Posted: 1/22/2011 4:41:27 PM EDT
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Right down to business. Local gun store has the AR I want, price is shitty. They claim to price match other stores, but didn't specifically state they match internet prices. Bud's Guns has the same model I plan on getting for a much lower price, but it is not CA-compliant as sold. If I order it off Bud's and have it sent to local gunshop, they can install a Bullet Button, can they not? Or am I over thinking this? Store is Faith Armory in Temecula. Will also check the Shootist, when I get the chance... |
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The FFL can only do that if they possess an AW permit from CADOJ. Some FFLs in other states offer "middleman" services where they accept the gun, make it CA compliant, and ship it to the FFL in CA. Henderson Defense in NV offers this service I believe. There is a second option of sending only the lower half to the FFL and have the upper shipped to you. In that case since the lower is not a "centerfire rifle" any FFL could accept it and install the BB and 10 round mag. This assumes of course that the lower is not banned by name. Some FFLs will do this, you need to ask you receiving FFL. |
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I think Swatter911 has described the labor involved in bringing that gun into California and offering it for sale. What he describes takes time, involves the labor of people and that is reflected in the price you see in the shop.
Perhaps you should just build your own rifle. That will be the least expensive way to get the rifle. Shopping around, whether for parts or for the best price on a complete firearm, takes time and energy and is your labor. Do you place a price on your own labor? If so, consider that cost as part of the price of the rifle you are wanting. Compare that to the price for the rifle sitting on the shelf in the shop. |
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Building my own is not an option. Not old enough to buy a lower. I'd have no problem just buying from the place, but their price is $300 more than Bud's, plus like 90 bucks tax, which is like 40% more all said and done. I guess I'll see if the Shootist has better prices. Or, look around at more CA specific webstores, maybe. ETA: of course, I could just ask if either of my two local places has an AW permit. |
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All I'm saying is that there's some value in buying locally. Someone has already done all the work necessary to bring it in and make it compliant.
Buying a lower is the same as buying a rifle, no? Aren't the age requirements are the same? Maybe there's something I don't understand about age requirements. Is it 18 to buy a complete rifle and 21 to buy a lower? Either way, my point on buying local remains the same. |
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Quoted: All I'm saying is that there's some value in buying locally. Someone has already done all the work necessary to bring it in and make it compliant. Buying a lower is the same as buying a rifle, no? Aren't the age requirements are the same? Maybe there's something I don't understand about age requirements. Is it 18 to buy a complete rifle and 21 to buy a lower? Either way, my point on buying local remains the same. Yes, and, as far as I know, that's a federal thing too. I'm 19, by the way. I'm not totally opposed to buying locally, I just don't want to spend an extra FOUR HUNDRED DOLLARS for the SAME RIFLE if I don't have to. |
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Unless they've changed their policy very recently, Bud's is anti-CA. The motherfuckers will gladly take your money if you're buying a fudd gun, but they will not ship ANY semi-auto rifles to CA, nor will they ship "Defense" shotguns whatever that means... The point is they are not friendly to our cause and you should not be supporting them. If you REALLY want to buy from Bud's, you would have to send it to an out of state third party FFL sympathetic to our cause –– Henderson Defense in Nevada is one –– and have them receive it, convert it to bullet button status, and then ship it to your local FFL. That will cost you quite a bit because you're paying for two transfers and shipping.
