Posted: 12/20/2006 10:43:47 AM EDT
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First a little background... I have had an HK USP9 for the last few years and chose it b/c it is utterly reliable(has been for me) and being a lefty it was one of the few pistols I liked the controls on. I feel I can shoot it fairly well and have become quite comfortable with it. Following my 1st class with Def. Edge, (cold weather handgun) I have learned a few things. 1. Bore over grip height. USP's is rather high and makes taming muzzle flip takes some work. 2. Manipulating control levers (safeties, decockers, & slide stops) under stress can lead to errors. 3. I'm still not used to the double action pull on the 1st shot for my USP. I shot a few of the guy's Glocks at the class and seemed to shoot ok with them. They were easier to control, and I liked the ease of use, especially after seeing how proper manipulations were done. I feel pretty good about trying to make a jump to the Glock platform (for a number of reasons), but have a few questions. I'm looking at going the 9mm route for now and am considering the G19 or G17. Might even go to the .40 if anyone has persuasive arguements. Perhaps if our wonderful state ever passes CCW, I would look into a G26 or 27. For now I'm looking for a good shooter to practice with, do some IPSC, and hopefully some more training. Your thoughts, suggestions are appreciated! |
| 19 for the size is the most popular glock ever. It leads to concealment better than the 17. It's cheap to feed as well. The only thing is the 19 is a little small for my hand and doesnt fit well if it has a 3rd generation frame. I shoot my old 17 and like it. But in all honesty don't get caught up in the glock koolaide stuff. Some people love them some dont. Find a gun that works for you and learn to use it well. Dont feel inadequate because you dont have a glock. |
| No persuasive reason to go with a .40 over a 9mm. Despite the propoganda of those "rules for a gunfight" posts, it's still a twentieth of an inch difference in unexpanded diameter. The good 9mm ammo will do most anything a .40 will do. And a 9mm is cheaper to feed with training ammo. |
LOL! Don't worry, I don't feel inadequate.  Just looking to improve/add to the tools in the toolbox. One of the aspects I am seeing about the Glocks is that one can train with a fullsize frame and then jump to a compact or different caliber without what would seem like too much difficulty. That and they are reasonably priced, reliable, & EASY to find parts, mags and accessories for. I have medium sized hands, and both the 17 and 19 felt "right". As far as possible concealability in the future, I wouldn't mind carrying a 26 or 27. I really liked Glenn_R's 27. Is there a range in the Milwaukee-Waukesha area where you can test drive a few? |
heh good. I just know some people who shot x pistol and then went to a class and then saw everyone else shooting a glock..then they had to have a glock like yesterday for no other reason than everyone else shot them. Doesnt really matter what you shoot as long as it works well and you like it  And to be honest my glock gets the least amount of range time now days. I cant put down my 226 anymore for some reason. There is something compelling me to shoot it and keep shooting it hahah. There will always be a spot in my heart for my beater glock but ive moved on to other tools and enjoy them just as much.
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I would say get a........I digress....... 
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The size. Not to big, not to small. I really don't see a need for a bigger pistol. The 17 is nice but I don't like the longer grip. The 19 grip is actually a tad bit short for my liking but it's a trade off I'm willing to take. As to glocks in general I just like them because they are simple and reliable. And simple and reliable when lots of things are happening at once. |
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Personally, I like the G19 cause it works best for me and my hand. For some people the G17 just fits their hand better. I don't need the longer grip of the G17 and the extra barrel length and sight radius isn't enough of a benefit to off set the larger size. Try both as much as you can to get a good idea of what works best for you. |
I like the 17 or 34 for training because of the larger size, it's alittle easier on my hands after a long day of shooting.
A nice thing about Glocks is that if your pistol should ever go TU there will usually be several spares offered and most likely a parts kit in someones rangebag. :-) Thinking about it there probably'd be a Glock armorer or 3 in the bunch. CY6 bulletcatchR |
Yeah, I'm still not totally convinced yet that this is the route I will go. Some things were just pointed out to me that made me think about what I want out of a pistol. If I was following a lot of todays crowd, I'd be the next in line for an XD. 
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WooWoo!  Anyhow, what'll make a difference is how far your hand comes down on the grip. If you're willing to come down to Racine, we've got a nice assortment you can play with.
