[ARCHIVED THREAD] - $538 (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 11/9/2006 5:55:00 AM EDT
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for RCW 46.61.525 negligent driving, 2nd degree. is that a common penalty? I'm not complaining. I was speeding (18 miles over the speed limit) but $538? what did I do, you ask: Driving Northbound following three car ahead of me in the fast lane all going 55-60 mph for the pass 15-20 minutes. All those times there was always a chance for them to be nice and let others pass nicely... but no they insist on driving on the fast lane. And you know what happened next, pass to the right and move ahead of them. With my luck this morning there was a state patrol 3-6 cars following behind me because as soon as I made my move I notice the same headlight lights move with me and started flashing after I pass all three cars ahead of me.   Now back to my question is that a common amount (penalty) for RCW 46.61.525 negligent driving, 2nd degree. trig |
Smells like bullshit to me. That's one I would definitely fight in court. |
A decent attourney can get you off of that one. Check out the news paper there are local ones that only charge $100 for a "green" violation. green meaning nonviolent, non combative. |
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RCW 46.61.525 Negligent driving -- Second degree. (1)(a) A person is guilty of negligent driving in the second degree if, under circumstances not constituting negligent driving in the first degree, he or she operates a motor vehicle in a manner that is both negligent and endangers or is likely to endanger any person or property. (b) It is an affirmative defense to negligent driving in the second degree that must be proved by the defendant by a preponderance of the evidence, that the driver was operating the motor vehicle on private property with the consent of the owner in a manner consistent with the owner's consent. (c) Negligent driving in the second degree is a traffic infraction and is subject to a penalty of two hundred fifty dollars. (2) For the purposes of this section, "negligent" means the failure to exercise ordinary care, and is the doing of some act that a reasonably careful person would not do under the same or similar circumstances or the failure to do something that a reasonably careful person would do under the same or similar circumstances. (3) Any act prohibited by this section that also constitutes a crime under any other law of this state may be the basis of prosecution under such other law notwithstanding that it may also be the basis for prosecution under this section. [1997 c 66 § 5; 1996 c 307 § 1; 1979 ex.s. c 136 § 86; 1967 c 32 § 69; 1961 c 12 § 46.56.030. Prior: 1939 c 154 § 1; RRS § 6360-118 1/2. Formerly RCW 46.56.030.] Were you in a construction zone? |
I am..it was in Kirkland where they are building the new exit for Evergreen Hospital? But there's nobody working at that time 5:30am...I guess it does still apply, that's a good point. thanks! Trig (I could get a nice revolver for $538 ) |
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I'd still fight it. It's up to the officer to prove you were wrong and you to prove you were right. If the officer fails to show then your ticket is tossed. Also with a 15 year clean record I guarantee that the judge will lower the fine if he doesn't dismiss it. There's nothing wrong with passing on the right if the jackass in front of you is holding up traffic. I see cops do it all the time. |
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Sounds like a bull shit deal but hopefully it stays fresh in your mind when driving. I have heard the 'aggresive driving' ( to curb road rage ) fines are around 500-$600 as well. And who is that at the discretion of ........ ? The issuing officer that's who. If you have to pass / overtake other vehicles / change lanes etc ... do it as discretely as possible, with as little acceleration as possible also. Rate x Time = Distance ( 10mph faster only gets you 10 miles further 1 hour later or saves you 10 minutes or so on a 1 hour commute ) You shave very little off of your commute time by speeding alittle here and alittle there. Best of luck if you fight it, which I would. I think a ticket like that is an insurance hike that will surprise the shit out of you. |
Yeah that is right, but call this guy and you only pay a flat fee, and it will never go on your record. He has gotten me of about 6 tickets in the last 11 years.Mitch Greene |
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Sounds like it's attorney time... I hate em' and if the ticket would only effect my wallet then and their FINE. I'll pay the money without complaint, no worries. BUT It's the long lasting Insurance hit that could potentially cost you thousands over the next 3-4 years that gets me on the phone. There was an amazing dude in Tampa that could get damn near anything beat. I dunno if there is someone up here like this but there prolly is, find the Attorney that beats tickets and pony up. Even if it costs double the ticket, you'll be saving money in the long term. |
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you got hit by one of the "road rage" troopers. Instead of going after the problem, people cruising in the passing lane, they go after the reaction. Morning traffic is also a giveaway, that's when most troopers are on the road. Anyways, I'd definately get a traffic attorney if you intend to fight it, a neg ticket is different than just a speed ticket. |