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Well guys, problem solved. Just picked up a Ruger SR556 upper on a JD Machine A2-style lower from Faith Armory, on consignment. Picking it up next Friday @ 3... absolutely outstanding look gun. And I got 2 of those big boxes of Federal XM193 from Wal-Mart to run through it as soon as I get the chance. I'm gonna have a FUN weekend. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
All I'm saying is that there's some value in buying locally. Someone has already done all the work necessary to bring it in and make it compliant. Buying a lower is the same as buying a rifle, no? Aren't the age requirements are the same? Maybe there's something I don't understand about age requirements. Is it 18 to buy a complete rifle and 21 to buy a lower? Either way, my point on buying local remains the same. Yes, and, as far as I know, that's a federal thing too. I'm 19, by the way. I'm not totally opposed to buying locally, I just don't want to spend an extra FOUR HUNDRED DOLLARS for the SAME RIFLE if I don't have to. not true, stripped lower is registered as a long gun. you only have to be 18. i bought mine when i was 19 |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: All I'm saying is that there's some value in buying locally. Someone has already done all the work necessary to bring it in and make it compliant. Buying a lower is the same as buying a rifle, no? Aren't the age requirements are the same? Maybe there's something I don't understand about age requirements. Is it 18 to buy a complete rifle and 21 to buy a lower? Either way, my point on buying local remains the same. Yes, and, as far as I know, that's a federal thing too. I'm 19, by the way. I'm not totally opposed to buying locally, I just don't want to spend an extra FOUR HUNDRED DOLLARS for the SAME RIFLE if I don't have to. not true, stripped lower is registered as a long gun. you only have to be 18. i bought mine when i was 19 Really? That's contrary to everything I've ever heard on that subject, including signs printed in both my nearest local gun stores. ETA: Google says you are wrong, too. ETA2: Google actually says (on multiple counts) that apparently complete lowers are a-OK for "minors," but stripped lowers (as you said) and a no-go. So I learned two things today. I can apparently buy a complete lower, and you are full of shit. |
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Quoted: You could have also bought a completed rifle lower and gotten the upper yourself. And that would benefit me... how? Is is better in some esoteric, philosophical way to build your first AR rather than just buy one? Because I did the math and found that for the parts used in what I got, I might have saved as much as about $50 at best. |
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DKroll92, dang boy. You come on here lookin for help and when GarEllis told you of his experience you tell him he is “full Of Shit”…
With that kind of attitude and lack of control over your reactions I am actually kinda worried you will be owning a fire arm at all. #1 Chill the hell out #2 I am holding in my hand the DROS, where on three different occasion, with two different FFL’s, I had lower receivers marked as……..wait for it…….. Long gun!!!!!! In the little box where they mark firearm type. 1- a Charles Daily AR lower 2- a Spikes AR lower 3- an Elk River AK receiver I may even have more like this but I will check my other DROS when I get home, I only have a few in my file here at work. Now if the FFL was doing it wrong or right, whatever, they were doing it. And if they went by the DROS they filled out, stating long gun, there is absolutely no reason to not believe some FFLs would and did sell them to a 19 year old. There are still a lot of FFLs confused about the rights and wrongs concerning ARs and AKs. PS I think you owe that man an apology. |
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Quoted: I think people need to take the internet less seriously. I was only repeated what I had heard from several local FFLs. Whether or not they are legally correct is irrelevant since if they believe what they say to be true, they wouldn't sell to me thus defeating the purpose of the entire thread.DKroll92, dang boy. You come on here lookin for help and when GarEllis told you of his experience you tell him he is "full Of Shit”… With that kind of attitude and lack of control over your reactions I am actually kinda worried you will be owning a fire arm at all. #1 Chill the hell out #2 I am holding in my hand the DROS, where on three different occasion, with two different FFL’s, I had lower receivers marked as……..wait for it…….. Long gun!!!!!! In the little box where they mark firearm type. 1- a Charles Daily AR lower 2- a Spikes AR lower 3- an Elk River AK receiver I may even have more like this but I will check my other DROS when I get home, I only have a few in my file here at work. Now if the FFL was doing it wrong or right, whatever, they were doing it. And if they went by the DROS they filled out, stating long gun, there is absolutely no reason to not believe some FFLs would and did sell them to a 19 year old. There are still a lot of FFLs confused about the rights and wrongs concerning ARs and AKs. PS I think you owe that man an apology. |
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Um GarEllis above indeed IS full of it about this subject - and thus OffGrid too. DKroll asked for useful/accurate info,
was fed some obviously incorrect info, and doesn't have to apolgize for anything. (I am glad he ended up with a good deal on a nice gun from a CA FFL with a good rep.) Yeah, a plain lower is DROSed as a long gun for *California* purposes (which causes another set of issues for people building pistols). But for *Federal* purposes lowers and long guns are different animals... .... BATF (and the law!) does NOT consider a lower (either stripped or stuffed with parts) a long gun exempt for purchase by 18-to-21yr olds per GCA '68. GCA '68 has specific exemptions for shotguns & rifles (i.e, shoulder-fired guns) to be sold to this age group, and 'other' doesn't fall into this category. And it thus does not matter if the CA sale/transfer is via PPT or not, etc. This is also why 18-to-21 yr olds can't buy PG-only shotguns like Mossberg 500 "Cruisers" unless the gun at least ships with a stock in the box. The various FFLs were right (for once!). This has been the subject of several BATF "FFL Bulletins" in 1998 and 1999 (Fall, then Spring, I believe). Bill Wiese San Jose CA |
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OP, I think calling someone out as a liar when you don’t know him from Adam is completely out of line. To me a man’s integrity is serious.
