her person a firearm,
concealed or otherwise, when acting as a private detective or private
security person, if the peace officer obtains a firearms permit
from the department. The department may grant an exception
from this requirement to a peace officer who submits to the department
a letter from a law enforcement agency, written not more
than one month before the date of receipt by the department, stating
that the law enforcement agency will accept liability for the
peace officer’s use of a firearm while on duty for the private detective
agency.
History: Cr. Register, October, 1988, No. 394, eff. 11−1−88; am. (1) (intro.), (a)
to (c), cr. (1) (am), (d) to (g), (3) and (4), r. and recr. (2), Register, December, 1994,
No. 468, eff. 1−1−95; am. (1) (intro.), cr. (1) (fm
1/27/2009 7:01:00 PM EDT
[#3]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Totally off the wall question, but was talking to a friend who is a Lieutenant with a local PD. We were talking about CCW and he thought (possibly mis-informed) that one could start a private investigation company (simple LLC) and go through the certs and whatnot and end up being able to carry legally. I haven't looked into it, just wondering if anyone has thought of it (probably a long time ago)

Just thought I'd bring it up. Might start some discussion. ARFCOM HOMETOWNWI PI LLC?


I don't think PI's can CCW.


RL 34.01 General conditions relating to carrying a
firearm. (1) No owner or employee of an agency may carry on,
about or near their person any firearm unless all of the following
apply:
(a) The circumstances or conditions of the owner’s or employee’s
assignment as a private security person give rise to a substantial
need for being armed.
(am) The agency requires the owner or employee to carry a
firearm when acting as a private security person.
(b) The client and the agency agree in writing that the agency
will assign armed security personnel to the client.
(c) The agency has received a permit from the department pursuant
to s. RL 34.015.
(d) The owner or employee is not prohibited from possessing
a firearm under s. 941.29, Stats., or any federal law.
(e) Subject to ss. 111.321, 111.322 and 111.335, Stats., the
owner or employee has not been convicted of a misdemeanor.
(f) The owner or employee is in uniform.
(fm) The owner or employee is on duty.
(g) The owner or employee complies with all federal or state
laws or local ordinances when carrying a firearm.
(h) The owner or employee does not hold a temperately private
security permit issued under s. 440.26 (5r), Stats.
(i) The agency has obtained a comprehensive general liability
policy pursuant to s. RL 31.034.
(2) Except as provided in sub. (4), an owner or employee of
any agency may not carry on, about or near the person any concealed
firearm at a time when he or she is on duty.
(3) Except as provided in sub. (4), a private detective, while
in uniform and on duty as a private security person, may only carry
on, about or near his or her person a firearm when all the conditions
in sub. (1) are satisfied. This subsection does not prohibit a
private detective from having on, about or near his or her person
a firearm which the private detective obtained and is holding as
evidence in an investigation.
(4) A person who is a peace officer, as defined in s. 939.22
(22), Stats., may carry on, about or near his or her person a firearm,
concealed or otherwise, when acting as a private detective or private
security person, if the peace officer obtains a firearms permit
from the department. The department may grant an exception
from this requirement to a peace officer who submits to the department
a letter from a law enforcement agency, written not more
than one month before the date of receipt by the department, stating
that the law enforcement agency will accept liability for the
peace officer’s use of a firearm while on duty for the private detective
agency.
History: Cr. Register, October, 1988, No. 394, eff. 11−1−88; am. (1) (intro.), (a)
to (c), cr. (1) (am), (d) to (g), (3) and (4), r. and recr. (2), Register, December, 1994,
No. 468, eff. 1−1−95; am. (1) (intro.), cr. (1) (fm



Layman's Terms please...
1/27/2009 7:27:52 PM EDT
[#4]
Quoted:

Layman's Terms please...