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#1 - Fight it. don't check the 'explain circumstances' box, they can only lower it not toss it if you go to the magistrate. Contest it and take it to the judge. #2 - What's the speed limit where you were at? you are allowed to pass slow vehicles, and while the so called limit is 10 over to pass if you need to make it safe 18 isn't unreasonable. #3 - Contrary to popular belief, it isn't speed that kills. Its deceleration trauma. Follow too close and you're going to find out sooner or later. |
Thanks! Everyone I'll give this Mitch a call, his website looks legit and professional Trig |
| He is one of the best, if the court is out of his area he will refer you to someone else that can do an equally well job. He will get the ticket dropped, and he will cost less than the tickets fine fee. He always gets them on technicality, and thats good, because you dont ever have to swear in and testify. My cousin and Cousin in law uses him too, they both have never been convited on a ticket. |
Not anymore, they changed the law this year. Besides, signing was just stating you recieved it, not admitting guilt. |
That's my point at least they have proof that they actually stopped you. What if you pissed a law officer unknowingly or somebody that has a friend or relatives that's a law officer and willing to get back at you this way... there's always some bad apple everywhere Thought I could clear this ticket without going through an attorney due to not signing it. Didn't know they changed the law on this. Thanks! Trig |
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RCW 46.61.100 Keep right except when passing, etc. (1) Upon all roadways of sufficient width a vehicle shall be driven upon the right half of the roadway, except as follows: (a) When overtaking and passing another vehicle proceeding in the same direction under the rules governing such movement; (b) When an obstruction exists making it necessary to drive to the left of the center of the highway; provided, any person so doing shall yield the right of way to all vehicles traveling in the proper direction upon the unobstructed portion of the highway within such distance as to constitute an immediate hazard; (c) Upon a roadway divided into three marked lanes and providing for two-way movement traffic under the rules applicable thereon; or (d) Upon a street or highway restricted to one-way traffic. (2) Upon all roadways having two or more lanes for traffic moving in the same direction, all vehicles shall be driven in the right-hand lane then available for traffic, except (a) when overtaking and passing another vehicle proceeding in the same direction, (b) when traveling at a speed greater than the traffic flow, (c) when moving left to allow traffic to merge, or (d) when preparing for a left turn at an intersection, exit, or into a private road or driveway when such left turn is legally permitted. On any such roadway, a vehicle or combination over ten thousand pounds shall be driven only in the right-hand lane except under the conditions enumerated in (a) through (d) of this subsection. (3) No vehicle towing a trailer or no vehicle or combination over ten thousand pounds may be driven in the left-hand lane of a limited access roadway having three or more lanes for traffic moving in one direction except when preparing for a left turn at an intersection, exit, or into a private road or driveway when a left turn is legally permitted. This subsection does not apply to a vehicle using a high-occupancy vehicle lane. A high-occupancy vehicle lane is not considered the left-hand lane of a roadway. The department of transportation, in consultation with the Washington state patrol, shall adopt rules specifying (a) those circumstances where it is permissible for other vehicles to use the left lane in case of emergency or to facilitate the orderly flow of traffic, and (b) those segments of limited access roadway to be exempt from this subsection due to the operational characteristics of the roadway. (4) It is a traffic infraction to drive continuously in the left lane of a multilane roadway when it impedes the flow of other traffic. (5) Upon any roadway having four or more lanes for moving traffic and providing for two-way movement of traffic, a vehicle shall not be driven to the left of the center line of the roadway except when authorized by official traffic control devices designating certain lanes to the left side of the center of the roadway for use by traffic not otherwise permitted to use such lanes, or except as permitted under subsection (1)(b) of this section. However, this subsection shall not be construed as prohibiting the crossing of the center line in making a left turn into or from an alley, private road or driveway. Underlined area the officer ticketed the wrong person. The truck ahead of you was supposed to be in the right lane. This will be on the troopers dash board cam. Subpoena him, and the video. It will show the obstructing truck not following the rules for a good period of time. I would also ask if the trooper was working with the truck driver, it almost sounds like a set up to me RCW 46.61.115 When overtaking on the right is permitted. (1) The driver of a vehicle may overtake and pass upon the right of another vehicle only under the following conditions: (a) When the vehicle overtaken is making or about to make a left turn; (b) Upon a roadway with unobstructed pavement of sufficient width for two or more lines of vehicles moving lawfully in the direction being traveled by the overtaking vehicle. (2) The driver of a vehicle may overtake and pass another vehicle upon the right only under conditions permitting such movement in safety. Such movement shall not be made by driving off the roadway. Take this into court. You were within your law to do what you did. |
I thought it was the other way around - it was a felony not to sign it. Don't recall and too lazy to go look it up... 