Bill, I didn’t say it was right or legal. What I was trying to do WAS NOT to give legal advice but let the OP know that just because it was not his experience it did not make GarEllis a liar. I did not even state that I had received anything while under 21. I simply showed where the error, mistake or what ever you want to call it could and HAS slipped through. “Now if the FFL was doing it wrong or right, whatever, they were doing it. And if they went by the DROS they filled out, stating long gun, there is absolutely no reason to not believe some FFLs would and did sell them to a 19 year old. There are still a lot of FFLs confused about the rights and wrongs concerning ARs and AKs.” Where in this statement did I state it was legal right or he could or should do the same? In my attempt to keep our home town forum from turning into just another GD I was standing up for a fellow Ca gunner who, we have no reason to call a liar, and had the same experience as a couple of local shooters who had stripped lowers run through before they were 21. But hey read it how you want. Because all FFLs and the feds get it right all the time and you didn’t see it, so it couldn’t have happened. My thinking he deserved an apology was for being called full of shit has not changed in spite of back up or redirect. And now that he and I are both full of shit in your judgment, sincerely, thank you for all you have done for Ca shooters, but screw you just the same for questioning my honesty. |
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Quoted:
My thinking he deserved an apology was for being called full of shit has not changed in spite of back up or redirect. And now that he and I are both full of shit in your judgment, sincerely, thank you for all you have done for Ca shooters, but screw you just the same for questioning my honesty. Wasn't questioning your honesty, just your knowledge/ willingness to run on assumptions. Sorry if I was unclear. -Bill |
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Ok, let me say that one of the girls in the office, just now, told me to get another cup of coffee because I was being a “Grumpy Bitch”. Yes we are pretty casual around here.
So that being said. In rereading this whole thing over, Yes I could have and should have posted, that the first half of GarEllis’s post was fud, incorrect, misguided, misinformed, wrong, No Bueno etc. Then I could have stayed off of my soap box about the OP calling the guy out about him getting his lower at 19. And maybe DKroll92 and bwiese didn’t mean “full of shit” as calling the guy a liar or dishonest as I interpreted it. I see I may have jumped the gun on giving a lecture. Maybe? Yet this situation has if fact happened and I will still stick up for the guy in that aspect. For my jumping the gun, misinterpreting statements or being disrespectful in my posts, I apologize to you gentlemen for that. 
Feel free to beat me for a while, I am headin out to get an extra large Monster energy drink to jumpstart my brain. 
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Quoted: Then I could have stayed off of my soap box about the OP calling the guy out about him getting his lower at 19. And maybe DKroll92 and bwiese didn’t mean "full of shit” as calling the guy a liar or dishonest as I interpreted it. I see I may have jumped the gun on giving a lecture. Maybe? Yet this situation has if fact happened and I will still stick up for the guy in that aspect. Yeah, I didn't mean for it to come off as bluntly as it did. Sorry about that. Quoted: (I am glad he ended up with a good Thanks. I think I'll join you for that Starbucks... my other addiction, aside from firearms. deal on a nice gun from a CA FFL with a good rep.)  |