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'Nother Koolaid drinker here.  As a dyed-in-the-wool 1911 guy, I couldn't deny that they just plain work (and work better for me than my 1911 ever did). Anyhow, I have a G17 & 19. If I had to do it all over again, I'd go with the 34 for practice and keep the 19 for carry. The G34 acts kind of like a Buckmark, and instills all sorts of confidence once you get your grip right. Add in the long sight radius, and you have a "Tactical" pistol extrodinaire (once you get rid of the IPSC/IDPA extended everything). |
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17 shooter here I have shot 19's as well and I have to say with my "farmer hands" I would have to go with the second gen 19 when I go that route, the third gen just does not fit right. Yes you will get a hard time at classes until you get a glock, don't let it stress you we give everyone a hard time that does not drink the koolaid. If you are shooting well and not having to fight the recoil all day then shoot what ya brung. [Sully]"unless they are all going in the same hole there is room for improvement"[/Sully] |
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All preference. I tried to like the 19 when I was Glock shopping, but the grip is just to short and stubby for me.. The G17 fits my hand better and I shoot better with it... Try them both and then decide... As for concealment... When we get the law passed, then I'll worry about concealment.... Get a good generation 3 Glock (Used ones are a great deal as very few owners shoot them that much) and a good set of Nite sights and leave it alone. Buy copious amounts of ammo and practice.... |
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I've owned a G21, 22, 23, 27, and a G30. I've still got the 30. The G21 (Full size .45ACP) was simply a monster, too big. The G27 (sub compact .40) was lousy, too much oomph for a little gun, and very prone to limp wristing jams when shot by my female friends. I miss my G23 (mid size .40, same size as G19 9mm), but a friend made me a cash offer too good to refuse. Same thing happened with my G22, also a very nice (full size) pistol that shot wonderfully. I will never ever part with my G30. 10 or 13 (if using G21 mags) rounds of .45ACP in the right size (for me) package. groups are terrific with blazer brass ammo, and the .45ACP+P feels goooooood to shoot. If 9mm is your thing, I would vote for a G19. Not too big, not too small, and 15+1 on tap. |
+1 Glock sights are functional, and thats about it. My daytime groups shrunk in half when I added Mepros. Its the only mod any of my glocks ever got, except for a piece of hockey tape around the grip for a bit more, well, grip. |
Yeah, I like it too. In about 40% of my training I try to reverse the practice methodology a couple of people suggest (shoot big/carry small). If I practice with the G27 (which forces me to concentrate on proper grip and trigger press) the G22 shoots very "easy" when I pick it up. I almost feel like I can't miss with the big gun. Although that might not have been very apparent last weekend  But I wouldn't suggest a subcompact for your "only" gun. It's hard to go wrong with either a G17 or G19, so try them side-by-side to decide. Oh, and +1 to the poster who said skill is more important than gun model. It's very possible to shoot a DA/SA gun like the HK really, really well. You don't need to change to a Glock. Glocks just have lots of things going for them. |
| Hyperformer just to be fair, I don't own a glock, I've shot the crap out of one over the last year. About 4K rounds give or take in classes and training sessions. When I first started shooting I couldn't shoot glocks for shit, I didn't like the grip or the gun. However after using one in high round count situations, I grew to like the ugly little things. The lack of extra cotrols is nice when using a hand held light, or in really cold situations. It is also really nice when you have to deal with/control other people while shooting. It can be a bitch to hit that decocker on the baby eagle one handed, and even on the beretta it was like that. I've come to the conclusion that when it comes to a fighting pistol, a glock (or similar gun like the XD, though the grip safety IMO is pointless) is just a better gun than one with external controls regardless of the name on that gun. |
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Thanks for the comments everyone. It is nice to hear what people like/dislike about diff. models. I know I could get along just fine with what I have, but simplicity in a "fighting pistol" makes too much sense. I have a friend who is just finishing up cop school. He apparently has a 17 and a 22. I'm supposed to go shoot with him this weekend and will take a few spins on his shooters. |
What would you consider "good" defensive 9mm ammo? |
Not Glenn, but I think I can answer for him, in this case: Federal HST or Winchester Ranger SXT. Both penetrate to the FBI required minimum 12", while reliably expanding 100% of the time when shot through denim/heavy clothing. ETA: I prefer the 9mm 124 Gr. HST, while my pal G carries SXT's in his .40 cal duty/off duty gun. |
FMD nailed it. I'd add the Speer Gold Dot to that list, based on what I've read about it. For any of the loads I'd shoot 200 through the gun I planned to use to make sure they functioned properly one-hand, limp-wristed, etc. For example, the Gold Dots never fed reliably in my Kahr PM9 or my wife's K9. I don't think it was a Gold Dot problem, or a Kahr problem...I think it was just a case of tolerance stacking (or something like that). No problem, though, because I just loaded up with HST's and called it good. |
| G17 or G19 because the 9mm is cheap allowing more practice and quality defensive ammo gives up nothing to the other calibers. The G19 would be a good size compromise for concealed carry or all around use. I also shoot a USP Compact with the LEM trigger. The LEM trigger does away with the double action press on the first shot. I am entrenched in the camp Photoman is in. Defensive pistols should have no controls to manipulate besides pressing the trigger. The thing I don't like about the USP is that if you ever need to actually use it defensively, you are putting a larger investment into police evidence room. Also Glock magazines are cheaper then HK by a lot. |
I suppose I could get the LEM trigger for the USP, but that is more money into a platform that is not nearly easy or cheap to get spare mags or parts for. As far as the USP into a police evidence room, I would consider it money well spent if I on the winning end of any confrontation. I do like the availability of accessories for the GLock, and that I can actually put a decent light on it if I ever wanted. I shot a 17 this weekend. It seemed to fit me ok. I am liking the glock the more I shoot it. I would like to try a 19 somewhere along the line. It seemed a little more comfortable in my hands. Does anyone know if Streichers still has those used MPD pistols avail? |
At the Waukesha show one vendor told me an associate of his had 14 left to sell. He handed me his card and I think I still have it at work. I'll look for it tomorrow. Shoot me an email me and I'll send you the info. I also have an HK USP9 I use for IDPA/IPSC and only problem I've had is operator error (no slide lock when thumb rides too high). As another IDPA/IPSC/tactical pistol I'm considering a G34 because of reliabilty, caliber, price. |
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G17 is my recommendation, as everyone should have one of these IMHO. It is a well built pistol that is very user friendly. It carries well, and better fits most hands for weapon control as compared to the G19. CY6 Greg Sullivan "Sully" Chief Instructor SLR15 Rifles TheDefensiveEdge.com |
Ya, I forgot about that. the rail on the HK is propriatary and I can't mount the Surefire weapon light on it without an adaptor. Sucks to be an HK owner sometimes. |
Then in that case you only have to get used to one operation SA Carry the weapon cocked and locked you take the safe off as you are coming up on target. two proplems solved and it is only 10:30 my work is done here. |