Here is the Readers' Digest Version... forget about a fake PI agency....:  

RL 34.01 General conditions relating to carrying a
firearm. (1) No owner or employee of an agency may carry on,
about or near their person any firearm unless all of the following
apply:
(a) The circumstances or conditions of the owner’s or employee’s
assignment as a private security person give rise to a substantial
need for being armed.
(2) Except as provided in sub. (4), an owner or employee of
any agency may not carry on, about or near the person any concealed
firearm at a time when he or she is on duty.
(4) A person who is a peace officer, as defined in s. 939.22
(22), Stats., may carry on, about or near his or her person a firearm,
concealed or otherwise, when acting as a private detective or private
security person, if the peace officer obtains a firearms permit
from the department. .
The department may grant an exception
from this requirement to a peace officer who submits to the department
a letter from a law enforcement agency, written not more
than one month before the date of receipt by the department, stating
that the law enforcement agency will accept liability for the
peace officer’s use of a firearm while on duty for the private detective
agency.
1/27/2009 7:55:16 PM EDT
[#5]
In any event, I wouldn't want to explain to a judge that I had found this "great loophole"... etc.
1/27/2009 8:36:13 PM EDT
[#6]



Quoted:





Quoted:





Layman's Terms please...








Here is the Readers' Digest Version... forget about a fake PI agency....

:  





RL 34.01 General conditions relating to carrying a


firearm. (1) No owner or employee of an agency may carry on,


about or near their person any firearm unless all of the following


apply:


(a) The circumstances or conditions of the owner’s or employee’s


assignment as a private security person give rise to a substantial


need for being armed.


(2) Except as provided in sub. (4), an owner or employee of


any agency may not carry on, about or near the person any concealed


firearm at a time when he or she is on duty.


(4) A person who is a peace officer, as defined in s. 939.22


(22), Stats., may carry on, about or near his or her person a firearm,


concealed or otherwise, when acting as a private detective or private


security person, if the peace officer obtains a firearms permit


from the department. .
The department may grant an exception


from this requirement to a peace officer who submits to the department


a letter from a law enforcement agency, written not more


than one month before the date of receipt by the department, stating


that the law enforcement agency will accept liability for the


peace officer’s use of a firearm while on duty for the private detective


agency.








Not sure what all that is, but here is the actual State Statute for CCW, my highlight:





941.23 Carrying concealed weapon.
Any person except a peace officer who goes armed with a concealed and
dangerous weapon is guilty
of a Class A misdemeanor. Notwithstanding s. 939.22 (22),
for purposes of this section, peace officer does not include a
commission warden who is not a state-certified commission warden.






For good Measure, the referenced statute number:





(22)
"Peace officer" means any person vested by law with a duty to maintain
public order or to make arrests for crime, whether that duty extends to
all crimes or is limited to specific crimes. "Peace officer" includes a
commission warden.








 
1/28/2009 6:51:43 AM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
Totally off the wall question, but was talking to a friend who is a Lieutenant with a local PD. We were talking about CCW and he thought (possibly mis-informed) that one could start a private investigation company (simple LLC) and go through the certs and whatnot and end up being able to carry legally. I haven't looked into it, just wondering if anyone has thought of it (probably a long time ago)

Just thought I'd bring it up. Might start some discussion. ARFCOM HOMETOWNWI PI LLC?


Will not work. You could open carry with the proper licensing from the state, however you can ONLY carry open, and only while on the clock.
1/28/2009 7:33:55 AM EDT
[#8]
No.

Private Security Person's may be armed if:  properly certified; assigned to an account requiring armed guards.

Private Detectives may be armed if:  in uniform; working as a Private Security Person; properly certified; assigned to an account requiring armed guards.
1/28/2009 7:40:51 AM EDT
[#9]
well that answered my question. thanks guys
2/6/2009 1:29:55 PM EDT
[#10]
Per WI statute and Department of Regulation and Licensing Regulation, PI's licensed in the state of Wisconsin CAN carry a weapon if it is in plain view, they recieve a permit from the DRL, and complete an approved 40 hour law enforcement firearms certification course. PI's with valid permit are also subject to the prohibition from carrying in an establichment that sells alcohol, schools, and public buildings. Section 941.23 of the Wisconsin Statutes states only allows exemption to peace officers for CCW, anyone else would risk a a trip to jail, loosing the weapon, and be charged with a class A misdemeanor.
2/7/2009 6:25:01 AM EDT
[#11]
A good example of people who fit in this "loophole" are the uniformed (armed) guards on the armored trucks that you see at your local banks. They certainly don't unload/encase their pistols before entering their truck.