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| No matter what, even if you think you have found a sure fire way out. Hire Mitch anyway, something always happens and you will get stuck with it. I have even been in court with Mitch before, he told me the judge was gonna be a hardass. Mitch pointed out 3 faulty points on the ticket that had not been filed, filled out, or marked correctly, and it took till the 4th thing for the judge to throw it out. The Judge just kept saying, I have a feeling your client is guilty, what else do you have on this infraction Mr. Greene? |
I405 heading Northbound from Bellevue to Lynnwood, got stopped at Kirkland. Wet but not raining, still dark. No I don't watch the news anymore...I rely on AR15 forum for news update and help Trig |
 I myself have no interest in getting pulled over by 'Johnny 1 bullet' and getting a $500+ ticket ran up my ass, so I'll refrain from any race track driving moves and leave all the fun for you and the Dukes of Hazzard. I used all of my luck w/ the Po-Po up in my younger days so I typically drive the speed limit most of the time and when i exceed it by alittle ... i sure as heel won't attract attention to myself by passing on the wrong side or erratic lane changes etc. |
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At anytime prior to passing the slow cars in the fast lane did you have an opportunity to pass them? Did you pass them and then pop back into the fast lane? Were the cars in the fast lane doing the speed limit? What did the WSP ask you after he pulled you over? Take some pictures of the area if you can, at about the same time when the traffic is flowing about the same as it was when you were pulled over. Last time I was pulled over by a state trooped for speeding (76 in a 60 on I5) he asked me if I was in a hurry. I told him no, that I enjoy safe driving and that I wanted to get around the rolling roadblock to get to the traffic free area. I didn't pull any hairball stunts, I didn't complain, heck, I even told him that I had a CCW on me. All he did was delay me for about 10 minutes and let me go. You said it was a construction zone? Fines are doubled in a construction zone. If you see a judge alone he'll probably reduce the fine to just the single fine amount. You might as well hire a lawer. |
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Damn, thats hardcore. I have been caught at 26 over and never was cited with anything but speeding. Two months ago I was a passenger in a car near Ritzville. My friend was cited for 87 in a 60. At most she was going 77--I looked at her speedometer when I saw the cop, and I saw him before she did. I'm used to getting pulled over and it doesn't bug me anymore, but whenever a stater is involved I always end up feeling like I got bent over. Maybe cause I've been cited for things I never did. Or maybe it was the threats they throw my way when I get pulled over. The fascetiousness of one Trooper in particular still gets me. Trooper Lance (IIRC), if you're reading this, I still think you're a prick. |
not completely, they dont have to appear in court anymore, they can do signed afadivates<SP and are not required to show up unless you submit a reason ahead of time requesting the officer to show up. Get a flat rate lawyer. 
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To answer some of the questions above: -It is actually still a misdemeanor to not sign the ticket, but it is not arrestable. You will be charged via investigation. -The ticket will not be thrown out if the officer does not appear. The narrative on the back of the ticket is taken as testimony. -I believe that construction zone tickets are the same as school zone tickets. They cannot not be reduced or deferred. It is all or nothing. -BJohnson |
| I was following an unmarked impala stater home on tuesday. A guy was doing 70 in the left lane and the trooper stayed right on his ass for about 15 minutes. When he had room he hit the middle lane, floored it, and swerved back into the left lane barely missing the guy. some people. I stuck right on his ass until he moved over for his exit, he was oblivious to anything going on around him. |
These guys www.setina.com |
Uh, oh, I better not go 100mph+ in that area anymore  On that same stretch I can make up to 100 from the Kirkland on ramp to the New Bus bridge...When its SAFE and there are few cars on the road....BUT NOT IN RAINING WEATHER.....I DONT WANNA DIE YET  Get a lawyer...My sister got out of two tickets. Robert Silva is his name, but I think he charges $250 for a ticket, but he gets it off the hook....My uncle got out of 10 or so tickets with this guy. |
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You think you got it bad. Kiro reported that WSP nailed a guy for doing 128 mph this week on WB I-90. PoPos are out in full force right now. Before the floods, I would always see at least six patrol units on or around the sr 204 & sr 9 area. All either behind a pulled over vehicle or sitting with thier radars out. |
they've been running a speed enforcement program financed thru the state, several diffrent days/times w/ up to 50 extra officers just targeting speed law breakers. Don't just look for WSP. using diff units from several Sno CO cities, so don't be suprised to be nailed by a Lynnwood motorcycle officer on SR 92 OR SR 204. damn guys are real hard to spot too. |
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Thank You all for the good advice, anyways after talking to some of my friends they said going to court is 50/50 depending on the judge and they advice me to go "deferral" defered finding. Infraction will be dismissed and won't appear on your record after one year of no further violation. Saves me attorney's fee and the court fee is only $100.00. Trig |
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I wouldn't do a deffered ticket. There is no way for you to guarantee yourself not getting a traffic ticket. What happens if you accidently rear end someone and get cited for it? With Mitch its about a 99/01 % chance in court that you will get off. If he doesn't get you off he pays your ticket and you only have to make up the difference. Dont conversate on it with your friends, contact his office and get some facts. He isn't #1 for nothing. You got to look at this two here also. If you get another ticket, not only will you get nailed with this one, but it will be even harder to fight the next one with a neg. on your record. Its the second worse ticket you can get (under a wreckless). Another couple hundred bucks and you walk away from this thing scott free over your $100 court fee. MITCH IS THE BEST!!!!!! |
Jeannie P. Mucklestone |
Since they put up all those signs that say speed limits strictly enforced the revenue mill has been in high gear. I just got popped for 47 in a 35. $132! The guy was pulling somebody else over while he was writing out my ticket. Had quite the little ticket mill going. When I asked to how he arrived at the speed he says hand held radar. Then he says he can't show my speed to me because this other guy's speed is on it. Makes you wonder how many 47 mph tickets he wrote that day. When he said what he did about the handheld I was wondering how the hell you use a radar gun you don't have in your hand. 
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I wonder if you even read his statement. The ticket sounds like BS to me but your statement is full of it too. -- Here is a little refresher------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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